The debate over whether telco network workloads can run on the public cloud has raged for years. While greenfield operators like DISH Wireless have demonstrated that a cloud-native 5G network is possible, critics dismiss these examples as outliers that don’t apply to established networks. But recent developments with brownfield operators and new infrastructure options are changing the conversation about what's possible.

In this episode, I'm talking with Dr. Ishwar Parulkar, Chief Technologist for Telecom at AWS. With extensive experience creating cloud solutions for telecom networks, Ishwar is at the forefront of helping operators transition their networks to cloud infrastructure.

Listen now to hear:

• How AWS has created an "edge continuum" of infrastructure options to support network workloads [05:25];
• What AWS learned from working with Telefónica Germany to run network workloads in a brownfield environment [07:31];
• How telcos are leveraging generative AI to transform customer experience, reduce operational costs, and create new revenue streams [11:41];
• Whether AI RAN workloads will be a new revenue source [15:03].

Links and Resources:

• Take a look at how Telefónica Germany successfully completed a trial to load 1 million subscribers into the public cloud. 
• Read the AWS announcement on the New AWS Outposts Rack and Server Offerings for Telcos.
• Watch my interview with Chris Penrose at NVIDIA about AI-RAN and using the extra capacity in the RAN to run AI workloads at the edge.
• Take a look at how SK Telecom built a specialized telco AI model trained with Anthropic's Claude on AWS.
• Learn more about how British Telecom is using Amazon Q to enhance developer productivity.
• Come see me June 3-4 in Windsor, England at Telecom TV's DSP Leaders World Forum. I'll be on Tuesday's panel, Leveraging AI throughout the network, and hosting a garden party that night!
• Ready for a movie night? Try this homemade popcorn recipe. 
• Check out this episode on our YouTube channel.
• You can find the episode transcript here.

Wanna talk AI and public cloud? Telco execs, set up a meeting with our team to learn how to tap the immense business value it can bring. 

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• Have an idea for a Telco in 20 podcast guest or topic? Send it in!
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The Telco in 20 podcast is ranked in the top 5% of all podcasts globally by Listen Notes! 🎉 We've also won a 2024 MarComm Award, a 2024 and 2025 Hermes Award, and are recognized as a TeckNexus Top 12 Telco and Tech Podcast, Forrester Top 100 Channel Podcast and Feedspot Top 10 Telecom Podcast.

If you enjoy the podcast, would you leave us a review? It takes you seconds to do in your app and it really makes a difference in helping to convince hard-to-get guests. And I love reading your feedback and reviews!

This week’s guest
Dr. Ishwar Parulkar is the Chief Technologist for Telecom and Edge Cloud at Amazon Web Services. In this role he is responsible for setting AWS technology strategy, defining new cloud services and leading initiatives to enable AWS’ edge cloud offerings and next generation telecom networks and services. Prior to AWS, Dr. Parulkar was a Distinguished Engineer at Cisco and Chief Architect for business units responsible for telecom routing, mobile packet core, small cell and network orchestration products. He was a founding member of industry-wide initiatives around mobile edge computing and 5G and the conviction that cloud technology can transform the telecom field brought him to AWS in 2016. Before Cisco, Dr. Parulkar was a Distinguished Engineer at Sun Microsystems where he led the design data center computing infrastructure, including the first multi-core processor systems and first compute virtualization platforms in the industry. He started his career at Apple, where he worked on the Mac desktop/laptop product lines and on the Newton PDA technology, which had the seeds of the iPhone revolution.

Podcast Credits

• Executive Producer and Host: Danielle Rios, TelcoDR
• Senior Producer: Lindsay Grubb, TillCo Media
• Senior Editor/Brand Manager: Alisa Jenkins, Springboard Marketing
• Audio Editor: Andrew Condell
• Supervising Producer: Amanda Avery
• Associate Producer: Kriselda Dionisio
• Music: Dyami Wilson

In today's rapidly evolving tech landscape, operators struggle with change because they are held back by their legacy systems and rigid processes. Bold transformation isn't just about upgrading networks or cutting costs—it requires fundamentally redesigning how the entire organization works. The future belongs to those with the courage to drive radical change — which is absolutely necessary in the age of AI and cloud.

For this episode, I'm talking with Mark Sanders, Chief Architect and Head of Autonomous Networks and AI Enablement at Telstra, about their composable architecture. Telstra is building on TM Forum's ODA to create a revolutionary framework that arranges telco knowledge into an ontology. We dive into how Telstra is leveraging a composable architecture to build an autonomous network, and using  AI to create a future-ready organization. 

