This is the 200th episode of Mountain & Prairie, so I decided to celebrate the milestone by bringing back the first-ever M&P guest, my good friend Erik Glenn. Erik is the Executive Director of the Colorado Cattlemen’s Agricultural Land Trust, a statewide conservation organization that protects Colorado's agricultural land, heritage, and families for future generations by conserving working rural landscapes. Erik is also the President of the Partnership of Rangeland Trusts, a collection of nine ag-based, western land trusts who work together to “advocate for the conservation of working lands and western heritage for the benefit and wellbeing of future generations.”

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When Erik and I spoke for episode number one all the way back in the spring of 2016, he was only about a year into his role as Executive Director. At that point, the organization had conserved just over 465,000 acres of land in Colorado. Fast forward seven and a half years to today, Erik and his team have added an additional 300,000 acres of conserved land, bringing the total to more than 765,000 acres. But most importantly, CCALT has served as a loyal and trusted partner for more than 400 agricultural families who are deeply committed to conserving Colorado’s western heritage and working landscapes.

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I consider Erik a great friend and a wise mentor, and if not for his kindness, encouragement, and counsel, I doubt there would be a Mountain & Prairie, nor would I have ever worked in the conservation world. We sat down at his office in Lakewood and caught up on everything, including: how Erik spurs innovation without losing sight of the basics of land conservation; his thoughts on building culture and retaining the best team members; balancing his own intense work ethic with his desire set reasonable-yet-high expectations for his team; how having kids has changed him; the growth of PORT; his mentors; the evolution of the perception of conservation easements in the ag community; threats and opportunities; book recommendations; and much more.

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A big thanks to Erik for letting me use him as a guinea pig for the first episode back in 2016, and for his willingness to join me again for episode 200. But more importantly, thanks to Erik for his leadership and commitment to conservation in Colorado, the West, and beyond. Hope you enjoy!

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• Erik Glenn
• Colorado Cattlemen's Agricultural Land Trust
• Partnership of Rangeland Trusts
• Complete episode notes & links: https://mountainandprairie.com/erik-glenn-2/
• Support M&P on Patreon

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TOPICS DISCUSSED:

• 3:30 - What the Colorado Cattlemen's Agricultural Land Trust is
• 11:00 - How Erik balances innovation with the basics of conservation
• 15:30 - Implementing a culture in the workplace
• 23:30 - Balancing his work ethic with the desire to not set unreasonable work expectations for his team
• 29:30 - How having kids impacted Erik
• 35:45 - Discussing PORT
• 46:00 - Discussing whether or not good conservation tools have become good business tools for land owners 
• 50:00 - Erik’s mentors
• 58:00 - The biggest threat and opportunity facing conservation
• 1:10:30 - Erik’s book recommendations
• 1:13:30 - Parting words

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For years now, listeners have been emailing me with many different versions of the same basic question:

“How do I get a job in the conservation world?”

Some of the inquiries come from college students or young professionals, while others come from folks who are deep into a specific career path but want to make a change. I’m always happy to receive these messages, and I’m flattered that anyone would think I have valuable advice to offer.

Unfortunately, I’ve never been able to provide what I believe to be a suitable answer, mainly because I could not do the question justice within the constraints of email or social media. And over the last few years, the volume of messages has reached a point that I simply cannot keep up with it all– so if you’ve reached out and I have not responded, my sincere apologies.

For (at least) the past three years, I’ve been considering answering this question in podcast form, thinking the episode could serve as a detailed resource for anyone who asked the question… and for those who will in the future. But I’ve procrastinated or rationalized reasons not to, mainly because I felt extremely uncomfortable about sitting by myself, blabbing my thoughts and ideas into a microphone. I never want to come off as a know-it-all or some kind of wannabe internet guru.

But the volume of the incoming messages kept increasing, so I finally decided to put my ego and self-consciousness aside and just answer the question in podcast form.

I wrote an eight-page outline that laid out everything I know about finding a job in the conservation world, then I sat down in The Shed and let ‘er rip. The result is a ridiculously long soliloquy in which I put it all out there. I’m calling it a SHED SESSION.

Please keep in mind that this episode is simply a recounting of my own personal and professional experience– it’s not some kind of one-size-fits-all “hack” that will lead you directly to your dream job. I’ve long said that I am the last person anyone should be asking for career advice, and there are certainly tons of people who are much more experienced and accomplished in conservation than I am.

