Not Real Art

While the pandemic has taken a lot away, it has also gifted many of us with extra time to pursue our passions. This is how today’s guest, Javie Lopez, views the forced downtime in 2020, and he has been grinding harder than ever before. As a consummate multi-hyphenate, Javie is an artist, producer, DJ, videographer, director, and Founder and Creative Director of Graffiti The City. Along with this, he is a great friend, a die-hard supporter of the arts, and all-round dope, positive guy. In this episode, we talk about how he has been making the most of a clearer than usual schedule and the importance of not making excuses and staying savvy. Things will eventually find their way back to normal, so you might as well stay ahead of the game. We also chat about his record label and his hesitation to strike out on his own. Being the standup man he is, Javie wanted to make sure he could do good by all the artists he signed. Although Javie is killing it in many ways right now, he admits that he has not always used his time effectively, and we talk about how artists can move past overthinking and feeling discouraged to use every hour in the day the best they can. He respects how the younger generation of artists puts stuff out there before it is properly polished, something he could never do when he was young. Our conversation also touches on the exciting work Graffiti The City has in the pipeline, why artists need to start working on their businesses more, and where the art world is headed. Don't miss out!

Key Points From This Episode:

• How Javie kept busy in 2020 and the challenge he had helping his daughter with schoolwork.
• The importance of making the most out of this forced downtime we have been gifted.
• It can be hard to work in a self-directed way, but artists have to figure it out.
• Hear about the work Javie is doing with Dahlia Coronado, the first MC he signed to his record label.
• Some of the other musical ventures Graffiti The City is undertaking.
• The story of how Javie met Dahlia when he was working as an Uber driver.
• Why Javie was so careful about starting a record label.
• Javie’s approach to video production and his passion for doing it all.
• Artists need to get past analysis paralysis and put work out, rather than waiting for ‘perfection’.
• Finding the balance between hating on and praising the younger generation of artists.
• How technology has democratized artistic production and expression.
• The importance of not placing too much emphasis on social media follower numbers.
• Why having his daughter helped give Javie the push he needed to start Graffiti The City.
• Lessons Javie has learned over the years about negative energy and staying away from it.
• Products, projects, and collaborations Graffiti The City is working on at the moment.
• L.A. versus Miami: The difference between these two art worlds.
• Sourdough’s insights into the future of the L.A. art world: Artists need to take more responsibility.
• Being a professional artist requires both business and artistic acumen.
• How Javie has dealt with feeling discouraged and his advice to other artists.
• Where to find Javie and Graffiti The City online.  

For more information and photos, visit here: https://notrealart.com/javie-lopez

For the acclaimed writer, producer, and broadcaster Frances Anderton, telling engaging stories is about inspiring people and never leaving them feeling hopeless. Having just left her position of 22 years at KCRW, in this episode we speak with Frances about transition and her history reporting on how design and architecture impact community, politics, and culture. Early in the show, we explore how crises can lead to personal adventure. Reflecting the theme of transition, we discuss positives resulting from how Los Angeles has adapted to the pandemic. We dive into Frances’ work in design and architecture before she opens up about the experience of leaving KCRW. We talk about the challenges that Frances is facing, including the creative problem of whether she should focus on a new direction or continue the work that she’s so well-known for. In the latter part of the episode, we touch on how space can enhance our sense of community, how waste never truly goes away, Frances’ upcoming projects, and expected shifts in the design industry. Tune in to hear Frances’ incredible insights on life, change, and humanizing design and architecture.

Key Points From This Episode:

• Exploring how crises can lead to periods of change. 
• How Los Angeles outside spaces have been adapted due to the pandemic.   
• Reflecting on Frances’ work humanizing design and architecture. 
• Frances talks about the experience of leaving her 22-year post at KCRW.
• Tracking KCRW’s journey from a small to a large broadcaster.
• How your organization’s culture changes as it grows. 
• We discuss what Frances has lost and gained from starting a new chapter in her life. 
• The importance of recalibrating your life to find what product you want to create. 
• Why deciding what to do in your life should be made with patience and self-love. 
• Hear about the projects that Frances has planned. 
• How living spaces enhance or detract from our sense of community. 
• Details on Frances’ upcoming show, No Such Place as Away. 
• Telling stories to inspire and not to depress. 
• Frances chats about her favorite aspects of working for KCRW.

