In this special role-reversal episode, Beth hands the mic to her longtime friend of 40+ years, OB-GYN Dr. Patricia “Tricia” McClelland—a familiar voice on the podcast from past episodes on hormones and menopause. This time, Tricia interviews Beth, asking the questions Beth usually asks everyone else.

Together they dive into the values that quietly steer Beth’s life—love, kindness, community, authenticity, using your gifts to help others, and treating everyone with dignity—plus how her Christian faith gives her peace with her own imperfections. Beth opens up about parenting three kids close together, her journey with ADHD, and how chronic people-pleasing and weak boundaries left her exhausted (and what she’s doing differently now).

They talk honestly about:

If you’ve ever felt like you’re supposed to have it all together while secretly struggling, this conversation will make you feel seen, normal, and a little more hopeful.

💛 We need your help! This podcast is funded by Dr. Beth, and we are looking for donations from listeners and potential sponsors. If you’re interested in contributing, you can send donations via Venmo (⁠https://account.venmo.com/u/NeverPerfectPodcast⁠) or email ⁠[email protected]⁠ to find out other ways to donate.

🎧 Listen to this episode and more: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠neverperfect.org⁠

📲 Follow us on Instagram: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠@neverperfectpodcast

Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

What if your pain is real—and also not the whole story?

In this episode, Dr. Beth sits down with two “pain whisperers” who bridge medicine and recovery: Dr. Matt McClanahan, an osteopathic physician (Neuromusculoskeletal & Family Medicine; Center for Insight Medicine), and Joe Timberlake, a 35-year sober addictions specialist and chronic-pain coach. Together, they explore how the brain processes danger—physical and emotional—in the same places, why neuroplasticity can both help and hurt us, and how grief, stress, and identity conflicts can keep alarms blaring long after tissues have healed.

You’ll hear why “pain × resistance = suffering,” how fear (not pain) is often the real treatment target, and why changing our relationship to symptoms (curiosity over panic, safety over threat) can downshift nervous-system alarms. Beth shares her own recent back injury amid the loss of her father, and the three unpack how context, attachment, and meaning shape the “pain experience.” We get practical too: reframing, paced return to movement (yes, yoga!), breath-led state shifts, and the difference between coping vs. retraining for neuroplastic pain.

If you’ve ever thought, “I just want an answer,” this conversation offers one that’s both compassionate and empowering: your pain is real—and there’s more hope than you’ve been told.

Perfect for listeners who…

Live with chronic pain, migraines, or panic flares

Are navigating grief, stress, or recovery

Want brain-based, skills-based ways to feel safer in their body

💛 We need your help! This podcast is funded by Dr. Beth, and we are looking for donations from listeners and potential sponsors. If you’re interested in contributing, you can send donations via Venmo (⁠https://account.venmo.com/u/NeverPerfectPodcast⁠) or email ⁠[email protected]⁠ to find out other ways to donate.

🎧 Listen to this episode and more: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠neverperfect.org⁠

📲 Follow us on Instagram: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠@neverperfectpodcast

Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Parenting teens isn’t about perfection—it’s about presence, honesty, and learning to let go.

In this conversation, Beth welcomes Randi Crawford, a straight-talking parenting coach who brings humor, vulnerability, and decades of life experience to the table. From co-founding a women’s health company with her father to becoming an empty-nester, Randi shares her journey of reinvention and what it taught her about resilience, grit, and independence.

Together, they dive into:

Why letting kids sit in discomfort is a gift (not punishment)

How to practice “tough love” without the toughness

The importance of listening without trying to fix

Modeling imperfection and apologizing as parents

Why communication is the #1 tool for building trust with teens

This episode is both refreshing and relatable—reminding us that our kids are not an extension of us, but their own people. If you’ve ever wrestled with how much to guide, when to step back, and how to stay connected through it all, this conversation is for you.

👉 To learn more about Randi, go to Randicrawfordcoaching.com

💛 We need your help! This podcast is funded by Dr. Beth, and we are looking for donations from listeners and potential sponsors. If you’re interested in contributing, you can send donations via Venmo (https://account.venmo.com/u/NeverPerfectPodcast) or email [email protected] to find out other ways to donate.

🎧 Listen to this episode and more: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠neverperfect.org

📲 Follow us on Instagram: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠@neverperfectpodcast

Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Figs o’Sullivan and his wife Teale are marriage therapists and relationship experts who developed the Empathi method.

They are the architects of the Empathi Method and they think of themselves as “wounded healers and fellow strugglers.” Figs takes a casual approach in his work with couples and see himself as “just another wounded person trying to make his own relationships work.”

Figs believes that “every person makes sense and every person is worthy of love”, AND if they can get beyond the narrative that one partner is right and one partner is wrong, they can find a neutral place to meet and talk and work through their issues.  

He shares a bit about his approach to helping couples, and he believes that “although people are complicated, therapy shouldn't be. “  Figs views himself as a fellow traveler in life and a fellow struggler. He likes to remind couples that many of their conflicts and arguments are just evidence that they care so much about this relationship.

O'Sullivan's approach encourages individuals to examine their own emotional responses and vulnerabilities, becoming more self-aware to attract and maintain a healthier relationship dynamic. 

