We hit record live from the floor at ISSA’s 2025 BusinessGrowth Strategies Conference in Chicago! In this special edition of HardRefresh, co-hosts Karina Neff and Caden Hutchens talkbusiness strategy, brand perception, and employee impact with special guestsfrom the field:

Alex Crowley, Vonachen Group

Brad Klein, Building Professionals of Texas

What’s better—unified brand strategy or specializedverticals? The answer might surprise you.

In This Episode:

Quick Control:

• Don’t miss CLX: Robotics & Automation on June 24
  Register here: https://us02web.zoom.us/meeting/register/zHuyXqp4Ta2DnqTveoB1tw#/registration

Clear Cache:

• Two truths and a lie: Legal surprises, drywall damage, andsports stadiums
• Vonachen Group’s journey from multi-brand fragmentation to a unified powerhouse across 14 states
• Why Brad built brands like EduClean and MediCleanunder one umbrella for sales psychology
• How verticals can boost perception and profits in cardealerships, churches, and medical spaces
• The key to growth: Focus, systems, and relationships—notjust charisma or cheap bids

💡 Hard Refresh is where the cleaning industry clears its cache—debunking bad tech habits, challenging tired narratives, and spotlighting operational excellence.

🎧 Subscribe & Follow HardRefresh on Spotify, YouTube, or wherever you get your podcasts.

Connect with the Hosts & Guests:Karina Neff – https://www.linkedin.com/in/karina-neff-01b0782a/Caden Hutchens – https://www.linkedin.com/in/caden-hutchens/Alex Crowley – https://www.linkedin.com/in/alex-crowley-14475798/Brad Klein – https://www.linkedin.com/in/brad-klein-c-b-s-e-2739b83/

🚽 Toilet talk—elevated. In this episode of Hard Refresh, hosts Karina Neff and Caden Hutchens dive deep (pun intended) into bathroom tech and brand psychology with Rob Poleki, Founder & CEO of Washie and self-proclaimed restroom revolutionary.

From his roots in government to a viral Shark Tank momentthat never aired, Rob shares how he turned a seemingly “crappy” problem into a category-defining smart toilet seat—and a cultural movement around restroom dignity.

In This Episode:

🔹 Clear Cache:

• The absorbent lie about toilet seat covers—and what we’ve all been doing wrong

• Washie’s origin story: from elected official to inventor of the first smart public toilet seat

• Delta Sky Club’s 5-star restroom experience and how it started with a single customer complaint

• The psychology of public restrooms (stall 3 is not the move)

• How Washie is using data and IoT to reinvent cleaning operations, reduce waste, and boost customer confidence

• The secret to sustainable restroom design—and why “sharticles” might be Rob’s greatest marketing moment

• 🚨 Washie Home is coming. Yes, for residential use.

🔹 Quick Control:

• Washie’s Free Trial Offer – For the month of June, facilities can try Washie free for 30 days

• ISSA Business Growth Strategies – June 10–11 in Chicago

Register here

Use code BGS10! for 10% off

• CLX: Robotics & Automation – June 24

Register here

• Last episode: AI, Autonomy & Robots with Brain Corp’s David Pinn

💡 Whether you're a facility manager, real estate operator, janitorial provider—or just a parent of teenage boys—this episode is for anyone who’s ready to rethink what clean really means in 2025.

🎧 Subscribe & Follow Hard Refresh on Spotify, YouTube, and your favorite podcast platform.

Connect with the Hosts & Guest:
Karina Neff – https://www.linkedin.com/in/karina-neff-01b0782a/
Caden Hutchens – https://www.linkedin.com/in/caden-hutchens/
Rob Poleki – https://www.linkedin.com/in/robpoleki/

🤖 It’s the most requested topic we’ve everhad—and we finally deliver! In this episode of Hard Refresh, hosts Karina Neff and Caden Hutchens welcome David Pinn, CEO of Brain Corp, for a deep dive into the future of robotics in the cleaning industry. From warehouse floors to Walmart supercenters, David shares how AI and robotics aretransforming facility management—without replacing frontline workers.

If you’ve ever wondered what the real impact of robots is on your team, your P&L, and your customer experience, thisconversation will reset your thinking.

In This Episode:

🔹 Quick Control:

• CLX Event on Robotics – June 24

👉 Register here: https://us02web.zoom.us/meeting/register/zHuyXqp4Ta2DnqTveoB1tw#/registration

• ISSA Business Growth Strategies – June 10–11 in Chicago (Acquisition, Retention & Expansion Workshop + Live Podcast)

👉 More info here: https://events.issa.com/events/2025-business-growth-strategies/

💥 Use code BGS10! for 10% off

• Recap: Funded or Fumbled with Brian Snow

• Next up: Rob Pilecki from Washi—don’t miss it!