Listen now to hear:

• How Telstra's "Lego block" approach to technology architecture accelerates innovation [07:11];
• The critical shift from automated processes to truly autonomous, outcome-driven systems [08:46];
• Why developing a telco knowledge ontology is fundamental for effective AI reasoning [10:12];
• The importance of bold leadership in driving transformative organizational change [14:39].

Links and Resources:

• Read this interview with Mark Sanders on how Telstra is using composable network, cloud, IT, and data building blocks to underpin innovation and growth.
• Check out this case study about Telstra's Reference Architecture powered by TM Forum’s Open Digital Architecture (ODA)
• Watch my talk, Avoid vendor lock-in with TM Forum Open APIs, that the telco industry dinosaurs demanded to be pulled down from TM Forum DTWS event in 2021.  I guess Amdocs didn’t like being called out for not really supporting the Open APIs? Whatever I said worked: they’ve gone from 1 API supported to 35! Told you it wasn’t a technical reason they didn’t do it…
• Learn more about Totogi’s BSS Magic and use our ontology to create your digital twin. Start modeling your processes and apply AI to reduce cost, reduce friction, and increase revenue. Tier 1 telcos are already trying it out.
• Meet with Totogi at TM Forums DTW Ignite, June 17-19, in Copenhagen. Stop by our Catalyst project (C25.0.836) in the Autonomous Networks Innovation Zone, Kiosk #14, and see how we’re working with Infosys and CloudBlue. The Catalyst demonstrates AI-led simplification of telco service ordering using CAMARA, TMF, and MEF APIs.
• Mark is headed to Antarctica, a place most people will never go! Take a look at some of the amazing sites he might see.
• Mark compares his composable architecture to Lego bricks. Check out this ASMR Lego stop motion cooking video that’s insanely satisfying to watch. If only BSS was this easy! Sound on for maximum enjoyment.
• Check out this episode on our YouTube channel.
• You can find the episode transcript here.

Wanna talk AI and public cloud? Telco execs, set up a meeting with our team to learn how to tap the immense business value it can bring. 

Follow DR

• Have an idea for a Telco in 20 podcast guest or topic? Send it in!
• Want to sponsor a podcast? Let us know
• Follow Telco in 20 on X @TelcoIn20
• Follow DR on X @TelcoDR

The Telco in 20 podcast is ranked in the top 5% of all podcasts globally by Listen Notes! 🎉 We've also won a 2024 MarComm Award, a 2024 and 2025 Hermes Award, and are recognized as a TeckNexus Top 12 Telco and Tech Podcast, Forrester Top 100 Channel Podcast and Feedspot Top 10 Telecom Podcast.

If you enjoy the podcast, would you leave us a review? It takes you seconds to do in your app and it really makes a difference in helping to convince hard-to-get guests. And I love reading your feedback and reviews!

This week’s guest
Mark is a transformational leader working in the intersection IT, Networks, Data and AI in telecommunications. Mark stands at the forefront of emerging technology for Telcos: Decoupled and composable architectures, Orchestration, APIs, AI, and Autonomous network services. Leading the innovation that will transform how Telco builds, activates, and lifecycle Services. As the Chief Architect, Mark assumes responsibility for developing comprehensive architecture strategies, and technology patterns across the enterprise and cross-domains at Telstra. In collaboration with Telco and Standards Development Organizations, he plays a pivotal role in shaping the industry and influencing Telco Architecture. Mark leads a team dedicated to providing enterprise-wide technology leadership. Their primary objectives include ensuring compliance with the Telstra Reference Architecture Model, minimizing technical debt, facilitating cross-domain decision-making, and contributing to optimal technology choices.

Podcast Credits

• Executive Producer and Host: Danielle Rios, TelcoDR
• Senior Producer: Lindsay Grubb, TillCo Media
• Senior Editor/Brand Manager: Alisa Jenkins, Springboard Marketing
• Audio Editor: Andrew Condell
• Supervising Producer: Amanda Avery
• Associate Producer: Kriselda Dionisio
• Music: Dyami Wilson

In today's telco landscape, operators are struggling with legacy BSS systems that are highly customized, expensive, and impossible to change. Rather than continuing the traditional approach of swapping out systems (ouch) or simply adding AI to siloed applications, a more revolutionary solution is emerging—one that creates a digital twin of your entire telco business and applies AI across all systems simultaneously.

