Search News You Can Use - SEO Podcast with Marie Haynes

Here’s a conversation I had with Gemini about how its vector space works and how it adjusts as it learns. It may be possible for us to influence how Gemini represents our business by having more conversations about the things that are good about your business.

Hope you find this interesting! (Also omg how many times did I say the word “interesting” in this episode? 😂

The end of this video includes a podcast made by NotebookLM AI podcasters talking about my conversation with Gemini.

Here’s a great video I found that taught me a lot about vectors:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YvobVu1l7GI

Here’s NotebookLM

https://notebooklm.google.com/

See past podcast episodes

https://community.mariehaynes.com/spaces/12946477/feed

If you want to learn more about the AI systems used in Search here’s my book, SEO in the Gemini Era: The story of how AI changed Google search

https://www.mariehaynes.com/gemini-era-seo/book/

And to go even deeper, here’s my course:

https://www.mariehaynes.com/gemini-era-seo/course/

Want to join other people who are excited as me about AI? We’d love to have you in the Search Bar

https://community.mariehaynes.com/

Thank you to Adam Szmerling from Bayside Psychotherapy who allowed me to publish our brainstorming session. The first 45 minutes or so of this episode are me sharing how Google’s algorithms have changed. Then, Adam and I look in detail at his competition and his website and discuss how to change it so that it is more likely to meet the needs of his potential clients.

Watch on Youtube: https://youtu.be/K0FVlM7Xmc0

Links

Marie’s book, SEO in the Gemini Era, The Story of How AI Changed Google Search

https://amzn.to/3WPBg0Z

SEO in the Gemini Era course:

https://www.mariehaynes.com/gemini-era-seo/course/

Brainstorm with Marie:

https://www.mariehaynes.com/work-with-marie/

DOJ vs. Google Pandu Nayak testimony:

https://thecapitolforum.com/wp-content/uploads/2023/10/101823-USA-v-Google-PM.pdf

My blog post on the API files with attributes including Navboost :

https://www.mariehaynes.com/what-is-this-leaked-google-code-digging-into-the-api-docs/

Cyrus Shepard’s Moz article on click patents:

https://moz.com/blog/click-based-seo-engagement-signals

Internal Google email talking about Navboost:

https://www.justice.gov/d9/2023-11/417828.pdf

Google brought new signals into the core algorithm with March core update:

https://searchengineland.com/seo-takeaways-google-elizabeth-tucker-smx-advanced-443070

Gemini 1.5 improved Google’s machine learning architecture:

https://blog.google/technology/ai/google-gemini-next-generation-model-february-2024/#architecture

My course if you’d like to learn more about the AI systems behind search:

https://www.mariehaynes.com/gemini-era-seo/course/

Frederic Dubut of Bing talking about how we must switch from keyword research to intent research.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NTriTRmEf34

Google’s information gain patent

https://patents.google.com/patent/US20200349181A1/en

Navboost is a system we learned about in the DOJ vs Google trial. Did you know that Google stores every query that you search, along with information on what you clicked on and engaged with? I share in this video how this system is described, and also how I believe Google's ability to predict what searchers are likely to find helpful is changing.

Mentioned in this video:

Blog post on Navboost by Marie:

https://www.mariehaynes.com/navboost/

Marie's workbook:

https://www.mariehaynes.com/gemini-era-seo/workbook/

Marie's book:

https://www.mariehaynes.com/gemini-era-seo/book/

Pandu Nayak testimony:

https://thecapitolforum.com/wp-content/uploads/2023/10/101823-USA-v-Google-PM.pdf

Douglas Oard testimony:

https://thecapitolforum.com/wp-content/uploads/2023/11/U.S.A.-et-al-v.-Google-LLC-Nov-15-2023-Bench-Trial-Day-41-Morn-Sess-Transcript.pdf

Rand Fishkin's post on the API files:

https://sparktoro.com/blog/an-anonymous-source-shared-thousands-of-leaked-google-search-api-documents-with-me-everyone-in-seo-should-see-them/

Cyrus Shepard's Moz article about Google patents involving clicks:

https://moz.com/blog/click-based-seo-engagement-signals

Google's announcement of the March core update:

https://developers.google.com/search/blog/2024/03/core-update-spam-policies

Google describing how the core update involved architecture changes and bringing in new signals:

https://searchengineland.com/seo-takeaways-google-elizabeth-tucker-smx-advanced-443070

Documents describing Google's ranking systems in great detail have been leaked by someone who sent an email to Rand Fishkin. In this video, I share my thoughts on Rand's post and then at around 35 mins or so I play around with analyzing this document with Gemini 1.5 Pro in AI Studio.

