Brian and Murdock answer a letter asking for the backstory on what went down between the two big personalities inside The Smiths - Steven Morrissey and Johnny Marr.

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SHOW NOTES

https://consequence.net/2025/06/johnny-marr-smiths-reunion-vibes/

https://www.vinylmeplease.com/blogs/music-industry-news/johnny-marr-rejects-smiths-reunion-offer-a-look-at-artistic-integrity-and-band-dynamics

https://www.billboard.com/music/rock/the-smiths-johnny-marr-reunion-offer-turned-down-1236003199

https://www.rollingstone.com/music/music-news/morrissey-turned-down-mega-bucks-smiths-reunion-offer-over-johnny-marr-96578/

https://www.theguardian.com/music/2022/jan/26/morrissey-accuses-johnny-marr-clickbait

Johny Marr’s book: Set the Boy Free: https://www.amazon.com/Set-Free-Autobiography-Johnny-Marr/dp/0062438697

Morrissey’s book: Autobiography: 

https://www.amazon.com/Autobiography-Morrissey/dp/014310750X/ref=sr_1_1

Tony Fletcher’s book: A Light That Never Goes Out:

https://www.amazon.com/Light-That-Never-Goes-Out/dp/0307715965

Chuck Klosterman’s IV (which contains the August 2002 SPIN article): https://www.amazon.com/Chuck-Klosterman-IV-Curious-Dangerous/dp/0743284895

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/music/artists/morrissey-johnny-marr-hate/

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cilla_Black

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Work_Is_a_Four-Letter_Word

https://www.rhino.com/article/deep-dive-cilla-black-the-smiths-work-is-a-four-letter-word

https://smiths.fandom.com/wiki/Joyce_v_Morrissey_%26_Ors#:~:text=In%20March%201989%2C%20Joyce%20and,and%20understood%20the%20royalty%20deal.

https://www.morrissey-solo.com/news/news1296.htm

https://www.salon.com/2024/08/30/a-history-of-the-smiths-beef-morrissey-and-johnny-marrs-political-divide/

https://www.brooklynvegan.com/morrissey-claims-johnny-marr-acquired-trademark-intellectual-property-rights-for-the-smiths-name/#:~:text=%E2%80%9CJ%20Marr%20has%20successfully%20applied,yet%20another%20Smiths%20best%2Dof.

https://x.com/Johnny_Marr/status/1836103851666993170

https://pitchfork.com/thepitch/does-the-mexican-american-community-still-love-morrissey-despite-everything/

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Brian and Murdock explore the rumor that Lennon's last album might have had some musical support from a certain set of Midwestern power-poppers.

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SHOW NOTES

Cheap Trick In Color with Steve Albini producing

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6bsT3EWlsJM&list=PLvLuPYa2vgAsbNg5NhnEBx2N1GgV28nX6

Interview with Rick Nielsen about working with Lennon

https://lasvegassun.com/blogs/kats-report/2009/sep/13/nielsen-original/#:~:text=%E2%80%9CI'm%20Losing%20You%E2%80%9D%20was%20knocked%20out%20in%20two,%2C%20never%2Dhappened%20things.%E2%80%9D

“Rick and Ben” on the Double Fantasy experience (this is cartoon spoof is barely a minute, animated and funny, but not actually Rick and Ben)

https://youtu.be/BHGTkWNsOcU?si=bQut-fIhOoNS4ozH

All About the Hit Factory

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Hit_Factory

Morris Levy wiki

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Morris_Levy

Double Fantasy Session Musicians

Tony Levin-Bass-bio

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tony_Levin

Andy Newmark-drums

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Andy_Newmark

“I’m losing you” outtake from Double Fantasy

Lennon with Rick and Ben from Cheap Trick

https://youtu.be/BZae6fbxItI?si=D8uPkEvxmxVrqxpI

Motley Crue headlining with Cheap Trick opening 1986, SHEFFIEEEELD, England.

