In this episode of Psyche Podcast, I sit down with scholar and writer Jill Carroll to discuss her bold and provocative book The Savage Side: Reclaiming Violent Models of God. We dive deep into Jill’s intellectual and spiritual journey—from her Pentecostal upbringing and seminary days at Oral Roberts University to her transformative encounter with Annie Dillard’s writings and her eventual doctoral work at Rice University under the guidance of Edith Wyschogrod.

Jill shares how her own doubts led her to question traditional theological frameworks and ultimately reimagine the divine—not as a domesticated or anthropomorphic projection, but as a force rooted in the raw, majestic, and sometimes brutal reality of the cosmos. We talk about nature, violence, feminist theology, atheism, and the possibility of a “savage spirituality” that doesn’t flinch from the truth of suffering and death.

This conversation pushed me to confront some of my own theological assumptions, and I think it might do the same for you. Whether you’re a believer, a skeptic, or somewhere in between, this episode offers a powerful meditation on what it means to live meaningfully in a world where nature is both breathtaking and indifferent.