Following the Fire

By Following The Fire

Like many others, we (Steve & Nathan) are on a spiritual journey of deconstruction and reconstruction to find what God truly wants of us. Just like Israel followed the pillar of fire in the desert... more

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How many episodes does Following the Fire have?

The podcast currently has 70 episodes available.

Following the Fire episodes:

April 21, 20219: Huge Black Eye: Modern idolatry and the image of God
Today Nathan’s return to a short story about Jesus healing 10 lepers leads us into the 10 commandments, idolatry, can we safely say “OMG”, then to masks, vaccines, the mark of the beast. We talk about being the image of God in this messed up spiritual desert, and we wish for brave leadership through it.
Intro - 1:27
The internet tricked Nathan in to learning magic
Alpha & Omega Playing Cards
Smoking is bad, playing cards is fine, or vice-versa (geography dependent)
Musical: “The Music Man”
Boxed-In Hangups - 8:07
The rich young ruler - Mark 10:17-27
Zaccheus - Luke 19:1-10
The 10 Lepers - Luke 17:11-19
Book: “Misreading Scripture with Western Eyes” by E. Randolph Richards & Brandon J. O’Brien
Structured brainstorming - The KJ method
“…the kingdom of heaven belongs to such as these.” - Matthew 19:14
Oh Emm Gee - 28:36
Numbering The 10 Commandments
Jesus fish
Idolatry
Mark of the beast
Image of God - 48:46
Bible Project Podcast: Royal Priests Series
Bible Project Video: Image of God
Article: White Evangelical Resistance Is Obstacle in Vaccination Effort
Pew Research: Intent to get vaccinated
Who's leading? - 1:09:26
Article: Why Is It So Hard to Change People’s Minds?
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1h 32min
April 14, 20218: Deconstructing Deconstruction: What it is and why it's happening
In this episode Nathan learns what the word ‘heuristic’ means, and we talk a lot about ‘deconstruction’ — what it means, what it doesn’t mean, and what the process might be like for people like us who are going through it.
Intro - 0:00
Sunburns are caused by the sun
Steve is very very white
It’s Everywhere - 3:43
Toyota Hilux Truck
Baader-Meinhoff Phenomenon
Confirmation Bias
Availability Heuristic
“Whoever has ears to hear…” Matthew 11:15
Article: “Jesus Cleansing the Temple” by Beth Moore
Article: Beth Moore leaves the SBC
What is it? - 15:16
Deconstruction according to Jaques Derrida
The Deconstruction Network
Pixar Movie: “Inside Out”
Black sheep going upstream - 33:04
Agreeableness
Group Think
Podcast: Adam Grant on “Dare to Lead” podcast by Brené Brown
Book: “Think Again” by Adam Grant
Life in a bubble - 49:20
Dinosaur National Monument
Article: The age of nones may favor churches that welcome doubters
Thomas Pikkety
Amish
Why do we deconstruct? 1:07:43
Article: U.S. Church Membership Falls Below Majority for First Time
The Flying Nun
Article: White Evangelicals stick by Trump
Cognitive Dissonance
Compounding variables - 1:29:07
Trump, Black Lives Matter, COVID
The Good Samaritan - Luke 10:25-37
You’re not alone
With God Daily
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1h 54min
April 10, 2021 Bonus Episode: The Leaven of Nathan
The Problem: Nathan is judgmental and gets it wrong about music
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15min
April 07, 20217: Bowling Without Bumpers: Rethinking the Restoration movement
Is restoration of the first century church REALLY what we should be focusing on? Is there a danger in trying to do the right thing all the time? Is faith supposed to be scary? Should we all give dancing naked a try? These and other questions, if not answered, will at least be asked on this week's episode.
Intro - 0:00
Steve’s trying to tell himself to “leave it” as regards Facebook arguments
Nathan has weird hobbies (e.g.,reading Amazon 1-star reviews)
Back to the beginning? - 6:22
Statute of limitations for spoilers
The Princess Bride
Is “going back to the beginning” inherently a good thing for the church to do?
Restoration Movement
On a timeline, when did Christians “get it the most right”?
Is the first-century Christian the one we want to emulate?
Jackie Robinson
Usain Bolt
Jesse Owens
“Who got it right?” is the wrong question to ask
We look in the Bible for a blueprint that isn’t there
Who do we emulate? - 26:32
We should emulate Christ, period
