Gender: A Wider Lens

The psychologist Erik Erickson’s theory of psychosocial development makes some essential observations about the period of adolescence and identifies the questions at this phase of life as “Who Am I?” and “What can I Be?”. Sasha and Stella examine this developmental period and ask how the concept of gender identity lays atop the teenage struggle for belonging, individuation, sexual development, and autonomy.

Links:

• The Adolescent Psyche: Jungian and Winnicottian Perspectives, by Richard Frankel  
• Untangled: Guiding Teenage Girls Through the Seven Transitions into Adulthood, by Lisa Damour, Ph.D.
• Hold on to Your Kids: Guiding Teenage Girls Through the Seven Transitions into Adulthood, by Gordon Neufeld & Gabor Maté
• “Trans Activism’s Dangerous Myth of Parental Rejection,” by Lisa Marchiano
• Childhood and Society, by Erik H. Erikson

Extended Notes

• The process of growing up; although it looks different across cultures, we all have to go through it.
• Stella shares the coming of age ceremonies she did for her children.
• There are 8 stages of “growing up” that we do, according to Erik Erikson:
• Infancy
• Toddler
• Early childhood
• Middle childhood
• Adolescence
• 20s–30s — Seeking intimacy
• 40s–60s — Stagnation
• 60s+ — Your legacy
• It’s so important for children to do things with a sense of conviction.
• Why are the adolescent years so turbulent?
• Erik Erikson was the person who coined the phrase, “Identity crisis.”
• Up until 12 years old, everything a parent says is considered “law.” After 12, they turn it off and take in outside influences. This makes sense. Children need this process.
• Children reject everything you stand for because they don’t want to be a clone of you.
• As a mother, Stella says there is nothing that strikes terror in our hearts more when our children are unhappy.
• Once our children are teenagers, is there nothing we can do to help them through this process?
• Parents need to have a working knowledge of what their teenagers are swimming in. This is a vital time to build a stronger relationship with the child, not disconnect from them.
• Do you want to understand where your children are coming from? Make the effort to learn what they’re into.
• Teenagers are agonizing over what to call themselves. It’s difficult. There are a lot of categories to choose from.
• As our sexuality develops, there is some shame around our feelings.
• When it comes to becoming transgender, children are not good at making judgments about long-term things.
• Teenagers sometimes can get wrapped up in the fantasy of blaming someone else for their developmental confusion.
• No one has perfect parents.
• There is a common thread on online forums that parents reject trans children, so it sets the child up to be defensive when they...
  
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Therapist Timothy Courtois pursued graduate education to deepen his knowledge of the role sexuality and intimacy play in our lives. He quickly came to feel that this program was using some of the same tactics of moralizing and indoctrination that he’d left behind after leaving a controlling religious community. We discuss the program's mixed-up understanding of sexuality, consent, and power dynamics in relationships. We set the stage for future conversations about a richer psychological and embodied view of sexuality.

Links:

• Tim’s Quillette Piece
• Queer Theory Jeopardy with Derrick Jensen
• AASECT
• Sexual Health Certificate Program

Extended Notes

• How did Tim get started in this field?
• How did Tim find out about the AASECT program?
• Prior to joining the program, Tim was working for a religious organization and it became apparent that there were going to be conflicts.
• Tim shares a little bit about his experience with the program and the materials in it.
• The program had a strong focus on BDSM porn and trans issues.
• Tim, as a therapist, wanted to be better equipped to handle new sexual issues but didn’t feel like watching porn and other materials in the program accurately helped him in this area.
• In the program, it was clear that it was “morally wrong” to make moral judgments about others. Tim found that troubling.
• It was clear that if you had any adverse responses or sensitivity to the materials being shown, those feelings needed to be “drowned out.” Tim wasn’t a fan of this method. There was so much room for exploration of one's own emotions that was ignored.
• When we try to buck our norms and be submissive with our behaviors, it can disconnect us from our instinct.
• The footage Tim saw was quite disturbing. He explains what he watched in the program.
• What is the pain that clients are bringing to us?
• It was a room of therapists watching these videos and they felt like they couldn’t speak up.
• In a lot of ways, Tim saw this “cult-following” to be much worse than the Christian organization he left.
• Did the program have an overview of intimacy and relationships?
• Let’s talk about morality and pedophilia within the program.
• There were some heavy contradictions in the program that Tim disagreed with.
• Virtual sex should not be considered “real sex.” It’s completely different from the real thing.
• How do you educate children about sex in a healthy way?
• You’re either going to be waterboarded with information or it’s suppressed. There doesn’t seem to be a happy middle.
• A lot of parents are concerned about their child’s sexual health, especially when they want to transition.
• What is the internet doing to our perceptions of sex, love, and intimacy?
• In the program, porn was a huge no because porn has a religious, moral, and political agenda.
• Tim shares a common story that many couples face when one of the partners has a porn addiction. What is your moral obligation as a therapist?
• We have to be able to point to something that goes beyond what the research paper says.
• What does a healthy, well-balanced, sex life looks like?

This podcast is partially sponsored by ReIME, Rethink Identity Medicine Ethics:

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Few people are aware of how much the political discussion around gender and sexuality has been touched by queer theory. This philosophy questions how we know what we know and turns hierarchies on their heads. Sasha and Stella explore the “smashing of binaries” in their therapeutic work and personal lives and discuss the positive and negative outcomes of taking queer theory thinking to its limits.

Links:

• Butler, Judith (2007). Gender Trouble: Feminism and the Subversion of Identity. Routledge.
• Jagose, Annamarie (1996). Queer Theory: An introduction (Reprint. ed.). New York: New York Univ. Press
• Foucault, Michel (1978) [1976] The History of Sexuality: Volume 1: An Introduction. London: Allen Lane.
• Foucault, Michel (1992) [1984]. The History of Sexuality: Volume 2: The Use of Pleasure. London: Penguin Books.
• Foucault, Michel (1990) [1984]. The History of Sexuality Volume 3: The Care of the Self. London: Penguin Books.
• Foucault, Michel (2021) [2021]. The History of Sexuality Volume 4: Confessions of the Flesh. London: Penguin Books
• Kosofsky Sedgwick, Eve (1990) Epistemology of the Closet
• Hood, Morag (2019). Brenda is a Sheep. London: Two Hoots
• “What I Saw at Drag Queen Story Hour,” WSJ
• Kate Bornstein

Extended Notes

• Mother and father are no longer inclusive?
• So much of our female oppression has been based upon our reproductive system.
• Queer theory is a “slippery fish.” What is the definition of queer theory?
• In any good democracy, there is a questioning of how we know what we know.
• Ireland is objecting to all sorts of oppression. They know first-hand what it’s like.
• How do you get through life if you have no idea what you know?
• Stella’s daughter once asked: Who says being fat is unhealthy?
• Queer theory will always be evolving.
• If you can’t be a man, and if you can’t be a woman, then what are you?
• Sasha shares some of her struggles as a woman and how she found her sexual orientation.
• The development of a woman’s sexuality feels very understudied. People might scoff at this, but Stella explains further.
• Not everything is due to a social construct.
• Is gender a performance?
• If there was a person by themselves on an island, would they really have a gender?
• We are not walking gender identities, there is so much more to us.
• You can’t use categories of behavior to try and assume someone’s...
  
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How and when did gender become such a heightened political issue? And what are the psychological implications for individuals and the collective? The origins of feminism, the LBG liberation movement, and the emerging transgender movement are explored within a psychological and cultural framework

Links:

Books 

Beauvoir, Simone de (2009) [1949]. The Second Sex. Trans. Constance Borde and Sheila Malovany-Chevallier. Random House. Simone de Beauvoir wrote that "the first time we see a woman take up her pen in defense of her sex" was Christine de Pizan in Epitre au Dieu d'Amour (Epistle to the God of Love) in the 15th century.  

Friedan, Betty (1963). The Feminine Mystique. W.W.Norton & Company. 

French, Marilyn (1977) The Women’s Room. Simon & Schuster 

Stryker, Susan (2009-01-07). Transgender History. Da Capo Press  

Bailey, Michael (2003). The Man Who Would Be Queen: The Science of Gender Bending and Transsexualism. Joseph Henry Press 

American Psychiatric Association. (2013). Diagnostic and statistical manual of mental 

 disorders (5th ed.). Washington, DC: American Psychiatric Press. 