For this episode, I talk with Marc Breslow, Field CTO at Totogi. We're exploring how Totogi’s BSS Magic is helping telcos leverage AI without replacing their existing systems while delivering dramatic results in weeks, instead of months. Listen now to hear:

• How BSS Magic functions as a telco-specific ontological layer, not a replacement BSS system [04:12];
• Why siloed AI approaches fail when trying to solve problems that span multiple systems [05:00];
• How an Asian telco dramatically reduced their enterprise sales process time with BSS Magic [09:07];
• How the BSS Magic transforms notoriously difficult BSS migrations from a multi-year project to just a few months [12:40].

Links and Resources:

• Watch my Gen AI Summit talk at MWC25 on Building an AI-first Telco
• Read my blogs, The AI-first telco won't wait 5 years for Amdocs and How to suss out the fake agents at MWC25
• Learn more about BSS Magic on the Totogi website to say goodbye to rigid, vendor-locked BSS applications
• Check out these BSS Magic Demos on Totogi’s YouTube channel:
  • Inventory AI Agent
  • Enterprise Sales Agent Flow
  • Competitive Product Design
  • … and many more! Find more on the BSS Magic Demos playlist 
• Build your first AI Agent for free! Kick-start your transformation by working with our Forward Deployed Engineering team to customize AI agent, at no upfront cost
• If BSS Magic is breaking down the boundaries between systems, imagine what’s happening with the boundaries between functional organizations. This article talks about how companies (and the humans in them) will change in the age of agentic AI.
• Check out this episode on our YouTube channel.
• You can find the episode transcript here.

Wanna talk AI and public cloud? Telco execs, set up a meeting with our team to learn how to tap the immense business value it can bring. 

Follow DR

• Have an idea for a Telco in 20 podcast guest or topic? Send it in!
• Want to sponsor a podcast? Let us know
• Follow Telco in 20 on X @TelcoIn20
• Follow DR on X @TelcoDR

The Telco in 20 podcast is ranked in the top 5% of all podcasts globally by Listen Notes! 🎉 We've also won a 2024 MarComm Award and Hermes Award, and are recognized as a TeckNexus Top 12 Telco and Tech Podcast, Forrester Top 100 Channel Podcast and Feedspot Top 10 Telecom Podcast.

If you enjoy the podcast, would you leave us a review? It takes you seconds to do in your app and it really makes a difference in helping to convince hard-to-get guests. And I love reading your feedback and reviews!

This week’s guest

Marc Breslow is Field CTO of Totogi, where he is leveraging AI to revolutionize the telecommunications industry. A veteran of Accenture, Lehman Brothers, and Citibank, Marc has a proven track record of building scalable, high-performance systems. At Totogi, he leads the development of AI-powered solutions that drive tangible results for telcos: reducing churn, increasing ARPU, and streamlining business processes. Marc is responsible for customer proof points demonstrating these capabilities. When not engaging with customers, Marc leads teams building Totogi’s BSS Magic technology, generating applications and improving efficiency using AI agents and workflows.

Podcast Credits

• Executive Producer and Host: Danielle Rios, TelcoDR
• Senior Producer: Lindsay Grubb, TillCo Media
• Senior Editor/Brand Manager: Alisa Jenkins, Springboard Marketing
• Audio Editor: Andrew Condell
• Supervising Producer: Amanda Avery
• Associate Producer: Kriselda Dionisio
• Music: Dyami Wilson

The energy demands of artificial intelligence are skyrocketing. AI workloads are doubling every few months, pushing data centers' energy consumption beyond the capabilities of our aging grid infrastructure. As these facilities approach gigawatt-level power needs—equivalent to powering entire cities—the energy question has become the critical bottleneck for AI's future growth.

In this episode, I'm talking with Roy Illsley, Chief Analyst at Omdia who specializes in cloud and data center technologies. We explore how the world’s biggest data center owners—Amazon, Google, and Microsoft—are responding to these challenges, from renewable energy investments to nuclear power, and what it means for the industry. Listen now to hear:

• Why hyperscalers are looking to nuclear energy solutions to meet their massive power requirements [03:23];
• How Europe's data sovereignty requirements are complicating AI development in power-constrained countries [05:40];
• What opportunity telcos have with AI inferencing at the edge, and why they risk repeating past mistakes [09:20];
• The crucial software capability gap that could determine who wins in the edge AI market [12:14].

