Podcast Editors Mastermind

How does a podcast editor compete as apps like Descript become better at doing our jobs? What is it that you’re really offering? Tanner shares his insight on the future of podcast editing and why accountability as service is critical for survival.   

Required reading for this episode: Accountability As A Service (AAAS): The Only Future For Freelance Podcast Editors.

Tanner Campbell of The Portland Pod bootstrapped his way from working at home serving independent creators to full-on studio space serving corporations and brands looking for an all-in-one solution. 

A prolific writer, Tanner often posts his content on Medium. His article on the future of podcasting caught our attention. He points out that it’s not enough anymore to simply edit. You must offer something more to succeed in this business. A lot more than Descript can offer.

He gives us an insiders look into his business model, his perspective on the future of editing, and even some of the things he STILL struggles with today. 

Highlights 

• How Tanner got started with his first client and what his business does now
• What Tanner charges and how he determines when to bring on a new team member
• The shift from serving indie creators to businesses
• The value of a great business coach
• The conversation about rates
• Tanner’s perspective on the future of podcast editing
• What will Spotify look like in the near future and why that matters to us
• Accountability as A Service-- what that means and who needs to adopt it in Tanner’s opinion
• The role of quality assurance
• Tanner’s onboarding and editing process and dealing with legal reviews
• Offering the marketing piece to clients

Guest Editor

This episode was edited by Alejandro Ramirez of YaYa Podcasting. 

Interested in being a guest on the show?

If you're a podcast editor, we'd love to see if you'd be a fit for a future episode. Fill out this form to let us know you're interested and we'll contact you to see if it's a good fit.

Resources:

• The Portland Pod
• www.goodboydesign.me
• Clean Cut Audio (we might need to change our name to the Tom Kelly Fan Club)
• Tanner's couses
• portlandpod.com/free15min
• Mike Kim
• Tanner on Medium
• Descript 
• PR Maven Podcast (you kinda should be into that kinda thing)
• Tanner's Business Coach

Appearing in this episode:

Tanner Campbell: https://portlandpod.com | @portlandpod

Daniel Abendroth: https://rothmedia.audio | @rothmedia_audio

Carrie Caulfield-Arick: https://yayapodcasting.com | @carriearick

Bryan Entzminger: https://toptieraudio.com | @toptieraudio

Yeti of the Chat (and the person keeping Carrie in check)

Jennifer Longworth: https://bourbonbarrelpodcasting.com | @KYPodcasting

This podcast uses the following third-party services for analysis:

OP3 - https://op3.dev/privacy

Podcast editing is a growing industry that still has opportunities for a lot of people. But the question still remains: "How can I differentiate myself as an editor and be irreplaceable for my clients?"

Dava Visaya from PodcastEngineers.com joined us to talk about that question.

Dave is a podcast editor from the Philippines who has an interesting career trajectory. He owns a small podcast production agency with all in-house producers and editors (at least in-house when they're not under COVID-19 restrictions). 

He had the goal of building a large agency with a deep portfolio of clients but has recently decided to shift his business.

Listen to discover:

• How many times the cats joined us :)
• How Dave didn't think of himself as a professional early on, even though he was working on a very popular show
• Challenges and strategies for pricing services, especially when working with international clients
• What often stops editors from hiring people to help them
• What you need to have in place before you start hiring
• The benefits of having your team in-house, operating on a single platform and suite of software and plugins
• Ideas for how you can differentiate yourself from your competitors to the point that you might be the only option your clients ever consider
• Why many strategies to "add value" often fail (hint: consider who actually DEFINES what's valuable)
• Working within boundaries - even across time zones
• Ideas for what you can have in place before you ever talk to prospective clients so that you can get them what they want - right out of the gate.
• And a LOT more.

This was an incredible conversation and you're going to LOVE it!

Guest Editor

This episode was edited by Tanner Campbell, who you can find at PortlandPod.com

Interested in being a guest on the show?

If you're a podcast editor, we'd love to see if you'd be a fit for a future episode. Fill out this form to let us know you're interested and we'll contact you to see if it's a good fit.

Resources:

• http://podcastengineers.com
• Podcast Engineering School (qualifying purchases benefit Bryan)
• iZotope RX7
• Waves Plugins
• Logic Pro X

Appearing in this episode:

• Dave Visaya: http://podcastengineers.com | @PodcastEngineers
• Daniel Abendroth: https://rothmedia.audio | @rothmedia_audio
• Jennifer Longworth: https://bourbonbarrelpodcasting.com | @KYPodcasting
• Carrie Caulfield-Arick: https://yayapodcasting.com | @carriearick

Chat Master:

Bryan Entzminger: https://toptieraudio.com | @toptieraudio

This podcast uses the following third-party services for analysis:

OP3 - https://op3.dev/privacy

All of us provide a needed service. Yet, as an industry, podcast editors don’t do a great job of defining our job. Editor, producer, and engineer are used interchangeably. So, what do these words truly mean to us, as editors, to our clients and the podcasting space as a whole? We get into the words we use to talk about what we do. How is a podcast editor different from a producer and different from an engineer? 