For more information and photos, visit here: https://notrealart.com/frances-anderton

Brand identity is a big business. From consumer products to startups and even political parties, if people identify with your message, they will be on your side. Today's guest, Ron Vandenberg, is a multi-Clio Award-winning brand consultant and creative director and is recognized for his expertise in brand thinking, communication, design and experience. He is currently in the middle of launching a brand-smart business transformation company, Blulab, and we kick off the show by hearing details about his new venture. Ron shares why he wants to be able to offer both business and brand innovation services so that companies see long-term gains. We talk about innovation generally, where Ron shares the struggles he has seen when companies are not able to innovate. He also debunks some of the misconceptions around innovating, and why it's vital to trust the iterative process. Having started in the brand industry as an outsider, Ron understands the power of innovation firsthand, and he talks about how he launched his first agency from scratch. The conversation then turns to Indivisible 2020, in which Ron is a participating artist. We hear about what indivisibility means to him, his take on the current political climate, and why political parties could benefit from thinking about their branding more. We wrap the show up with a look into the future, and Ron leaves us with a final message of hope that if we look to understand rather than vilify one another, we can come together once again.  

Key Points From This Episode:

• The new agency Ron is launching – how they look to combine business and brand innovation.
• The impetus for starting Blulab and why Ron calls it a ‘business transformation company.’ 
• Business innovation versus brand innovation: What they are and how they are different.
• Why it is so difficult for businesses to truly innovate on the brand or business front.
• The companies that come to mind when we think of innovation.
• Where businesses go wrong when they are trying to innovate.
• Innovation comes from many iterations; Ron uses the example of the automotive industry.
• How Ron has been able to innovate in the corporate brand industry.
• The story of how FutureBrand worked with Nelson Mandela to change the South African Airlines branding after Apartheid.
• Winning three Clio Awards on one campaign; Ron shares this success.
• What Ron embarked on once he moved back to the West Coast
• The important qualities that stand out to Ron when looking for employees and collaborators.
• Creatives don’t get to make the final decision when it comes to branding; business people do.
• How Ron’s marriage and business relationship with his wife have enabled his success.
• What indivisibility means to Ron, and why he, as an immigrant, was drawn to the U.S.
• The roles that brands can play in fostering political unity.
• It is possible to find common interests and still hang onto our political beliefs.
• How Ron is staying hopeful in this time: A belief that we can manifest our destiny.
• The importance of moving away from judgment and to a place of understanding.
• What we can learn from why Donald Trump was elected in the first place.
• Understanding politics from a marketing point of view; what we can take away.

For more information and photos, visit here: https://notrealart.com/ron-vandenberg

Welcome to this special holiday episode of the Not Real Art Podcast! As Sourdough explains early on in the show, this episode is fast and loose, featuring a bunch of boys behaving badly due to excessive amounts of holiday cheer! ManOne is finally back in the studio after his year-long assignment and what makes today’s show even better is that James Shen and Teachr from Paint The Town podcast make an appearance too! After such a wild year of isolation, hustling, and adjustments, the warm energy throughout the conversation is palpable, with our hosts and guests feeling super excited to get a chance to catch up and shoot the breeze. The show kicks off with some stories about what it has been like trying to raise kids at this time in history, and then we move onto discuss the atmosphere of freedoms and restrictions in different parts of the U.S. at this late stage of the pandemic. From there, ManOne spills the beans about his assignment – a 78 x 14-foot mural that he has been making on panels in his studio! He also tells another story about doing a mural for Coca-Cola in Crips territory which ended in a police shootout! Other topics discussed on today’s show include Trump finally being voted out, James and Teachr’s plans for 2021 including the release of a new spray paint brand, and the appearance Sophie Dee will be making on the Paint The Town podcast next year. For all this and a whole lot more on topics of art, family, politics, porn, and the pandemic, be sure to tune in!

