Do you ever wonder about the "so what?" of your journey maps...

To this day, I often see that journey mapping is treated as a "documentation" exercise.

Basically as a way to visualize our customers experiences. And while having that visual overview is useful, it's just the beginning.

As you probably know, the real challenge is turning that understanding into action that actually impacts your customers (and your business). Not a small challenge by any means.

That's why this episode of The Journey Management Playbook is fully dedicated to it.

We're already into episode six of the series, and if you haven't seen the previous ones, you can find the full playlist in the show notes.

So far, we've gone from defining a business challenge to using AI to generate and enrich insights. We’ve covered how to structure and simplify your journey to be more action-biased.

But all of that work is just a foundation.

The journey map we've created is a reflection of the current state, and the key question still remains: What do we do now?

In this episode, Tingting Lin from TheyDo and I finally answer that question. We dive into the crucial building blocks of opportunities and solutions, and you’ll see what is key to turning your journey maps from static documents into dynamic drivers of lasting business impact.

We also tackle a few common pitfalls to avoid like:

• Jumping to solutions before defining opportunities.
• Cheating with the opportunity statement.
• The tendency to over-document.
• And turning journey management into a separate workflow.

As you'll hear, this episode is again packed with practical advice to help you move beyond mapping to true journey management in the most effective way.

What are your biggest challenges in moving from insights to action? Leave a comment on YouTube or Spotify, or reach out on LinkedIn. We'd love to hear from you.

Enjoy and keep making a positive impact!

Be well,

~ Marc

---[1. LINKS 🔗 ] ---

👉 Playbook Slides - https://go.servicedesignshow.com/ofmtc

✅ Sign up for TheyDo - https://go.servicedesignshow.com/prcde

--- [ 2. GUIDE ] ---

01:00 Recap from previous episode

04:00 Core Problem with Static Journey Maps

06:00 Introducing the "Solutions" Building Block

10:00 Defining "Opportunities"

12:00 The triple diamond workflow

15:30 Real-world opportunity

16:00 Why we separate Opportunities & Solution

18:30 Where to look for the opportunity first

22:00 Off-boarding Problem as a Case Study

24:30 Connecting the Problem to the Solution Quickly

28:00 Distinguishing Between Problems and Opportunities

32:00 Pain Point to an Opportunity

36:30 Importance of Language in Naming Opportunities

38:00 Debate About Using AI in this Process

40:00 Who are we writing these opportunities for

45:00 Connecting Opportunities to Strategic Objectives

47:00 Summary of Opportunities

49:00 Transitioning to "Solution" Blocks

51:00 Example of a Concrete Solution

59:45 Practicality of Using Solution Types

1:02:00 Defining Statuses

1:06:00 Connecting Solutions to Opportunities

1:08:00 Final Summary

--- [ 3. FIND THE SHOW ON ] ---

• YouTube ~ https://go.servicedesignshow.com/journey-management-playbook-06-youtube
• Spotify ~ https://go.servicedesignshow.com/journey-management-playbook-06-spotify
• Apple ~ https://go.servicedesignshow.com/journey-management-playbook-06-apple
• Snipd ~ https://go.servicedesignshow.com/journey-management-playbook-06-snipd

The things service design professionals have to deal with...

Okay, so your boss tells you drive to a place with “a great view,” hands a full tank of gas, and wished good luck. Oh and by the way, we need to be there in 30-days, no compass, no map.

Now take a guess, how likely is it that after a month you'll have arrived at exactly the location they had in mind. I'd say anything higher than 0 is an optimistic perspective.

This sounds pretty absurd, right? But I'm not making it up.

But how often have you been in that exact situation at work?

The destination is vague, nobody can tell you where you are today, and there’s no way to know if your actions are actually moving you in the right direction.

And the cherry on top is when you're asked for hard evidence that you're getting closer, while someone else gets praised for reporting a higher average speed than last week. Yeah, but dude, are we even moving in the right direction? So painful and frustrating.

If you didn’t know better, you might think this is the plot of a bad comedy. But based on the conversations I'm having, this isn't an exception; it's the daily reality for most of you.

So, what are we going to do about it?

Even though the situation might feel a bit hopeless, the good news is that it’s certainly not.

Last year, I had Stacey Barr on the show to talk about measurement. She’s spent her career becoming an expert in using measures as a truth seeker.

Guess what that conversation became the most-watched episode of the year.