Articles 

10 reasons american politics are so divided:  

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2015/01/07/the-top-10-reasons-american-politics-are-worse-than-ever/ 

Conversion therapy bans:  

https://www.lgbtmap.org/equality-maps/conversion_therapy 

Tumblr: A Call Out Post:  

https://4thwavenow.com/2019/03/20/tumblr-a-call-out-post/ 

The Controversy Surrounding the Man Who Would Be Queen (Michael Bailey’s book): 

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3170124/ 

Film  

Suffragette (2015) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IFoQt5vsgnQ 

Media 

Julie Bindel, 2004 article in the Guardian:  https://www.theguardian.com/world/2004/jan/31/gender.weekend7  

Kimberly Nixon and the Vancouver Rape Relief Centre: Rupp, Shannon (February 3, 2007). "Transsexual Loses Fight with Women's Shelter". The Tyee: https://thetyee.ca/News/2007/02/03/Nixon/  

Michigan Womyn's Music Festival:  https://www.facebook.com/michfest/posts/10153186431364831 

https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2009/03/02/lesbian-nation  

Ken Zucker: 

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Buck Angel transitioned in 1994 and now lives happily as a 58-year-old transsexual man. Buck describes his rollercoaster with gender dysphoria and explains why he was willing to become a medical guinea pig when he first transitioned. Buck talks about the importance of owning his sexuality within a transsexual body and he also provides a critique of the modern flavor of the transgender movement.

Links:

• Buckangel.com 
• Twitter: @BuckAngel
• Facebook: Facebook.com/officialbuckangel
• Instagram: Instagram.com/buckangel/

Extended Notes

• Who is Buck and what has his transition journey been like? 
• Buck suffered a lot with coming to terms with this new identity. He tried to commit suicide at 16.
• When did Buck first hear about transitioning from a therapist?
• Buck went in and out of therapy. Therapists didn’t believe him when he said, “I feel like a man.”
• Finally, one therapist recognized Buck’s confusion and just listened. She saved his life.
• Nobody understood Buck. In 78, this was just unheard of. Buck got committed to a psych ward.
• How did Buck become a model?
• Buck ended up getting addicted to drugs and alcohol. It ended with him becoming a prostitute.
• Buck is proud of his pornography work and shares a little bit about what that experience was like.
• If you’re not attracted to a trans person, does that make you transphobic?
• You should disclose if you are trans! Buck gets a lot of hate for this.
• Why does Buck still have female body parts?
• Buck talks about having an orgasm for the very first time in his late 20s/early 30s.
• Buck has become a guinea pig in the medical world to better understand gender dysphoria.
• Buck had the mantra of, “If it doesn’t work out, I will kill myself.”
• Buck talks about what medical things went wrong for him during his transition.
• Buck tries to explain some of the consequences these treatments have on your body. They’re harsh on your body.
• Being trans feels like a full-time job.
• Why are people detransitioning?
• What’s missing in the conversation when we talk about transitioning?
• Buck is a very controversial figure in the trans community. He clears the air on why he believes what he believes.

This podcast is partially sponsored by ReIME, Rethink Identity Medicine Ethics:

Rethinkime.org

Learn more about our show: Linktr.ee/WiderLensPod

In therapy, collusion happens when the therapist (consciously or unconsciously) participates in a client’s bid to avoid an important issue instead of helping the client to gain a deeper understanding or take a more helpful perspective. In the collective, society has colluded with the fantasy of gender identity, much to the detriment of dysphoric and transgender people themselves. Sasha and Stella discuss what factors contribute to this kind of collusion and how individuals have the power to steer us towards a more truthful and thoughtful direction.