Key Points From This Episode:

• The recent battle Teachr’s son had with suicidal thoughts due to being cooped up at home.
• The evolving discourse around adoption and Sourdough’s experience of raising his adopted kids.
• James discusses fame and being an influencer in relation to his and Teachr’s careers.
• The situation in different places in America with COVID restrictions and freedoms.
• Perspectives on safely eating at restaurants using different kinds of masks.
• How James and Teachr have framed a recent podcast they did with a difficult guest.
• ManOne’s process making a huge mural for RTI Cables and how it saved him this year.
• What everybody thinks about the vaccine and when they expect to take it.
• James’ experiences partying with Sophie Dee who will be a guest on Paint The Town soon.
• A story where ManOne painted a Coca-Cola mural in a Crips neighborhood and things got out of hand.
• An announcement about the new spray paint label James and Teachr are releasing.
• How helpful podcasts have been for keeping people sane in this time of isolation.
• What people can expect from the Paint The Town podcast in 2021.
• ManOne’s story about how street art is invisible until you start noticing it.
• Gratitude about Trump being voted out and thoughts about what he is planning next.
• Thoughts on what webcam sex websites mean from an anthropological perspective.

For more information and photos, visit here: https://notrealart.com/paint-the-town-podcast

As the lines we have drawn to separate ourselves from others seem to be hardening, will we ever get to a place where we all get along? There may not be a silver bullet to reach a place of inclusion and equity, but this does not mean it is not possible. Today's guest, Scott Hoesman, Founder of inQuest Consulting, is doing the work to help teams create a more empathetic and inclusive culture. With feelings of anger, exclusion, and fear at an all-time high, Scott helps companies understand difference and find common humanity. In this episode, we talk about what inclusivity means and why we need to move past the idea that when we bring people in, we will lose something. Not only is this not true, but viewing people who are different from us through a fear-based lens only entrenches divisions further. We discuss why topics of inclusion and equity are so difficult for people to talk about, where Scott encourages everyone – yes, even the most liberal among us – to interrogate how they live the value of inclusivity. Rather than villainizing one group, we have to turn inward, open our hearts and minds, and interrogate our own biases. Even though we are in a difficult period of history, Scott remains optimistic that we will be able to get back to civil discourse and a society of openness and learning.  

Key Points From This Episode:

• Not getting along is part of the human experience, but it is something we need to lean into.
• Our scarcity mindset – that does in some ways protect us – pits us up against one another.
• Inclusion does not mean there will be fewer resources for you.
• Why Scott is both proud and not satisfied with the work inQuest has done.
• Some of the common themes that Scott has noticed from his work. 
• Understanding that there will be backlash when talking about difficult topics openly.
• The power of naming your discomfort when trying to talk to people about topics where your knowledge is limited
• You cannot put the burden of your education on other people – It is your responsibility.
• How geographical and social context influences Scott’s work around inclusion.
• The power of proximity: Why being exposed to different people breaks down barriers.
• Nature versus nurture: Scott’s take on whether empathy is innate or learned.
• Why Scott believes the topic of inclusivity is particularly difficult for people to grapple with.
• How Scott’s 40th birthday party made him reflect on how he lived his professional values in his personal life.
• Hear how Scott helps people to see how diverse their social and professional circles are.
• We have made it socially acceptable to discriminate based on visible and invisible difference.
• Social media can further polarize or unite us depending on how we use it.
• Hear Scott’s take on cancel culture and why the argument is so nuanced.
• Why – even though we are facing such a hard time – Scott is still so optimistic.
• The worry Scott has about us becoming complacent with these issues.
• The history of inclusive consulting as a profession and how it has evolved over time.
• What the role of government is in creating and enabling inclusive and equitable practices.
• It is not only conservative people who need to open their minds; liberals do as well.
• We need to get back to a place of civil discourse where we can disagree without villainization.

