The vexing problem of IoT security is slowing IoT adoption and creating waves of sensational headlines, from insecure smart homes to industrial IoT concerns. Mrinal Wadhwa and his team at Ockam has an ambitious plan to address this, but how? Via open source for one. As a follow up to last year's dignomica podcast with Ockam and Den Howlett, this new podcast shares how Wadhwa's thinking has evolved. In a nutshell: "Decoupling the secure channel protocol from the transport layer protocols removes complexity, minimizes the attack surface and can enable us to build end-to-end secure and private systems." This in-depth talk breaks that concept down in real-world terms. Wadhwa explains why this is a potential IoT security breakthrough. The guys also revisit their blockchain debates, and how Wadhwa sees blockchain fitting into IoT security going forward. An invitation for others to get involved with Ockam's open source pursuits at https://github.com/ockam-network is also included.