In this episode, Stacey is back to show us how to untangle this mess.

There’s a remarkably simple process, that looks a lot like design, to get from vague goals to meaningful measures, clear targets, and effective actions.

It’s a method that gives you real leverage to achieve the impact you want to make.

So if you want to learn how to put measures in place that are actually meaningful, prove your work is moving the needle, and do it with more confidence, definitely don’t miss this episode.

What's becoming clear to me is that we’re actually really good at this. We thrive in scenarios where things are undefined. We know how to figure stuff out and iterate our way forward. So once you grasp that finding the right measurements is just another design challenge, you might actually start looking forward the process...

Enjoy and keep making a positive impact!

Be well

~ Marc

--- [ 1. GUIDE ] ---

00:00 Welcome to Episode 237

03:45 Measurement's surprising popularity

04:30 Stacey Barr on Service Design

06:00 Breaking down the measurement puzzle

09:00 Measuring for empowerment

10:00 addressing the gap

16:30 Company cultures

22:30 Beyond shipping stuff

23:30 The problem when starting with measures

24:00 What does influence actually mean

27:00 Reverse engineering the goal

29:00 The Net Promoter Score Trap

32:00 Measuring across silos

34:00 Challenge of individual KPIs and quotas

37:00 Strategies for creating paradigm shifts

40:30 Setting meaningful targets

45:45 Challenge of human-related data

52:45 defining and measuring the gap

56:45 Casuality vs correlation

01:1:45 The patience to shift big goals

1:03:45 The PUMP Results Map

1:04:15 Introducing PUMP Light

1:07:00 Where to Sign Up

1:07:45 Discount for the program

1:08:15 Question to ponder

--- [ 2. LINKS ] ---

• https://www.linkedin.com/in/staceybarr/
• The PuMP Lite Program - https://pump.academy/pumplite/
• https://pump.academy/

--- [ 3. PROMO ] ---

Use code SDS10 to get 10% off the PuMP Lite program, running November 11-13 and 25-26, 2025.

--- [ 4. CIRCLE ] ---

Join our private community for in-house service design professionals.

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--- [ 5. FIND THE SHOW ON ] ---

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Are you tired of proving the value of service design… over and over again?

Well, I'm happy to share that you're not alone. It's one of the most common frustrations I hear from professionals in our field.

You work hard, you get a win, you move the needle... and then the next project starts, and it feels like you're right back at square one, making the case all over again. Sound familiar.

Many of us feel stuck in this endless "prove it" loop, wondering how to get service design to move from a special invitation to a fundamental expectation.

So, how do you break the cycle? How do you build momentum that lasts?

That’s the challenge we take head on in this episode of our Inside Service Design series.

In this series we explore the real, unpolished practice of driving change from within organizations.

For this conversation, I was joined by two brilliant in-house professionals, Nancy Samayoa and Sara Langston, who are deep in the reality of this work every day.

They share some honest and insightful perspectives on this struggle.

• Why service design can sometimes be perceived as a "threat" to the status quo.
• The moment they realized very few actually have seen service design at a true "scale" stage, and why that can feel so disheartening.
• And a powerful reframe: how to (re)define success by celebrating the small, daily, "invisible" wins that truly build momentum and prevent burnout.

As with all the conversations in this series what you'll be getting isn't just some interesting theory. It's a practical guide to shifting your mindset from chasing big, elusive victories to appreciating the daily progress that ultimately leads to lasting change.

So if you’re ready to hear how to play the long game and find sustainable ways to make an impact, this conversation is for you.

I'm curious, have you made a habit of celebrating the small, "invisible" wins? If so how are you doing that? And if no, what's stopping you?

Enjoy the conversation!