Links and Resources:

• Read Omdia’s latest reports on cloud and data centers technologies.
• Watch NVIDIA's CEO Jensen Huang’s keynote at GTC on their future rack power requirements.
• Check out this press release on Oracle’s $5 billion UK investment in cloud infrastructure.
• Learn more about Verizon’s AI edge computing initiatives. 
• Read about Microsoft's exploration of nuclear energy options, including the re-opening of Three Mile Island.
• Take a look at Google and Amazon’s investment in small nuclear reactors. 
• Listen to the previous episodes I mentioned in my Takeaway:
  • Ep 1 (Jim Abolt) It starts with…transformational leadership
  • Ep 110 (Charles Fitzgerald) Hyperscaler CapEx is going nuclear
• Homer Simpson's nuclear career takes an unexpected turn in "C.E.D'oh" when he accidentally becomes Springfield Nuclear Power Plant's CEO after impressing Mr. Burns with business jargon. His executive dreams melt down faster than uranium-235 when he discovers the job requires making tough decisions, sacrificing family time, and actually understanding nuclear physics. Guess the CEO job isn't for everyone!
• Check out this episode on our YouTube channel.
• You can find the episode transcript here.

Wanna talk AI and public cloud? Telco execs, set up a meeting with our team to learn how to tap the immense business value it can bring. 

Follow DR

• Have an idea for a Telco in 20 podcast guest or topic? Send it in!
• Want to sponsor a podcast? Let us know
• Follow Telco in 20 on X @TelcoIn20
• Follow DR on X @TelcoDR

The Telco in 20 podcast is ranked in the top 5% of all podcasts globally by Listen Notes! 🎉 We've also won a 2024 MarComm Award and Hermes Award, and are recognized as a TeckNexus Top 12 Telco and Tech Podcast, Forrester Top 100 Channel Podcast and Feedspot Top 10 Telecom Podcast.

If you enjoy the podcast, would you leave us a review? It takes you seconds to do in your app and it really makes a difference in helping to convince hard-to-get guests. And I love reading your feedback and reviews!

This week’s guest

Roy Illsley has over thirty-eight years of IT experience, working for a variety of consultancy and end-user companies with experience in the defence, utilities, automotive, retail, and Fast-Moving Consumer Goods (FMCG) industries. He works in the Cloud and Data Centre practice and is recognized as Omdia’s expert on Cloud, Virtualisation, and Management. He also has experience of Data Centre technologies, Quantum Computing, IT Service Management, and covers IT Strategy and Policy. His most recent reports include a series of five on the topic of edge computing, and two on the topic of sovereign cloud. In addition to the reports, he has produced white papers and carried out primary research for leading global organizations. He has delivered keynotes speeches and webinars. He has also presented at external trade events all over the world on a wide range of topics. 

Podcast Credits

• Executive Producer and Host: Danielle Rios, TelcoDR
• Senior Producer: Lindsay Grubb, TillCo Media
• Senior Editor/Brand Manager: Alisa Jenkins, Springboard Marketing
• Audio Editor: Andrew Condell
• Supervising Producer: Amanda Avery
• Associate Producer: Kriselda Dionisio
• Music: Dyami Wilson

The telecom industry is adopting AI at break speed. Unlike past innovations that demanded risky network transformations and long timelines, AI-based innovation is accelerating experimentation without disrupting core networks. 

For this episode, I sat down with Kevin Shatzkamer, corporate vice president of customer experience strategy and operations at Microsoft, to explore the power of agentic AI and why it represents such a transformative opportunity for telcos. Listen now to hear:

• Why AI could be the fastest technology adoption in telecom history [03:37];
• How AI agents reimagine processes instead of retrofitting existing workflows [08:16];
• Ways Microsoft's telecom customers are putting agentic AI to work in their business [12:00]; and
• How telcos are unifying their data for deeper insights [13:17].

Links and Resources

• Take a look at Kevin’s LinkedIn post about how AI has the potential to be the fastest adopted technology in telecom history.
• Read Anthropic’s guide on building effective agents.
• Watch my talk from MWC25 on how to build an AI-first telco, and how operators need to tackle the legacy tech debt in their BSS estate to do it.
• Check out my conversations with TelecomTV and Mobile World Live about how Totogi’s AI-first solutions are delivering real revenue growth to telcos TODAY.
• Learn more about the North American operator that switched billing systems and saved big bucks with Totogi.
• Read more about Microsoft’s tools for telcos:
  • AutoGen
  • Semantic Kernel
  • Copilot Studio
  • Fabric
  • Azure AI Foundry
• How to write a book with AI tweet thread
• Check out this episode on our YouTube channel. 
• You can find the episode transcript here.

Wanna talk AI and public cloud? Telco execs, set up a meeting with our team to learn how to tap the immense business value it can bring. 

Follow DR

• Have an idea for a Telco in 20 podcast guest or topic? Send it in!
• Want to sponsor a podcast? Let us know
• Follow Telco in 20 on X @TelcoIn20
• Follow DR on X @TelcoDR

The Telco in 20 podcast is ranked in the top 5% of all podcasts globally by Listen Notes! 🎉 We've also won a 2024 MarComm Award and Hermes Award, and are recognized as a TeckNexus Top 12 Telco and Tech Podcast, Forrester Top 100 Channel Podcast and Feedspot Top 10 Telecom Podcast.

If you enjoy the podcast, would you leave us a review? It takes you seconds to do in your app and it really makes a difference in helping to convince hard-to-get guests. And I love reading your feedback and reviews!

This week’s guest
With more than two decades of software and operational experience, Kevin Shatzkamer has a record of driving transformation and innovation at scale to improve customer experiences. In his role as CVP of Customer Experience Strategy and Operations, he holds operational, technical, and customer responsibilities. His portfolio of work includes strategy and planning, market insights, business performance, learning and development technical enablement, compliance, and AI adoption within Customer Experience. He serves as an executive sponsor for new Azure commitments and other mission-critical engagements, as well as oversees onboarding and AI innovation across key customers.

Podcast Credits

• Executive Producer and Host: Danielle Rios, TelcoDR
• Senior Producer: Lindsay Grubb, TillCo Media
• Senior Editor/Brand Manager: Alisa Jenkins, Springboard Marketing
• Audio Editor: Andrew Condell
• Supervising Producer: Amanda Avery
• Associate Producer: Kriselda Dionisio
• Music: Dyami Wilson

A few weeks ago I gave my FIFTH Mobile World Congress talk at the GSMA’s Gen AI Summit. More than 2,000 people RSVP’d for the event, and the room was packed with telco industry leaders eager to learn more about building an AI-first telco. 

But the big problem they have to overcome is their mountain of tech debt from their legacy BSS systems. In my talk, I explained how AI can help operators leverage their existing BSS estate and use it to drive toward an AI-first future. I’ve turned my talk into this podcast. Listen now to learn:

• The transformation that happens when intelligence moves above all your systems [04:19];
• How BSS Magic launches new products and offerings in minutes instead of months [04.55];
• Why having enterprise-wide intelligence, purpose-built for telecom, accelerates transformation [07:34]; and
• How AI can breathe new life into legacy systems and turn technical debt into a strategic advantage [08:33].

Links and Resources

• If you missed my live talk, check out the video version on our YouTube channel.
• Learn more about BSS Magic and book a demo! 
• Read GenAI for BSS systems: Telcos on the cusp of a new era, a free-to-download white paper from Appledore Research, sponsored by Totogi. 
• Check out Totogi’s announcement about how we’re ending the era of billion-dollar BSS failures.
• Watch all my MWC talks! Start with the talk that began it all, my 2021 MWC keynote, The Paradox of the Public Cloud, and then check out my: 
  • 2024 MWC MVNO Summit talk, Unveiling the AI-First Future of BSS
  • 2023 MWC talk, SUPERCHARGE your MVNO with personalization
  • 2022 MWC talk, The Public Cloud is NOW!
• Watch my interview with Ray Le Maistre from TelecomTV about all the things Totogi did at MWC25.
• The great thing about BSS Magic is you don’t have to swap off your current BSS systems to use it—it adds an AI layer above all of your existing systems to make them more powerful. It reminds me of this scene in “The Jerk” where Steve Martin doesn’t need anything… except this.
• You can find the episode transcript here.

Wanna talk AI and public cloud? Telco execs, set up a meeting with our team to learn how to tap the immense business value it can bring. 

Follow DR

• Have an idea for a Telco in 20 podcast guest or topic? Send it in!
• Want to sponsor a podcast? Let us know
• Follow Telco in 20 on X @TelcoIn20
• Follow DR on X @TelcoDR

The Telco in 20 podcast is ranked in the top 5% of all podcasts globally by Listen Notes! 🎉 We've also won a 2024 MarComm Award and Hermes Award, and are recognized as a TeckNexus Top 12 Telco and Tech Podcast, Forrester Top 100 Channel Podcast and Feedspot Top 10 Telecom Podcast.

If you enjoy the podcast, would you leave us a review? It takes you seconds to do in your app and it really makes a difference in helping to convince hard-to-get guests. And I love reading your feedback and reviews!

Podcast Credits

• Executive Producer and Host: Danielle Rios, TelcoDR
• Senior Producer: Lindsay Grubb, TillCo Media
• Senior Editor/Brand Manager: Alisa Jenkins, Springboard Marketing
• Audio Editor: Andrew Condell
• Supervising Producer: Amanda Avery
• Associate Producer: Kriselda Dionisio
• Music: Dyami Wilson

The Big Three hyperscalers each hit an all-time high in CapEx spending in 2024, collectively investing almost $200 billion. For this episode, I speak with Charles Fitzgerald, managing director at Platformonomics, whose annual "Follow the CAPEX" report tracks the cloud providers’ spending. He pulls back the curtain on what’s driving investments, how AI and nuclear power are coming into play, and whether telcos have what it takes to sell AI workload capacity at the edge. Listen now to hear:

• What happened with hyperscaler CapEx spending in 2024 [02:49];
• Insights into the Stargate project, which aims to boost AI infrastructure and know-how in the United States [7:17];
• How the cloud providers are addressing AI’s energy needs, and the role nuclear power is poised to play [11:06]; and
• Why telcos may want to think twice before betting on selling AI workload capacity at the edge [14:25].

Links and Resources

• Read Charles Fitzgerald's 2024 retrospective on public cloud CAPEX spending and check out his Cloud Reactor Tracker.
• Take a look at Charles' 2022 paper calling on big tech companies to champion nuclear energy.
• Learn more about the hyperscalers’ nuclear energy plans.
• REad about telcos’ aspirations to make money by selling AI infrastructure at the edge:
  • Verizon execs hint at making money from AI infrastructure
  • AT&T and Verizon are pivoting into the landlord biz for AI
• This is Charles’ third time as a guest on Telco in 20. He’s working his way to our 5-Timers Club! Check out the first Saturday Night Live 5-Timers club inductee, Tom Hanks, who was ushered in by Paul Simon, Steve Martin, and other special guests.
• Watch this episode on our YouTube channel.
• You can find the episode transcript here.

Wanna talk AI and public cloud? Telco execs, set up a meeting with our team to learn how to tap the immense business value it can bring.

Follow DR

• Have an idea for a Telco in 20 podcast guest or topic? Send it in!
• Want to sponsor a podcast? Let us know
• Follow Telco in 20 on X @TelcoIn20
• Follow DR on X @TelcoDR

The Telco in 20 podcast is ranked in the top 5% of all podcasts globally by Listen Notes! 🎉 We've also won a 2024 MarComm Award and Hermes Award, and are recognized as a TeckNexus Top 12 Telco and Tech Podcast, Forrester Top 100 Channel Podcast and Feedspot Top 10 Telecom Podcast.

If you enjoy the podcast, would you leave us a review? It takes you seconds to do in your app and it really makes a difference in helping to convince hard-to-get guests. And I love reading your feedback and reviews!

This week’s guest

Charles Fitzgerald is a Seattle-based angel investor, with a focus on developer platforms and infrastructure. Previously, he spent 20+ years working on platform businesses at Microsoft and VMware. He can see the cloud from his house.

Podcast Credits

• Executive Producer and Host: Danielle Rios, TelcoDR
• Senior Producer: Lindsay Grubb, TillCo Media
• Senior Editor/Brand Manager: Alisa Jenkins, Springboard Marketing
• Audio Editor: Andrew Condell
• Supervising Producer: Amanda Avery
• Associate Producer: Kriselda Dionisio
• Music: Dyami Wilson

The telco industry is in the midst of a GenAI revolution, with vendors and operators racing to integrate this technology into their products and services. But with all the buzz around AI capabilities, how can telcos tell which solutions can deliver real business value, and which are just marketing hype?

For this episode, I sit down with John Abraham, principal analyst and leader of the digital enablement practice at Appledore Research. We dive into how operators can identify true AI innovation, trends in BSS, and how telcos can start to address vendor interoperability challenges. Listen now to hear:

• The definition of agentic AI [04:50];
• Questions to ask to determine which vendors have great AI product visions [07:52];
• The huge problem vendor interoperability presents to telcos [11:06]; and
• How Totogi solves the interoperability problem—and DR shares Totogi's AI vision for BSS [13:52].

Links and Resources

• Read more about BSS Magic and set up a time to meet with Team Totogi at MWC25 to see it in action. 
• While you’re in Barcelona, be sure to catch my epic talk, “Building an AI-first telco,” at the Gen AI Summit in Hall 6 on Monday, March 3 … and don’t miss Totogi’s exclusive VIP party on March 5. DM me on LinkedIn or X @TelcoDR for an invite.
• Learn more about the North American operator that switched billing systems and saved big bucks with Totogi. 
• I’ve written a couple of awesome blogs that explain the massive problem around vendor interoperability and how AI is poised to help telcos break free. Check them out!:
  • Amdocs is ruining your business to keep their empire. AI to the rescue!
  • The AI-first telco won’t wait 5 years for Amdocs
• Read the article from Sequoia Capital about the shift from Software-as-a-Service to Service-as-a-Software, which incorporates outcome-based pricing and marks an evolution in how software companies monetize their products. 
• Headed to Barcelona for MWC25? Be sure to reserve a table at John’s and my favorite restaurants, Michelin-starred Disfrutar and Atempo. 
• Watch this episode on our YouTube channel.
• You can find the episode transcript here.

Wanna talk AI and public cloud? Telco execs, set up a meeting with our team to learn how to tap the immense business value it can bring. 

Follow DR

• Have an idea for a Telco in 20 podcast guest or topic? Send it in!
• Want to sponsor a podcast? Let us know
• Follow Telco in 20 on X @TelcoIn20
• Follow DR on X @TelcoDR

The Telco in 20 podcast is ranked in the top 5% of all podcasts globally by Listen Notes! 🎉 We've also won a 2024 MarComm Award and Hermes Award, and are recognized as a TeckNexus Top 12 Telco and Tech Podcast, Forrester Top 100 Channel Podcast and Feedspot Top 10 Telecom Podcast.

If you enjoy the podcast, would you leave us a review? It takes you seconds to do in your app and it really makes a difference in helping to convince hard-to-get guests. And I love reading your feedback and reviews!

This week’s guest

With over 16 years’ experience in the telecom industry, John Abraham is a principal analyst at Appledore Research and leads the digital enablement practice. Previously, he was at Analysys Mason for 11 years, where he led the Digital Experience research segment as Principal Analyst. He has experience working with a varied client base on topics including digitization benchmarking and procurement for CSPs; strategy and go-to market for vendors; and commercial and technical due diligence for financial institutions. Earlier, as a consultant at a BSS vendor, he led requirements gathering, solution definition, and implementation at multiple tier-1 telcos in Asia and Europe. John holds a bachelor’s degree in computer science from Anna University (India) and an MBA from Bradford University School of Management (UK).

Podcast Credits

• Executive Producer and Host: Danielle Rios, TelcoDR
• Senior Producer: Lindsay Grubb, TillCo Media
• Senior Editor/Brand Manager: Alisa Jenkins, Springboard Marketing
• Audio Editor: Andrew Condell
• Supervising Producer: Amanda Avery
• Associate Producer: Kriselda Dionisio
• Music: Dyami Wilson

TelecomTV’s DSP Leaders Council is a hand-picked group of ~100 industry experts (including moi) that weighs in regularly on the state of the telco industry. A recent survey of Council members on the topic of Digital Support Systems (DSS) revealed that operators are grappling with mixed feelings about AI, with some dragging their feet on AI adoption, and others racing toward an AI-driven future. Today, I’m talking about the survey findings with TelecomTV Editorial Director Ray LeMaitre. We dig into where telcos are making progress, what’s holding them back, and what needs to happen to spark industry-wide AI transformation. And you know with Ray—it’s not a conversation unless we talk about COFFEE! Listen now to hear:

• The good news about operators and startup BSS solutions [4:40];
• Why the habit of waiting to be "ready" for change might leave slow-moving telcos on the sidelines [8:20];
• The shocking percentage of telcos that don’t see AI as essential to their future [10:24]; and
• Plans for the DSP Leaders Council and survey topics going forward [13:49].

Links and Resources

• Learn more about TelecomTV’s DSP Leaders Council and its DSP Leaders Reports.
• Read my blog about the DSS report findings, 3 key takeaways from TelecomTV’s DSS report—one will surprise you.
• When Ray and I first met, I compared myself to Daenerys Targaryen from the blockbuster TV series Game of Thrones, because let’s face it, sometimes you need to walk through fire to get stuff done in telco. Check out this scene when Daenerys becomes the mother of dragons (warning: explicit scenes, but it’s epic so I’m putting in the show notes anyway!).
• If you’re like Ray and love dark-roasted, Latin American coffee, check out this video about the best way to brew it.
• Watch this episode on our YouTube channel.
• You can find the episode transcript here.

Wanna talk AI and public cloud? Telco execs, set up a meeting with our team to learn how to tap the immense business value it can bring. 