For more information and photos, visit here: https://notrealart.com/scott-hoesman

Artists who are willing to put themselves in harm’s way are a rare bread, and those who use their work to help others are perhaps even rarer. Photographer, Brian McCarty, is one of these unique artists, and since 2011, he has been collaborating with the United Nations and other NGOs to help traumatized children in war zones. Through his project, War Toys, Brian uses the power of children’s toys, free play, and his camera to help these children process their pain. Brian has worked in places like Iraq, Syria, and the West Bank, and he joins us today to share insights into his work. We begin by hearing about his experience of working in a war zone and the complex emotions these spaces cause him to feel. On the one hand, he is exposed to the darkest side of humanity, while on the other, he sees people trying to help in the most selfless ways. Brian talks about the absurd and trite nature of his work and how this exact absurdity ultimately hooks people and draws them in. This endeavor has not been easy for a variety of reasons, and Brian shares more about the 15-year journey he has been on which culminated in forming a non-profit last year. Naturally, we discuss the pandemic, where Brian explains why he – like many who have worked in war zones – is particularly on edge about the election and the conflict that may come with the transfer of power. Our conversation also touches on projects Brian has in the pipeline, the immense power of art therapy in high-conflict areas and war zones, and the potential of a documentary about his work being made. Tune in today to hear more.

Key Points From This Episode:

• Hear how Brian was drawn to photographing toys, a passion that started at a young age.
• What it’s like to be working in an active war zone; it’s an addicting experience.
• The long road Brian walked to finally get to work in a war zone – It took 15 years to get there.
• What Brian believes the hook of his work – which at first glance seems trite – ultimately is.
• Brian’s relationship with toy manufacturers and the support they provide him.
• Forming the War Toys non-profit; why Brian finally decided to launch it last year and their pilot project.
• The interesting connection Brian has seen between toy guns and active war zones.
• War zones reveal both the primal and deeply hopeful nature of human beings.
• How religion affects the work Brian does and what he has learned along the way.
• The difficulty that comes with trying to find children again in high conflict areas and war zones.
• Find out how the lessons Brian has learned from his work have helped him in the pandemic.
• How Brian is using this newfound time seeing as he is unable to travel.
• Donating to War Toys; what the money will be used for.
• Some important photographers like Chris Hondros and Dickey Chapelle Brian hopes to honor.
• Why Brian doesn’t think that the media will be protected in war zones again.
• Insights into DesignerCon and why Brian is so excited about what is happening in the space.
• What Brian’s day-to-day looks like and how he stays disciplined.
• Brian’s fundraising goal for 2021 and the work he hopes to do going forward.
• Children in war zones need to be taught emotional literacy because they are often detached from their feelings.
• Capturing the work; how filming has formed a part of Brian’s project.
• Where to find Brian and War Toys online.

For more information and photos, visit here: https://notrealart.com/brian-mcCarty

This year has understandably been tough for artists. With increasing levels of stress and anxiety, it is not easy to be freely creative. Yet, art, in all its forms, is more important than ever for getting people through these difficult times. Parlor Social is at the top of their game, and Ric’key Pageot and Dessy Di Lauro, the husband-and-wife duo behind the band, join us today to share what the pandemic has been like for them. We start by talking about some of the ways they have adapted to not being able to perform live and go on tour. Despite their initial reluctance to live streaming, they have found more connection than they ever thought possible with their virtual audience. Ric’key and Dessy talk about why they decided to give free access to their content, where they acknowledge their privilege of not being stressed about finances. We also hear about some of the other blessings that have come from this time for the pair like increased creativity and getting better at their craft. Naturally, the conversation goes to Black Lives Matter, where we talk about the issues of race and police brutality and what needs to be done to dismantle these imbalanced structures. Correcting racial injustices needs to happen at so many levels, including the arts, where Black and PoC artists have always been marginalized. Ric’key, with roots in classical music, talks about the underrepresentation of Black people in this musical genre and the work he is doing to give back. Although these times are dark in many ways, Ric’key and Dessy are doing so much to spread hope and be positive forces in people’s lives. They are the embodiment of selfless artists who want to spread light and joy through all that they create.  

Key Points From This Episode:

• Hear some of the creative ways Ric’key and Dessy have adapted to these trying times.
• The time that we all have now is a blessing if we can use it well.
• Ric’key and Dessy’s skepticism around the vaccine and why they would still take it.
• How Ric’key and Dessy’s respective families are doing during the pandemic.
• Why Ric’key and Dessy decided to create Soulful Jazz Brunch and the reception to the event.
• The decision to not charge a fee for Soulful Jazz Brunch; wanting to make content accessible.
• The importance of engaging with your virtual audience to create connection.
• An idea Ric’key has to release an album of all the songs they recorded during the pandemic.
• When Ric’key and Dessy finally found their stride with live streaming.
• The major improvements Ric’key and Dessy have seen getting to perform every week.
• Some of the technical difficulties Ric’key and Dessy have faced going virtual.
• Work Ric’key is doing to get back to his classical music roots and some incredible discoveries he’s made.
• Hear about the progress Ric’key has made with his upcoming movie project.
• Why Ric’key wants to give back at this stage in his career and ways he plans on doing so.
• Ric’key’s experience at McGill University, where there were very few Black students.
• Why Dessy feels even though conversations around race and police brutality are important, they are not enough.
• How Ric’key and Dessy believe you can spread hope in these difficult times.
• The hope that Sourdough has for his kids, who are growing up in a world different to his.
• The problems the U.S. is currently grappling with are not unique to the country; they are global issues.
• Where to find Parlor Social online and what they have in the pipeline.
• Dessy’s words of comfort to her fellow artists: Be kind to yourself in this hard time.
• Find out about the line of skincare products Dessy has created.

For more information and photos, visit here: https://notrealart.com/ric’key-pageot-dessy-di-lauro

Today’s guest is pioneering conservation photographer, Robert Glenn Ketchum. Robert's imagery and books have helped to define contemporary color photography while at the same time addressing critical national environmental issues, having made him one of the most successful artists and activists in American history. In today’s episode, Robert talks about the development of his career, the many adventures his work has taken him on, and the social change these projects have kickstarted. We dive straight in hearing Robert talk about the Pebble Mine campaign he is involved in currently where he is fighting against the construction of the largest gold and cyanide leech mine in the history of the world in Southwest Alaska. From there, Robert rewinds to his days as a student at UCLA in the 60s, where he started his photography career taking snaps of the famous bands that played in his neighborhood. On the way back from the Monterey Pop Festival, Robert camped out at Limekiln Creek to break the trip up, and in a moment of contemplation next to a quiet stream he got the idea to pivot into conservation photography. Robert’s career blew up after that event, and he tells one epic tale after another about the different campaigns he fell into, the huge names he rubbed shoulders with, and the incredible ripple effects his photographs had. We also get to hear Robert's thoughts on some of the most vital sides of being an artist, how to secure money, and how to increase the clout of one’s projects. Wrapping up our conversation, Robert tells a few more awe-inspiring stories about how he started translating his prints into textiles after discovering the quality Chinese embroidery. Tune in for tales of adventure, discovery, and serendipity, all powered by a passion for creativity and our natural environment with Robert today.

Key Points From This Episode:

• The campaign Robert is working on to protest the Pebble Mine in South West Alaska.
• Robert’s book, Southwest Alaska, which talks about overfishing in Crystal Bay.
• Saving San Ignacio Lagoon with Joel Reynolds from the NRDC and recruiting him for the Southwest Alaska work.
• The multi-tiered nature of the campaigns Robert works on; drawing on multiple channels.
• The funds necessary to launch these big campaigns which groups smaller than the NRDC wouldn’t manage.
• The power of branding to spread public awareness about bad practices.
• Differences in quality between wild and farmed salmon and Robert’s adventures with Alaskan locals.
• Robert’s experiences shooting famous bands in LA in the 1960s.
• How Robert got the idea to transition into environmental photography on the way back from Monterey Pop.
• Moving to the East Coast to work on a project in the Hudson River Valley.
• Photographing destructive practices in the Hudson River Valley and getting published by Aperture.
• Passing the largest timber reform bill in the U.S’s history during the Tongass Rainforest Project.
• Getting invited onto the board of the American Land Conservancy and helping save Limekiln Creek.
• Robert’s ‘method’ involving simply taking pictures and falling into one project after another.
• Using contrasting images of natural beauty and destruction in campaigns.
• How Robert realized the power of photography after photos of his caused real changes.
• Founding the International League of Conservation Photographers.
• The need for artists with great ideas to secure funding and how Robert did this.
• Events related to the publicity and funding of the Tongass Rainforest Project.
• Some of the books that Robert has published and collections he has curated.
• Getting invited by Robert Redford to be an artist in residence at his Sundance Institute.
• An expedition on William E. Simon’s private yacht through the Northwest Passage.
• How Robert convinced Bill Simon that the Tongass logging was not ethical.
• The story of finding out about Suzhou embroidery prowess and getting photos translated into textiles. 
• How Robert is incorporating his knowledge of Chinese silk into clothing products.
• The story behind the print Sourdough bought from Robert depicting Arctic diurnal fog.

For more information and photos, visit here: https://notrealart.com/robert-glenn-ketchum

Human beings have done a good job of ripping this planet apart; we have to figure out how to put it back together, and today’s guest is at the forefront of this initiative. Erin Yoshi joins us today to talk about her new project, The Land of WE. In this project, Erin is using art to drive conversations that imagine a different world, one in which we live within our means, and we rethink our exploitative systems that deplete our limited resources. Our conversation with Erin starts by tracing her journey as an artist, zooming in on how she got interested in murals, where her activistic approach found its expression, and how she developed such a strong skill in the business side of the pursuit. From there, we switch gears and focus on our current moment in history, a time defined by the exploits of capitalism which have driven movements to destroy the environment, divide people, and spread feelings of hopelessness. Erin talks about her belief in, and the possibility of, building a post-capitalist world. In this dream society, we keep the benefits of modernity but achieve them in more sustainable ways by ‘remembering forward’ – taking solutions from the past and turning them into our new default systems. This segues into a focus on The Land of WE, and listeners get to hear Erin talk about how she is researching these kinds of older, sustainable cultures and systems, and spreading the word about them through murals, billboards, and educational social media initiatives.

Key Points From This Episode:

• Introducing muralist Erin Yoshi and her new project fighting climate change, The Land of WE.
• Erin’s love of podcasts, the types she listens to, and some of her experiences as a guest.
• Discipline, being a mom, and how Erin has been dealing with the logistics of being an artist.
• How Erin got her work ethic and skills in the business and creative sides of art.
• The story of how Erin’s mural career evolved, starting from an erasable board her dad bought her.
• Being scrappy and how a career in art is a slow journey with no overnight success.
• The need for artists to enjoy the craziness of the struggle that comes with being an artist.
• Tough love as a parent and lessons Erin learned from her dad that made her a better artist
• Themes of the fight for justice and against prejudice; the story of Erin’s family history.
• Erin’s consideration of herself as an activist and some of her work in this area.
• How Erin became ED of the Estria Foundation and the environmental activism work they did.
• The extent that religion impacts humankind’s ability to manage its natural resources.
• The myth of the political right versus the left: A way of distracting the masses from their similarity.
• Pros and cons of capitalism and Erin’s belief that a post-capitalist world is coming.
• ‘Remembering forward’: How Erin applies this principle to advocate for more sustainability.
• The idea that more sustainable solutions already exist, we just need to incorporate them.
• The need for governments to support sustainable initiatives so they aren’t so expensive.
• Localized solutions and the need for systems that allow local leaders.
• Warnings to be found in bizarre natural disasters that sound like sci-fi but are real.
• The role of the artist in these times of crisis as storytellers and history keepers.
• What The Land of WE is doing to use art to celebrate and spread stories about more sustainable practices.
• How bad modernity is for mental health.
• The power of art to pierce the soul, making it such a powerful too right now.
• What the rollout of the first phase of The Land of WE will look like; murals, billboards, and more.
• Where to find Erin and her project online to learn more and get involved.
• Erin’s skill for grant writing and her love of sharing this knowledge.