He shares the  3 pillars of relationships that he focuses on in couples work: 

    1    Attachment theory

    2    Systems Theory

    3    Transformation/Experiences

To learn more about Figs and his work, go to empathi.com

Listen to this episode and more: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠neverperfect.org⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠

Follow us on instagram ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠@neverperfectpodcast⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠

Please rate and review this podcast. Send us an email with any feedback or requests: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠[email protected]⁠

Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Today Dr. Carol Stoney, Beth’s most frequent (and very likely one of the most popular ) podcast guests returns to the show to talk about marriage. She likes to encourage married couples to ask themselves the question regularly: “ Why did we get  married?” Like when things get hard  or when transitions happen, she urges them to sit down and have a conversation “What’s our purpose?” Sometimes couples have change their mission, she said.

Dr. Stoney stated “I don’t care what couples are fighting about, I care what they are fighting FOR“ “What is the mission and the purpose and the reason you are staying together?”

In essence, it is important for couples to know and remember what it is they are trying to achieve and what stands in the way (or threatens) what it is that they are trying to recover to achieve that goal they never knew they had.

She urges couples to consider, why is this so important to me? What is it that we’re fighting for?

To hear more episodes with Dr. Stoney, go to your favorite podcast platform and Google Never Perfect Dr. Stoney

To learn more about her, you can go to healingforcouples.com

Listen to this episode and more: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠neverperfect.org⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠

Follow us on instagram ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠@neverperfectpodcast⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠

Please rate and review this podcast. Send us an email with any feedback or requests: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠[email protected]⁠

Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

What is the difference between unconditional love and conditional love? Does healthy love have to include approval of all choices? Are we showing love to our children or our loved ones even when we don’t approve of their choices, or when we grieve their choices? Is our love for them more selfish or more selfless? Are we wanting them to make choices that are good for US or for THEM? How do we handle it if they have different priorities or make different choices than we want them to? Are we allowing them to be their healthiest best selves or are we trying to control them?  Do we punish people when they don’t do what we want? How can you provide guidance and rules without interfering with healthy development and choices? Today Dr. Beth records a conversation about these topics with a client, honing in on topics related to healthy parenting and unconditional love. This conversation was recorded spontaneously immediately following their therapy session. This client, who has several adolescent and young adult children, shared some great insights and questions, along with examples from her own childhood.

Listen to this episode and more: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠neverperfect.org⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠

Follow us on instagram ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠@neverperfectpodcast⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠

Please rate and review this podcast. Send us an email with any feedback or requests: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠[email protected]⁠

Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

What do we need to know about midlife and how to navigate it? How does wellness intersect with women’s experiences of midlife? Today Beth discusses these topics with counselor Elizabeth O’Brien, the author of “The Power in the Middle”. Check out links to her book at sign up for her monthly  newsletter at her website HERE

Listen to this episode and more: ⁠⁠⁠⁠neverperfect.org⁠⁠⁠⁠

Follow us on instagram ⁠⁠⁠⁠@neverperfectpodcast⁠⁠⁠⁠

Please rate and review this podcast. Send us an email with any feedback or requests: ⁠⁠⁠⁠[email protected]⁠

Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

John Wang, a leadership coach, corporate speaker, Podcast host and book author, is on a mission to empower Asian Americans to break through external and internal limitations in order to reach their full potential professionally and personally. Many of them get overlooked for leadership positions in spite of their brilliance and conscientiousness. John’s book, “Big Asian Energy: An Unapologetic Guide for Breaking Barriers to Leadership and Success” was published this month (May 2025) and can be found, along with information about his coaching and his podcast HERE

Listen to this episode and more: ⁠⁠⁠neverperfect.org⁠⁠⁠

Follow us on instagram ⁠⁠⁠@neverperfectpodcast⁠⁠⁠

Please rate and review this podcast. Send us an email with any feedback or requests: ⁠⁠⁠[email protected]⁠

Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Before becoming a high performance relationship coach and gender dynamics social scientist Katarina Polonska struggled in her own relationship journey, calling off her first engagement. And today, this Oxford, trained therapist and relationship coach specializes in helping people figure out when to stay or when to go. She helps individuals as well as couples identify blind spots in their relationships and in their careers. Katarina has a podcast called Successfully in Love and a free 20 minute Masterclass outlining her  “Successfully in Love method”. For more information, check out  her website HERE

Listen to this episode and more: ⁠⁠neverperfect.org⁠⁠

Follow us on instagram ⁠⁠@neverperfectpodcast⁠⁠

Please rate and review this podcast. Send us an email with any feedback or requests: ⁠⁠[email protected]⁠

Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Julie Baumgardner has spent 35 years helping guide people to create healthy vibrant marriage relationships. Almost 28 years ago, she helped launch First Things First, an award-winning nonprofit dedicated to helping people have healthy relationships. In this episode,  she addresses some common myths about marriage and shares some of her favorite research and advice, for walking through hard seasons of marriage and why building a culture of appreciation in marriage can make all the difference. She emphasizes the importance of individuals building their own happiness as a way to put less pressure on  their spouse to meet all their needs. Also be on the lookout for Julie‘s new project called “Marriage on the Daily” which should be coming in the Fall of 2025.

Recommended Resources:

- The Mindful marriage (Ron and Nan Deal)

- Hold Me Tight and Created for Connection (Sue Johnson)

- God, Sex and Your Marriage (Juli Slattery)

- Hot Monogamy (Pat Love)

- The Heart of Commitment (Scott Stanley)

Listen to this episode and more: ⁠neverperfect.org⁠

Follow us on instagram ⁠@neverperfectpodcast⁠

Please rate and review this podcast. Send us an email with any feedback or requests: ⁠[email protected]

Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices