The May 21st, 2025 episode of MC Fireside Chats, hosted by Brian Searl, convened a panel of esteemed recurring and special guests to delve into pivotal topics within the outdoor hospitality and recreation industry. The familiar voices joining the conversation included Mike Harrison of CRR Hospitality, a company focused on owning and operating luxury upscale RV and glamping resorts, as well as providing third-party consulting. Ali Rasmussen, co-founder of Spacious Skies Campgrounds, which owns and operates campgrounds along the East Coast from Maine to Georgia, also returned, expressing enthusiasm for the upcoming season. Rounding out the recurring panel was Jeff Hoffman from Camp Strategy, a consulting firm dedicated to helping campground owners achieve profitability. This episode welcomed two special guests. Heidi Doyle from Utility Supply Group (USG) introduced her company as a key electrical distributor for the outdoor hospitality sector, serving RV parks, campgrounds, marinas, and glamping resorts. Heidi emphasized USG’s commitment to not just supplying products but also ensuring safety and compliance by actively working with the National Electric Code and UL standards for power outlets. The second special guest was Jim Omstrom, co-founder of Open Road Resorts. Jim shared that Open Road Resorts owns a growing portfolio of campgrounds across the United States, including locations near Dallas, Santa Fe, West Yellowstone, and Omaha, with a focus on acquiring and developing more properties. Before diving into the special guest segments, Brian prompted the recurring panelists for any pressing industry topics. Mike Harrison immediately highlighted the continued and accelerating growth of Artificial Intelligence (AI) in the camping sector. He referenced a recent generational camping report indicating that 30% of campers have already used AI for search, a figure expected to rise to 75% in the coming years. Mike stressed the importance for industry players to stay ahead of the curve as generative search and Google’s prioritization of AI are set to revolutionize how campers find and book their stays. Jeff Hoffman echoed Mike’s sentiments, noting the rapid learning capabilities of AI and its daily improvements, particularly when actively trained. Ali Rasmussen added her experience, mentioning a demo she encountered built within ChatGPT that functioned as an itinerary and trip planner for one of their campground locations, showcasing the practical applications of AI for enhancing guest services. Beyond AI, Ali Rasmussen, also a board member of OHI (Outdoor Hospitality Industry), brought a critical legislative issue to the forefront: the Credit Card Competition Act. She explained that this bipartisan bill aims to address the duopoly of Visa and MasterCard, which has led to escalating credit card swipe fees – a significant expense for campground owners, often ranking in their top five operational costs. Ali detailed the unique impact on campgrounds, where multiple transactions (booking, changes, cancellations, re-bookings) can incur non-refundable swipe fees, even when guests are refunded. Mike Harrison and Jeff Hoffman shared that they had previously lobbied in Washington D.C. on this very issue, underscoring its importance. They urged listeners to visit OHI’s social media pages for links to contact their representatives and voice their support for the act, emphasizing that it affects all businesses accepting credit cards, not just RV parks. Heidi Doyle mentioned that for Utility Supply Group’s larger transactions, credit card fees are often passed on to the customer, while smaller orders’ fees are absorbed. Brian acknowledged the pervasiveness of these fees, even with third-party payment systems. The conversation then shifted to a deeper dive with the special guests. Heidi Doyle elaborated on Utility Supply Group’s long-standing presence in the industry, noting their 26-year history initiated by Wade Elliot. She explained USG’s unique approach of primarily connecting with customers through trade shows and conferences rather than traditional advertising, valuing their loyal customer base. A core philosophy for USG, instilled by Wade, is to be a resource and ensure customers get the right products, especially for those new to the industry or specific electrical components. Heidi highlighted their expertise in the National Electric Code and NFPA 1194, positioning USG as more than just a seller. Key products offered include pedestals, surface mount boxes, distribution panels, transformers, wire, site amenities like lighting, and increasingly, solutions for EV charging. She also discussed the growing importance of electrical metering (sub-metering) to help campgrounds recoup utility expenses and encourage conservation, differentiating between “dumb” meters requiring manual reads and “smart” meters that integrate with reservation systems. Jeff Hoffman inquired about the potential for USG to develop water metering solutions, to which Heidi responded that while they offer basic water meters, USG currently focuses on electrical distribution and is not primarily a software developer, though they are aware of companies like Wild Energy exploring integrated solutions. Next, Jim Omstrom shared the origin story of Open Road Resorts, which began as a “midlife crisis” entrepreneurial venture with his business partner, Chase, around 2018. Leveraging their backgrounds in public equity investment and a shared passion for the outdoors, they acquired their first park in Dallas. After a pause and operational refinement during the COVID-19 pandemic, Open Road Resorts partnered with consumer private equity fund L Catterton, RV manufacturer THOR Industries (owner of Airstream and Jayco), and two other family offices to fuel their growth. Jim articulated that the brand “Open Road Resorts” aims to address the inconsistent experiences often encountered in the RV park industry. While each park retains its unique local feel, the goal is to provide a consistently clean, safe, highly amenitized, and family-friendly environment with excellent customer service. When Brian asked about the 10-year vision, Jim stated the focus is on continued brand building, team expansion, and acquiring great parks to build a national network. Discussing operational approaches, Jim explained their model of having a General Manager at each park who reports to a central operations team. This sparked a broader discussion among the multi-park operators. Ali Rasmussen shared Spacious Skies Campgrounds’ journey, from initially attempting a model where regional managers also managed a home campground, to their current structure of three regional directors overseeing GMs and reporting directly to her. They’ve intentionally trimmed layers to maintain control and efficiency. Jeff Hoffman emphasized the importance of building a solid foundational structure for scalability, noting that while technology like cloud-based PMS and accounting systems has made remote management easier, finding the right people remains the biggest challenge. Mike Harrison added that there’s no one-size-fits-all operational model, and what works depends on the specific properties, revenue, and stage of growth, sharing that CRR Hospitality also pivots its structure based on circumstances. Ali Rasmussen then queried Jim Omstrom about the unique partnership with THOR Industries. Jim explained their pre-existing relationship with THOR’s management team from their public equity days. When Open Road Resorts decided to accelerate growth, they approached THOR, who saw an opportunity to strategically partner and help shape the campground experience, potentially testing new concepts. As an example, Jim mentioned an “Airstream-only” section, or “camp Airstream,” being piloted at their West Yellowstone park. This led to a discussion about the RVIA Campground Coalition’s efforts to foster communication between manufacturers and campground owners, particularly concerning the increasing size and electrical demands of new RVs, and how campgrounds, especially older ones, can keep pace with infrastructure needs. Heidi Doyle noted that, as of 2022, THOR had no immediate plans for 100-amp RVs, which would require new electrical pedestal designs. The final major topic was the significant advancements in AI search, spurred by recent Google I/O announcements. Brian presented a short video showcasing Google’s new “AI Mode,” a complete re-imagining of search that moves beyond the traditional 10 blue links to a personalized, generative AI-driven experience. This mode will allow for longer, more complex queries and even enable “agents” like Project Mariner to perform tasks on the user’s behalf, including making purchases. Brian stressed that this will dramatically impact how campgrounds are discovered and booked, affecting website traffic (likely decreasing overall traffic but increasing conversion rates of qualified leads) and user interaction. Heidi Doyle asked about the implications for keywords and search strategies. Brian explained that the shift is towards longer, conversational queries, and that AI itself will increasingly interpret and refine user intent, making traditional keyword targeting less relevant. The focus, he advised, should be on high-quality content, user experience, site architecture (like schema markup), and brand trust signals (like press releases and social mentions). Jim Omstrom inquired if anyone was exploring “AI SEO,” to which Mike Harrison and Brian confirmed they were actively working on these strategies, emphasizing that a blend of traditional SEO and new AI-focused approaches is currently necessary. The discussion highlighted the personalized nature of AI search results, with different users receiving different recommendations based on their implicit and explicit preferences, making foundational website best practices even more critical. As the episode concluded, each guest provided their final thoughts and where listeners could learn more about their respective organizations. Heidi Doyle directed listeners to Utility Supply Group’s presence in Woodall’s and their social media. Ali Rasmussen pointed to spaciousskiescampgrounds.com and their social channels, mentioning their current exciting phase of seeking new partners. Jeff Hoffman invited inquiries through campstrategy.com. Jim Omstrom encouraged visits to openroadresorts.com for information on their parks. Brian Searl wrapped up the show, thanking his guests and promoting his other podcast, Outwired, which would further delve into AI announcements and RV park guest demographics.