Be well,

~ Marc

--- [ 1. GUIDE ] ---

00:00 Welcome to August Round Up

04:30 Sara's unexpected journey in service design

06:30 Unexpected transferability of skills

09:30 Nancy's path from architecture to service design

12:30 "Gung-ho" applicant and a surprising hiring manager

14:30 Challenges of working on in-house projects

17:30 The "ooh," "ah," and "oh no" moments

19:30 How service designers are approached for projects

20:30 Service design as a perceived "threat" in government

23:00 Linking service design activities to positive outcomes

25:30 Getting past the "endless proof" stage

28:30 Garden metaphor = design maturity

31:45 Challenge of getting from the "prove" to the "scale" stage

33:45 Risk of service design

36:30 Applying models without feeling disheartened

38:00 What scaffolding looks like in service design

40:30 Focusing on celebrating the wins

42:00 Why we tend to focus on problems over success stories

43:15 Redefining success and progress

44:00 How Nancy views her wins

46:00 The Circle as an extended SD team

48:15 Sara's expectations

51:15 Nancy's service design expectations

52:45 SD skill: Relationship building

56:45 Treating stakeholder relationships like a research project

57:00 Other key skill: Curiosity

59:30 Question to ponder

1:02:15 Final words of wisdom from Sara

1:03:30 Final words of wisdom from Nancy

--- [ 2. LINKS ] ---

• https://www.linkedin.com/in/nancy-designer/
• https://www.linkedin.com/in/sara-langston/

--- [ 3. CIRCLE ] ---

Join our private community for in-house service design professionals.

⁠https://servicedesignshow.com/circle

--- [4. FIND THE SHOW ON] ---

• Youtube ~ https://go.servicedesignshow.com/inside-service-design-05-youtube
• Spotify ~ https://go.servicedesignshow.com/inside-service-design-05-spotify
• Apple ~ https://go.servicedesignshow.com/inside-service-design-05-apple
• Snipd ~ https://go.servicedesignshow.com/inside-service-design-05-snipd

I'm sure you've seen the news...

At the outset, the recent announcement of the "America by Design" initiative and the new "National Design Studio" is quite exciting. It’s a huge spotlight on our field.

But it also feels a bit strange, doesn't it?

Because it wasn’t so long ago that the US government had 18F, an entire organization dedicated to improving the user experience of its services. And then, in early 2025, it was deemed "non-essential" and unceremoniously "deleted".

One of the people right in the middle of it all was our guest, Ron Bronson. As the Head of Design at 18F, he was at the forefront of applying service design within the complexities of government.

So, you can imagine that when Ron sat down with me for the conversation, it wasn’t just a walk in the park.

We dove into some juicy questions that challenge the very core of our practice.

1. Is service design too opaque and stuck in its own craft?
2. What if we reframed our work as a form of “design as repair”?
3. Why might AI actually be the biggest blessing for service design yet?

I can assure you, this is a conversation that will get you out of your comfort zone in the best way possible.

So, if you’re ready to be challenged with some fresh perspectives, make sure you tune in to this one.

Even though we tackle some pretty huge topics in the episode, Ron brings it all back to a simple, powerful idea right at the end of the conversation. Can you take a guess? (Hint: it’s about zooming in, not out ).

Enjoy the episode and keep making a positive impact!

Be well,

~ Marc

--- [ 1. GUIDE ] ---

00:00 Welcome to Episode 236

04:00 Who is Ron

05:30 Service design is too opaque

07:45 Importing service design to the US

09:30 Conversations designers should be having

10:00 The "best service experience" during a crisis

12:50 The Trojan Horse strategy for designers

14:30 Creating a "pull" for service design from within

17:30 The power of doing "uninvited" work

23:00 Examples of a golden nugget

26:00 Trust as a core deliverable

27:00 What students get wrong about design

29:45 The gap between conferences and reality

32:00 Idea of consequence design

34:30 Design as repair: A new mindset

37:30 The "forward deployed" designer.

39:30 What would change if we adopt this mindset

45:00 Making service design ubiquitous

46:30 Right way to frame a problem

48:30 Are organizations in the service business?

51:30 The blessing & curse of "doing the work"

54:15 How he hopes service design would look in 3-5 years

57:00 AI: A blank space for service designers

59:15 Questions to ask about AI

1:01:14 Malicious path vs. ideal path

1:02:45 A question to ponder

1:04:30 What can you fix

1:07:15 Get in touch

--- [ 2. LINKS ] ---

• LinkedIn - https://www.linkedin.com/in/ronbronson/
• BlueSky - https://bsky.app/profile/ronbronson.com
• Website - https://www.ronbronson.design/
• https://consequencedesign.org/

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Join our private community for in-house service design professionals.

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• Spotify ~ https://go.servicedesignshow.com/236-spotify

All you want to do is run away…

Okay, so you’re standing in a boardroom overlooking a beautiful vineyard, leading a workshop for a major client, and the only thing that's going through your mind is: How do I get out of there?

This was a real moment for this episode's guest, Ben Rennie.

And it's a feeling that I think many of us can relate to, even if the setting is different (vineyards sound good though).