For more information and photos, visit here: https://notrealart.com/erin-yoshi

Continuing our conversation with Indivisible 2020 participating artists, today’s guests Mary Sherwood Brock and Joshua Wattle engage in a stimulating discussion filled with passion for the country. Show curator Karen Fiorito joins the two artists, who both have roots in Washington and have been on the frontlines for their whole lives — Mary as an activist, and Joshua as a lawyer and lobbyist for the anti-war movement. We get into what indivisibility means to our guests, where they both express the aspirational notion of it. While it is easy to dismiss aspirations, it is what keeps hope alive and gives us something worth fighting for. We hear about the work that Mary and Joshua submitted to the Indivisible exhibition and the rationale behind their creations. Participating in the exhibition aligns with much of the work that both Mary and Joshua have done in and outside of the arts, and we gain insights into their respective activism. We also talk about having hope, where Joshua references history and how America has overcome a lot worse, and why he feels confident the country will come out of this moment stronger. Mary expresses a less than optimistic outlook but still remains hopeful despite it all. The conversation also touches on the erosion of the idea of the collective, the importance of getting back to a place of civil discourse, and the sort-sightedness of American exceptionalism. This was an exciting, rich dialogue filled with many insights, so tune in today to hear more!

Key Points From This Episode:

• The notion of indivisibility and what it means to Mary and Joshua.
• Joshua’s interest in his American identity and America, having grown up abroad.
• The pride Joshua felt when Obama was president and the strides made toward indivisibility.
• Mary’s experience with protesting, having been raised in a politically active home.
• Why Mary is so passionate about creating change locally.
• Mary’s motivation for participating in Indivisible 2020 and other political work she has done.
• Hear more about the work that Mary submitted to Indivisible.
• The photograph that Josh has in the show and the meaning behind it.
• Why Joshua feels we should have hope even though America is in a state of decline.
• Mary’s apprehension and feeling of nervousness around the protection of the court system.
• Joshua’s faith in the court system and why he feels this way.
• The worry Mary feels about the fact that there is not a common source of legitimate news.
• The deep sense of aspiration synonymous with America that Josh felt during his activist work.
• Viewing the current moment with an understanding of historical context.
• Mary’s take on the two-party system and how it makes people disillusioned with democracy.
• What Mary thinks needs to happen in the Democratic Party for meaningful change to occur.
• How capitalism has made the idea of the common good so politicized.
• Mary’s experience of political conservatism in other countries compared to America.
• Karen’s experience of having a Republican supporting father and stepmother.
• Why Joshua–as a lawyer–is so concerned about what the Trump legal team is doing.
• The duty we have to call people who work for or with Trump out as racist sympathizers.
• America’s limited conception of reproductive rights and supporting women more comprehensively.
• The US no longer holds collective activity up as an ideal.
• How American exceptionalism has hurt the country in many ways.
• Final words from Mary about hope and continuing to fight battles.

For more information and photos, visit here: https://notrealart.com/mary-sherwood-brock-joshua-wattles