But he doesn’t give us how to “church” the “right way”
Jesus being tempted by Satan - [Matthew 4:1-11](Matthew 4:1-11)
Proof Texting
Stuck on getting it right - 42:50
Restoration Movement
Barton W. Stone
Thomas Campbell
Alexander Campbell
Millenial Harbinger magazine
Postmillennialism
“Follow me as I follow Christ” - 1 Corinthians 11:1
Change is scary
Brené Brown podcast “Daring to Lead”
Grace vs. Righteousness
Making God “happy” is the wrong approach
Sinning more to manufacture grace - Romans 6:1-2
Dancing naked - 1:00:48
David danced before the Lord - 1 Samuel 6:12-22
“Anyone Can Fall for a Conspiracy Theory — Even You”
We need more awareness of how we approach new ideas
What satiates fear is control
Faith is letting go of control
Seek Ye First - Matthew 6:33
Fruit of the Spirit - Galatians 5:22-23
My yoke is easy… - Matthew 11:28-30
Book: "The Freedom of the Hills”
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1h 23min
March 31, 20216: It’s not about farming: Is the Bible everything we think it is?
We’re going to talk about the B.I.B.L.E. and discuss whether it’s the book for us. Where’d it come from? Is it truth? What is truth? Then we get deeper and deeper. Come follow along as we try to figure this out.
What’s the deal with the Bible? - 2:06
Deconstructing is now a “thing”
Reconstruction is also important
The 3 ‘I’s of scripture - 7:32
Inspired, Infallible, Inerrant
Quotation confusion in the New Testament
Hebrews 8: 7-9
Jeremiah 31:32
Luke 24:45-47
Jude 14-15
1 Enoch 1:9
Things added later
“Cast the first stone” story - John 8:-11
Biblical Chiasmus
Mark 16:9-20
The Sacredness of Scripture - 28:01
Book: “Red Letter Revolution” by Shaine Claiborne & Tony Campolo
The sections of the Tanakh
“All scripture is useful…” 2 Tim 3:16-17
Competitive Agency vs. Dual Agency
“Pray to God for Protection. Then Praise Him for Your Mask.” By Tish Harrison Warren
“Liturgy of the Ordinary” By Tish Harrison Warren
A Toxic Relationship With the Bible - 48:03
Putting too much of our faith on the 3 ‘I’s can cause it all to crash down
The through-line of the Bible is the important thing
Coming to terms with imperfection is important
Differently Important - 1:05:54
Looking for the Truths instead of the Rules
From milk to meat - 1 Corinthians 3:1-3
We want to stay with “incorrect vs. correct” but the Bible is pulling us in a different direction
Jesus taught in this direction - Matthew 5:17-48
It’s not about the rule, it’s about your heart and a relationship with God
Easter Letter of Athanasius
History of the New Testament Canon
Q Source
What’s the minimum viable Bible?
Book: “Love Does” by Bob Goff
“Turn Your Eyes Upon Jesus”
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1h 25min
March 24, 20215: The G.O.D. Club: The problem of Christian moral superiority
Nathan shares his thoughts on how misunderstanding "Good Guys vs. Bad Guys" can lead to an inverted gospel of moral superiority, and how it contributes to the problem of "Us Against Them." And, along the way, Nathan realizes that he's not the Jedi he thought, but he was the Sith the whole time.
Book Club! - 0:00
“With” by Skye Jethani
Intro - 2:52
Good guys vs. Bad guys - 4:30
The Empire Strikes Back
Darkwing Duck
Rescuers Down Under
How to know if someone’s a bad guy
Smokes cigarettes
They’re ugly
Foreign accent (Russian or German, but the worst is British)
OT “heroes” are very flawed people
We’re not necessarily supposed to emulate the heroes at all times
Noah had a dark ending (Genesis 9)
Abraham lying about his wife being his wife (Genesis 20)
David & Bathsheba (2 Samuel 11)
Jacob & Esau (Genesis 25)
Judah & Tamar (Genesis 38)
We read ourselves into the best parts of the story
Going to church = I’m a good guy
The G.O.D. Club (sorry Jodie)
We associate being a Christian with moral superiority
The natural response to meeting God is not “I’m so great”
The Gospel of Moral Superiority - 4:30
The need to feel “good enough” to become a Christian
Focusing so much on right vs. wrong that we miss the forest
Fear of morality outside Christianity
We are skeptical of things not written by people we always agree with
We should also be skeptical of those we think we do agree with
Leads us to hide any darkness we find inside ourselves
We then hide the shortcomings of our leaders
Ravi Zacharias scandal
Us Against Them -
