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In this episode I continue my conversation with the husband and wife grace team, Mike and Susan Adams, hosts of the podcasts The UnSunday Show and The Grace Café. In the last episode, they each shared their stories of how they met Jesus and why they started their podcasts. In this episode we focus our conversation on the covenants found in the Bible. 

We will be discussing the way certain churches have created a whole belief system called covenant theology. This system is an unbiblical way that they control believers by convincing them that they are bound to keep part of the Old Covenant law.

You can find all of Mike and Susan's resources here:

 Grace Cafe Podcast website

The UnSunday Show website

The UnSunday Show Instagram

The UnSunday show TikTok

The UnSunday Show YouTube Channel

The Grace Cafe YouTube Channel

Reach us at: [email protected]

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I’m thrilled to welcome guests Mike and Susan Adams, who self- identify as the husband and wife grace team. They are the creators and hosts of 2 podcasts: The UnSunday Show, which asks honest questions about the origin and validity of institutional church rules, traditions, and practices. They engage in conversations around the freedom we’ve been given apart from empty religious obligation. The other podcast is called The Grace Cafe, where they both share more about their own journey toward the full freedom that is ours in Christ under His new covenant of grace.

 Grace Cafe Podcast website

The UnSunday Show website

The UnSunday Show Instagram

The UnSunday show TikTok

The UnSunday Show YouTube Channel

The Grace Cafe YouTube Channel

Reach us at: [email protected]

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In this episode I’m joined again by my daughter as we discuss the interview I recently posted in S2E4 with Dr. Andrew Bauman, author of Safe Church: How to Guard Against Sexism and Abuse in Christian Communities. You can find all of Dr.Bauman’s resources here:

Andrew's website

Follow him on Facebook

and here on Instagram

Buy the Safe Church book here

Other abuse support:

Outreach Inc- a resource to support spiritual abuse survivors

OPC Presbyterian Advocacy Coalition

Presbyterian Pew (PCA abuse support)

The RE.S.T. podcast email

To all our local listeners in the Charlotte, NC area: My husband and I are considering opening our home for weekly informal drop-ins. These would be spaces where we can continue the conversation around the issues in the podcast. If you would be interested, please send me an email ( above) and I will send you the details.

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I’m thrilled to welcome to this episode Dr. Andrew Bauman. A therapist and author, he is Founder & Director of the Christian Counseling Center For Sexual Health & Trauma alongside his wife Dr. Christy Bauman.  Andrew is the author of 7 books including The Sexually Healthy Man,  Stumbling Toward Wholeness, and The Psychology of Porn. We will be discussing his newest book Safe Church, which is an honest look at how misogyny masquerades as biblical truth. It is meant to be a vital resource for pastors, church leaders, and anyone who wants to guard against sexism and abuse in Christian communities.

Andrew's website

Follow him on Facebook

and here on Instagram

Buy the Safe Church book here

Reach us at [email protected]

Send us a text

My daughter joins me again as we unpack the last episode where I interviewed Peter Bell of the Sons of Patriarchy podcast. We discuss how the exposure of abuse stories by the SOP resonated with our own experiences in that denomination. 

You can find all the offerings for abuse survivors by the Sons of Patriarchy here:

Sons of Patriarchy Apple podcast 

Sons of Patriarchy YouTube

Sons of Patriarchy Instagram

Sons of Patriarchy links to Google drive documents of OPC abuse cases

Peter's email

Outreach Inc- a resource to support spiritual abuse survivors

OPC Presbyterian Advocacy Coalition

Presbyterian Pew ( PCA abuse support)

We welcome all feedback. You can reach us at: The RE.S.T. podcast email

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In this episode I interview Peter Bell, creator of the Sons of Patriarchy podcast which is described as : “What happens when biblical patriarchy, christian nationalism, and a theology of authority and submission become the pillars of a movement? Scores of abuse stories in marriages, schools, churches, families, and more.”

Sons of Patriarchy Apple podcast 

Sons of Patriarchy YouTube

Sons of Patriarchy Instagram

Sons of Patriarchy links to Google drive documents of OPC abuse cases

Peter's email:[email protected]

Outreach Inc- a resource to support spiritual abuse survivors

OPC Presbyterian Advocacy Coalition

Presbyterian Pew ( PCA abuse support)

Reach us at:  [email protected]

Send us a text

This is the first episode of our second season. You’ll find the bulk of our story in the episodes of season one. I am joined again by my daughter on this kickoff episode as we reflect on season one and share the direction the podcast will take from here. 

We welcome all feedback and want to hear your stories. You can reach us at [email protected]

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I'm going solo again in this episode, reviewing a book by Pastor Terran Williams called How God Sees Women: The End of Patriarchy. It explores the roots of Christian patriarchy and how culture- not the Bible- has formed much of the Church's opinions of women over the centuries.

Here are the other links mentioned in this episode:

The Danvers Statement

Interview: What happens when a pastor sets out to prove complementarianism

Instagram reel of a "scold's bridle"

September book discussion in my home: The Making of Biblical Womanhood by Beth Allison Barr. Please connect with me at the email below if you would like to join in. 

As always, we welcome your comments. 
You can reach us [email protected]

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We wrap up our conversation with Cait West, author of RIFT:  A Memoir of Breaking Away from Christian Patriarchy.

Cait's Instagram

Cait's Facebook

Cait's website

Below you'll find resources Cait suggests for engaging in a healing journey from spiritual trauma:

Tears of Eden

Survivors Discuss podcast

For those interested in exploring the transition of Old Covenant to New:
My Instagram page @All.Things.New

We welcome all feedback and comments. 
You can always reach us at [email protected]

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We are honored to be joined by Cait West, author of RIFT: A Memoir of Breaking Away from Christian Patriarchy. My daughter and I dialog with her about the book and the story behind it, as well as our shared connection to the same high control denomination where we encountered harm.

You can find RIFT here

Cait's Instagram

Cait's Facebook

Cait's website

As always, we welcome your comments and feedback. You can reach us at [email protected]