Share your thoughts on what these words in our Facebook group. Let us know what you call yourself and what clients call you. 

***We recognize that we are not necessarily qualified to define the terms, but feel total qualified to have the conversation.***



If you don’t know Steve Stewart, you should. From training editors with his Audacity course, providing resources in his Facebook group to putting on the only conference for editors, Steve is an industry leader. Oh, and he also edits many BIG financial podcasts!

Highlights

Steve shares why this conversation is important to have. How is podcasting different from radio, music, movies, and tv post-production... And different from his past-life as a DJ in the clubs. 

Steve says that right now “podcast editor” is the safest term you can use to describe what you do. 

What is a detailed editor vs. a content editor?

Bryan uses the word technical editing, but admits to doing some content editing. Carrie does do content editing and makes editorial decisions, but doesn’t make producer type decisions.

So what is a producer? Carrie thinks it has more to do with other jobs beyond editing… in the realm of indie podcasters. Steve’s on-board with that. Jennifer talks about the difference between radio and podcast production. Bryan wants you to think about the list we threw out, do the thing you’re best at and call yourself that. 

How do you take these terms an attach perceived value to them? We don’t know the answer. It’s in the fuzzy parts maybe? 

Steve says putting the word “podcast” in front of everything we do will help clarify things. 

When should you NOT call yourself an audio or podcast engineer?  And why you should correct clients and potential clients when they refer to you any sort of engineer (unless you are). Don’t believe Steve when he tells you he can fly a plane. 

Carrie has found she has to teach the audio engineers she works with how to edit podcasts. Bryan shares a little bit about why that is. 

Podcasters are soooo much better at streaming from home than the professional broadcasters. 

Steve plants the stake in the ground on the language.

Editor: Content-- editorial choices & Detailed: taking out things like filler words and cat meows (thanks Clark)

Producer: The person who wears a whole bunch of hats doing non-editor and non-engineer stuff. (The BOSS)

Engineer: Someone with formal training who conditions the audio.

We didn't get into Sound Design or Narrative much, but we feel like that language kinda crosses over from other industries.

Steve shares how he edited PEM004… and it was no easy feat! Carrie titled her audio file “Sorry Steve.” 

How Steve got his first client. 

Guest Editor

This episode was edited by Dave Visaya of Podcast Engineers. 

Interested in being a guest on the show?

If you're a podcast editor, we'd love to see if you'd be a fit for a future episode. Fill out this form to let us know you're interested and we'll contact you to see if it's a good fit.

Resources:

Podcast Editors Club: https://www.facebook.com/groups/podcasteditors/

Podcast Editors Conference: https://podcasteditorsconference.com/

Podcast Editors Academy: https://www.podcasteditoracademy.com/

Tom Kelly of Clean Cut Audio already talked about this

Appearing in this episode:

Steve Stewart: https://stevestewart.me | @SteveStewartMe

Jennifer Longworth: https://bourbonbarrelpodcasting.com | @KYPodcasting

Carrie Caulfield-Arick: https://yayapodcasting.com | @carriearick

Bryan Entzminger: https://toptieraudio.com | @toptieraudio

Yeti of the Chat:

Daniel Abendroth: https://rothmedia.audio | @rothmedia_audio

This podcast uses the following third-party services for analysis:

OP3 - https://op3.dev/privacy

What is an editor's value and why should people buy-in to what we do? If podcasting is an art or performance, then editing is a critical part of the show. Since we listen critically for a living, we can add in extra services and value adds to not only make more sales, but retain clients and be paid fairly for our skills. How do you translate that skill to clients and how do you charge for it?

Our Guest

Callie Wright of Podcasts That Don’t Suck is a trained audio engineer and podcast editor. They edited episode 003 of the Podcast Editor’s mastermind and they share their approach to our audio, dealing with EQ and compression and removing the sound of Carrie’s cats. (They could also tell what mics we used. Can you?) 

Callie was the editor of PEM 003- How Can I Find My First Editing Client? 

Compressors and EQers, Oh my!

We totally geek out on plugins and share what we use and what’s on our wishlist. (see the links section to learn which ones we talk about) As Callie mentioned, it’s good to have a justification to spend money on plug-ins. 

Livestreaming... yeah, not so easy

Do you edit your podcasts on Livestreams? Callie has done some editing livestreams on Twitch and Daniel on Instagram & Facebook. We all agree that you do need your client’s permission before livestreaming an editing session. 