In a recent episode of MC Fireside Chats, host Brian Searl of Insider Perks kicked off the conversation by lightheartedly addressing his scratchy voice and acknowledging the absence of several regular panelists, including Joe Duemig, who was attending a conference in Australia, Scott Foos, who had a meeting, and Kevin Thueson, who was traveling. Despite these absences, Searl enthusiastically introduced the two featured guests: John Handy, co-owner of Treebones Resort, and Devon Towle, Founder and CEO of Global Glamping, also known as Sir Glamps-a-lot. John Handy shared the 20-year journey of establishing Treebones Resort in Big Sur with his wife Corinne. He recounted the serendipitous rezoning of their oceanfront property to commercial use and their subsequent decade-long exploration of creating a unique lodging experience. Handy explained that the concept of “glamping” didn’t even exist when they began, but their vision was to offer an experience that combined the closeness to nature of camping with the comforts of a hotel, leading them to discover yurts. He highlighted the significant financial risks they undertook with business and construction loans, contrasting their approach with the revenue-sharing models discussed later. Handy emphasized that the success of Treebones lies in its unique location, the dedicated on-site staff, and the array of amenities, including fine dining with a sushi bar and lodge restaurant, massage, yoga, a pool, spa, and jacuzzi, all while maintaining a low carbon footprint. Devon Towle, or Sir Glamps-a-lot, detailed his entrepreneurial journey, starting from a background in architecture and housing consultation to founding Global Glamping. He shared how his initial foray into glamping began with a single yurt on raw land in Montana, which surprisingly led to recognition as one of the best Hipcamps in the state. This experience highlighted the potential of the industry and the need for guidance, prompting him to establish Global Glamping. Towle proudly mentioned the company’s growth to 15 resorts with over a hundred short-term rentals and their specialization in eco-tourism development. He was particularly excited to be calling in from their Guardian Ranch location in San Diego, showcasing 3D-printed tiny houses from Azure Printed Homes, emphasizing the rapid construction and eco-friendly nature of these units made from recycled materials. The conversation then shifted to the topic of bootstrapping versus seeking investment capital. Towle shared his experience of creatively financing his ventures, including a “Glamping Rev Share” model that allowed him to partner with landowners and structure providers. He emphasized that the barrier to entry in glamping can be significantly lower than traditional real estate investments, allowing entrepreneurs to start with modest means and grow creatively. Searl resonated with this, sharing his own experiences of building his business without significant initial investment and highlighting the flexibility and potential rewards of a bootstrapped approach. Both Handy and Towle agreed on the importance of agility and the ability to pivot in business. Handy used a compelling ship analogy, stating that a ship in a harbor is safe but not fulfilling its purpose, and that forward motion is necessary for steering. He shared examples of unforeseen challenges like road closures and economic shifts that require constant adaptation. Towle echoed this, emphasizing that nothing ever goes exactly to plan and that perseverance and the willingness to pivot are crucial for entrepreneurs in the often unpredictable world of eco-tourism and glamping. The discussion touched upon the role of technology in their businesses. Handy highlighted how Starlink internet and advancements in battery storage systems have been game-changers for Treebones, especially given their off-grid location. He also spoke about their adoption of Azure 3D-printed homes as an eco-conscious lodging option. Towle also emphasized the speed to market and cost-effectiveness of the 3D-printed homes. Both expressed excitement about future technological advancements, including the potential of AI in design and 3D printing. Searl raised the topic of disconnecting in a hyper-connected world, sharing his own recent experience of the benefits of unplugging. Handy recounted a story about the Wall Street Journal inquiring about their “prepare to unplug” message from their early days, noting the initial resistance from some guests but also the eventual appreciation for the opportunity to disconnect. He mentioned that while technology has advanced at Treebones, they still maintain areas where guests can intentionally unplug. Looking towards the future, Handy expressed that Treebones Resort would remain family-owned and operated, with the next generation taking on leadership roles. He emphasized their commitment to maintaining the essence of Treebones – perching lightly on the land, living simply, and connecting with nature – even as they evolve. Towle shared his vision for Global Glamping, aiming to create affordable, eco-friendly living communities and develop a gamified app to enhance the ecotourism experience. He expressed a long-term goal of securing larger-scale funding to expand these communities for midterm and long-term living, promoting a lifestyle connected to nature and entrepreneurship. In closing, Searl expressed his admiration for the work of both Handy and Towle, predicting a bright future for their ventures and the eco-tourism industry as a whole. He underscored the power of inspiring others through their innovative approaches to hospitality and sustainable living.

