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can access an article Phil mentioned at https://rsc.byu.edu/literature-belief/dark-way-tree

Kerry and Phil explore Lehi’s teachings about the fall that stem from his dream. We tie it into Nephi’s experiences as he learns from God, and the need we all have to come into conversation with God. We also discuss what our dark and dreary waste may look like, and how we can be guided through that, and what it has to do with having a fallen and divine nature, and what Christ and covenant have to do with that, and with overcoming our lost and fallen state, and the various ways that people think that through which tend to discount and negate the atoning sacrifice of Christ.

We are grateful for our sponsor, Lisa Spice, and our producer, BJ Muhlestein, and for Rich Nicholls, who composed and plays the music for the podcast.