But for those of you who did ask, this episode is for you. I lay it all out, including: my specific career path; my specific job in the conservation field; skills that are needed in the conservation sector; why relationship building is the most important skill; how I built a deep and broad network in Colorado despite only knowing one person when I moved here in 2010; why I think networks are the most valuable assets; what I looked for when I was hiring for conservation roles; what you should look for (and avoid) in conservation organizations; pros and cons of working in non-profit conservation, book recommendations, and more. Links to everything are in the episode notes.

Again, all of this is just my personal experience and my possibly weird ideas about doing purpose-driven work. For those of you who have reached out, I hope this adds some value. For everyone else, we’ll be back to the regularly scheduled interviews later this week.

Thanks for listening!

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• Watch the video on Patreon
• Support M&P on Patreon!
• Full episode notes and links: https://mountainandprairie.com/shed-sesh/

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TOPICS DISCUSSED:

• 3:12 - Intro, Questions, and Goals
• 10:20 - Disclaimers
• 13:58 - Discussion outline
• 15:45 - My career path
• 19:53 - My specific job in conservation
• 22:30 - How I built a network from scratch
• 40:01 - Advice on how to build a network
• 48:55 - What I looked for when I was hiring
• 54:39 - What you should look for in a conservation organization
• 1:05:51 - Book Recommendations
• 1:15:05 - Pros and cons
• 1:22:22 - Closing thoughts

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Lorelei Cloud is a member of the Southern Ute Indian Tribe and currently serves as Vice Chairman of the Southern Ute Indian Tribal Council. Lorelei’s commitment to conservation, leadership development, and Ute language, traditions, and culture is evident by the staggering number of leadership roles she holds– she is Co-Chairman of the Indigenous Women’s Leadership Network, a Board Trustee for the Nature Conservancy, and serves on the Colorado River Basin’s Water & Tribes Initiative. Earlier this year, she was appointed by the Governor of Colorado to serve on the Colorado Water Conservation Board, making her the first-ever Tribal member of the board.

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Lorelei was born and raised on the Southern Ute Reservation, which is located in the far southwestern corner of Colorado. From the very beginning, water has played a central role in Lorelei’s life– much of her childhood was spent without running water and access to drinking water continues to be a challenge on the Reservation to this day. Much of Lorelei’s early career was spent working in various businesses, including banking and energy, all while being a mother and raising four children. In 2015, she was elected to the Tribal Council, which began this new phase of her life and career– a phase devoted to serving her Tribal Community, as well as the communities, landscapes, and natural resources of the American West.

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I’ve been hearing such great things about Lorelei for years, so I was honored to have the opportunity to chat with her on the podcast. We enjoyed a wide-ranging conversation about her upbringing on the Southern Ute Reservation, the history of the Southern Ute Tribe, her recent appointment to the CWCB, why she decided to devote herself to public service, the goals of the Indigenous Women’s Leadership Network, her work with the Nature Conservancy, the need to elevate Tribal voices on issues of water and land conservation in the West and beyond, advice for aspiring leaders, her favorite books, ways the listeners can get involved and support the work of the Southern Ute Tribe, and much more.

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Be sure to check out the episode notes for a full list of topics discussed and links to everything. A huge thanks to Lorelei for taking the time out of her busy schedule to talk with me and for her deep commitment to doing such impactful work in Colorado and beyond. Enjoy!

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• Lorelei Cloud
• Southern Ute Indian Tribe
• Colorado Water Conservation Board
• Full episode notes and links: https://mountainandprairie.com/lorelei-cloud/

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This episode is brought to you in partnership with the Colorado chapter of The Nature Conservancy. Guided by science and grounded by decades of collaborative partnerships, The Nature Conservancy has a long-standing legacy of achieving lasting results to create a world where nature and people thrive.

On the fourth Tuesday of every month throughout 2023, Mountain & Prairie will be delving into conversations with a wide range of The Nature Conservancy’s leaders, partners, collaborators, and stakeholders, highlighting the myriad of conservation challenges, opportunities, and solutions here in the American West.

