Haystacks & Hell

Support the Show • Part 2 of Santiago's interview with Dee. We discussed his questioning of Adventism and Christianity in general, Satanic Panic, his evolving perspectives on religion, and having empathy for believers. We also talked about Dee's move to Sweden, his childhood connection to Dr. Ben Carson, and how the Ben Carson on TV is not the same man Dee once knew.

Resources / Topics Mentioned: 
Song - I'm Afraid I'll Go to Heaven by Moon Walker 
Book - Inside Rock Music (SDA anti-rock propaganda) 
Artist - Erykah Badu 
Video - Erykah Badu NPR Tiny Desk Concert 
Article - Dr. Ben Carson 
Video - Carson 1997 National Prayer Breakfast Speech @ 34:53 
Video - Carson 2013 National Prayer Breakfast Speech @ 34:10

00:00 Intro 
01:05 Part 2 of Dee's Story 
02:34 The Historical Jesus 
04:42 Personal Tragedy and Realizations 
07:34 Why Do People Leave? 
13:47 Empathy for Believers 
21:41 Segregated Conferences 
26:17 Sweden, Racism, and CRT 
32:58 Music and Satanic Panic 
44:00 Dr. Ben Carson 
49:39 Moving to Sweden 
54:02 Ethics and Adventism 
1:05:37 Closing Thoughts
 

Full Transcripts, resources and more: hell.bio/notes 
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Credits: Music: Hall of the Mountain King Kevin MacLeod (incompetech.com) • Licensed under Creative Commons: By Attribution 3.0 License

Support the Show • Part 1 of Santiago's interview with Dee, a fourth-generation Seventh-day Adventist, about his SDA background, early baptism, education, and what led him out of the church. In our wide-ranging conversation, we discussed racial issues in Adventist schools, the Civil Rights Movement, and more.

Resources / Topics Mentioned: 

Video - We Are the World 
Topic - Public Enemy 
Film - Malcolm X (1992) 
Topic - Assassination of MLK Jr. 
Topic - Poor People's Campaign 
Topic - The 15 Year Battle for MLK Jr Day 
Video - MLK: "A riot is the language of the unheard" 
Topic - White Americans Celebrated MLK's Death 
Topic - Ronald Reagan's wartime lies
 

00:00 Intro
00:17 Meet Dee: 4th Gen Adventist
02:49 Early Memories & Fearing Ellen White
04:01 Questioning Church Teachings
09:02 A Life-Changing Tragedy
11:04 Living with Fear & Moving to Huntsville
19:01 Baptism and Religious Pressure
22:26 Purity Culture & Mixed Messages
28:51 Weird "Health Message" Fads
31:29 Racial Issues in Adventist Schools
38:11 Civil Rights, Division, MLK
43:30 Deconstructing Beliefs
47:02 How Othering Manipulates Us
53:07 The New Generation
55:29 Trickle Down Greedonomics
1:00:42 Dee's Adventist Education
1:07:16 Goodbye Oakwood, Hello Adulthood
1:11:26 Outro

Full Transcripts, resources and more: hell.bio/notes 
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Credits: Music: Hall of the Mountain King Kevin MacLeod (incompetech.com) • Licensed under Creative Commons: By Attribution 3.0 License

Support the Show • Part 2 of Santiago's interview with Rosei Quartz, a former Seventh-day Adventist pastor's kid, content creator, and Twitch streamer. In this episode, we cover more of Rosei's deconstruction, finding contentment and a new outlook on life, complementarianism, consent, mental health, becoming a content creator, and more.

Resources / Topics Mentioned: 
Links - Rosei Quartz's Links 
Podcast - Rosei Quartz's Podcast 
Topic - Complementarianism 
Topic - Attachment Styles 
Topic - Bill Gothard's "Umbrella of Protection" 
Reddit - ex-SDA comments on Gothard's Umbrella 
Topic - The FRIES Model of Consent 
Book - #ChurchToo: How Purity Culture Upholds Abuse and How to Find Healing 
Topic - Youth Wilderness / Troubled Teen Industry 
Topic - SWERF Definition 
Topic - BITE Model of Authoritarian Control 
Topic - Adventist GC "Human Sexuality Task Force" 
Podcast - S1B2 - Human Sexuality Task Force 
Topic - Weaponized Incompetence 
Podcast - The Dream (Examining MLMs)

00:00 Intro
00:17 Rosei's Deconstruction
05:16 Contentment and New Worldview
13:47 Complementarianism Hurts Everyone
20:36 Purity Culture & Consent
22:10 Journey into Online SW
28:10 Work is Work
32:27 Online SW vs. Traditional Work
36:33 SWERFs vs. Autonomy
45:04 Adventist Leadership
52:52 Advice for Leaving the Church
55:20 Where to Find Rosei 
57:22 Outro

Full Transcripts, resources and more: hell.bio/notes 
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Have a story to share? Write to us, send a DM or voice message on Instagram, or leave a voicemail at (301) 750-8648‬. We take your privacy seriously: Privacy Policy 
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Credits: Music: Hall of the Mountain King Kevin MacLeod (incompetech.com) • Licensed under Creative Commons: By Attribution 3.0 License

Support the Show • Santiago interviews Rosei Quartz, a former Seventh-day Adventist pastor's kid, content creator, and Twitch streamer. Rosei shares her Adventist upbringing, the pressures of parasocial relationships, and the high expectations placed upon her as a pastor’s kid. We cover her journey out of Adventism and how studying psychology played a big role.