We’ve all heard stories of people who achieve incredible success. The entrepreneur, the athlete, the professional, only to end up feeling empty and miserable.

They had their eye on "the prize," did everything to get it, but upon achieving their goal, they end up more unhappy than before.

Well, this story is about what happens next.

Ben co-founded a design agency that, by all external measures, was a huge success.

He was working for leading brands and riding the wave.

But one day, during that exact workshop overlooking the vineyard, he had enough.

He quit his own agency.

That single decision sparked a new journey, one full of unknowns.

But one thing was certain: Ben was going to rebuild his life around work that was deeply meaningful and aligned with his core values.

He traded fossil fuel clients for partnerships with Patagonia, driven by a new manifesto that took him 15 minutes to write on a piece of paper, not days in a boardroom.

For me, Ben’s story is a powerful reminder that we need to define what success truly looks like for ourselves... before it’s too late.

So how do we define that? And what can we do to get one step closer to it every single day?

That's what we're exploring in this episode.

The message of this episode is so important, and surely not solely limited to service design.

Because when you spend your most precious possession — your time and energy — for often 40+ hours a week, it better be towards something that gives you fulfilment and pride.

The stakes are just too high.

Enjoy the conversation and keep making a positive impact!

Be well,

~ Marc

--- [ 1. GUIDE ] ---

00:00 Welcome to the show

04:30 What is creativity?

07:00 The price we pay

08:30 The imposter syndrome story

10:30 The two lives

13:30 A different turn

17:00 Momentum without boundaries

19:00 From profit to purpose

20:00 How Patagonia became a client

22:00 What is systemic design?

23:30 Creativity as confidence

33:30 What needs to change?

36:45 A word of advice

41:00 The accountability of design

42:30 Transition design examples

45:00 Vote with your money

50:00 A good starting point

52:30 Legacy for the next generation

54:00 Questions about creativity

57:00 Fewer experts, more curiosity

59:00 Resources

--- [ 2. LINKS ] ---

• LinkedIn - https://www.linkedin.com/in/benrennie
• Lessons in Creativity (Book) - https://benrennie.com/collections/create/products/lessons-in-creativity
• Website: https://benrennie.com/

--- [ 3. CIRCLE ] ---

Join our private community for in-house service design professionals.

⁠https://servicedesignshow.com/circle

---[ 4. FIND THE SHOW ON ] ---

• Youtube ~ https://go.servicedesignshow.com/235-youtube
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What makes time go fast for you, and what makes it go slow...

It's a powerful question that might just help you find more meaning and heck, yes even more joy in your work.

We see a brighter future, but the system moves slowly. This mismatch can lead to frustration and burnout. What if the secret to creating change wasn't about the system, but about you?

In this conversation with Martha Edwards, a public sector veteran, we talk about powerful personal habits that keep her effective and optimistic.

In this episode we explore topics like:

How to find satisfaction in work that might not bear fruit for years

Why the energy you bring to a room is one of your most powerful professional tools

And how a simple practice like writing "week notes" can be a hack to recognize your small wins and give you the motivation to keep going.

This framing takes the pressure off and allows us to be kinder to ourselves, knowing we’ve contributed a piece to a larger, longer story. I'm curious if this metaphor resonate with you too.

Enjoy the episode and keep planing seeds .

Be well,

~ Marc

--- [ 1. GUIDE ] ---

00:00 Welcome to Episode 234

04:00 The current state of public sector design

07:30 How Systemic Uncertainty Affects Designers

08:30 From "Designer" to "Public Servant"

09:30 Finding Meaning in Government Work

12:30 How she can find herself still grateful

16:00 Big learnings: working as a creative writer

18:00 Seeing a "Parallel Universe" at UK's GDS

20:00 Avoid the "Design Colonialist" Mindset

22:30 How it shifted

23:30 government digital service to canadian government

28:30 How Sharing Work Waters the Seeds of Change

30:30 what she recommends to share

36:30 staying patient in a government organization

38:00 how do we navigate that?

43:30 Exercise to Recognize Your "Small" Wins

45:15 Being flexible with your role in the public service industry

48:30 How to Make Smart Compromises

54:30 Finding Your Joy

57:30 Question to ponder

59:30 Connect with Martha

--- [ 2. LINKS ] ---

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/marthaedwardscan/
• Bluesky: https://bsky.app/profile/maredwards.bsky.social
• Website: marthaedwards.ca 

Readings:

• Going beyond planting seeds
• I’m a service designer and I’ve never done co-design
• Leading with design at the Ministry of Environment
• The long slog of public service transformation - by Martin and Kara
• Barriers to Service Design in Government - Created by Linn Vizard, Marie Serrano and Spencer Beacock

--- [ 3. CIRCLE ] ---

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What if we’ve been led down the wrong path…

When it comes to service design, we’re often told the main goal is to break down silos. And that makes sense, right?