We should be the salt of the earth not the starch of the vest (Matthew 5:13)
Today means: authentic, guard down, not worried about perceptions
Book: “Unchristian” by Gabe Lyons and David Kinnaman
Rethinking how we measure ourselves
Jesus came to the “in group” and reached out to the “outsider”
Thought experiment: Tell yourself the “Good Samaritan” story and substitute the person you can’t stand as the Samaritan
God leaves no room for someone we’re NOT supposed to love
“Jesus the Pharisee” - Joseph Shulam
There is no outsider! There is no “us vs them”
Love actively
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1h 17min
March 17, 20214: Flossing Deconstructed: More things we accidentally learned in church
On this episode we continue our conversation of the list of some of the small things on Steve’s mind like eternity, the Old Testament and the New Testament and what things we’re supposed to get out of them, and what does it mean to talk to God.
We’re just barely getting in to these topics, but we plan on diving deeper on all of them in the future, and we really want to know your thoughts, comments, questions, and concerns. So PLEASE send us an email at [email protected] - we’d love to hear from you, maybe answer your questions or work your comments into a future episode.
Book Club announcement! 0:00
First book: “With” by Skye Jethani
Discussion on the April 7 show.
Send us your comments, questions, and book ideas!
Intro: 2:00
Working from home pros and cons
Nathan’s been doing home improvement work to prep for his wife moving in
The paint should make things interesting
Framing the topics: 5:27
The goal, just like the "Restoration Movement", is really to strip back the traditions and get to the core of Christianity
Don’t let the truth be a scary thing
What we’re really doing is deconstructing - just need to be sure we rebuild
The relationship between Christianity and Judaism - 16:18
What’s the Old Testament good for?
Joseph Shulam - Netivya Ministries, Jerusalem
The purpose of Christianity - 27:17
It’s not just to get myself to heaven
It's about the Kingdom starting now
Book: "The Great Divorce" by C.S. Lewis
Book: “The Divine Conspiracy” by Dallas Willard
All about prayer - 43:36
Class: Why do we pray that way?
How prayer works & what’s it for?
Traditions around prayer
Long-distance romantic relationship as a metaphor for prayer
Book: "Book of Common Prayer" the (not very pocket-sized) Pocket size edition
Prayer is for relationship
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1h 3min
March 10, 20213: Spiritual Pillows: Rethinking things we accidentally learned in church
Today we start going down Steve's list of things he’s been thinking about and rethinking, and we don’t get too far. Also, we solve the issue of women’s roles in the church. Almost.
Things we were taught or accidentally learned that we are unlearning or rethinking that were touched on in this episode:
Intro - 0:00
We're cold. It's cold.
Adults like fluffy snow, kids like sticky snow
Things Steve is rethinking, pt1 - 3:54
Exclusive mindset of the churches of Christ
Musical instruments in worship
Worship = Sundays only - 16:40
5 acts of worship
Requirement to have an "invitation"
Worship is what we should be doing with our entire lives
Books: "The Space Trilogy" by C.S. Lewis
Women's roles in the church - 24:26
There are many unwritten rules about this that are traditional
We wouldn't allow this if we were talking about race
This practice is damaging to the men, women, and kids - and we're losing them (article)
Some books:
"God's Woman Revisited" by Gary T. Burke
"What Most Women Want, What Few Women Find" by F. LaGard Smith
"The Mishnah"
Problem of making worship the main event - 42:49
We're missing out on so much of what women have to say, and teach, and pray
The gift of diversity in the church - 50:24
It's important to seek out a little discomfort - it helps us grow
EDITS:
The "5 elements of worship" are actually: singing, giving (money), preaching, praying, and taking the Lord's Supper.
It's the "Bereans" who searched the scriptures to see if Paul & Silas were correct, not the "Berameans" (which isn't a thing)
The "woman at the well" (John ch 4) and the woman Jesus jokingly referred to as a "dog" (Matthew ch 15) were not the same person
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1h 7min
March 03, 20212: Gnats & Camels: Pros and cons of growing up in the Church of Christ