Hope you enjoy this type of video. I share a lot of my thoughts on how machine learning systems work to use all of the many attributes described in this documentation. This includes links, clicks, return to search results and much more.

Take home point: Google uses MANY signals/attributes/features in their calculations that predict what is likely to be helpful to the searcher. Our goal should be to create content that people choose to engage with and ultimately find to be the satisfying answer to their query - or in other words, HELPFUL.

This episode may be best seen as a video podast:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kVYUvh4Vt30

Links mentioned

Marie’s newsletter: mariehaynes.com/newsletter

Marie’s notes (paid newsletter - follow along as I take notes on things like this each week.)

https://community.mariehaynes.com/spaces/12261861/feed

Marie’s Course and book: SEO in the Gemini Era is out soon.

The Docs referred to in this video: https://hexdocs.pm/google_api_content_warehouse/0.4.0/api-reference.html

Rand Fishkin’s post. He received an email with the contents of the leak. https://sparktoro.com/blog/an-anonymous-source-shared-thousands-of-leaked-google-search-api-documents-with-me-everyone-in-seo-should-see-them/

Mike King’s article on these documents:

https://ipullrank.com/google-algo-leak

Some quick thoughts on Google's AI overviews (formerly SGE). I don't think they're going away. I do believe they will get more accurate. We should be paying attention to which websites Google is showing in the link cards in these.

More on changes to my newsletter: mariehaynes.com/newsletter

Finally another podcast episode! I was babbling on to my husband about how similar Gemini 1.5's new architecture was to our brain structures and he said, "You need to do a podcast episode on this!" So, here it is. This is a rambly one.

We'll talk about the machine learning models behind search and how Gemini 1.5's new MoE architecture works just like our brains do.

Google + Harvard research on 3D modeling of the brain:

https://blog.google/technology/research/google-ai-research-new-images-human-brain/

Gemini 1.5 info:

https://blog.google/technology/ai/google-gemini-next-generation-model-february-2024/#gemini-15

Sign up to get Marie's Notes with live access to my weekly Google doc as I record the things I want to refer back to in regards to Search and AI:

https://community.mariehaynes.com/spaces/12261861/feed

Brainstorm with Marie: https://www.mariehaynes.com/work-with-marie/

Google is changing their SEO starter guide. They're removing a bunch of content.

This episode has visuals. Watch on Youtube:

https://youtu.be/we3n9NTeSAU

In this episode we talk about Google's Search off the Record Podcast and I'll share my thoughts on what is most important when it comes to ranking on Google today. We'll go through the latest Google Search off the Record podcast episode that talks about the changes they are making to the guide.

Then, near the end we'll take my notes on this story and I'll show you how I use Gemini in Google's AI studio to summarize stories like this for newsletter.

Newsletter:

https://mariehaynes.com/newsletter/

Marie's Thoughts (paid newsletter):

https://community.mariehaynes.com/spaces/12261861/feed

SOTR podcast:

https://content.libsyn.com/p/6/6/0/66095646568452e4/_SOTR068__Search_Off_the_Record_-_68th_episode_-_Video_en_us.pdf?c_id=166779698&cs_id=166779698&response-content-type=application%2Fpdf&Expires=1706206368&Signature=dczPIGWZ9UbDLwAwbeu9pmhl-OL~PspXTQqtTOU1qXwNZqX8pC9OmWxSPqm~FYb4-ZowqcS57MVVK4ZKuuiPr4YHJeeEMT8JaLHcoeB2PLjEC95iU0Pdv-abPZlRNWL63dXq2eFpAHhv6FqnYjPtReqZCHeTum7Dilbz7rOAMpK2b8fP4d27~RplnP0fSaE3ZZmPgvRT~kDHk1dn8zG8y6MCpS-p0K0sXdRpx3YizlQTADebGEcZWG06aIvZtuu9p2epH~5CCTLz~TjENxYA3suE~GwJMy2LCn328mNV6t5WLz6iBv8ucb2aByasVSwZZj1EUITWQ2~wkS-XRS1KuQ__&Key-Pair-Id=K1YS7LZGUP96OI