“Ten Seconds to Love”

https://youtu.be/8hWnUsyTtik?si=vSMfF2vUpvmGkSOy

Kid Rock intros Cheap Trick into the RNR Hall of Fame

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yjxkpoqM3Q8&t=367s

Highway to Krell

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pf0Pa2iyOEA&list=RDpf0Pa2iyOEA&start_radio=1

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The guys go through a series of letters all focused on the intersection of musicians and publicity. Did Grateful Dead dose an audience? Did a punk band pull one over on tabloid TV? And why was the singer of that emo band on Sally Jesse Raphael?

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SHOW NOTES

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk_show

https://www.liveabout.com/talk-isnt-cheap-a-brief-history-of-the-tv-talk-show-3177025

https://ellenhume.com/talk-show-culture/ii-history-u-s-talk-shows-from-radio-to-television-and-the-internet/

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Late-night_talk_show

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Owsley_Stanley

https://www.thetimes.com/culture/music/article/carlos-santana-woodstock-that-was-when-my-guitar-turned-into-a-snake-m708lgchr

https://www.openculture.com/2021/01/when-the-grateful-dead-performed-on-hugh-hefners-playboy-after-dark.html#google_vignette

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Playboy_After_Dark

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Playboy%27s_Penthouse

https://liveforlivemusic.com/features/grateful-dead-dosed-playboy-after-dark/

Jon Gugala piece on acid and the Dead: https://huckberry.com/journal/posts/trip-of-a-lifetime-how-the-grateful-dead-s-acid-experiences-shaped-its-sound

https://www.rollingstone.com/feature/owsley-stanley-the-king-of-lsd-82181/

https://www.loudersound.com/news/watch-this-super-rare-footage-of-a-baby-faced-gerard-way-before-he-was-famous-defending-comic-books-on-a-us-chat-show

Gerard Way on Sally Jesse Raphael: 

https://youtu.be/98LQmdkO8DU?si=-Am2NWuk-W8vvHiB

https://www.rollingstone.com/culture/culture-news/my-chemical-romances-gerard-way-embroiled-in-comic-controversy-89842/

https://www.reddit.com/r/MyChemicalRomance/comments/1xza0l/hart_d_fisher_goes_off_about_my_chemical_romances/

https://www.reddit.com/r/MyChemicalRomance/comments/f2ybkq/someone_on_fb_just_posted_this_and_i_was_shocked/

https://bloody-disgusting.com/news/3277602/interview-hart-d-fisher-goes-off-about-my-chemical-romances-gerard-way-kickstarter-and-fangoria/

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sally_Jessy_Raphael

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tabloid_talk_show

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hart_D._Fisher

https://www.keycollectorcomics.com/series/on-ravens-wings,66401/

https://www.vice.com/en/article/the-locust-justin-pearson-on-jerry-springer-1999-video/

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Justin_Pearson_(musician)

https://web.archive.org/web/20170405073703/http://www.laweekly.com/news/a-day-with-the-locust-2137011

https://www.epitaph.com/news/article/the-locust-have-signed-with-epitaphs-anti-label

The Locust on Jerry Springer: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1oRAVNUWTOk

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Brian and Murdock get a listener request to revisit the life, trials, and absolute chaos that came to define the finest country music singer of all time - George Jones.

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SHOW NOTES

The George Jones & Tom Carter book: I Lived to Tell it All

George Jones On The Reccord with Ralph Emery:

https://youtu.be/BPoH39J-LWU?si=SV-7SNHBXToi18sM

Mike Judge’s Tales from the Tour Bus:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wPA5iWmbYtY

Bad Cock will Treat You Right:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cmm7nvCpNAM

Heartbreaking stories about George: 

https://www.factinate.com/people/george-jones/

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Brian and Murdock answer an inquiry regarding The Pre-Fab Four and one member who may (or many not) have had an outsized impact on the future of rock n roll beyond the band.

