This week's Making It Up is extra-special as it features Tim Booth, lead singer and lyricist of James, a British band who has been performing for over 40 years and has sold more than 25 million albums globally (James is also Carter’s absolute favorite band, making Tim one of his personal heroes). You may have seen quotes from James songs as epigraphs in many of Carter’s novels, which is how he got to know Tim. After a decade in the making, Tim's brilliant debut novel, When I Died For the First Time, just released in the U.K. and is set for a U.S. launch in July 2024.

Among other things, Tim and Carter discuss seeking out art and culture as a kid, how improvisation and editing are large parts of Tim’s lyricism, and how having an established audience affects confidence in writing. At the end of their conversation, they make up an incredibly descriptive story using a line from David Mitchell’s Slade House.