To learn more about The Nature Conservancy’s impactful work in Colorado and around the world, visit www.nature.org/colorado

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TOPICS DISCUSSED:

• 3:30 - Lorelei’s youth on the Southern Ute Reservation
• 6:15 - How Lorelei’s family would get water
• 8:15 - Lorelei’s childhood personality, school years, and early jobs
• 13:30 - Whether or not Lorelei wanted to stay on the reservation
• 15:30 - A brief Ute history
• 19:00 - How Lorelei’s appointment as the first Indigenous representative on the CWCB
• 22:15 - What the CWCB does
• 27:30 - How Lorelei decided to pursue public service
• 30:15 - About the Indigenous Women’s Leadership Network
• 34:00 - Lorelei’s advice for aspiring leaders
• 36:15 - Lorelei’s mentors
• 40:30 - About Lorelei’s role as Vice Chairman of the Southern Ute Tribe
• 43:00 - How Lorelei became involved with TNC and how she evaluates whether or not to pursue a professional opportunity
• 48:15 - Whether or not Deb Haaland has elevated Tribal voices through her work
• 52:00 - Lorelei’s book recommendations
• 55:00 - How you can help Lorelei’s work
• 56:00 - Lorelei’s words of wisdom

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Christy Sing Robertson is a hatmaker and the founder and owner of Sing Hat Company. Based in Jackson, Wyoming, Christy has evolved rather quickly from making a few hats for herself and several friends into becoming one of the most popular and sought-after hat makers in the West. Whether she’s hand-shaping palm leaf hats for hundreds of people at events such as last month’s Old Salt Festival or creating a custom felt hat for a 5th generation rancher or celebrity musician, Christy’s humility, curiosity, and commitment to the craft have allowed her to stand out in the crowded field of custom hatmakers.

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Christy was born and raised in the Ozark Mountains of Arkansas, and she stayed there for the first half of her career, working as a high-performing salesperson in the insurance industry. But despite her success in the conventional and lucrative world of sales, she felt called to the West and decided to uproot her life and move to Jackson, Wyoming. Even though she moved to Jackson without knowing a soul, she managed to establish roots and build a fulfilling life centered around motherhood, hard work, and leading a thoughtful, intentional life. And along the way, just as she felt a calling to move to Wyoming, she felt called to make hats– so she went all-in. Today, Christy’s hats– and her long list of customers– demonstrate the amazing success she’s achieved in a relatively short amount of time.

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I’ve been following Christy’s work for many years now, so I was thrilled to finally have a chance to chat with her on the podcast. Her story is amazingly inspiring and speaks to the importance of grit, risk-taking, working hard, humility, and trusting your gut. We covered a lot during our hour together, including: her upbringing in Arkansas and her success in the insurance business; the spiritual event that led her to move to Wyoming; how motherhood changed her; the focus and hustle required to make ends meet as a single mother; hunting big game for food; balancing the artistic side of hatmaking with the all-important need to earn a living; the increasing wealth inequality in Jackson; the importance of friendships with other artisans and makers; why imposter syndrome can be a good thing; techniques for keeping an even keel; favorite books; and much more.

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If you haven’t checked out Christy’s website or followed her on social media, I recommend that you do– there are links in the episode notes to all of that and everything else we discussed. But in the meantime, I know you’ll enjoy this inspiring and motivational conversation with Christy Sing Robertson.

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• Sing Hat Company
• Sing Hat Company on Instagram
• Full episode notes and links: https://mountainandprairie.com/sing/
• SUPPORT M&P on Patreon
• Visit the M&P SHOP

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TOPICS DISCUSSED:

• 4:30 - Christy’s childhood
• 9:00 - Christy’s life post high school
• 10:45 - When making things clothes came into Christy’s life
• 12:00 - How Christy came to the Rocky Mountains, and how it changed her
• 23:00 - What Christy’s work and life was like after moving to Wyoming
• 25:15 - When hatmaking entered Christy’s life
• 27:30 - How Christy’s life changed after she had kids
• 32:00 - How Christy became self-sufficient in hunting
• 35:30 - Back to hats 
• 39:00 - Whether or not Christy ever reconsidered her decision to make hats
• 40:55 - When Christy felt she was good at making hats
• 42:45 - How relationship building impacted Christy’s business
• 44:15 - How it went when Christy went full into making hats for a living
• 46:45 - How Christy manages the prices of Jackson, WY
• 50:15 - How Christy keeps an even keel
• 51:30 - How a community of makers has impacted Christy’s journey and career
• 55:15 - Reflecting on how Christy got where she is in her craft and career
• 58:45 - Christy’s advice for aspiring makers
• 1:01:15 - Christy’s vision for Sing Hats
• 1:05:00 - Christy’s book recommendations
• 1:07:00 - Christy’s parting words of wisdom

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This is a special live episode that was recorded in late June 2023 at the first-ever Old Salt Festival, which was held on the Mannix Family Ranch in Helmville, Montana. The Old Salt Festival is a three-day celebration of ranching, land stewardship, and wild places that features live Western music, wood-fired cooking, products from some of the West’s most renowned artisans, readings and interviews with Western authors and poets, and in-depth discussions about conservation and land stewardship. The festival was a resounding success, so I’m thrilled to share one of the many conversations with you here.