In a recent episode of MC Fireside Chats, host Brian Searl led a comprehensive discussion on the evolving landscape of the outdoor hospitality and recreation industry. The episode featured recurring guests, industry experts who appear regularly on the show, and special guests who brought specific insights to the conversation. Recurring guests Scott Bahr, Simon Neal, and Mark Koep offered their perspectives on current trends and challenges. Mark Koep, in particular, focused on the growing influence of Artificial Intelligence (AI) and its implications for marketing strategies within the industry. He argued that traditional methods, such as relying heavily on Google search, may become less effective as AI-driven search results gain prominence. Brian Searl expanded on this point, noting the increasing sophistication of AI and its capacity to generate synthetic data, which could further disrupt established online business models. The guests emphasized the importance of campground owners and operators staying informed about AI and adapting their strategies to remain competitive. The discussion then shifted to the physical aspects of campgrounds, with Scott Bahr raising questions about the trend towards developing very large RV parks. He expressed concern about their long-term sustainability and whether they might become obsolete like shopping malls. This sparked a broader conversation about the ideal size and design of campgrounds, with panelists weighing the benefits of large-scale operations against the appeal of more intimate, niche-focused experiences. Mary Arlington, a special guest with extensive experience in the campground industry, shared her insights on this topic. She acknowledged the existence of very large parks but emphasized that many successful campgrounds focus on creating a strong sense of community and catering to specific customer needs. Another special guest, Brian Linton, contributed to the discussion by providing a perspective from the glamping sector. He explained that glamping sites, which often involve more luxurious accommodations than traditional camping, can be economically viable even with a smaller number of sites. Linton also highlighted the importance of storytelling and creating engaging content to attract guests. Simon Neal, a recurring guest from Europe, offered a different viewpoint, describing the European campground market and its unique characteristics. He noted the prevalence of seasonal travel and the trend towards investing in high-quality amenities to enhance the guest experience. Neal also discussed the concept of organizing campgrounds into distinct “neighborhoods” to cater to diverse preferences. The episode also explored ancillary revenue streams for campgrounds, such as pet-related services. Guests shared ideas for offering pet amenities and products to enhance the customer experience and generate additional income. Furthermore, the panelists considered the potential impact of emerging technologies like VR and AR on the outdoor hospitality industry. While acknowledging that these technologies are unlikely to replace traditional camping experiences, they discussed their potential for marketing and attracting new customers. Finally, Mary Arlington took the opportunity to introduce “Rivers and Rockies,” a new association serving campground owners in several states. She explained its mission to provide localized support and address the specific needs of park owners in the region. Throughout the episode, host Brian Searl guided the discussion and encouraged the guests to share their expertise and insights. The conversation provided valuable information and perspectives for campground owners, operators, and anyone interested in the future of the outdoor hospitality industry.

The MC Fireside Chats episode on April 30th, 2025, began with host Brian Searl acknowledging technical difficulties at the start of the show. Brian then introduced the guests: Mychele Bisson, Mary Sparrow, and Heidi Royle, each bringing a unique perspective on the outdoor hospitality industry.

Mychele Bisson shared her work with Bison Peak Ventures, acquiring campgrounds across the country, revitalizing them, and aiming to preserve the original family's legacy. She emphasized the importance of maintaining the essence of these establishments while introducing modern improvements.  

Mary Sparrow discussed her ownership of a boatyard in the east of England and her innovative approach to hospitality with floating glamping pods. Her business evolved from traditional houseboats to unique, luxury floating accommodations, offering guests a distinctive experience on the water.

Heidi Royle detailed her journey of establishing the Groove Glamping, a glamping site in Minnesota, located near a state park. She highlighted the natural attractions of the area, such as the clear water creeks and the state park, which enhance the appeal of her glamping site.  

The discussion then shifted to the concept of "glamping," with various perspectives on its definition and evolution. The guests explored how glamping has changed over time, influenced by social media and the increasing demand for unique outdoor experiences.

