Billions of years ago, battles between bacteria and viruses wrote the rulebook for how hosts and pathogens behave. Today, our immune system follows suit. On this episode of The Quanta Podcast, host Samir Patel speaks with writer Viviane Callier about how recent discoveries could shape how we think about the evolution of immunity. This topic was covered in a recent story for Quanta Magazine.

Each week on The Quanta Podcast, Quanta Magazine editor in chief Samir Patel speaks with the people behind the award-winning publication to navigate through some of the most important and mind-expanding questions in science and math.