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The episode is a panel discussion titled "Rebuilding a Resilient, Regional Meat Supply Chain," featuring several of the West’s leading voices in sustainable meat production and regenerative agriculture. In order of their appearance in the episode, you’ll hear from Cole Mannix, President of the Old Salt Co-op; Kate Kavanaugh, owner of Western Daughters Butcher Shoppe and host of the Mind, Body, and Soil Podcast; Dan Miller, Founder of Steward; and Wyatt Nelson, President of Wild West Local Foods. As you’ll hear, each panelist is deeply immersed in a different aspect of the meat production supply chain, and each of them brings a unique and wise perspective to the challenges facing producers and small businesses involved in meat production.

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Many of you may already know, but the Old Salt Festival is a part of the Old Salt Co-op, a new, purpose-driven company that “provides meat raised with integrity from Montana landscapes its customers know and care about.” The Old Salt Co-op is working to rebuild the meat business in Montana, creating a sustainable business model that is beneficial to local ranchers, local consumers, and local economies– all while responsibly and effectively stewarding the lands that support agriculture. Rebuilding Montana’s meat supply chain is no small feat, but with smart, purpose-driven people like Cole, Kate, Dan, and Wyatt working to find solutions, I think you’ll be both inspired and encouraged.

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To learn more about the Old Salt Co-op, you can go back to my first podcast conversion with Cole from February of 2023. And be on the lookout for another live Old Salt Festival episode, which I’ll be releasing on August 8, 2023– that one will feature a conversation with famed western author David James Duncan followed by a reading from his new novel Sun House.

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A huge thanks to Cole and the Old Salt team for inviting me to the Festival, and a huge thanks to the Mannix Family for sharing their stunning ranch with all of us. Thanks to Cole, Kate, Dan, and Wyatt for sharing their wisdom. And last but definitely not least, thanks to the one and only, always hilarious and energetic Bex Frucht for the amazing intro. Hope you enjoy.

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• OLD SALT FESTIVAL
• OLD SALT CO-OP
• Cole's first M&P episode
• Full episode notes and links: https://mountainandprairie.com/old-salt/

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TOPICS DISCUSSED:

• 2:45 - Introductions
• 6:15 - The challenge and opportunity that Cole saw, leading to the development of Old Salt Co-op
• 9:00 - What Kate sees as major potential challenges for Old Salt Co-op going forward
• 12:15 - What attracted Dan to finance regenerative agriculture, especially given that industry’s tight margins
• 15:00 - Wyatt’s introduction, as well as the roadblocks that Wyatt sees to a more resilient food system from the distribution side of things
• 17:15 - How the panel members go about getting people’s attention
• 24:45 - The work Cole’s family and neighbors have done to protect the local landscape, as well as trends in young people getting involved with agriculture
• 32:15 - What Kate is seeing on the retail side of meat production, and how to address it
• 38:15 - What Old Salt Co-op is working on right now
• 41:15 - What we can do that would help build a resilient meat and food system

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Rob Addington is the Director of the Forest and Fire Program with The Nature Conservancy in Colorado. He and his team are focused on increasing the pace and scale of forest restoration in Colorado to reduce hazardous fuels and promote landscape resilience to natural disturbances such as wildfire as well as climate change.

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You don’t have to live in the West to know that the region has been battling ongoing drought, historically large and intense wildfires, and various forms of insect-induced forest devastation. Over the past few years here in Colorado, we’ve experienced some of the most destructive wildfires in recorded history, and the pine beetle infestation continues to be a source of serious and increasing concern. And Colorado is obviously not alone– there are similar stories of struggling forests throughout all of the Western states.

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While the current conditions may be dire, you’ll be happy to know that Rob and his team at The Nature Conservancy are working extremely hard to find collaborative, creative, and effective solutions to the challenges facing our forests here in the West. By partnering with government agencies, Tribal nations, private landowners, various non-profits, and more, TNC has been leading and implementing some of the most innovative forest health work in the country– work that is creating more resilient, healthy landscapes across hundreds of thousands of acres.

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For all the listeners who have been asking for a wildfire and forest health-focused episode, this one is for you. I met up with Rob at the TNC office in Boulder, and he was kind enough to educate me on both the big picture and finer details of all things forest health. You can check out the notes for a full list of everything we discussed, but a few of the topics include: The infamous 2020 wildfire season and the outlook for 2023, the history of land management and how that has affected wildfires, pine beetles, wildfire’s effects on water quality, how beavers can play a role in fire mitigation, some specific success stories, business solutions for forest health, the all-important focus on partnerships, post-fire land management strategies, good books, and much more. Be sure to visit the episode webpage for links to everything, including TNC’s exciting new Western Division Forest and Fire Initiative.