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SHOW NOTES:

https://www.setlist.fm/setlist/the-monkees/1997/cardinal-stadium-louisville-ky-4bda9b8e.html

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michael_Nesmith

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Justus_(album)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bob_Rafelson

https://www.rogerebert.com/reviews/head-1968

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Head_(film)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Davy_Jones_(musician)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peter_Tork

https://americansongwriter.com/the-brutal-reason-why-stephen-stills-was-rejected-by-the-monkees/

https://www.imdb.com/name/nm0004880/bio/

https://www.theguardian.com/music/2021/dec/11/the-monkees-michael-nesmith-a-supremely-gifted-innovative-songwriter

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bette_Nesmith_Graham

Michael Nesmith’s book: https://www.amazon.com/Infinite-Tuesday-Autobiographical-Michael-Nesmith/dp/1101907517/ref=sr_1_1

https://recordcollectormag.com/articles/michael-nesmith#:~:text=But%20what%20I%20said%20was,and%20I%20will%20follow%20you.%E2%80%9D

https://medium.com/the-riff/one-of-the-last-interviews-with-michael-nesmith-aba038cb4703

The Damien Love deep dive piece: https://damienlove.com/writing/loose-salute-the-story-of-michael-nesmith-and-the-first-national-band/

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rio_(Michael_Nesmith_song)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_First_National_Band

The RIO video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yciLq5kYFnU

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/From_a_Radio_Engine_to_the_Photon_Wing

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Qube_(cable_television)

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Brian and Murdock talk about discovering the first Boston album and dive into the fascinating and upsetting story of the two men who defined their sound and personified their struggles.

CONTENT WARNING: This episode contains mention of suicide and abuse after the 34 minute mark.

If you are suffering with thoughts of depression and hopelessness and considering harming yourself, please seek help.

Additionally, we ask all listeners to consider visiting and supporting the work of To Write Love on Her Arms.

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SHOW NOTES:

http://rockandrollgarage.com/how-boston-tom-scholz-made-their-entire-debut-album-in-his-basement/

https://www.rollingstone.com/music/music-news/exclusive-interview-bostons-tom-scholz-remembers-bradley-delp-94896/

https://www.thirdstage.ca/boston/the-band/former-members/brad-delp

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barry_Goudreau

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tom_Scholz

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brad_Delp

https://www.loudersound.com/features/how-boston-flew-so-high-and-fell-so-far

https://www.rcfp.org/briefs-comments/scholz-v-boston-herald/

The actual court decision on Scholz vs the Herald: https://www.rcfp.org/wp-content/uploads/imported/2014-05-02-scholz-v-boston-herald.pdf

Archive of lawsuit briefs/decisions/documents: https://www.thirdstage.ca/boston/articles/legal-documents

https://ultimateclassicrock.com/brad-delp-suicide/

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Boston_band_members

The Boston Herald piece with important parts highlighted: https://static1.squarespace.com/static/525ed589e4b07b05fff51e46/t/585b2884725e25b52bb8eaf4/1482369156574/Boston+Herald+Reporting.pdf

http://archive.boston.com/ae/music/articles/2012/05/27/boston_singer_brad_delps_final_days_marked_by_crisis_over_hidden_camera/

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Brian and Murdock unravel the story of the Roland TR-808 - a drum machine/musical innovation hailed as an absolute failure - until it absolutely wasn't.

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SHOW NOTES:

https://www.reddit.com/r/trapproduction/comments/2d9sc2/what_is_an_808/

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roland_TR-808

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Egyptian_Lover

https://youtu.be/7_CIiNBdEvI?si=eN1KI8gcGE-12uA4

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Don_Lewis

https://www.nytimes.com/2022/12/13/arts/music/don-lewis-dead.html

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MIDI

https://djhistory.com/read/don-lewis-changed-electronic-music/

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Organ_(music)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Drum_machine

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roland_MC-8_Microcomposer

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roland_CR-78

https://www.roland.com/us/promos/roland_tr-808/

The Mr Tuna reel showing 808 use: https://www.instagram.com/reel/DDQjcrPvBoP/

Roland’s “808 Beats” Spotify playlist: https://open.spotify.com/playlist/0tYX2qYhiZxpaB5jnMPRjV?go=1&sp_cid=d7e1412f578968a8f36733673e0bd2a1&utm_source=embed_player_p&utm_medium=desktop

https://articles.roland.com/paul-revere-beastie-boys/

https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b00kn4rj

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heart_of_Glass_(song)

https://iprofessdesign.wordpress.com/2020/08/20/the-modest-mr-kakehashi-and-the-defect-effect/

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J4oO7PT_nzQ&t=487

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Brian and Murdock dig into the iconography of one of outlaw country's loudest voices, discovering how Hank's visual turn from tribute act to rowdy powerhouse was due in part to a fall he shouldn't have survived.