The challenges and strategies of promoting and operating glamping sites were also discussed. Heidi Royle shared her experience with influencer collaborations to increase awareness of the Grove Glamping.

Mary Sparrow provided insights into the complexities of running a business that combines traditional boating with modern glamping. This included the unique considerations for floating accommodations and the importance of preserving the natural environment.

Mychele Bisson spoke about Bison Peak Ventures' business model of acquiring and upgrading campgrounds, emphasizing the rewarding aspect of providing families with opportunities to connect and create memories in nature.

A significant part of the conversation focused on the personal fulfillment derived from operating these businesses. The guests shared stories of the joy and satisfaction that comes from seeing families and children enjoy the outdoors, away from the distractions of modern technology.

The episode concluded with the guests sharing their final thoughts and where to find more information about their businesses. The overarching theme was the value of creating unique outdoor experiences and the positive impact these experiences have on individuals and families.

In a recent episode of MC Fireside Chats, Brian Searl convened a panel of industry leaders and experts to explore the multifaceted dynamics of the RV and outdoor recreation sectors. The discussion featured recurring guests Eleonore Hamm from RVDA of Canada, Phil Ingrassia representing RVDA, and Greg Emmert, alongside special guest Eva Mitic, providing a range of perspectives on the current state and future direction of the industry. The episode addressed key issues such as the potential impact of tariffs, the shifting landscape of consumer behavior, and the role of innovation in driving the industry forward. The conversation began with a focus on the looming threat of tariffs and their potential repercussions for the RV industry. Eleonore Hamm provided insights into the Canadian perspective, explaining RVDA of Canada’s efforts to inform its members about the potential impact of counter tariff measures. She highlighted the challenges posed by the lack of a sufficient Canadian supply chain to meet the demand, with a significant portion of RVs sold in Canada being imported from the US. The tariffs, if implemented, would affect RVs crossing the border, potentially increasing costs for dealers and consumers. Phil Ingrassia, speaking from the United States, acknowledged the industry’s shared concerns regarding tariffs and underscored the importance of maintaining free and fair trade between the two countries. He noted the interconnectedness of the US and Canadian RV industries. Brian Searl raised the concern about the potential impact on private campgrounds if tariffs do go into effect. Eleonore Hamm responded that there could be a positive side for Canadian campgrounds as people might choose to camp locally. However, she expressed concern about the long-term impact on dealers and potentially on consumers. Eva Mitic contributed to the conversation by focusing on the role of technology and sustainability in shaping the future of the RV industry. She discussed trends like the increasing importance of user-friendly RV systems and the growing emphasis on sustainable practices. The episode explored how innovations such as lithium technology and artificial intelligence are transforming RV design and functionality, catering to evolving consumer expectations. The discussion also delved into the evolving landscape of consumer behavior in the RV and outdoor recreation sectors. Participants noted a trend toward ease of use and connectivity, as well as the impact of the COVID boom on consumer education and expectations. This has implications for both RV manufacturers and dealers, requiring them to adapt their offerings and strategies to meet changing consumer preferences. Brian Searl prompted the panel to consider various factors influencing the industry, from consumer behavior to technological advancements. Panelists discussed the importance of convenience and intuitive design, as well as the ongoing need to educate consumers about RV operation and maintenance. The episode further explored the challenges and opportunities associated with technological innovation in the RV industry, including the development and adoption of new power systems and the potential influence of electric vehicle technology. The complexities of research and development costs and the balance between innovation and affordability were also considered. The impact of economic uncertainties, including concerns about consumer sentiment and market fluctuations, was a recurring theme. Panelists analyzed the ways in which these factors influence consumer confidence and purchasing decisions, as well as business planning and investment in the RV sector. The discussion also underscored the increasing importance of advancements in RV components and systems, reflecting a broader trend toward enhanced functionality and user experience. The ongoing advancements in power systems and the potential to integrate “smart home” technology into RVs were highlighted as key areas of development. Ultimately, the MC Fireside Chats episode provided a valuable platform for exploring the multifaceted dynamics of the RV industry, bringing together diverse perspectives to analyze current challenges and anticipate future trends. The insights shared by industry experts contributed to a richer understanding of the forces shaping the sector and offered guidance for navigating its ongoing evolution.