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A huge thanks to Rob for taking the time to answer all my questions and another huge thanks to TNC for leading all of this important work. I hope you enjoy!

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• Rob Addington
• Colorado Wildfires, Climate Change and Water | TNC
• What Colorado Trailblazers Teach Us About Wildfire Recovery
• Colorado Forests and Beer: OktoberForest
• Full episode notes and links: https://mountainandprairie.com/rob-addington/

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This episode is brought to you in partnership with the Colorado chapter of The Nature Conservancy. Guided by science and grounded by decades of collaborative partnerships, The Nature Conservancy has a long-standing legacy of achieving lasting results to create a world where nature and people thrive.

On the fourth Tuesday of every month throughout 2023, Mountain & Prairie will be delving into conversations with a wide range of The Nature Conservancy’s leaders, partners, collaborators, and stakeholders, highlighting the myriad of conservation challenges, opportunities, and solutions here in the American West.

To learn more about The Nature Conservancy’s impactful work in Colorado and around the world, visit www.nature.org/colorado

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TOPICS DISCUSSED:

• 3:30 – Discussing the fire season of 2020
• 9:45 – The outlook for the fire season of 2023
• 12:00 – Discussing the variability in Colorado’s recent fire seasons
• 14:45 – The causes for Colorado’s changing fire seasons
• 17:30 – Exploring, specifically, the role of historic land management and how it impacts fire behavior
• 20:30 – Discussing pine beetles
• 26:00 – How the forest regime progresses in beetle-killed stands without fire, and how changing fire behavior is impacting the forest regime
• 32:00 – How fires impact water
• 39:15 – Discussing potential solution strategies for Colorado’s fire situation
• 42:00 – Discussing the importance of managing partnerships in this work
• 44:45 – A specific, fire-related project that Rob is happy about
• 47:15 – Exploring the potential of a for-profit business that is incentivized to thin out fire-prone forests
• 50:30 – Beavers’ role in wildfire prevention
• 54:30 – Rob’s favorite period of history to read about
• 56:30 – Management strategies for an area that has been wiped clean by fire
• 1:00:30 – Rob’s book recommendations

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David Gessner is no stranger to Mountain & Prairie listeners– he’s joined me for many episodes and is the author of many of my favorite books, including "All the Wild That Remains," "Leave It As It Is," "My Green Manifesto," and more. His newest book is "A Traveler's Guide to the End of the World: Tales of Fire, Wind, and Water," which once again showcases David’s unique ability to combine humor, travel, and memoir in service of connecting the reader with the natural world.

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"A Traveler's Guide to the End of the World" chronicles David’s journeys around the country, where he finds himself in the middle of an unsettling number of climate disasters– from historic forest fires in the American West to hurricanes on North Carolina’s Outer Banks. Eschewing the ubiquitous facts, figures, and policy debates that often dominate climate-focused books, David does what he does best: he tells stories. Specifically, he tells impactful, insightful stories from the front lines of the climate crisis– stories that will stick with the reader for years to come.

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As has been our tradition for several years now, David and I met up in Boulder, Colorado, where he and his family visit each summer. We obviously talk a lot about the book, but as is the case whenever we get together, the conversation flows into many fun and unexpected topics. You can check out the episode notes for a full list of everything we discussed, but some of the topics include: David’s recent writing workshop at the Zapata Ranch with his friend, author Craig Childs, the importance of momentum and dailiness in writing, how David’s daughter was the influence for the new book, optimism vs. pessimism when reporting current events, thoughts on death and loss, David’s good friend, the late Mark Spitzer, the next generation of conservation-minded writers, some book recommendations, the idea of being a “polygamist of place,” and much more.

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I’m always happy to have the opportunity to sit down with David for a conversation, so I greatly appreciate his carving out the time. I hope you can check out "A Traveler's Guide to the End of the World," and I hope you enjoy this episode.

