What if the key to influence isn’t knowing—but admitting you don’t? Could the most powerful leaders be the ones most willing to learn and be changed by what they hear?

In this episode, former wartime interrogator Eric Maddox and business president David White reveal how empathetic listening proved equally effective in the hunt for Saddam Hussein and in rebuilding trust with a frustrated community. Together, they show that genuine influence begins when we let go of needing to know and instead listen with deep curiosity and care to the people closest to the problem.

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