April 16th Episode Recap The episode of MC Fireside Chats, hosted by Brian Searl of Insider Perks, convened a diverse panel of industry professionals including recurring guests Jeff Hoffman (Camp Strategy), Mike Harrison (CRR Hospitality), and Sandy Ellingson (Industry Liaison/Consultant), alongside special guests Kurtis Wilkins (Private Equity Analyst, Rjourney), Jennifer L. Grissom (Co-Owner, Crystal River KOA), and Yolanda “Yo’EL” D’Oyen (Owner, ARK@Denali Campground Resort). The comprehensive discussion explored crucial aspects of the outdoor hospitality sector, focusing on operational strategies, the interpretation of market data, adapting to consumer shifts, and navigating the increasing trend of institutional investment. Brian Searl opened the show by introducing the panel and highlighting recent technological advancements from Insider Perks. He announced the rollout of Rigsby, their AI voice chatbot, which is now capable of handling reservations via chat and is soon expected to offer voice reservation capabilities. Brian emphasized that this innovation is poised to be a significant disruptor in the industry, providing 24/7 booking options and eliminating common issues like busy signals, acknowledging that early adoption may involve a testing phase. The conversation quickly turned to industry data, prompted by insights drawn from the KOA North American Camping Report. Sandy Ellingson shared her positive takeaways, noting substantial increases in camping households and high retention rates among campers who began during the pandemic. She also highlighted encouraging growth in specific accommodation types, such as a significant rise in tent usage. However, Sandy expressed concern that some parks were limiting tent camping, which she sees as a vital “onboarding” method for introducing younger generations to camping, and advocated for viewing tent and car camping as strategic tools. Providing additional perspective on the data, Mike Harrison and Kurtis Wilkins cautioned against solely comparing current figures to 2019 (pre-pandemic) growth, which naturally saw a massive surge. While acknowledging continued overall interest, they stressed the importance of analyzing recent year-over-year changes and noted signs of potential headwinds, including recent nationwide dips in consumer activity in Q1 and April. Kurtis specifically highlighted that Rjourney is observing tighter booking windows, making forecasting more challenging despite no overall drop in bookings. A key theme discussed was the need for campgrounds to adapt to the evolving consumer. Mike Harrison pointed out that demographic data in some CRR Hospitality resorts shows a nearly equal distribution across age groups (Baby Boomers to Gen Z), necessitating varied marketing strategies across different platforms to reach each segment effectively. He and Kurtis Wilkins stressed the importance of adopting “experiential hospitality” to make stays a lifestyle experience and utilizing technology for simple enhancements, not just complex systems, to cater to the modern traveler. Kurtis Wilkins emphasized that understanding each park’s specific demographic and location is crucial for effective microtargeting in marketing efforts, noting that even regional terminology like “campground” versus “RV park” matters. He stressed the critical need for operators to closely monitor operational data such as pace reports, leads, and conversion rates at a granular level to identify demographic shifts and pivot strategies quickly in response to market changes, including those influenced by external factors. Jennifer L. Grissom shared her firsthand experience as a new owner/developer of the Crystal River KOA, which opened recently. She spoke about the success of her first year, exceeding initial projections, but also highlighted the operational challenges posed by the current narrow booking window that complicates forecasting. Jennifer discussed her surprise regarding the volume of tent campers and the lessons learned about pricing and managing that segment, noting that higher price points sometimes attract specific demographics like elderly individuals seeking facility access. She strongly emphasized the invaluable support the KOA franchise provides through established operating systems, marketing, and brand recognition for a park of her size. Yolanda “Yo’EL” D’Oyen introduced her unique and ambitious project, ARK@Denali Campground Resort in Alaska. Describing herself as a visionary builder, Yo’EL is developing the property to leverage its unparalleled view of Mount Denali. She detailed her strategy to operate year-round, which is uncommon in Alaska, partly driven by a personal mission to provide a place of light and community during the long winter months. Yo’EL outlined diversified revenue streams beyond traditional RV sites, including capitalizing on tour bus traffic with a heated viewing deck and other amenities, and mentioned exploring funding options like USDA loans and phased development to include workforce housing for quicker revenue generation. The increasing trend of institutional investment and the entry of major hotel brands into the outdoor hospitality space were significant points of discussion. Kurtis Wilkins highlighted Rjourney’s recent success securing a CMBS loan that included transient revenue, a first of its kind, which he believes will pave the way for other RV parks to access similar institutional financing. Mike Harrison discussed how this trend, combined with potential future online distribution platforms for campgrounds, is professionalizing the industry, suggesting that independent parks must embrace “operational excellence” and differentiate themselves effectively to compete, a point echoed by Jeff Hoffman on finding one’s niche. Concluding the chat, Kurtis Wilkins used a memorable analogy: technology is the car, and data are the windows – you need the right tech systems (the car) but also need to look at your data (the windows) to know where you're going. He called for more collective data sharing across the industry to better understand and compete in the evolving market. The overall sentiment was one of dynamic change, with significant opportunities for parks willing to adapt, understand their guests and market, and leverage technology and data to enhance operations and guest experience. Brian Searl invited listeners to continue the data discussion on his other podcast, Outwired.