Expanding your offers

Especially now, we may need to start thinking about how we can stretch our skills and what we can offer beyond regular editing. Have you tried selling training and consulting? Callie and Carrie share how they’ve taken a no to editing and turned into a yes for these other services. Daniel points out that this will keep you top of mind when that client can pay for editing services. 

You probably need to edit your podcast...

Callie has very strong opinions about bragging about not editing. Most people who can get away with not editing have years of experience in performing, interviewing, and getting things right in the pre-production stage. Most podcasters do not. Bryan points out that even Todd Cochrane, who is a proponent of NOT editing, has years of experience podcasting, pre-production, and post-production.

Why when and how do you tell your clients that they aren’t Joe Rogan? 

Speaking of Joe Rogan, we tackle content development for clients, especially the myth of shows being a ‘natural conversation.’ Anytime you mic someone, you take away the ‘natural’ part. (Why won’t that trope die already?)

Coaching clients can be a great way to add value to your services, but how much should you be coaching your clients, and what are the boundaries? How much feedback should you be giving your clients about their content? Framing the conversations with your clients is critical. Their podcast is their baby so we need to remember how we deliver critical feedback is proportional to how it’s heard. 

Continuity Matters

When do you leave in flaws and when don't you? Callie shares their process and how they explain to clients why the edit isn't perfect. (Carrie has embraced her noisy cats-- one of her cats is deaf and apparently, deaf cats tend to meow more than hearing cats)

This episode was edited by Steve Stewart. He's the next guest for the next episode... and we're gonna talk about language-- what an editor, engineer, and producer is and what they are NOT.

Links:

• Waves stale is still on as of 4/28: https://www.waves.com/
• FET Compressor https://www.softube.com/fet
• EQP1A https://www.waves.com/plugins/puigtec-eqs
• SSL Comp https://www.waves.com/plugins/ssl-g-master-buss-compressor
• CLA-2A https://www.waves.com/plugins/cla-2a-compressor-limiter
• Fabfilter Pro-Q 3 https://www.fabfilter.com/products/pro-q-3-equalizer-plug-in
• Scheps Omni Channel https://www.waves.com/plugins/scheps-omni-channel
• The Pultec EQP-1A https://www.waves.com/plugins/puigtec-eqs
• Vocal Rider https://www.waves.com/plugins/vocal-rider
• Bryan’s Mic is the Lewitt LCT 440
• Patrecon
• Twitch
• OBS
• iZoptope RX
• Audition’s Essential Sound Panel
• Podcasting is a Performance from Clean Cut Audio

Appearing in this episode:

Callie Wright: https://www.podcaststhatdontsuck.com/

Daniel Abendroth: https://rothmedia.audio | @rothmedia_audio

Carrie Caulfield-Arick: https://yayapodcasting.com | @carriearick

Bryan Entzminger: https://toptieraudio.com | @toptieraudio

Chat Moderator: 

Jennifer Longworth: https://bourbonbarrelpodcasting.com | @KYPodcasting

This podcast uses the following third-party services for analysis:

OP3 - https://op3.dev/privacy

One of the questions we hear from new podcast editors all the time is, "How can I find my first client?"

Let's be honest - it can be hard, confusing, daunting, and scary. 

You know what you're doing but you don't know where to find clients. Or more specifically, you might not know where (and how) to find the RIGHT clients.

Should you start editing on Fiverr? Should you work for free to build your portfolio? Should you just pitch every podcaster in a Facebook group? Should you troll the forums and groups looking for the best possible podcast clients? 

Should you focus on building your brand - even if you don't have a body of work to show for it?

These are all tough questions. And trying to find answers can be paralyzing. You might be afraid that making the wrong decision will lock you into something that doesn't work. And even worse, making NO decision will definitely keep you from getting started.

The good news is that there's no ONE right answer.

The bad news is that there's no ONE right answer.

Listen as our four Yetis share the stories of their first clients.

Daniel shares how he got started on (and still gets some clients from) a popular discount platform. He shares how he was WAY underpriced at first, how he's approached getting to rate parity, and how he now uses that platform to screen out the wrong clients.

Carrie shares how she submitted around 100 proposals in a single day that led to her first client using a different platform. She talks about her experience, how that platform has changed, and the incredible administrative overhead that goes with a platform like that.

Bryan shares how a guest on his first podcast helped jumpstart his editing, why he invested in Chris Curran's Podcast Engineering School, and how he's moved from editing pro-bono to professional editing as a side hustle podcast editor.

Jennifer shares how a radio station and an online course led to her first editing clients and how she's transitioned her focus and efforts over the years.

We're not saying that any of these ways are right (or even recommended) but they're our stories. They're how WE got started. And maybe you can learn from both what worked and what didn't work for us.

Our Guest Editor

This episode was edited by Callie Wright. You can find their website at https://www.podcaststhatdontsuck.com/.

Interested in being a guest on the show?