Links:

• JK Rowling Essay: Jkrowling.com/opinions/j-k-rowling-writes-about-her-reasons-for-speaking-out-on-sex-and-gender-issues/
• Pluralistic Ignorance: “When no one believes, but everyone thinks that everyone believes.” Sk.sagepub.com/reference/socialpsychology/n402.xml
• The Asch Conformity Test: Simplypsychology.org/asch-conformity.html
• The Milgram Experiment: Simplypsychology.org/milgram.html
• Carl Rogers, the Core Conditions in Person-centered therapy: Simplypsychology.org/client-centred-therapy.html
• Diverse thresholds: Think.ing.com/articles/want-to-change-the-world-behavioural-science-offers-someadvice/#:~:text=The%20second%20microfoundation%20of%20social,what%20they%20say%20or%20do
• Californian policy congenital growth: Insurance.ca.gov/0400-news/0100-press-releases/2020/release140-2020.cfm

Extended Notes

• What does collusion mean in this context?
• What’s the difference between a good therapist and a bad therapist? They are able to step back when they’ve colluded with their client.
• There is collective collusion among therapists as well as collective collusion among languages.
• Stella showcases how the JK Rowling situation is the perfect example of collective collusion. She is not transphobic!
• A person-centric therapist might be very reluctant to give honest feedback and to challenge their client.
• They’re afraid that they’ll rupture the client's trust if they question whether someone with gender dysphoria is a boy or a girl.
• However, this approach can lead a client to feel stuck and they become a prisoner to their own narrative.
• It’s important the therapist doesn’t take the word of their client at face-value. Take a bird’s eye view of it instead.
• People are more than just a walking identity. It’s important for a client to explore all the different reasons why they might have an issue.
• Stella outlines how therapists fall into collusion instead of exploring the client’s feelings and emotions. It happens because they’re very empathic toward their feelings.
• By trying to protect your client, you end up hurting them because reality will always hit hard.
• Stella shares her thoughts on trans therapists and what they need to be aware of when it comes to collusion.
• It’s easy to be kind short-term, but to be kind long-term is preparing...
  
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Quick Notes 

A whistle-stop tour through the history of psychological and medical approaches to sex and gender in the 20th century. This episode gives background and context to the formation of WPATH (World Professional Association for Transgender Health) and today’s “affirmative model of care” for gender issues. 

Extended Notes

• A little bit of history about gender transitions over the decades.
• The medical and psychological theories behind gender transition have always been controversial.
• Why would someone struggle with their gender?
• Which gender roles should you raise your children in? Sasha shares a case that happened with twin boys, and one transitioned into a girl in 1965.
• The outcome was not great. People played God on a child.
• In 1965, only 3% of surgeons took sex change requests seriously. However, by the 70s, these surgeries were commonplace.
• People pushed for experimental interventions too soon without having long-term data.
• Instead of saying “should we do this?” doctors said, “can we do this?”
• No one knows why a trans person exists. A psychologist would be asking questions to figure out this key piece.
• It wasn’t until the 2010s that you’d see a huge uptick in gender dysphoria.
• Both Stella and Sasha break down why they like Dr. Zucker and the research he’s conducted on child gender issues.
• There are so many variables. It’s hard to know or pinpoint what makes a child want to transition.
• Objectively, it may be better to have people come to terms with their biology vs. going through a very risky medical path.
• There is a heavy medical burden when you try to transition. It is not an easy thing to do. Even certain trans people admit that, if you can avoid it, you would be better.
• Sasha shares a gender study that used hormone blockers on children for two years and the reports they found.
• What is the psychological impact of puberty blockers?
• The criteria to see if you have gender dysphoria in the DSM, 5 out of 8 of them use outdated and stereotypical gender roles. Like if the boy or girl likes playing with the opposite sex toys.
• There is such a thing as a placebo effect.
• Sasha shares another study where 4.5% of males ended up dying from the gender intervention.
• What’s crazy is a lot of these studies are deemed to be successful. Someone dying is not a success. It’s a tragedy.
• From a medical and psychological perspective, there is a big difference between how you treat gay or lesbian people vs. how you treat a trans person.
• The treatment for a trans person is to take drugs till the day you die. The treatment for being gay is to live your life.
• How young is too young to get a child to transition?
• How do you talk to young people about their gender? It can be quite troubling the different doctors’ approaches on the matter.
• There doesn’t seem to be any studies showcasing why intervening early is going to be good for the long term wellbeing of a gender dysphoric child.
• You’re halting the development of a young person, we should take that seriously.
• Feeling distressed about your body? There might be something else going on and it might not just be strictly gender, to begin with.