This MC Fireside Chats episode on April 9th, 2025, hosted by Brian Searl from Insider Perks, brought together a panel of experts to discuss the current state and future trends of the outdoor hospitality industry. The recurring guests, Joe Duemig, the owner and founder of App My Community, a company specializing in mobile apps for campground guest engagement and communication, and Kevin Thueson, a partner at KCN Campgrounds, a real estate investment firm operating a portfolio of nine KOA franchise parks, were joined by special guests Lucy Comer, the co-owner and founder of Hadspen Glamping, an off-grid glamping site in Southwest England, and Jen Rice, the general manager at Empire Recreation Management and WhoaZone, which develops water-based family entertainment centers. The central theme of the discussion revolved around the anticipated impact of the prevailing economic uncertainty and the rapidly evolving sociopolitical landscape on camper behavior in the 2025 season. Brian Searl initiated the conversation by referencing early data that suggested an uptick in reservations for early 2025 compared to the previous year. However, this optimistic outlook was immediately challenged by Kevin Thueson, who reported seeing a contrary trend within KCN Campgrounds, with reservations currently lagging behind the same period last year. He attributed this hesitancy among travelers to the continued uncertainty stemming from various factors, including the recent election and ongoing rapid changes. Joe Duemig offered a more nuanced perspective, suggesting that the impact of these uncertainties would likely vary significantly depending on the specific characteristics of individual campgrounds. He posited that factors such as the type of park (e.g., destination-focused versus en-route stops) and its geographical location would play a crucial role in determining its resilience. He voiced particular concern for campgrounds that heavily cater to snowbirds and those with a significant portion of their clientele coming from Canada, given the existing political tensions and reported decrease in border crossings. While acknowledging the historical trend of campgrounds performing well during economic downturns as a more affordable travel option, Joe Duemig cautioned that the recent increase in campground rates might alter this dynamic. He advised campground owners to proactively develop backup plans to mitigate potential negative impacts. Kevin Thueson further elaborated on the booking trends, suggesting that the current situation might not necessarily indicate a crisis but rather a reversion to pre-pandemic travel patterns. He recalled that before the surge in early and extended bookings during COVID-19, the majority of reservations were typically made much closer to the stay date. He also pointed out the significant decline in international travel since the onset of the pandemic and the slow pace of its recovery, which could influence the impact of current international travel advisories. He emphasized the importance of differentiating between overnight or journey-style parks, which traditionally experience slower reservation pick-up, and destination parks that often see bookings well in advance. Shifting the focus to the UK market, Lucy Comer provided an insightful perspective from Hadspen Glamping. She reported a substantial cost of living crisis in the UK, which has influenced travel patterns. Interestingly, despite this economic pressure, their bookings for April were double compared to the same month in the previous year. However, she also noted a clear trend of people opting for more local vacations and a significant decrease in international travel to their site. Lucy Comer highlighted that Hadspen Glamping’s success lies in offering a unique experience centered around sustainability, its off-grid nature, and its deep connection with the local environment and suppliers. She emphasized that they are selling an escape and an experience rather than simply accommodation. The conversation then transitioned to strategies for enhancing the guest experience. Kevin Thueson underscored the critical role of exceptional hospitality and actively engaging with guests as a key differentiator, particularly for campgrounds that might not have the newest facilities. He suggested practical ways to elevate the guest experience, such as organizing tournaments and events around existing amenities like mini-golf or newly added pickleball courts. Joe Duemig, drawing from his extensive travel experiences with his large family, echoed the sentiment about the importance of friendly and attentive customer service. He shared positive anecdotes from campgrounds that went the extra mile, such as offering free water sports equipment, proactively providing assistance, and offering small but impactful gestures like welcome drinks for adults and children. Jen Rice introduced WhoaZone, explaining its mission to revitalize existing bodies of water in various settings by installing inflatable water-based attractions for family entertainment. She emphasized the goal of encouraging outdoor recreation and providing an immersive and thrilling experience for guests, whether they are staying at a partnering campground or visiting for the day. Jen Rice highlighted that WhoaZone’s unique selling proposition is their deep operational experience, as they not only provide the equipment but also manage and operate the attractions, bringing a practical, on-the-ground perspective to their clients. Finally, the discussion touched upon the future of the industry, particularly concerning sustainability and the adoption of new technologies like electric vehicle (EV) charging stations. Lucy Comer discussed the challenges of implementing EV charging at an off-grid glamping site and the importance of ensuring that any technological additions are both effective and user-friendly for guests. Kevin Thueson provided a pragmatic view on investing in EV infrastructure, emphasizing the need to balance the potential demand with the financial implications for investors and the rapidly evolving nature of the technology. He suggested a cautious approach, monitoring the actual demand and the technological advancements before making significant capital investments, as overspending based on speculation could be risky. In conclusion, Brian Searl thanked the insightful panel for their contributions, providing listeners with contact information for Hadspen Glamping (hadspenglamping.co.uk), App My Community (appmycommunity.com), and WhoaZone (gowhoazone.com). He announced the upcoming Outwired podcast episode, promising further data-driven discussions on consumer behavior in the outdoor hospitality sector.

In the recent episode of MC Fireside Chats, Brian Searl warmly welcomed everyone to another episode, highlighting the theme of data insights and analysis, a core focus for their 2025 discussions. With a touch of humor, he acknowledged the self-explanatory nature of the show’s title, playfully teasing Scott Bahr about the redundancy. He then introduced the returning guest, Simon Neal from Camp Map, and special guests Emily Simmons, President of CONY, and Michael Moore, who wears numerous hats, including those at TACO and AGS, and is now also the President of CAMP. Before diving into the data, a lighthearted exchange ensued about Michael’s sports memorabilia, specifically a jersey, and whether it needed updating given the player’s current status, a conversation that briefly touched on the topic of inflation and its impact on investments. Michael Moore then provided a comprehensive introduction to his various roles, starting with the Texas Association of Campground Owners, affectionately known as TACO, the largest state campground association in the country, boasting nearly 450 member campgrounds. He outlined the association’s diverse range of activities, including lobbying, legislative work, legal support, marketing, and the provision of numerous discount and savings programs. Shifting gears, he spoke about AGS, a company that markets and produces guest guides for campgrounds across almost all 50 states, detailing their work in printing, collateral, and digital marketing. Finally, he touched on his recent election as President of CAMP, an organization that facilitates information sharing and collaboration among state and regional campground associations. Emily Simmons followed, introducing herself as the President of CONY, celebrating her upcoming two-year anniversary in the role. She echoed Michael’s description of association benefits, emphasizing advocacy, education, and cost savings programs, and highlighted the recent successful launch of their virtual conference, “Fire Up Forum,” which was designed to address member feedback and provide accessible, ongoing educational resources. She also noted their membership numbers, currently approaching 200, and their strategic focus on attracting Canadian visitors, given their proximity to the border. The conversation then transitioned to a detailed discussion of data trends, with Simon Neal sharing a presentation from PIN Camp, a major European marketplace for outdoor hospitality. He emphasized the increasing prevalence of online bookings across all age groups, even among those over 70, highlighting the importance of digital accessibility for campgrounds. He then delved into booking behavior, comparing trends from the previous year to the current one, revealing a growing price sensitivity among consumers, with a noticeable shift towards cheaper destinations and shorter stays. This led to a broader discussion about the impact of rising prices on consumer decisions, with contributions from Scott Bahr, Michael Moore, and Emily Simmons, who all shared insights into how these trends were playing out in the US and Canada. Scott Bahr provided additional context, noting that while online booking preferences were generally higher in the US, the trend of older age groups embracing online bookings was consistent across both regions. He also discussed the contrasting data on RV registrations, which were declining in the US but growing in Germany, as highlighted by Simon Neal. The speakers then explored the implications of these trends for campground operators, discussing the need to adapt pricing strategies, enhance value propositions, and focus on customer loyalty. They also touched on the broader economic and political uncertainties influencing consumer behavior, emphasizing the importance of scenario planning and data-driven decision-making. The conversation then shifted to a discussion of association activities, with Emily Simmons detailing CONY’s successful virtual conference, “Fire Up Forum,” and Michael Moore outlining TACO’s upcoming conference and legislative priorities. They both emphasized the importance of providing ongoing education and support to their members, recognizing the diverse needs and challenges faced by campground operators. Michael Moore also discussed his role as President of CAMP, highlighting the organization’s efforts to facilitate collaboration and information sharing among state and regional campground associations, and their upcoming meeting in Washington DC to address key industry issues, including tariffs. Finally, the speakers shared their key data insights and trends for 2025. Simon Neal emphasized the importance of digital bookability and showcasing value propositions, Emily Simmons stressed the significance of consumer sentiment, cost awareness, and clear communication of offerings, Michael Moore advised promoting to existing guests and leveraging data on consumer spending in local communities, and Scott Bahr pointed out the trend of campers staying closer to home, emphasizing the need for local marketing efforts. Brian Searl concluded the discussion by reiterating the importance of paying attention to shifting consumer behaviors and leveraging available data to inform strategic planning.