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• A Traveler’s Guide to the End of the World by David Gessner
• David Gessner
• Full episode notes and links: https://mountainandprairie.com/david-gessner-4/
• Support Mountain & Prairie
• Sign up for Ed's Book Recommendations

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TOPICS DISCUSSED:

• 3:15 - David’s Zapata Ranch retreat
• 6:45 - Discussing the power of “dailiness”
• 7:45 - Whether or not teaching helped in David’s practice of writing
• 9:00 - How many books David has written in the past 18 months
• 10:30 - How David knows when an idea becomes a book in his mind
• 16:45 - David’s goal for "A Traveler’s Guide to the End of the World," including how he balanced stories with statistics and humor with the weight of the subject
• 20:45 - Evaluating how the news of the West is reported
• 27:45 - What David means when he identifies as a “polygamist of place”
• 33:15 - David’s relationship with Mark Spitzer
• 39:30 - How David feels about entering a stage in life where his friends are beginning to pass away
• 43:45 - Discussing David’s daughter, climate change, and how they figure into "A Traveler’s Guide"
• 50:30 - David discusses the various tools he would like to use to face climate change
• 52:45 - Who David thinks will continue the work of the Doug Peacocks of the world
• 56:45 - Discussing the political alignment affiliated with climate change work
• 1:01:30 - David’s book recommendations

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Doug Peacock is a legendary environmentalist, writer, filmmaker, and grizzly bear advocate. He’s the co-founder of two conversation nonprofits– Round River Conservation Studies and Save the Yellowstone Grizzly. Doug was also the inspiration for the character George Washington Hayduke in his friend Edward Abbey’s classic novel "The Monkey Wrench Gang." And to top it all off, he is the author of many classic books, including "Grizzly Years: In Search of the American Wilderness" and his most recent award-winning book "Was it Worth It? A Wilderness Warrior’s Long Trail Home," published by Patagonia Books.

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Doug was born and raised in Michigan, where he grew up obsessed with nature and the outdoors. As a young man, he was drafted into the Vietnam War, where he served as a Green Beret combat medic, an experience that placed him squarely in the middle of devastating violence toward his fellow soldiers, as well as civilian men, women, and children. In 1968, he returned home from Vietnam spiritually broken, mentally unwell, and physically debilitated with malaria. Not knowing where to turn, he headed deep into the wilderness of Yellowstone National Park by himself, where he formed an unlikely bond with the Yellowstone Grizzly Bear. Eventually, he recovered both physically and mentally and, to this day, he credits the grizzly with saving his life. He has spent the last half-century repaying his debt to the grizzly bear, aggressively fighting for their protection and recovery in the Greater Yellowstone Ecosystem and beyond.

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I met up with Doug in Aspen, Colorado, where he was in town for a reading of "Was it Worth It?" at Aspen’s only bookstore, Explore Booksellers. Even though I could’ve talked with Doug for many hours, we managed to jam a lot of stories into this conversation. Some of the topics we discussed include: Why Doug does not carry a gun in grizzly country; why it is important for humans to love and protect a creature as powerful, even dangerous, as a grizzly; his friendships with Edward Abbey, Yvon Chouinard, Jim Harrison, and others, and how each of those high-voltage personalities helped to elevate the others; the death and secret burial of Edward Abbey; why climate changes is such a threat to grizzlies, the challenges and financial realities of a life dedicated to environmental advocacy; his greatest source of pride and greatest disappointment; what is giving him hope now; and Doug reads several passages from "Was It Worth It?’"

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Today, at age 81, you can still feel the fire in Doug’s spirit, and his passion for grizzlies is palpable. I was honored to have the opportunity to chat with Doug, and I loved his book "Was it Worth It?" I hope you enjoy this conversation as much as I did.

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• Doug Peacock
• "Was it Worth It? A Wilderness Warrior’s Long Trail Home"
• "Grizzly Years: In Search of the American Wilderness"
• Save the Yellowstone Grizzly
• Round River Conservation Studies
• Full episode notes and links: https://mountainandprairie.com/doug-peacock/

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TOPICS DISCUSSED:

• 4:10 - Discussing the picture on the front of Doug’s book
• 6:25 - When Doug decided it wasn’t fair to be in grizzly country with guns
• 8:40 - How Yellowstone became a part of Doug’s life 
• 10:55 - How grizzlies provided a much-needed community for Doug after his time at war
• 12:40 - How long it took for Doug to find peace in grizzly country after Vietnam
• 15:10 - Exploring Doug’s balance between telling the good stories and being willing to fight for conservation
• 18:10 - Why specifically it is so important for humans to learn to love and protect a creature as powerful, even dangerous, as a grizzly
• 19:40 - How Doug’s friends made him a better conservationist
• 21:40 - How Doug’s friends balance their very strong personalities
• 22:40 - The importance of ceremony and how Doug handled the passing of his dear friend, Ed Abbey
• 28:40 - Whether or not parenthood changed Doug’s outlook on risk and death
• 30:10 - Who or where Doug drew his motivation from
• 32:10 - How Doug managed his lifestyle
• 33:40 - What keeps Doug awake at night, as it pertains to grizzlies
• 36:40 - How Doug became interested in fighting climate change by way of grizzlies
• 39:30 - Where Doug would focus his energy if he were starting his career in conservation now
• 40:25 - Whether or not Doug is an optimist
• 43:40 - What work Doug is most proud of in his life, and where he thinks he may have fallen short
• 46:00 - Doug’s friendship with Jim Harrison
• 47:10 - What gives Doug hope
• 48:40 - Doug’s mandatory reading