Our organizations are structured vertically, but the experiences we design flow horizontally. This clash creates friction, so the natural instinct is to declare war on silos.

But what if that’s sending us in the wrong direction?

Silos exist for a reason; they bring focus and efficiency to specific tasks. The real problem is often the broken connection between them. So, what if instead of trying to eliminate silos, we focused on repairing them?

In this episode, I talk with Ellen Pittman, a researcher who shares a fascinating case study from a high-stakes organization struggling to meet a critical, time-sensitive performance target. On the surface, the pressure was on a single department to solve it.

But as they dug deeper, they discovered the true bottleneck wasn't in that department at all, or even on the organizational chart. The real roadblocks were less visible and far more human.

So what does it take to overcome these hidden barriers?

Ellen found a specific mix of ingredients that allowed them to collaborate across team boundaries and address the issue with great success.

In our conversation, we explore what those ingredients are and why it seems so hard for most organizations to get them right.

This episode has the potential to reframe your thoughts on silos, leadership, and the roadblocks you think are in your way.

A theme that I really loved exploring was how easily organizational metrics can be "gamed". We've all seen it, you hit the target but miss the actual goal... we talk about antidote in the episode.

Enjoy the conversation and keep making a positive impact.

Be well,

~ Marc

--- [ 1. GUIDE ] ---

00:00 Welcome to Episode 233

05:00 Vertical vs. Horizontal Structures

06:00 Ellen's Journey into Healthcare Change

07:30 Hospital Case Study

10:30 Real Challenge: System-Wide Impact

12:30 Breaking Silos: A Hospital's Approach

15:30 Leadership Beyond KPIs: True Purpose

23:30 Top-Down Initative, Bottom-Up Ownership

25:30 The Consultant's Fear of ED Patients

27:45 Overcoming Fear with Data Experiments

30:00 Data as Curiosity, Not Blame

35:30The CEO's Risky Vulnerability

39:30 Leadership Flexibility: When to Take Control

44:30 Repairing Silos vs. Breaking Them

45:30 Overcoming Jadedness

48:30 Reconnecting to Shared Purpose

52:30 Principles Etched in Minds, Not Walls

55:30 Why Cultural Change Takes Time

59:00 Insulating Change at Every Level

1:01:00 Leaders & The System: Mutual Understanding

1:04:00 Alan's Book: The Hive Model of Fluidity

1:07:45 Question to Ponder

--- [ 2. LINKS ] ---

• https://www.linkedin.com/in/dr-ellen-pittman-27311421a/

--- [ 3. CIRCLE ] ---

Join our private community for in-house service design professionals.

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Everyone wants change, just not for themselves…

I remember a great experiment we used to do back in my agency days.

At the start of a workshop, we'd ask everyone to put on a prop.

It could be a hat, a pair of oversized glasses, or even a superhero cape. After some initial laughter, everyone usually played along.

But the interesting part wasn't putting the props on. It was what happened in the minutes that followed.

As we started the "official" program, the first person would quietly take their prop off.

Then a second would follow, and so on. At no point had I instructed them to stop wearing the props, yet, one by one, they always did.

It was a powerful way to confront the group with the strong pull towards conformity.

Towards the default mode of doing things. Towards getting back in line.

As service design professionals, we know that to create meaningful change, we have to challenge the way things are currently done.

But doing anything outside the status quo is inherently risky, especially when the incentive structures in our organizations are set up to reward those who play it safe.

To break free, you need a magic ingredient: courage.

But how do you build this courage?

And why would you risk your career when it’s so much easier to conform?

Those are the big questions we explore in a fascinating conversation with Alberta Soranzo. As you'll hear, Alberta has lived these questions.

She shares powerful stories about what it takes to create change.

From convincing a client to choose a risky, unknown path over the safe bet, to the surprisingly profound impact of a personal choice about her own hair.

We also get into what it really means for leaders to provide ‘air cover’ for their teams and how you can find the courage to challenge the system even when you feel powerless — without burning yourself out in the process.