In a recent episode of MC Fireside Chats, Brian Searl convened a panel of industry leaders to delve into the pressing issues and evolving trends impacting the RV and outdoor recreation sectors. The discussion featured Eleonore Hamm from RVDA of Canada, Shane Devenish of the Canadian RV Association (CRVA), Greg Emmert, Phil Ingrassia representing RVDA, and Aaron Bannon from the American Outdoors Association. The episode tackled the complex landscape of potential tariffs, shifting consumer behaviors, and the innovative strides being made within the industry, providing valuable insights for campground owners, RV dealers, and outdoor enthusiasts alike. The discussion began with the potential impact of tariffs on the RV industry. Eleonore Hamm explained that RVDA of Canada is providing information and resources to its members regarding potential counter tariff measures. She highlighted the lack of a sufficient Canadian supply chain to meet the demand, with a significant portion of RVs sold in Canada being imported from the US. The tariffs, if implemented, would affect RVs crossing the border, potentially increasing costs for dealers and consumers. Shane Devenish emphasized the difficulty in keeping everyone informed due to the rapidly changing situation. He also clarified that the Canadian countermeasures would only take effect if the US imposes tariffs on Canadian goods. Phil Ingrassia, speaking from Washington D.C., acknowledged the industry’s concern and stressed the importance of free and fair trade. He noted the interconnectedness of the US and Canadian RV industries. Brian Searl raised the concern about the potential impact on private campgrounds if tariffs do go into effect. Eleonore Hamm responded that there could be a positive side for Canadian campgrounds as people might choose to camp locally. However, she expressed concern about the long-term impact on dealers and potentially on consumers. Aaron Bannon provided an overview of the American Outdoors Association, which comprises organizations providing facilitated recreation experiences on public lands. He discussed the crossover between his members and the RV industry, noting that many guides live in RVs and that a robust tourism industry benefits outfitters. Bannon also mentioned trends like the increasing popularity of glamping and a shift towards shorter, less risky trips. Greg Emmert and Shane Devenish weighed in on the trend of shorter trips, linking it to economic uncertainty and fuel costs. Shane Devenish shared anecdotal evidence of some people planning longer trips within Canada. Brian Searl then posed a question about how businesses in different sectors could pivot in a moderately challenging economic scenario. Aaron Bannon suggested that outfitters might focus on attracting customers from nearby metropolitan areas and diversify their offerings. Greg Emmert emphasized the importance of partnerships and experiential offerings for campgrounds, particularly those near population centers. Eleonore Hamm said that Canadian RV dealers might focus more on pre-owned sales and service. Shane Devenish highlighted the challenges faced by parts suppliers and manufacturers on both sides of the border. Phil Ingrassia discussed the complexities of the situation for US manufacturers due to the sourcing of components and the impact of consumer sentiment on RV sales. Phil Ingrassia then discussed the RVIA’s emerging leaders program, which aims to connect and develop industry professionals. Aaron Bannon spoke about similar programs within the Outdoors Association, emphasizing the value of fresh perspectives. Phil Ingrassia also discussed Go RVing’s experiential events, which are designed to introduce RVing to people who may have little exposure to it. Eleonore Hamm added that Go RVing Canada also participates in similar events. Brian Searl then brought up Pebble, an all-electric RV with advanced technology. Greg Emmert provided details about Pebble’s features, including its self-hitching, remote control maneuverability, and extended vehicle range capabilities. Phil Ingrassia noted that the company was founded by former Tesla executives and that these types of innovations may appeal to a new demographic of RVers. In their final thoughts, Eleonore Hamm thanked everyone for the opportunity to speak. Greg Emmert stressed the importance of developing the next generation of leaders in the outdoor hospitality industry. Aaron Bannon highlighted the passage of the Explore Act and its potential to facilitate new outfitter businesses. Shane Devenish mentioned the CRVA’s 50th anniversary and upcoming special events. Phil Ingrassia expressed optimism about the upcoming season. Eleonore Hamm provided information on how to access the petition regarding tariffs on the RVDA website.