Today we’ll be talking a bit about how growing up in the Churches of Christ impacted our faith. And to all of our friends and family in the Churches of Christ, hopefully this episode will be less awkward to listen to than it was for us to record it.
Show Notes:
Intro - 0:00
Bike rides were taken
Nathan is "way behind on a bunch of stuff"
Very generalized and incomplete intro to the "Church of Christ" - 4:20
Talking about the "Church of Christ" is hard because they're independent
It is part of the "Restoration Movement"
Similar to, but not exactly the same as the "Reformation Movement"
The goal: Get back to Jesus and measure ourselves against that
Nathan lists of some standard Church of Christ tentpoles
Steve's history with the Church of Christ - 18:20
Very long family history with the "churches of Christ"
Exclusivist terminology is common (i.e., "we are THE church") but not universal
Only going to a C of C, you miss a lot of perspective
Steve's realization: Churches of Christ are not the only Christians who are earnestly trying to follow God
Vintage City Church in Fort Collins
Things Nathan felt were important or that he accidentally learned - 32:30
He was accidentally taught a lot of things (i.e., instrumental music in worship)
Gut reactions can be powerful! They bypass the brain
Happens often when it's "not the way you grew up"
Defining ourselves - 41:00
"If we define ourselves as 'not like other churches' we'll define ourselves out of existence." - Curt Niccum
"Whoever is not against us is for us" - Mark 9:38-41
" For in the same way you judge others, you will be judged" - Matthew 7:2
Wanting to "do church right" can distract from following God
"For I desire mercy, not sacrifice" - Hosea 6:6
"You strain out a gnat but swallow a camel." - Matthew 23:24
How we got here
Hermeneutics
Command, Example, Necessary Inference
"Who's my neighbor?" - Luke 10:36-37
We've focused too much on Sunday morning
The unity that Jesus wanted? - 57:47
Churches of Christ don't have the monopoly on "right"
Emphasis needs to shift from differences to commonalities
Jesus praying in the garden for unity - John 17:20-23
We can easily build our identity on things that are NOT God
We've all gotten it wrong, and we still do
All of this requires a lot of humility & grace
Am I pleasing God and following him, or just trying to "do the right thing"
The Lord's Prayer is a great alignment tool - Matthew 6:9-13
When we go back to church, we hope we don't fall back in to old, unhelpful, patterns
Be defined by who you're going toward, not who we're going against
Wrap up - 1:12:37
The Superbowl is on - Nathan doesn't "even want to talk about it"
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Links:
Way behind on a bunch of stuff
Restoration Movement
Reformation Movement
Vintage City Church
Mark 9:38-41 — Whoever is not against us is for us
Matthew 7:2 — For in the same way you judge others, you will be judged
Hosea 6:6 — For I desire mercy, not sacrifice
Matthew 23:24 — You strain out a gnat but swallow a camel
Command, Example, Necessary Inference
Luke 10:36-37 — Who's my neighbor?
John 17:20-23 — Jesus praying in the garden for unity
Matthew 6:9-13 — The Lord's Prayer is a great alignment tool
...more
1h 16min
February 24, 20211: Spongy Bread: Who we are and why we’re doing this
Today we’ll be introducing ourselves to you, talking a bit about our spiritual journeys, and why we’re doing this podcast thing in the first place.
Intro - 0:00
Meetings meetings workshops meetings powerpoint
Introductions - 2:55
Steve
Oklahoma Christian University
Dresden, Germany
Nathan
Bible Belt
Paris, France
Nathan notes that he and Steve are extremely similar in several weird ways
Why a podcast & our spiritual journeys - 17:35
The need to take a new look & changing perspective
Working on a real relationship with God
Moving from “believer” to “follower” - 34:39
Discovering new ways to approach God
Mandatory vacation for bankers recommended by FDIC
Viewing COVID lockdown as a sabbath
What it means to "follow the fire" - 46:40
The wilderness wandering was when God taught Israel to have a relationship with Him
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52min

FAQs about Following the Fire:

How many episodes does Following the Fire have?

The podcast currently has 70 episodes available.