🔹 Clear Cache:

• The myth of “full autonomy” and why robots aren’t replacing humans (yet)

• Why floor care is the perfect starting point for robotics in cleaning

• How Brain Corp partners with OEMs to create a premium experience

• The role of data, telematics, and analytics in scaling cleaning operations

• Building trust with frontline teams: training, motivation, and ongoing support

• From floor care to shelf-scanning: how “Automate the Aisle” is shaping the future of facility management

• ROI benchmarks: When does robotics make sense for your business?

🎯 Whether you’re a facility manager, BSC,or tech leader exploring the frontier of AI and automation, this episode offerspractical insights—and a vision for the road ahead.

🎧 Subscribe & Follow HardRefresh on Spotify, YouTube, and your favorite podcast platform.

Connect with David: https://www.linkedin.com/in/dpinn/
Connect with Karina: https://www.linkedin.com/in/karina-neff-01b0782a/
Connect with Caden: https://www.linkedin.com/in/caden-hutchens/

💰 Ever wonder what it takes to get real venture capital in the cleaning industry? In this episode of Hard Refresh, co-hosts Karina Neff and Caden Hutchens sit down with Brian Snow, Managing Partner at Impala Ventures, to break down how VC firms assess janitorial tech—and why most startups fumble before they’re funded.

From AI-powered cleaning sensors to robotic scrubbers, this episode reveals what investors are actually looking for, why grit matters more than pitch decks, and how the next decade of cleaning tech will be shaped by capital, culture, and clarity.

In This Episode:

🔹 Quick Control:

• CLX returns June 24 — Topic: Robotics 🤖

• Join our live Hard Refresh podcast + workshop at ISSA Business Growth Strategies (June 10–11, Chicago)👉 Register here

💥 Use code BGS10! for 10% off

• Upcoming July 15 webinar led by Gerald from BrightGo

🔹 Clear Cache:

• Inside Impala Ventures: how a family office targets built environment tech

• Why “janitorial tech” still struggles to scale—and how to fix it

• The truth about unicorn founders and the myth of instant funding

• What makes or breaks a startup founder (hint: it’s not the slide deck)

• How AI, robotics, and sensor-driven models are changing the game for frontline work

• Why your customers won’t pay for tech—so bake it into your service

• The hidden power of synergizing your portfolio and turning clients into investors

🎯 Whether you're a service provider exploring tech, a startup eyeing BSCs, or just curious about how VCs think—this episode is your playbook for making smarter innovation bets.

🎧 Subscribe & Follow Hard Refresh on Spotify, YouTube, and your favorite podcast platform to stay ahead of the curve.

Connect with Brian: https://www.linkedin.com/in/briansnow/
Connect with Karina: https://www.linkedin.com/in/karina-neff-01b0782a/
Connect with Caden: https://www.linkedin.com/in/caden-hutchens/

💻 As AI accelerates software development, more cleaning industry leaders are asking: Should we build our own software or buy off the shelf? In this episode, co-hosts Karina Neff and Caden Hutchens sit down with Ryan Ferons, Software Architect at Pioneer and the mind behind their proprietary platform Cora, to unpack the real pros and cons of building in-house.

Whether you’re drowning in spreadsheets, dreaming of custom tools, or struggling to get your team to use the tech you already have—this conversation will ground your thinking.

In This Episode:

🔹 Quick Control:

• Recap of Roasted by AI and More Software, More Problems with George Boutsalis

• Upcoming: Funded or Fumbled with Brian Snow

• CLX Virtual Series returns June 24 (Topic: Robotics 🤖)

• 🧠 Don’t miss our live podcast + workshop at the ISSA Business Growth Strategies event in Chicago – June 10–11

👉  Register here

💥 Use code BGS10! for 10% off

🔹 Clear Cache:

• The Build vs. Buy dilemma: cost, timeline, team dynamics, and cultural readiness

• Lessons from 8+ years and over $1M invested into Pioneer’s internal software journey

• What AI can (and can’t) do for software builders today• Why most companies should exhaust off-the-shelf options before going custom

• How to think about software ROI: acquisition, retention, and expansion

🎯 Whether you're a tech tinkerer, scaling operator, or just software-curious, this episode will give you a sobering but strategic lens to evaluate your next big tech move.

🎧 Subscribe & Follow Hard Refresh on Spotify, YouTube, and your favorite podcast platform to stay ahead of the curve.

Connect with Ryan: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ryan-ferons-92a04516/
Connect with Karina: https://www.linkedin.com/in/karina-neff-01b0782a/
Connect with Caden: https://www.linkedin.com/in/caden-hutchens/

💡 In this episode of Hard Refresh, hosts Karina Neff and Caden Hutchens sit down with George Boutsalis, President of Impact Cleaning Services, to explore the double-edged sword of software overload in the cleaning industry. George shares his family-run business journey, his evolution in tech strategy, and why sometimes, less really is more.

