Infectious Historians

Richard McKay (University of Cambridge) talks to Merle and Lee about his work on the history of the HIV/AIDS epidemic, with a particular focus on Patient Zero and the history of the disease. After speaking about the problematic idea of the term Patient Zero, including its chance development, he discusses the early history of the epidemic and its popularization in broader public culture. He then turns to how these public perceptions of HIV/AIDS, and Covid, shape policy responses to disease along with some possible ways forward for historians to engage in public work in the future.

Stephanie Marciniak (Penn State University) joins Merle and Lee to discuss some of the fascinating developments in studying historical diseases from a scientific perspective: ancient DNA and more broadly paleogenetics. Stephanie provides some context for this research approach, before touching upon several related topics: the process of researching ancient DNA, the diseases that we can (or cannot) identify in human remains, some of the research questions that interest ancient DNA scientists, and a few issues concerning numbers of remains and of positive identifications of disease.

Janet Kay (Princeton University) talks to Merle and Lee for a special episode about preparing to teach her “Art & Archaeology of Plague” during the upcoming Spring 2021 semester. She discusses her planning for the broad chronological range of her course that runs from the Plague of Athens (c. 430 BCE) to Covid-19, while introducing Plague Simulations, an innovative set of assignments, and several guest lectures by colleagues. Janet then talks about why she thought this was a perfect time to offer a course like this and how she hopes it will help students think about disease and pandemics of the past while reflecting on our world today. At the end, she promises to come back at the end of the semester and talk about how the course went.

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Lukas Engelmann (University of Edinburgh) joins Merle and Lee to discuss the history of epidemiology. The conversation begins by thinking about epidemiology as a discipline as well as the gap between the discipline and scholars who use epidemiology. After discussing the development of epidemiology, including in the context of Covid-19, the interview moves to reflect upon infectious disease models, which have become especially popular in the recent pandemic. Some of the advantages and disadvantages of models are discussed, as well as some of the different approaches in how to evaluate them.

Adia Benton (Northwestern University) talks to Merle and Lee about the West African Ebola outbreak in 2014 and why that disease in particular has terrified Western audiences since the late 20th century. After discussing the basics on what Ebola is, where it was discovered, and where it is found today, Adia expands upon its recent large outbreak in West Africa. She then examines why so little time was spent on caring for people who got sick with it and why Ebola has such a powerful sway over popular imagination. She then outlines what she calls racial immuno-logic before reflecting on Ebola and Covid at the end of the episode.

Chinmay Tumbe (Indian Institute of Management Ahmedabad) talks to Merle and Lee about his new book, The Age of Pandemics, that reveals the story of how three pandemics - cholera, plague and influenza - have significantly affected India over the course of the long 19th century, resulting in episodes of mass mortality. He first discusses some background on all three pandemics and then turns to why they have not had significant historical scholarship on them over the last century. Chinmay then offers thoughts on new ways to approach the history of pandemics moving forward. At the end, he turns to the process of writing the book during Covid.

Merle and Lee record their final episode for 2020 in which they cover a recently published article of theirs. The article, published in the American Historical Review, examines how scholars thought about the Justinianic Plague over the past century and a half. While the scholarly interpretation of plague increased to include more deaths over a longer period and a wider geographical scope, Merle and Lee argue that a more critical analysis reveals that much of this understanding is based on limited evidence and can be better explained through what they term as “the plague concept” - the difference between what plague actually did and our assumptions of what plague should do, by its definition - which often tend towards exaggeration. The discussion therefore examines the changing mortality of plague alongside its different chronology and geographic scope, and then touches upon a couple of truisms - our almost automatic association of the plague with rats and climate which tends to oversimplify the evidence. Merle and Lee wrap up with a discussion of some potential next steps in research on the Justinianic Plague.

Guy Beiner (Ben-Gurion University of the Negev) talks to Merle and Lee about his work on the memory and forgetting of the 1918 Influenza Pandemic. Guy first provides background about the impact of the Influenza Pandemic and offers an introduction to memory studies and social forgetting while pointing to problems with concepts such as collective memory. During the discussion Guy examines how historical events are remembered, then surveys the different ways academics and the public have discussed the 1918 Influenza in the past century. He highlights key moments that increased attention to the topic, such as the publication of Alfred Crosby’s book on the topic or the 1968 “Hong Kong Flu”. Finally, Guy reflects upon the most recent wave of attention to the 1918 pandemic during the present-day Covid pandemic.

John McNeill (Georgetown University) speaks with Merle and Lee about the changes to environmental and disease history over the last half century. After laying out his definition of environmental history, John discusses the background of the field, then reflects on how different chronological and geographical fields use sources along with how this may change moving forward. Following the previous episode, the question of agency of non-humans is raised again. The conversation touches upon other issues as well - collaboration, how it works and how it may change in the discipline of history. The question of engaging public audiences for example through writing for non-specialists, or creating podcasts and documentaries.

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Susan Jones (University of Minnesota) talks to Merle and Lee about the role of animals in the spread of diseases and how these diseases can spill over from animals to humans. After laying out some background on the topic, she discusses her new work on “Plague Homelands” in Soviet central Asia during the 20th century. Susan talks about how the Soviet state first attempted to eliminate and then control the spread of plague in various regions, with the implications for people, animals, and the environment. At the end, she reflects upon how her unique background, a doctorate in veterinary medicine in addition to a doctorate in the history of science, shapes the questions she asks about historical sources and animals.