I'm confident that you’ll walk away with some unique insights from this honest conversation about leadership, courage, and taking risks.

If you've been following along with the past few episodes, I think you'll start to see a clear pattern emerging.

When multiple guests, independently of each other, touch on the same topics, it's probably something we should all be paying more attention to.

Enjoy the conversation and keep making a positive impact.

Be well,

~ Marc

--- [ 1. GUIDE ] ---

00:00 Welcome to Episode 232

05:00 Why Courage is Key for Organizational Magic

09:30 Two Business Breakthroughs

15:00 The "Change" Illusion

17:30 Signals of true organizational change

22:30 What triggered the landslide

26:00 Inspiration: Oreo hair

29:00 When Leadership Means Role Modeling

32:00 Reframing Workplace Urgency

35:00 Identity Shift: Your Job Isn't Your Whole Self

39:30 Transformation of "my work does not define me, it's part of me"

44:00 vulnerable act vs the real act

46:00 Alberta's Role: Cultivating Team Excellence

49:00 Navigating Resistance

52:45 Learning from corporate rebels

53:45 The Power of organizational empathy

55:00 Empathy for the System

59:00 Courage in Future Generations

1:01:00 Struggle of helping our kids shaping the world

1:02:30 Question to ponder

1:05:00 Resources

--- [ 2. LINKS ] ---

• LinkedIn - http://linkedin.com/in/albertasoranzo
• Website - https://albertasoranzo.com/
• BlueSky - https://bsky.app/profile/albertas.bsky.social
• Good to watch - The Playlist on Netflix

--- [ 3. CIRCLE ] ---

Join our private community for in-house service design professionals.

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As a service design professional, what is your primary role...!?

Are you the host who sets the table for collaboration and creates a safe space for everyone?

Or are you maybe a trusted advisor, working quietly behind the scenes to help stakeholders make better decisions?

Well, what if the answer is... both?

This tension between hosting and advising is at the heart of the latest Inside Service Design episode, in which we explore the real, unpolished practice of driving change from within organizations.

In this episode, we have a great conversation with two seasoned professionals, Seth Campbell and Phil LaDeur, who bring some honest perspectives to the table.

Phil shares how we can create the perfect conditions for collaboration and influence by drawing inspiration from the concept of "Unreasonable Hospitality".

And Seth talks about the importance of patience, humility, and the art of giving away choices to empower your team and build long-term trust.

This is one of those episodes where you get a true peek behind the curtains and hear how other service design professionals are approaching their work.

So, if you're ready to discover new ways that will help you move the needle inside your organization, this one is for you!

I'm curious, in your current role, do you feel more like a "host" or an "advisor"? Leave a comment on the episode and let me know. I'd love to hear which role resonates more with you.

Enjoy the conversation!

Be well,

~ Marc

--- [ 1. GUIDE ] ---

00:00 Welcome to the June Round Up

04:30 Phil's Journey to Service Design

06:45 How Seth started his role

11:00 The Challenges and what Seth actually does

13:00 Service Design in a Faith-Based Organization

17:00 Defining success in service design

20:30 Seth's Personal Success Metric

24:45 Phil: Small Wins & Feedback"

26:00 The Circle's "Dinner Table" Discussions

28:00 Hospitality as Influence (Phil)

30:00 Theatrics of Design (Seth)

35:00 Overcoming Time Blocks

37:30 Phil's "Restaurant" Framework

41:30 Seth: Hard-Earned Lessons

45:45 The Caboose of a project

46:00 Phil: Learning Organization Horizon

49:30 Investing in Relationships

51:30 Seth: Essential Service Design Skills

53:30 Secret Weapon: Snacks!

54:45 Phil: Skills for Impact

57:30 Questions for Service design professionals

--- [ 2. LINKS ] ---

• https://www.linkedin.com/in/seth-campbell/
• https://www.linkedin.com/in/phillip-ladeur/

--- [ 3. CIRCLE ] ---

Join our private community for in-house service design professionals.

⁠https://servicedesignshow.com/circle

[4. FIND THE SHOW ON]

• Youtube ~ https://go.servicedesignshow.com/inside-service-design-04-youtube
• Spotify ~ https://go.servicedesignshow.com/inside-service-design-04-spotify
• Apple ~ https://go.servicedesignshow.com/inside-service-design-04-apple
• Snipd ~ https://go.servicedesignshow.com/inside-service-design-04-snipd