The March 19, 2025, episode of MC Fireside Chats centered on business operations and management in the outdoor hospitality industry, featuring a diverse panel of recurring and special guests. Host Brian Searl was joined by Mike Harrison, Sandy Ellingson, and Ali Rasmussen, along with special guests Katie McLeod, General Manager of Quilly’s RV Parks, and John, Beth, and Ali Kieffer, owners of the Blue Ridge Dakota River KOA in Georgia. The discussion covered a wide range of topics, from technology and consumer trends to the evolving demographics of campers and the challenges faced by campground owners. The conversation began with Brian highlighting the importance of choosing the right online reservation system, emphasizing that campground owners should prioritize systems with open API access. He explained that APIs allow for seamless data integration, automation, and enhanced analytics, ultimately improving efficiency and decision-making. Sandy agreed, reinforcing that consumers want a streamlined experience without needing multiple tools, and that open APIs allow campgrounds to integrate the best features from different platforms. She pointed out that many reservation systems claim they are working on integrations but often fail to deliver them in a timely manner. With a robust API, owners can build their own integrations without relying on software developers. Shifting gears, the discussion turned to the decline in Canadian travelers visiting U.S. campgrounds. Ali Rasmussen noted a dramatic 70% drop in Canadian visitors at her properties, a trend that has forced her to rethink advertising and marketing strategies. While some campground owners, like Katie McLeod, reported an increase in Canadian guests at their Texas properties, others, particularly in Georgia and New England, have seen significant declines. Mike Harrison explained that he had noticed booking trends weakening as early as mid-2024 and attributed part of the decline to economic factors, including the weakening Canadian dollar and rising tariffs. Brian added that rhetoric around the “51st state” concept had also alienated Canadian travelers, leading many to cancel U.S. trips in protest. Sandy Ellingson questioned whether the decline was solely due to travel restrictions or if it was also tied to a broader shift in demographics, where older generations of campers are not being replaced by younger ones. This led to a larger discussion about the changing profile of campers. Sandy shared insights from ongoing industry research, which suggests that traditional camping demographics are shifting. She noted that many long-time campers are aging out of the industry, and younger generations are not adopting RVing and camping at the same rate. She referred to this shift as the “death of the camper and the rise of the traveler,” emphasizing that modern outdoor enthusiasts often view camping differently. Instead of seeing it as a long-term lifestyle choice, many younger travelers prefer shorter, more curated outdoor experiences. Brian agreed and pointed out that glamping, cabin rentals, and tent sites are potential entry points for this new demographic. Sandy announced that the research findings would soon be shared with the industry at upcoming conferences, with the goal of helping campground owners adapt to these changes. The conversation also touched on the challenges of encouraging curiosity and adaptability among campground owners. John and Beth Kieffer discussed their experience as KOA franchisees, emphasizing how KOA’s extensive data and support systems have helped them refine their operations and improve guest experiences. However, John noted that many long-time KOA owners are resistant to change and hesitant to upgrade their facilities, despite KOA’s recommendations. He explained that some owners blindly rely on past success rather than adapting to evolving guest expectations, which could lead to difficulties in the future. Beth added that financial constraints often contribute to this reluctance, as many owners worry about the costs associated with infrastructure upgrades. Brian suggested that curiosity is a key factor in success, questioning whether it can be taught or if it is an inherent trait. Katie McLeod expressed skepticism, stating that while curiosity is difficult to instill, setting clear expectations for staff and fostering a culture of learning can help bridge the gap. Ali Rasmussen raised another important question about how the industry can attract younger generations to camping and RVing. She pointed out that Millennials and Gen Z often avoid physically demanding activities, which could pose a challenge for traditional RVing, which requires setup and maintenance. Katie shared an innovative approach she has seen at some parks, where campgrounds offer “first setup” services to help new RV owners learn the basics. She explained that her own park manager regularly assists guests with their first-time setup, creating an emotional connection that makes them more likely to return. Sandy added that a successful initiative she has worked on involves partnerships between campgrounds and RV dealerships, where dealerships host “maiden voyage” experiences at campgrounds, teaching new RV owners the essentials of setting up and troubleshooting their rigs. These programs not only create better experiences for first-time campers but also help build long-term loyalty. The discussion then turned to the importance of offering diverse experiences that go beyond traditional camping. Brian emphasized the need to foster a deeper passion for the outdoors, rather than just selling amenities. John and Beth Kieffer shared how they have introduced additional services at their KOA, such as food trucks, fly fishing lessons, and winery tours, all of which enhance the guest experience without adding significant operational costs. Brian encouraged owners to think outside the box, suggesting that activities like survival skills workshops, guided hikes, and even foraging experiences could create lasting memories and a deeper appreciation for the outdoors. As the episode wrapped up, each panelist shared their final thoughts. John Kieffer warned that the rising cost of building new campgrounds—now averaging $60,000 per site—could push prices even higher, potentially making camping less accessible. Sandy reiterated the importance of actively onboarding new guests and attracting younger travelers to sustain the industry’s long-term growth. Katie emphasized the need to create unique, nature-focused experiences that encourage guests to disconnect and reconnect with the outdoors. Ali echoed this sentiment, adding that fostering a sense of community at campgrounds is just as important as providing great amenities. She noted that people are increasingly seeking meaningful human connections and that campgrounds should embrace that need by designing experiences that encourage interaction and shared moments. Brian concluded the show by reflecting on the broader challenge of capturing people’s attention in an era of digital distractions. He argued that the passion for the outdoors is still there, but it is competing with an overwhelming amount of digital content and entertainment. To remain relevant, campground owners must not only adapt their offerings but also find innovative ways to communicate the value of outdoor experiences to new audiences. With so many factors shaping the industry’s future, from economic shifts to changing traveler expectations, the key takeaway was clear—those who embrace curiosity, adaptability, and a forward-thinking approach will be best positioned for success.