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SHOW NOTES:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hank_Williams

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rufus_Payne

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Audrey_Williams

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hank_Williams_Jr.

https://www.wideopencountry.com/audrey-williams/

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Your_Cheatin%27_Heart_(film)

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hank_Williams_Jr._and_Friends

https://theboot.com/hank-williams-jr-secret-history-of-country-music/

Bobby Bones Hank Jr Interview (2022) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oNdkB2jgoN4

Classic interview: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kaj2mLeiVZg

https://www.pbs.org/kenburns/country-music/hank-williams-jr-biography

https://savingcountrymusic.com/40-years-later-hank-jr-s-fall-from-ajax-mountain-the-full-story/

Photo of Hank with Dick and Walt Willey years later: https://www.instagram.com/p/CVOCxICFMIp/

9/28/76 interview with Ralph Emery: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7im8DjPNMro 

https://theboot.com/hank-williams-jr-mountain-climbing-accident/

The tweet that shows distance of the fall: https://tasteofcountry.com/hank-williams-jr-mountain-climbing-accident-fall/

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Brian and Murdock get sent looking for stories of out-of-control album creations and come back with the tale of Walter, Donald, 3 years, 50 musicians, a drug problem, a tragic death, and a personal injury - aka Gaucho.

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SHOW NOTES:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Steely_Dan

Reelin in the Years book by Brian Sweet: https://www.amazon.com/Steely-Dan-Reelin-Brian-Sweet/dp/1468313142

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Steely_Dan_members

https://www.lindahoovermusic.com/bio

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Countdown_to_Ecstasy

Quantum Criminals book preview: https://www.google.com/books/edition/Quantum_Criminals/JPi0EAAAQBAJ?hl=en&gbpv=0 

Die Behind the Wheel Crime Fiction:

​​https://downandoutbooks.com/bookstore/thornton-die-behind-wheel/

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aja_(album)

Jonathan Clark’s Medium article: https://medium.com/@jonathanusa/the-crazy-story-of-the-making-of-steely-dans-gaucho-e4e7d68651e5

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gaucho_(album)

The Jake Malooley reporting on “The Second Arrangement”

https://expandingdan.substack.com/p/second-arrangement-steely-dan-roger-nichols-tape

https://wiki-lied.fandom.com/wiki/The_Second_Arrangement

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roger_Nichols_(recording_engineer)

https://rogernichols.com/wendel

https://bangnzdrum.blogspot.com/2017/09/the-many-sides-of-walter-becker.html

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Walter_Becker

https://www.rollingstone.com/music/music-features/steely-dans-quiet-hero-inside-walter-beckers-troubled-life-wry-genius-199094/

https://faroutmagazine.co.uk/steely-dan-most-tragic-album/

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Brian and Murdock dig into the infamous tale of that time a whole lotta money went missing - and the suspects, mobsters and managers who may (or may not) have been at the center of it all.

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SHOW NOTES

Zeppelin’s unreal record deal

https://www.loudersound.com/news/led-zeppelin-atlantic-contract

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Led_Zeppelin

Led $eppelin

https://forums.ledzeppelin.com/topic/10704-how-rich-are-led-zeppelin/

Lead guitar, Jimmy Page

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jimmy_Page

Aleister Crowley’s swinging satan pad

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boleskine_House

“Hey, the money is gone.”

https://www.ledzeppelin.com/event/july-29-1973

“NYPD, open up”

https://ledzepnews.com/2024/01/08/exclusive-nypd-files-on-robbery-of-180000-from-led-zeppelin-drake-hotel-1973-revealed-after-50-years/

Peter Grant post heist press conference 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=00LtwfpSfX8

Bob Spitz’s book that oozes sex, drugs, rock and roll and robbery. 

https://nypost.com/2021/11/08/new-book-sheds-light-on-200000-led-zeppelin-robbery/

Peter Grant rocking out at ‘Zep’ shows/events post Bonham’s death

https://forums.ledzeppelin.com/topic/20557-peter-grant-at-post-zep-shows/

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