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Chris Hawkins is the Colorado Urban Conservation Manager for The Nature Conservancy, where he leads the organization’s efforts in Denver to “solve global challenges like the biodiversity and climate emergencies by supporting and creating more sustainable, efficient ways of living.”

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When many people think of The Nature Conservancy, they may envision large-scale conservation efforts across vast grasslands and wild landscapes– but TNC also conducts some of its most innovative conservation work in cities— work that leads to more resilient, healthy, and equitable communities. Chris’s work in Denver is a shining example of how nature-based solutions in densely populated urban areas can have positive ripple effects far beyond the city limits.

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Chris was born and raised on the east coast, attended college in Boston, and from the very beginning of his career, he’s been focused on service and causes greater than himself. He’s worked as a Corps Member of AmericaCorps, as Chief of Staff in New York City’s Department of Environmental Protection, and for the past nine years, he’s been with the Nature Conservancy. As you’ll hear in this conversation, Chris’s diverse professional experiences have allowed him to bring a unique and effective perspective to the complex world of urban conservation.

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Chris was nice enough to join me at my dining room table for an engaging and educational conversation about all things urban conservation. We started out by discussing why TNC has chosen to devote its resources and expertise to conservation in cities, and he explains the unique challenges facing cities in the West. We discuss how public health is directly related to people’s access to nature, and how the simple-but-not-easy strategy of planting trees in neighborhoods can have huge conservation and public health benefits. As is the case with all of my conservation-related conversations, we discuss the critical importance of relationships, and how Chris has managed to build relationships with a diverse group of Denver residents. We also discuss his professional trajectory, the importance of exporting urban conservation ideas to other cities, and the critical roles of mayors and local leadership. And finally, Chris is a serious history buff, so we have a great discussion about books.

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There is so much fascinating information packed into this episode, and I greatly appreciate Chris’s taking the time to share his wisdom with the Mountain & Prairie community. Check out the episode notes for links to everything we discuss. I hope you enjoy this conversation as much as I did.

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• Chris Hawkins

• TNC's Urban Conservation Program in Denver

• TNC's Global Cities Program

• Full episode notes and links: https://mountainandprairie.com/chris-hawkins/

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This episode is brought to you in partnership with the Colorado chapter of The Nature Conservancy. Guided by science and grounded by decades of collaborative partnerships, The Nature Conservancy has a long-standing legacy of achieving lasting results to create a world where nature and people thrive.

On the fourth Tuesday of every month throughout 2023, Mountain & Prairie will be delving into conversations with a wide range of The Nature Conservancy’s leaders, partners, collaborators, and stakeholders, highlighting the myriad of conservation challenges, opportunities, and solutions here in the American West.

To learn more about The Nature Conservancy’s impactful work in Colorado and around the world, visit www.nature.org/colorado

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TOPICS DISCUSSED:

• 3:45 - Why do Chris and TNC work in cities
• 7:00 - Thriving cities in the West and the unique challenges they present
• 9:30 - Whether or not the health benefits of the outdoors have become a larger part of Chris’s work recently
• 15:30 - Discussing trees
• 27:45 - How Chris builds relationships in his work in cities
• 33:45 - Specific strategies Chris uses to build trust
• 38:30 - Where Chris grew up and why he became involved in this work
• 43:30 - Discussing the work of city mayors
• 53:00- How ideas that are exported or imported between cities show up in Chris’s work in Denver
• 1:00:15 - Chris’s book recommendations

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Back in September of 2022, I held the first annual Strenuous Life Retreat at the renowned Zapata Ranch in Colorado’s San Luis Valley. The retreat consisted of five days of adventure and education inspired by Theodore Roosevelt’s well-known commitment to living “the Strenuous Life.” We hiked high into the Sangre de Cristo Mountains, rode horses in Great Sand Dunes National Park, and enjoyed world-class meals. And each afternoon, we enjoyed facilitated conversations about land stewardship, conservation, and regenerative agriculture. This episode is a recording of one of those conversations.

