Imaginary Worlds

One of the most common tropes in fantasy genres is personifying Death – turning this abstract and often terrifying concept into a character that people can interact with. Sometimes Death is portrayed as a Grim Reaper, but Death doesn’t have to be grim. Death can be compassionate, and even funny. And more often in recent years, Death has been depicted as someone with deeply ambivalent feelings about their job. I talk with listeners about their favorite portrayals of Death from Discworld to Sandman to Dead Like Me, and why imagining Death as a character changed the way they felt about death and grief. 

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List of media mentioned in this episode:

The Sandman comics and Netflix series

Dead Like Me

Discworld novels by Terry Pratchett

Death With Interruptions by Jose Saramago

On A Pale Horse by Piers Anthony

The Book Thief by Markus Zusak

Critical Role podcast

The Seventh Seal

Bill and Ted’s Bogus Journey

Monty Python and The Meaning of Life

Personification of Death academic study from 2019

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The stories we tell about the past can determine the way we understand the present. But what happens when we combine tales of magic and fantasy with some of the most traumatic chapters in history? I talk with novelists P. Djeli Clark, Nisi Shawl, and Zen Cho about how speculative fiction can be a useful tool to reimagine the legacy of colonialism and imperialism. Plus, we hear readings from actress Nneka Okoye.

Books mentioned in this episode:

Nisi also recommends:

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In part 2 of our mini-series on mentorships, we travel to a galaxy far, far away. Amy Richau (co-author of Star Wars; I am Your Father and other Star Wars-related books) talks about her favorite partnerships between the Jedi and other characters in the Star Wars found family. Blogger Angry Staff Officer explains why the rigid rules for Jedi mentorships may have led to the downfall of the Jedi Council. And Ryan Arey of ScreenCrush says we can see how the rival philosophies of The Jedi and The Sith would play out in the real world on the show Cobra Kai, which imagines the rivalries from The Karate Kid being passed down to the next generation.

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In the first of a two-part episode on mentors in fantasy genres, we look at the roles of superheroes and their protégées. Matt Fraction talks about the inspiration for his acclaimed comic book series Hawkeye: My Life as a Weapon, which was adapted into a Disney+ series. University of Oregon professor Ben Saunders explains why Peter Parker needs an endless series of mentors. Hellenic College Holy Cross professor Stamatia Dova explains why all these fantasy mentors can be traced back to the character of Mentor in The Odyssey. And Julie Nugent, senior VP of learning and advisory services at Catalyst, discusses how superhero mentorships reflect the way mentoring plays out in the workplace.

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When the artist Cliff Chiang co-created the comic book series Paper Girls, about four suburban kids in the ‘80s who get caught up in forces that can break space and time, he thought they’d come up with something totally original. But soon after the comic book came out, Stranger Things debuted on Netflix. Both creative projects are part of a genre that’s more popular than ever: Kids on Bikes. I talk with Cliff about why he wanted Paper Girls to stand out from other Kids on Bikes stories. Screenwriter Stephany Folsom discusses how she adapted Paper Girls into an Amazon Prime Video live-action show by pitching it as “anti-nostalgia.” I also talk with game designers Jon Gilmour and Doug Levandowski about how they distilled the elements of Kids on Bikes stories into a role-playing game, and whether the genre is ready to outgrow its 1980s setting.

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It’s not often that I’m watching a TV show and I think, “I should ask the writers about that.” Luckily, I was in the same undergraduate film program as Henry Alonso Myers and Bill Wolkoff, who are writers and producers on the Star Trek series Strange New Worlds, and they were happy to chat. We cover the challenge of telling new stories about legacy characters like Spock and Uhura, the need for Star Trek to stay politically relevant, why Captain Pike is really into cooking and hijinks are the most logical course of action during a Vulcan courtship.

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I’ve long been fascinated by automatons – wind up mechanical beings that create the illusion of life. People have been making automatons for centuries, but how many automatons get to sing opera? This week’s episode comes from the podcast Aria Code from WQXR, WNYC Studios and The Metropolitan Opera. The show breaks down famous arias and looks at the meaning behind them. Host Rhiannon Giddens, along with Soprano Erin Morley, conductor Johannes Debus, machine learning researcher Caroline Sinders, and psychologist Robert Epstein explore Jacques Offenbach’s 1881 opera The Tales of Hoffmann and how its automated character Olympia echoes current day concerns about A.I. technology.

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Our Flag Means Death is a hilarious anachronistic pirate comedy on HBO Max. But the backstory of its main characters is surprisingly real. I talk with pirate historian Jeremy Moss, Purdue professor Manushag Powell and Jamie Goodall, staff historian at the U.S. Army Center of Military History, about how the historical figure of Blackbeard used theatricality to become a media phenomenon, and why it was an easy transition for people to believe he was a fantasy character versed in the dark arts. And we look at whether the endearing portrayal of the bumbling “gentleman pirate” Stede Bonnet in Our Flag Means Death is leaving out a crucial aspect of his backstory. To learn more, check out these books:

British Pirates in Print and Performance by Manushag N. Powell

The Life and Tryals of the Gentleman Pirate, Major Stede Bonnet by Jeremy R. Moss

Pirates of the Chesapeake Bay: From the Colonial Era to the Oyster Wars by Jamie L.H. Goodall

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When I began this podcast in September 2014, I couldn’t imagine myself someday celebrating 200 episodes of Imaginary Worlds. It feels like a momentous occasion, a moment to reflect and celebrate. So, I put together a super-sized episode where I check in on creative people that I’ve interviewed in the past. We also hear from listeners about where they listen to the show, and how those places evoke imaginary worlds for them. Featuring Caro Murphy, Jason Suran, Tim Lapetino, Shari Spiros of AdMagic, and Scot and Jane Noel of DreamForge magazine. You can learn more about Jason's show Reconnected here.

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Mystery Science Theater 3000 or MST3K is back once again. The show was first created by Joel Hodgson, then a stand-up comedian who was ambivalent about the career path laid out in clubs or maybe a sitcom. His premise -- that he and a few robot pals are trapped by mad scientists on a spaceship and forced to watch bad movies – turned the show into a cult classic and helped define a snarky, self-aware sense of humor for pop culture in the ‘90s. I talk with Joel about why he left the initial run of the series, and how he's brought it back on his own streaming service called Gizmoplex. We also explore how his sense of humor has changed, and whether he might have been too harsh on some of the films they lampooned.

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