Whether you’re leading a cleaning operation or navigating acomplex tech stack, this episode will challenge your assumptions about “best in breed” vs. “all-in-one” and how to align your systems with growth.

In This Episode:

🔹 Quick Control:

• Preview of next week’s episode Funded or Fumbled with Brian Snow from Impala Ventures

• Upcoming What Are You Doing? Growth Workshop at the ISSA Business Growth Series in Chicago (June 10–11)

🔹 Clear Cache:

• “More Software, More Problems” – how George built a tech stack from scratch and why he's now rethinking it• The challenge of data silos and duplicative systems across cleaning operations

• Why communication—not structure—might be the key to a successful family business

👀 Plus, a hilarious round of Two Truths and a Lie involving vacuum tattoos, multilingual myths, and getting fired twice (by your dad no less).

🎧 Hard Refresh delivers sharp takes, honest insights, and tech-first strategies straight from the ISSA Tech & Innovation Committee.

🔗 Subscribe & Follow on Spotify,YouTube, or wherever you get your podcasts.

Connect with George: https://www.linkedin.com/in/georgeboutsalis/

Connect with Karina: https://www.linkedin.com/in/karina-neff-01b0782a/

Connect with Caden: https://www.linkedin.com/in/caden-hutchens/

🧠 In this lively episode, co-hosts Karina Neff and CadenHutchens blend laughs with insight as they explore how AI istransforming the cleaning industry—from frontline language translation to generative marketing strategy.

Oh, and did we mention they roast themselves with ChatGPT? Yep, this one’s equal parts humor and hard truths about embracing tech in today’s janitorial world.

In This Episode:

🔹 Quick Control:

Caden and Karina announce their upcoming growth hacking workshop at the ISSA Business Growth Strategies event in Chicago (June 11–12)

CLX follow-up and AI implementation stories from the field

🔹 Clear Cache:

The role of AI as a confidence booster for frontline teams and non-native English speakers• Real tools like ChatGPT, Claude, Lucidchart AI, Midjourney, and Plaud.AI for productivity, communication, and coaching

Why Generative Engine Optimization (GEO) is the new SEO—and how AI is reshaping search and decision-making

How to use AI for branding, email writing, sales coaching, prompt design, and field ops clarity

Creative use cases: AI as your Home Depot assistant, design reviewer, and macros builder

Caden’s hot take: AI isn't replacing you; it's exposing inefficiencies. Learn it—or get left behind

💡 Whether you’re a tech-forward operator or just starting your AI journey, this episode will give you practical use cases, laughs, and even a new sales tool to try.

🎧 Subscribe & Follow Hard Refresh on Spotify, YouTube, and your favorite podcast platforms for more candid conversations, practical strategies, and behind-the-scenes stories from the tech side of the cleaning industry.

Connect with Karina: https://www.linkedin.com/in/karina-neff-01b0782a/

Connect with Caden: https://www.linkedin.com/in/caden-hutchens/

🎙 This week on Hard Refresh, Karina Neff and Caden Hutchens are flying solo (and loving it)! No guest, just a candid conversation between your co-hosts—and some Two Truths and a Lie to kick it off. But don’t be fooled by the playful start—this episode digs into a serious topic: Is digital transformation just a buzzword, or are businesses truly changing?In This Episode:🔹 Quick Control:• Check out the newly released panel: The Great API Debate: Open Ecosystems vs. Walled Gardens• Preview of the next episode featuring Brain Corp — We Want Full Autonomy... Until We Don’t• Interested in joining the ISSA Tech & Innovation Committee? Reach out! Volunteers welcome🔹 Clear Cache:• "Digital transformation"—real change or just digitizing paper?• The crucial difference between digitization vs. transformation• Why companies must evolve culturally—not just technologically• Caden introduces the concept of going from chaos → order → automation• Karina breaks down how transformation is more than just picking the right tool—it’s about strategy, people, and process• How to prioritize tech decisions using Caden’s “triangle” method• Why AI adoption without foundational systems can do more harm than good💡 This episode is perfect for leaders trying to modernize operations, streamline systems, or avoid the traps of tech for tech’s sake.🎧 Subscribe & Follow Hard Refresh on Spotify, YouTube, and your favorite podcast platforms for more candid conversations, practical strategies, and behind-the-scenes stories from the tech side of the cleaning industry.

Connect with Karina: https://www.linkedin.com/in/karina-neff-01b0782a/

Connect with Caden: https://www.linkedin.com/in/caden-hutchens/Interested in serving on the ISSA Tech & Innovation Committee? Contact us to get involved.