If you're a podcast editor, we'd love to see if you'd be a fit for a future episode. Fill out this form to let us know you're interested and we'll contact you to see if it's a good fit.

Resources:

• Toggl
• Bryan's crazy Google Sheet for workload tracking
• Fiverr
• Upwork
• Podcast Engineering School (qualifying purchases benefit Bryan)

Appearing in this episode:

• Daniel Abendroth: https://rothmedia.audio | @rothmedia_audio
• Jennifer Longworth: https://bourbonbarrelpodcasting.com | @KYPodcasting
• Carrie Caulfield-Arick: https://yayapodcasting.com | @thekeldakitty
• Bryan Entzminger: https://toptieraudio.com | @toptieraudio

This podcast uses the following third-party services for analysis:

OP3 - https://op3.dev/privacy

As professional podcast editors, we are also business owners. That means that it's our job to not only support our clients but also to manage our business and to plan for the future. In this episode of the Podcast Editors Mastermind, we talked about both the current health crisis due to COVID-19, as well as a way you might be able to reduce expenses by taking advantage of an Appsumo deal.

Coronavirus and podcast editors

It's no secret that we're in the middle of a global health crisis. And, while we see funny memes like "Podcasters: practicing social distancing since 2004," the reality is that it's affecting us as editors.

We discuss questions like:

• What you might want to share with the clients you work for.
• The importance of marketing appropriately during this season.
• The importance of having a plan to support your clients if you get sick.
• How a health crisis can affect editors who also have in-person studios.

In this episode, Tony Dec of PodcastFellows.com also chimed in with several insightful comments in the chat.

**Disclaimer** We are podcast editors, not health or legal professionals. These are our opinions, shared for your consideration. Talk to your health or legal professional for specific guidance.

Will Meetfox meet our needs?

In addition to contingency planning, it's always a good idea to look for ways to control your expenses and many podcast editors find software and services to be some of the larger expenditures.

Daniel recently took advantage of an Appsumo deal for Meetfox (Daniel benefits from qualifying purchases) and Bryan wondered if it would be sufficient to replace his current combination of Book Like A Boss and Zoom.us, which is costing about $16 per month.

Daniel was kind enough to give us a behind-the-scenes look into Meetfox and answer some questions that all of the Yetis had for him. 

The conversation is good, but the screen-share is better.

Interested in being a guest on the show?

If you're a podcast editor, we'd love to see if you'd be a fit for a future episode. Fill out this form to let us know you're interested and we'll contact you to see if it's a good fit.

Resources:

• SBA Disaster Funding
• Post in the Podcast Editors Club
• Emily Prokop's public comment
• Appsumo Recession Proff Business
• The COVID19 Guide for Podcasters
• Tony Dec shared this
• Tony Dec - https://PodcastFellows.com
• JustBusters Group
• Podcasters Lounge
• Meetfox
• Podcast Editors Mastermind

Subscribe: http://subscribe.podcasteditorsmastermind.com

Appearing in this episode:

• Daniel Abendroth: https://rothmedia.audio | @rothmedia_audio
• Jennifer Longworth: https://bourbonbarrelpodcasting.com | @KYPodcasting
• Carrie Caulfield-Arick: https://yayapodcasting.com | @thekeldakitty
• Bryan Entzminger: https://toptieraudio.com | @toptieraudio

This podcast uses the following third-party services for analysis:

OP3 - https://op3.dev/privacy

This year at Podfest also saw the first-ever Podcast Editor’s Conference. While there were several amazing speakers, the one that stood out the most was from Craig Wealand called Ethics of Editing & Disfluencies. He talked about disfluencies and the ethics of editing podcasts.

While this topic got everyone thinking, it brought to mind a specific question for Jennifer, “Should we, as podcast editors, remove profanity from our clients’ episodes?” 

Resources: 

• Podfest: https://podfestexpo.com
• Podcast Editors Conference: https://podcasteditorsconference.com
• Podcast Editors Club (Facebook): https://www.facebook.com/groups/podcasteditors/
• Hindenburg Systems: https://hindenburg.com
• Reaper: https://reaper.fm
• Descript: https://descript.com
• Hindenburg Users Group (Unofficial): https://hindyusers.com
• https://www.facebook.com/groups/podcasteditors/

Appearing in this episode: 

• Daniel Abendroth: https://rothmedia.audio | @rothmedia_audio
• Jennifer Longworth: https://bourbonbarrelpodcasting.com | @KYPodcasting
• Carrie Caulfield Arick: https://yayapodcasting.com | @carriearick
• Bryan Entzminger: https://toptieraudio.com | @toptieraudio

Jennifer & Carrie’s Microphones provided by Mathew Passy of The Podcast Consultant (thanks!)

This podcast uses the following third-party services for analysis:

OP3 - https://op3.dev/privacy