Resources / Topics Mentioned: 
Links - Rosei Quartz's Links 
Podcast - Rosei Quartz's Podcast
Podcast - Armchair Expert - Cults (Rosei starts at 50:08)
Topic - Complementarianism
Book - #ChurchToo: How Purity Culture Upholds Abuse and How to Find Healing
Topic - LARPing
Topic - Startle Response
Topic - Cry Nights
Topic - Hypervigilance & Hyperawareness
Topic - Terror Management Theory
Topic - Thought-terminating cliché
Podcast - H&H S1:E4 - When Did You Learn About...
Playlist - Debunking Young Earth Creationism

00:00 Intro
00:13 Meet Rosei Quartz
01:17 SDA Family History & Early Memories
04:31 Sabbath Mornings
07:33 Pastor's Kid Pressures
17:48 Spiritual Manipulation & Content Creation
26:49 Health Message & Ellen White
30:28 "Spiritual Warfare" & Psychology
38:28 Terror Management Theory
41:55 Why Rosei Left Adventism
43:35 Harmful Beliefs & Pseudoscience
55:12 Crossing Ethical Boundaries
57:46 Ethics & Behavior Modification
1:00:37 High Demand Religion & Mental Health
1:05:11 Personal Growth Outside the Church
1:14:14 Outro

Full Transcripts, resources and more: hell.bio/notes 
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Have a story to share? Write to us, send a DM or voice message on Instagram, or leave a voicemail at (301) 750-8648‬. We take your privacy seriously: Privacy Policy 
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Credits: Music: Hall of the Mountain King Kevin MacLeod (incompetech.com) • Licensed under Creative Commons: By Attribution 3.0 License

Support the Show • Santiago shares some personal news, updates on the future of the show, and listener stories.

Resources / Topics Mentioned:

Slate: Why Do We Give Our Pets Death With Dignity but Not Ourselves? 
S1:E2 - Do You Believe in an Afterlife?
More Listener Stories 
Podcast Resources 
Book Resources

Full Transcripts, resources and more: hell.bio/notes 
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Have a story to share? Write to us, send a DM or voice message on Instagram, or leave a voicemail at (301) 750-8648‬. We take your privacy seriously: Privacy Policy 
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Credits: Music: Hall of the Mountain King Kevin MacLeod (incompetech.com) • Licensed under Creative Commons: By Attribution 3.0 License

Support the Show • Part 2 of Santiago's interview with Andres Pichinte (They/Them), a Gen Z ex-Adventist who went from fundamentalist Adventism and going door to door for two summers with Youth Rush, to exploring esotericism and now Orthodox Christianity. We discussed the sales tactics used by Youth Rush, the books they sold and beliefs they encountered, misadventures in door-to-door evangelism, and more.
 

Resources / Topics Mentioned:

Andres' Website & Bio 
Youth Rush Article - Spectrum Magazine

00:00 - Haystacks & Hell Intro
00:34 - Youth Rush Canvassing Sales Tactics
06:49 - Books and Beliefs
20:58 - Misadventures in Door-to-Door Evangelism
25:39 - From Fast Food to Film School
32:04 - Embracing Diversity and Finding Acceptance
37:28 - Exploring Orthodoxy
46:06 - Closing Thoughts
48:12 - Haystacks & Hell Outro

Full Transcripts, resources and more: hell.bio/notes 
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Have a story to share? Write to us, send a DM or voice message on Instagram, or leave a voicemail at (301) 750-8648‬. We take your privacy seriously: Privacy Policy 
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Credits: Music: Hall of the Mountain King Kevin MacLeod (incompetech.com) • Licensed under Creative Commons: By Attribution 3.0 License

Support the Dunk Family • Support the Show 
— 
Santiago interviews Andres Pichinte (They/Them), a Gen Z ex-Adventist who went from fundamentalist Adventism and going door to door for Youth Rush (for two summers), to exploring esotericism and now Orthodox Christianity. We talk about growing up Adventist, being surrounded by conspiracy theories, and moments that made them question their Adventist faith.