In this episode of Hard Refresh, host Caden Hutchens and co-host Karina Neff sit down with Gerald Fong, CEO of BrightGo, to explore the powerful intersection of software development, APIs, and innovation in the commercial cleaning industry. Gerald shares his extensive insights into why APIs are critical for effective data management, seamless software integration, and how businesses can leverage technology to drive efficiency and growth.

Throughout the episode, Karina, Caden, and Gerald break down the ongoing debate between open ecosystems and walled gardens, highlighting how each approach impacts data accessibility, user experience, and overall system performance. The discussion further dives deep into the unique technologicalchallenges that cleaning industry businesses face, particularly focusing on data management complexities, user adoption barriers, and integration hurdles.

Highlighting the tension between businesses' desire for comprehensive, all-in-one solutions versus the practical reality of managing multiple specialized software systems, Gerald emphasizes the importance of strategic technology optimization. He advocates for adopting solutions that balance simplicity, robust functionality, and seamless API connections, providing users with optimized software experiences that cater specifically to their business needs.

The group also discusses critical issues related to onboarding challenges, emphasizing the need for intuitive, user-friendly software solutions designed with diverse user profiles and varying business sizes in mind. The conversation underscores the importance of thorough onboarding processes to facilitate easier software adoption and reduce the friction associated with switching software.

Listeners will gain valuable insights into how cleaning industry companies can better utilize existing data through effective technology adoption, improving both internal processes and customer satisfaction. Gerald emphasizes that software solutions should not compromise quality for ease of integration, reinforcing the importance of best-in-class applications connected seamlessly through APIs.

🔑 Key Takeaways:

The critical role of APIs in software integration and efficient data management

Advantages and limitations of open ecosystems vs. walled gardens in software development

Essential considerations for user-centric software design

Strategies for overcoming onboarding challenges and improving user adoption rates

Balancing single-platform simplicity with specialized, best-in-class solutions

Importance of seamless API connections for optimized technology utilization

Overcoming challenges related to software switching and maximizing existing software capabilities

🔗 Tune in and join the conversation for in-depth insights into business technology, software innovation, technology optimization, API development, and the future of software solutions tailored for the cleaning industry!

Connect with Gerald: https://www.linkedin.com/in/geraldfong/

Connect with Karina: ⁠https://www.linkedin.com/in/karina-neff-01b0782a/⁠

Connect with Caden: ⁠https://www.linkedin.com/in/caden-hutchens/

#API #SoftwareDevelopment #CleaningIndustry #CommercialCleaning #TechnologyInnovation #WalledGardens #DataManagement #BusinessSolutions #SoftwareIntegration #AllInOneSolutions #UserExperience#BusinessTechnology #TechnologyOptimization #OnboardingChallenges#SoftwareSwitching #TechnologyAdoption #IndustryInsights #UserCentricDesign #SoftwareInnovation #TechnologyUtilization #DataAccessibility #BestInClassSolutions #HardRefreshPodcast #ISSA

🎓 Training is back in the spotlight. In this episode of Hard Refresh, hosts Karina Neff and Caden Hutchens sit down with brothers Tony and Vince Maione from Core America and Smart Inspect to talk about something every cleaning organization faces—training that doesn’t stick.

With decades of consulting and field experience, Tony andVince unpack why training fails, what real training looks like, and how to avoid common pitfalls when implementing new technology. From shift-based rollouts to language barriers to forgotten Apple passwords—this episode is both tactical and relatable.

In This Episode:

🔹 Quick Control:

Recap: The ROI Fallacy with Jon Hill

Upcoming: The Great API Debate with Gerald from Brightco

CLX Virtual Series is off to a strong start—thanks to Tony and the committee

🔹 Clear Cache:

Why training needs to be personalized, not preached• The shift in the cleaning industry post-COVID and the leadership knowledge gap

The role of tech trainers, trainers of trainers, and in-house champions

How to align training with culture, strategy, and stakeholder needs

Real-life barriers: language, security, devices, data limits, and connectivity

The case for phased platform rollouts and building user confidence in layers.

💡 Whether you’re onboarding a new software platform, launching inspections, or improving culture, this episode offers battle-tested insights from the front lines of tech adoption and workforce training.

🎧 Subscribe & FollowHard Refresh on Spotify, YouTube, and your favorite podcast platforms for more candid conversations, practical strategies, and behind-the-scenes stories from the tech side of the cleaning industry.

Connect with Tony: https://www.linkedin.com/in/tony-maione-b3b28234/

Connect with Vince: https://www.linkedin.com/in/vincent-d-maione-47665325/

Connect with Karina: https://www.linkedin.com/in/karina-neff-01b0782a/

Connect with Caden: https://www.linkedin.com/in/caden-hutchens/