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I was honored to be joined by conservation veteran Nancy Fishbein, who serves as Director of Resilient Lands for the Colorado Chapter of The Nature Conservancy. Nancy has been a long-standing leader in the Western conservation community, so we were all honored that she took time out of her full schedule to join us and share some stories and hard-earned wisdom. The Zapata Ranch is owned by the Nature Conservancy and managed by Ranchlands, so Nancy has a unique insight into the history of the ranch, as well as the importance of conservation in the San Luis Valley.

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We recorded this conversation at the ranch’s education center, one afternoon after a morning of horseback riding. The first half consists of me asking the questions, and the second half consists of questions from the retreat participants. We cover everything from the history of the Zapata Ranch to the establishment of Great Sand Dunes National Park, which adjoins the ranch to the north. We talk about the conservation bison herd that calls the ranch home, and some of the ongoing challenges in the San Luis Valley created by water speculation and development. We discuss how mineral rights development can coexist with conservation, the protection of biodiversity on ranches, how TNC and the National Park Service work together, and much more. As you’ll hear, everyone in attendance was super engaged and curious about Nancy’s work, and it showed in the range of interesting and thoughtful questions.

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I hope this episode will give you a bit of insight into the types of conversations we had at the 2022 Retreat and the kind of conversations you can expect in 2023 and beyond. Colorado is blessed to have so many committed conservationists like Nancy who devote their time and energy to protecting and stewarding these spectacular landscapes, and I can’t thank Nancy enough for taking the time to join us.

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If you’re interested in joining me for the 2023 Retreat, as of this recording, there are still a few spots left. You can click here to learn more and reserve your spot. Thanks for listening, and I hope you enjoy!

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• Nancy Fishbein
• Zapata Ranch
• Strenuous Life Retreat
• Full episode notes and links: https://mountainandprairie.com/nancy-fishbein/

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TOPICS DISCUSSED:

• 3:30 - A quick intro to Nancy
• 5:30 - The story of the Education Center on Zapata Ranch
• 7:00 - How Zapata Ranch first got onto TNC’s radar
• 10:00 - How TNC goes about acquiring properties like Zapata Ranch
• 12:15 - Why the previous owner of Zapata Ranch did not charge TNC full fair market value for the property
• 13:30 - The importance of relationships in TNC’s work
• 15:30 - What happened after TNC acquired Zapata Ranch
• 18:15 - Explaining a conservation easement
• 20:00 - Why the bison herd on Zapata Ranch were such a focal point of TNC’s conservation work there
• 22:15 - Why TNC has chosen to hold onto Zapata Ranch as an owner for so long
• 25:45 - How TNC works with various levels of government agencies
• 27:30 - Nancy’s biggest concern for the San Luis Valley
• 29:00 - The most recent scheme to remove water from the San Luis Valley
• 31:45 - Audience questions begin
• 32:00 - Whether or not Nancy wished that TNC had done something different in their acquisition of Zapata Ranch
• 32:45 - Nancy’s surprises and lessons learned about Zapata
• 34:30 - Why an easement cannot be put on San Luis Valley’s aquifer
• 36:15 - TNC’s role in the establishment of Baca Wildlife Refuge and the Great Sand Dunes National Park
• 40:45 - The distinction between a national park and a national monument
• 41:30 - How the TNC navigated purchasing land that was managed by a private company (Rocky Mountain Bison) but on leased state land
• 42:30 - Exploring the potential causality between water export schemes in the San Luis Valley and the establishment of the Great Sand Dunes National Park
• 44:00 - Whether or not there remains the appetite for bipartisan action, such as the kind that led to the creation of the Great Sand Dunes National Park, in our current political climate
• 45:00 - Exploring TNC’s support of agriculture as a conservation service
• 43:30 - Whether or not TNC deals with agricultural leases
• 51:30 - How easements impact mineral and mining rights on a property
• 53:30 - How fracking might complicate conservation easements, and whether or not easements are a successful tool for reducing oil and gas development 
• 55:45 - How TNC measures success in its conservation work and the preservation of biodiversity on a property, and how they respond to and act on those measurements
• 1:00:55 - What TNC is working on right now in Colorado

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ABOUT MOUNTAIN & PRAIRIE:

• Mountain & Prairie - All Episodes
• Mountain & Prairie Shop
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• Upcoming Events
• About Ed Roberson
• Support Mountain & Prairie
• Leave a Review on Apple Podcasts