Resources / Topics Mentioned: 
Andres' Website & Bio 
The Hairbrush Song - Silly Songs with Larry 
His Cheeseburger - Love Songs with Mr. Lunt 
Youth Rush Article - Spectrum Magazine

Full Transcripts, resources and more: hell.bio/notes 
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Have a story to share? Write to us, send a DM or voice message on Instagram, or leave a voicemail at (301) 750-8648‬. We take your privacy seriously: Privacy Policy 
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Credits: Music: Hall of the Mountain King Kevin MacLeod (incompetech.com) • Licensed under Creative Commons: By Attribution 3.0 License

Support the Dunk Family • Support the Show 
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3rd and final part of Santiago's interview with Charlotte Hayes (Charli), a Gen-Z ex-Adventist. After escaping her abusive home, Charli discovered she didn't have proof of her U.S. citizenship, so she had to get a green card and worried about possibly being deported. We also discussed her journey of healing and leaving the faith she grew up in.

Charli's Links: 
TikTok @charli.hayes 
Instagram @charlihayes_ 
YouTube @charlihayes_

Resources / Topics Mentioned: 
Maskrosbarn ("Dandelion Child") 
Mental Health and Therapist Resources

Support for Victims of Abuse: 
RAINN - National Sexual Assault Hotline 
Childhelp - National Child Abuse Hotline 
The Hotline - National Domestic Violence Hotline

Full Transcripts, resources and more: hell.bio/notes 
— 
Have a story to share? Write to us, send a DM or voice message on Instagram, or leave a voicemail at (301) 750-8648‬. We take your privacy seriously: Privacy Policy 
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Twitter • TikTok • Instagram • YouTube • Facebook 
— 
Credits: Music: Hall of the Mountain King Kevin MacLeod (incompetech.com) • Licensed under Creative Commons: By Attribution 3.0 License

Support the Dunk Family • Support the Show
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Part 2 of Santiago's interview with Charlotte Hayes (Charli), a Gen-Z ex-Adventist. She was adopted from Russia and brought to the U.S. as a baby by an Adventist couple. Growing up, Charli experienced horrific things at home. The police and Child Protective Services investigated, but nothing happened, so she ran away from home at 18. She now has over 500k people on TikTok who have been following her life story.

Charli's Links: 
TikTok @charli.hayes 
Instagram @charlihayes_ 
YouTube @charlihayes_

Resources / Topics Mentioned:  
Little Duck Diner - Savannah, GA 
Hostel in the Forest - Brunswick, GA 
Hostelworld - Find hostels around the world

Support for Victims of Abuse: 
RAINN - National Sexual Assault Hotline 
Childhelp - National Child Abuse Hotline 
The Hotline - National Domestic Violence Hotline

Full Transcripts, resources and more: hell.bio/notes 
— 
Have a story to share? Write to us, send a DM or voice message on Instagram, or leave a voicemail at (301) 750-8648‬. We take your privacy seriously: Privacy Policy 
— 
Twitter • TikTok • Instagram • YouTube • Facebook 
— 
Credits: Music: Hall of the Mountain King Kevin MacLeod (incompetech.com) • Licensed under Creative Commons: By Attribution 3.0 License

Support the Dunk Family • Support the Show 
— 
Santiago interviews Charlotte Hayes (Charli), a Gen-Z ex-Adventist. She was adopted from Russia and brought to the U.S. as a baby by an Adventist couple. Growing up, Charli experienced emotional, physical, and sexual abuse at home. The police and Child Protective Services investigated, but nothing happened, so she ran away from home at 18. She now has over 500k people on TikTok who have been following her life story.

Charli's Links: 
TikTok @charli.hayes 
Instagram @charlihayes_ 
YouTube @charlihayes_

Resources / Topics Mentioned: 
VeggieTales - Jericho Slushies 
Battle (Genocide) of Jericho - Wikipedia 
IBLP - Wikipeda 
Shiny Happy People: Duggar Family Secrets 
Alisa Williams' Thread on SDAs & Shiny Happy People
Katie Morton - Licensed Therapist, YouTuber 
Religious Trauma-informed Therapists & Other Resources

Support for Victims of Abuse: 
RAINN - National Sexual Assault Hotline 
Childhelp - National Child Abuse Hotline 
The Hotline - National Domestic Violence Hotline

Kati Morton Videos: 
Abuse Topic Playlist 
Sexual Abuse: How do we recover & how long does it take? 
What is Consent, Assault & Harassment? 
What's considered sexual abuse? 
Struggling with childhood sexual abuse? 
Healing from Sexual Abuse & Incest

Full Transcripts, resources and more: hell.bio/notes 
— 
Have a story to share? Write to us, send a DM or voice message on Instagram, or leave a voicemail at (301) 750-8648‬. We take your privacy seriously: Privacy Policy 
— 
Twitter • TikTok • Instagram • YouTube • Facebook 
— 
Credits: Music: Hall of the Mountain King Kevin MacLeod (incompetech.com) • Licensed under Creative Commons: By Attribution 3.0 License