Links 

About John Money & David Reimer 

• http://www.hawaii.edu/PCSS/biblio/articles/1961to1999/1997-sex-reassignment.html  
• 
  
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Quick Notes

Endocrinologist Will Malone joins Sasha and Stella to discuss the pivotal position that endocrinologists have in the new practice of childhood transition. In this conversation, Will describes attending a conference in 2017 run by the Endocrine Society where suddenly everything related to trans healthcare appeared to shift, without any discussion or analysis.

Extended Notes

●    A quick introduction about Dr. Will Malone.

●    How did Dr. Will get involved in this field?

●    Dr. Will was seeing small clusters of females declaring they were trans. What was going on?

●    Primary doctors were calling Dr. Will for help. They had never seen anything like this before.

●    Dr. Will explains what he’s been seeing in his practice when it comes to teens experiencing gender dysphoria.

●    Stella notes that the three main professionals needed are surgeons, endocrinologists, and psychologists to help teens through this journey.

●    What is the role of an endocrinologist and what kind of guidelines should they be following when helping at teen transition?

●    Dr. Will doesn’t agree with the treatment protocol for hormone blockers in teens.

●    Dr. Will was surprised by the study they based this new treatment protocol off of. It referenced only one study and the quality of evidence, he believes, is questionable.

●    Endocrinologists prescribing puberty blockers or sex hormones to teens outside of clinical trials — they are engaged in experimental medicine.

●    “Let’s see what we can do.” Is not an approach any medical professional should take. People will be harmed by this.

●    Sasha recaps how medical professionals were treating gender dysphoria prior to 2010 vs. how they’re treating it now. It’s alarming.

●    Where’s the data?

●    What are Dr. Will’s peers and colleagues saying about the Endocrine Society’s stance on this?

●    The harms can be significant. We’re talking about infertility, increase in heart disease, and irreversible effects in children.

●    Dr. Will has attended conferences where counterpoints are presented when it comes to prescribing new medicine, but he did not see this occur when it came to gender dysphoria. It was difficult even to submit questions.

●    What type of person/endocrinologist pursues this field of work (sex hormone blockers)?

●    How did SEGM get started?

●    The UK recently had a ruling about puberty blockers. Dr. Wil shares more details.

●    On a chemical and medical level, what happens when you stop puberty?

●    Can a simulated puberty be the same as biological puberty?

●    Why halt puberty with a mental intervention? Why aren’t we getting more psychologists on board during this process to help distressed teens navigate their new bodies?

●    The medical field is more than happy to provide solutions to client demand, even if it is to the detriment of the client.

●    Sasha is seeing something very shocking happening with parents and their gender dysphoric children right now.

●    Parents are being ignored. It seems to be culturally acceptable by medical professions to skip the due diligence and go straight to hormone blockers. Any questions parents bring up — they are deemed bigotted.

●    UK medical professionals think the guidelines are rubbish and are not...

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Quick Notes:

Why do people seek to ​change genders​? What drives a person to ​curate​ a brand new identity? In this episode, Sasha and Stella look beyond a literal understanding of​​ transitioning and explore the​ psychological power and vulnerability of attempting transformation​​.

Links:

Hacsi Horvath on Erin Brewer

Queer in the Crib

Gender Dysphoria is not One Thing

Extended Notes:

• Why do people want to transition?
• Let’s clear up some misconceptions today about trans people.
• Why do little children between the ages of three and five have gender dysphoria?
• Which comes first? Gender nonconformity, then sexuality, or is it the other way around?
• People can just tell when a child is developing gender-nonconforming traits.
• What makes a child become gender-nonconforming in the first place? Stella offers some of her insights.
• There is an instinctive grab for attention when siblings come along and this might create thoughts/feelings of, “If I were the other gender I’d get more attention like the way my brothers (or sisters) are getting.”
• It’s very hard to parent a strong-willed child, but they tend to do great things if you can handle the storm.
• It can be hard as a parent. The desire to save face when your child is rebelling can be very difficult to manage.
• Why would a child in their teenage years be looking to transition?
• Perhaps the desire to be a different gender, someone other than you, helps teens feel more in control of their developing bodies.
• Teens constantly being asked “What are you?” by adults adds an extra layer of pressure to their identity.
• How can a more sensitive and non-aggressive boy get the attention of the girls?
• When a guy reveals he’s trans or transitioning, all of sudden he’s getting more attention from the girls than ever before.
• Why don’t you hear more about transvestism anymore?
• Do children just need to “suck it up”?
• Adults really underestimate the mental toll puberty can have on children.
• Some children don’t even explore the option of transitioning into another gender because they didn’t even realize that they could.
• We tell children they can be anything they wish! Well, how stressful is that for a child who doesn’t even know who they are?
• What do you do when a young child is influenced by social media?
• There are so many options to pick an identity or gender pronoun. It’s stressful for a child to pick “who” they are.
• The more accepted transgender identities become, the more people will be asking masculine women when they plan to transition. That’s exhausting and insulting.
• What does it really mean to be a “woman” or to be a “man”?
• We want excitement. For some people, it’s exciting to call yourself a different pronoun. It’s new, it’s different, it makes you stand out.
• Even if you change your gender, you still wake up the same person on the inside.
• Sasha believes there should be a mandate for psychological exploration before taking a big decision like a gender change.

This podcast is partially sponsored by ReIME, Rethink Identity Medicine Ethics:

Rethinkime.org

Learn more about our show: Linktr.ee/WiderLensPod

Quick Notes:

Arty Morty* found it very difficult to grow up as a feminine boy amongst his peers. In this episode he explains how difficulties in his social and family life shaped his identity development. Ultimately, he came to accept himself as a gay man and he touches upon the new concept of gender identity and how it might have impacted his identity had he been a teen today.

*Arty Morty is a pseudonym 

Links: 

Arty Morty on Twitter

Arty Morty on YouTube

Rupert Everett on Childhood Dysphoria

The Man Who Would Be Queen by Michael Bailey

Extended Notes

• Who is Arty and how has gender touched his life?
• Arty has always been a feminine boy growing up. He grew up with his mother and his sister.
• Arty remembers one of his very first memories (at the age of 2) was him wanting to be one of Charlie's Angels.
• Arty’s father was in the army and he died. This made his mother very opposed to weapons and violence.
• When Arty went to school, his feminine nature became a huge problem. The children thought he had AIDS.
• When Arty’s family moved to a smaller town, the bullying got much worse. Not only was he a sissy boy, but he was a city nerd.
• Male figures frighten Arty. They were too rough and always wanted to fight. Arty had a lot more fun by having female friendships.
• Arty would have a fun time playing one-on-one with boys, but the moment another one showed up, they had to reject him and take on a more masculine role.
• Were there any other boys in Arty’s group that are now gay?
• Because Canada is such a hockey country, which is very violent in itself, a lot of the men Arty grew up with thought this behavior was normal.
• It’s the Canadian identity to watch people beat each other up.
• Arty was getting teased, bullied, and beat up regularly at school. He had enough. He ran away from home at 15.
• You see in the media how men act a certain way. Arty knew he would never be one of those guys. He knew that the world had no place for him.
• No matter how much gay acceptance there is in the world, it will always be hard for a teenage boy trying to find his way.
• People say being gay is an identity. It’s not. It’s a physiological reaction.
• There still isn’t proper representation in the media. Yes, there might be gay characters, but they’re a trope and not a real representation of gay people.
• Are gay men attracted to masculine traits?
• Some gay men have a total rejection of gay culture. Arty explains a little bit about the gay ghettos you’d find in cities back in the ’90s.
• There’s a lot of ambivalence when you discover there’s something different about you.
• When did Arty come to terms with his sexuality?
• If Arty was 15 today, how would he feel about coming out today?
• In today’s climate, Arty would identify as trans if he could at that age. He would have wanted to undergo a sex change, but he’s glad he has the body he has today.
• Not all feminine boys become attracted to the same sex.
• Although being gay has been decriminalized, it still feels like we’re living in the early days.
• How should parents react or best approach their child’s gender nonconformity?
• Finding yourself is hard. It’s part of being human.

This podcast is...

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