Follow DR

• Have an idea for a Telco in 20 podcast guest or topic? Send it in!
• Want to sponsor a podcast? Let us know
• Follow Telco in 20 on X @TelcoIn20
• Follow DR on X @TelcoDR

The Telco in 20 podcast is ranked in the top 5% of all podcasts globally by Listen Notes! 🎉 We've also won a 2024 MarComm Award and Hermes Award, and are recognized as a TeckNexus Top 12 Telco and Tech Podcast, Forrester Top 100 Channel Podcast and Feedspot Top 10 Telecom Podcast.

If you enjoy the podcast, would you leave us a review? It takes you seconds to do in your app and it really makes a difference in helping to convince hard-to-get guests. And I love reading your feedback and reviews!

This week’s guest

Ray Le Maistre was appointed Editorial Director at TelecomTV in April 2020. He has been an editor and journalist covering the telecoms sector for 29 years, previously as Editor-in-Chief at Light Reading, where he worked for 18 years. He is based in the UK, owns too many flowery shirts, and will bore you to tears on the topics of films, football, and coffee if you give him half a chance.

Podcast Credits

• Executive Producer and Host: Danielle Rios, TelcoDR
• Senior Producer: Lindsay Grubb, TillCo Media
• Senior Editor/Brand Manager: Alisa Jenkins, Springboard Marketing
• Audio Editor: Andrew Condell
• Supervising Producer: Amanda Avery
• Associate Producer: Kriselda Dionisio
• Music: Dyami Wilson

As artificial intelligence (AI) adoption accelerates across the telco industry, operators are grappling with a big challenge: how to empower employees with transformative AI tools while ensuring responsible use. For this episode, I’m talking with McKinsey & Company Partner Ferry Grijpink who leads the global consulting firm’s Center for Advanced Connectivity within the Technology, Media & Telecommunications Practice. As one of the authors of a recent report, Responsible AI: A Business Imperative for Telcos, he has ideas on how telcos can find the right balance between innovation and managing risk. Listen now to hear:

• The definition of Responsible AI and how it comes into play for telcos [02:27];
• How to balance responsible behavior with innovation [04:28];
• Guidance on guardrails and policies that can encourage responsible use across your teams [08:58]; and
• How organizations can track AI usage and cost [12:56].

Links and Resources

• Read McKinsey & Company’s recent report, Responsible AI: A Business Imperative for Telcos
• Find out more about McKinsey’s Center for Advanced Connectivity
• Ferry has been a guest on Telco in 20 two other times. Check out these great episodes for more of his valuable insights:
  • Episode 83: Monetizing Network APIs
  • Episode 45: Drumming up ways to increase ARPU with McKinsey
• Ferry is famous for his scarves, but they can be hard to style. Check out this video on all the ways to tie a scarf. 
• My trademark: my Golden Goose sneakers! Don’t judge me on the cost; I save money by not buying heels! 👠 I’m partial to the Mid-Star; with their wingtip styling in the front, they qualify as business wear. Check them outI
• Watch this episode on our YouTube channel.
• You can find the episode transcript here.

Wanna talk AI and public cloud? Telco execs, set up a meeting with our team to learn how to tap the immense business value it can bring. 

Follow DR

• Have an idea for a Telco in 20 podcast guest or topic? Send it in!
• Want to sponsor a podcast? Let us know
• Follow Telco in 20 on X @TelcoIn20
• Follow DR on X @TelcoDR

The Telco in 20 podcast is ranked in the top 5% of all podcasts globally by Listen Notes! 🎉 We've also won a 2024 MarComm Award and Hermes Award, and are recognized as a TeckNexus Top 12 Telco and Tech Podcast, Forrester Top 100 Channel Podcast and Feedspot Top 10 Telecom Podcast.

If you enjoy the podcast, would you leave us a review? It takes you seconds to do in your app and it really makes a difference in helping to convince hard-to-get guests. And I love reading your feedback and reviews!

This week’s guest

Ferry Grijpink leads the McKinsey Center for Advanced Connectivity within McKinsey & Company’s Technology, Media & Telecommunications Practice, and advises telecommunications companies on strategy, marketing, and operations, including mobile operators that are launching adjacent businesses in areas such as mobile health and money services. He also co-leads McKinsey’s research on deploying and commercializing next-generation infrastructures, such as fiber, mobile broadband, and 5G networks.

Podcast Credits

• Executive Producer and Host: Danielle Rios, TelcoDR
• Senior Producer: Lindsay Grubb, TillCo Media
• Senior Editor/Brand Manager: Alisa Jenkins, Springboard Marketing
• Audio Editor: Andrew Condell
• Supervising Producer: Amanda Avery
• Associate Producer: Kriselda Dionisio
• Music: Dyami Wilson