This is an impromptu, unscripted episode with Dr. Marie Haynes, recorded because of a recent news headline from Search Engine Roundtable that said, "Google: Author Bylines Don't Help You Rank Better; Google Doesn't Check Credentials. Barry's article was prompted based on comments from Google's Search Liaison Danny Sullivan regarding yet another Verge article that does not look favourably on SEO.

Are author bios a ranking factor?

If you've followed my theories and teachings on Google's ranking systems, you know that I am indeed a proponent of using author bios in many situations. In the episode I share anecdotes of sites that did indeed see improvements after getting qualified authors and then doing more to share about their qualifications.

Are author bios a ranking factor? No.

Will having an author bio increase the chances that searchers will trust your site and find it useful. Sometimes, yes.

We have recently learned from the DOJ antitrust trial against Google that user engagement signals are incredibly important when it comes to shaping the algorithm.

In this episode, we go back to statements from John Mueller's help hangouts several years back to look at why the industry developed rules about author bios that most sites follow. They make so much more sense now that we understand how user engagement signals (called IS - likely information satisfaction) signals in the DOJ trial are used to train RankBrain.

RankBrain is Google's AI that is used to re-rank the top 20-30 results and SERP features you see when you do a search.

Hopefully this episode convinces you that both the following can be true:

1) Author bios aren't a ranking factor

2) Author bios can be a part of the entire package that helps improve user engagement and satisfaction signals, which in turn is what drives rankings.

SER article:

https://www.seroundtable.com/google-author-bylines-ranking-36684.html

Verge article:

https://www.theverge.com/c/23998379/google-search-seo-algorithm-webpage-optimization

Danny Sullivan's comments:

https://x.com/searchliaison/status/1744371735405772927?s=20

In this episode, we dive deep into Google's revolutionary new language model, Gemini, destined to be the most impactful technological shift of our time. Host Dr. Marie Haynes unravels its capabilities, which extend beyond text to encompass images, video, and beyond.

Discover how Gemini's potential to transform information access, problem-solving, and decision-making could reshape our lives. While we wait for its full potential to unfold in 2024, learn how Bard, soon integrated into Google Assistant, offers a taste of the future.

This episode delves into the criticisms of AI, encouraging listeners to actively engage with Bard and explore its possibilities. We also explore the exciting world of GPTs (apps built on chat GPT), which may possibly be seen in a similar form in Google AI Studio.

Oh boy, finally another podcast episode! This is an unscripted chatting episode where I share the story of what happened to my agency. It formed because of an understanding of AI - except I didn't know that at the time. Imagine my surprise when I realized that wait a second - Panda and Penguin - the Google algorithm shifts that made me obsess over SEO and leave my career as a veterinarian - were machine learning systems.

It was understanding AI that created my SEO agency. But, understanding and optimizing for Google search was also our downfall. I expect many of you are going down the same road I did.

It is time for a huge mindset shift when it comes to SEO. We found out in the Department of Justice's Trial against Google that user engagement plays a much bigger role in determining rankings than we thought.

I hope you enjoy this episode!

Links mentioned:

============

My Helpful Content Workbook

https://mariehaynes.com/product/creating-helpful-content-workbook/

The Search Bar: https://community.mariehaynes.com/

DOJ trial exhibits showing how much user engagement is used in the algo: https://www.justice.gov/atr/us-and-plaintiff-states-v-google-llc-2020-trial-exhibits

Marie's Thoughts (paid newsletter episode) where I explain this more:

https://community.mariehaynes.com/posts/ep-12-how-user-engagement-signals-are-used-in-ranking-new-info-from-the-doj-trial-against-google