Telco in 20

By Danielle Rios, TelcoDRBusiness Technology Management

Telco in 20 episodes

September 29Ep 150 - 6G is different. AI is why.
Every ten years, telcos have to decide whether to move to the next G. The business case has always been based on usage, capacity, and a revenue forecast. That’s because the one number that should drive the decision—what each cell actually earns—has been out of reach… until now.
In this special What’s Up with Totogi episode, I share the keynote I delivered at TelecomTV’s AI-Native Telco Forum in Düsseldorf. In it, I cover how AI finally makes that number visible, how one operator in Bolivia is using the Totogi Ontology to rank every site by the profit it earns, and how AI is changing the way telcos can make the 6G call.
Listen now to hear:
Why 6G will be decided differently than every G before it [02:53];
The two numbers every tower has—and why your systems show you only ONE [03:23];
Where telco’s most sophisticated capital decision is being made right now [04:18]; and
Why Telstra, Swisscom, and Verizon are each building the same thing—separately [08:23].
Links and Resources:
Watch the video version of my talk.
Read my blog, The first G with AI in the room, which reinforces the case I make here.
Listen to my conversation with Mark Düsener, Swisscom’s chief technology and information officer, who I mentioned on stage. Savvy operators are already building telco-wide semantic consistency to replace their legacy estate.
Hear my conversation with Mark Sanders, Telstra’s chief architect and head of autonomous networks and AI enablement, who argues that operators need a shared language: an ontology of how a telco actually works.
Tune into my episode with Stefan Pongratz, vice president of RAN and telecom CapEx research at Dell’Oro Group, for the hard numbers under the biggest capital decision this industry makes.
Dig into three Dell’Oro Group reports (paywalled) about on where telco CapEx goes from here:
Telecom Capex Report (March 2026)
6G Advanced Research Report (October 2025)
Telecom Capex Report (September 2025)
Explore TM Forum’s Autonomous Networks framework and its "road toward Level 4," the standards the Totogi Ontology is built on. The map can rebuild itself every night against a moving target instead of dying like every data-dictionary project before it.
Study the Verizon playbook on building an AI context platform at enterprise scale, How to Build an AI Context Platform at Enterprise Scale (Verizon), published through Gartner. Gartner forecasts up to 80% more accurate agents at up to 60% lower cost.
Wondering which of your sites actually earn their next-G upgrade? See how the Totogi Ontology builds a live P&L for every cell and ranks them by the profit each one makes, so you invest by revenue instead of raw traffic.
Catch me with VIVA Bolivia CEO Ryan Alvarez at TM Forum’s Innovate Americas in Dallas on October 6, where we get concrete about the next-G upgrade calls that VIVA is weighing right now.
Salar de Uyuni. You’ve seen it before. It’s the blinding white salt flat where Kylo Ren squares off against Luke Skywalker in Star Wars: The Last Jedi. Red dust kicks up under Kylo’s boots, but never under Luke’s, because Luke isn’t really there. That salt flat is in Bolivia: the largest on Earth, and home to the operator in this talk. Don’t be Kylo Ren, swinging at a ghost. Use AI to see what’s actually there: the profit on every tower.
Check out this episode on our YouTube channel.
You can find the episode transcript here.
Wanna talk AI and public cloud? Telco execs, set up a meeting with our team to learn how to tap the immense business value they can bring.
Follow DR:
Have an idea for a Telco in 20 podcast guest or topic? Send it in!
Want to sponsor a podcast? Let us know.
Follow DR on X @TelcoDR
The Telco in 20 podcast is ranked in the top 5% of all podcasts globally by Listen Notes! 🎉 We’ve won 2026, 2025, and 2024 Hermes Creative Awards, and 2025 and 2024 MarCom Awards. We are also recognized as a TeckNexus Top 12 Telco and Tech Podcast, Forrester Top 100 Channel Podcast and Feedspot Top 10 Telecom Podcast.
If you enjoy the podcast, would you leave us a review? It takes seconds to do in your app and really makes a difference in helping to convince hard-to-get guests. And I love reading your feedback and reviews
This week’s guest:
Danielle Rios (DR) is the founder and CEO of TelcoDR and Totogi, and host of the Telco in 20 podcast.
Podcast Credits:
Executive Producer and Host: Danielle Rios, TelcoDR
Senior Producer: Lindsay Grubb, TillCo Media
Senior Editor/Brand Manager: Alisa Jenkins, Springboard Marketing
Audio Editor: Andrew Condell
Supervising Producer: Amanda Avery
Associate Producer: Kriselda Dionisio
Music: Dyami Wilson
11 min
September 15Ep 149 - Microsoft deploys the FDEs (Kevin Shatzkamer)
Every telco has hundreds of AI use cases, dozens of pilots, thousands of agents. So why can’t they get to production at scale?
I sat down with Kevin Shatzkamer, corporate vice president of the Telco and Media Engineering Studio at Microsoft Frontier Company, the hyperscaler’s new operating unit. His team embeds forward-deployed engineers (FDEs) at enterprise customers to build and run AI at scale.
Listen now to hear:
Where AI actually breaks inside a telco [05:13];
What happens when Frontier engineers embed at an operator [08:38];
The real bottleneck for running AI at scale [09:30]; and
What telcos bring to the table that Microsoft can’t manufacture [14:09].
Links and Resources:
Read the announcement of Microsoft Frontier Company—the hyperscaler’s $2.5B, 6,000-engineer bet on embedding teams inside enterprise customers.
Learn about Frontier’s outcomes-first model, where success is measured by the customer’s business result rather than the product shipped.
Check out Kevin’s LinkedIn post about taking the Telco and Media lead position for Frontier Company.
Want to go from idea to production in days instead of months? This is how Totogi builds: FDEs and twice-weekly capability sprints, feedback to shipped code by Thursday.
Kevin mentions John Chambers, the former Cisco CEO who said, “the Internet will change the way we work, live, learn, and play.” Read his thoughts on AI’s impact, including moving five times faster than the internet, with bumpy jobs transitions along the way.
Catch me with VIVA Bolivia CEO Ryan Alvarez at TM Forum’s Innovate Americas in Dallas on October 6, where we make the fast-cadence thesis concrete. Ryan runs every cell site as its own P&L on the Totogi Ontology. We’ll walk through the next-G upgrade calls VIVA is weighing right now.
My advice to kids going to college in the Age of AI? Become an expert! Just like Mr. Miyagi teaches Daniel-san karate. Wax on, wax off.
Check out this episode on our YouTube channel.
You can find the episode transcript here.
Wanna talk AI and public cloud? Telco execs, set up a meeting with our team to learn how to tap the immense business value they can bring.
Follow DR:
Have an idea for a Telco in 20 podcast guest or topic? Send it in!
Want to sponsor a podcast? Let us know.
Follow DR on X @TelcoDR
The Telco in 20 podcast is ranked in the top 5% of all podcasts globally by Listen Notes! 🎉 We’ve won 2026, 2025, and 2024 Hermes Creative Awards, and 2025 and 2024 MarCom Awards. We are also recognized as a TeckNexus Top 12 Telco and Tech Podcast, Forrester Top 100 Channel Podcast and Feedspot Top 10 Telecom Podcast.
If you enjoy the podcast, would you leave us a review? It takes seconds to do in your app and really makes a difference in helping to convince hard-to-get guests. And I love reading your feedback and reviews!
This week’s guest:
Kevin Shatzkamer is a corporate vice president of engineering at Microsoft Frontier Company, leading the Telco and Media industry verticals and customer experience transformation across industries. With more than 20 years of experience driving AI, digital transformation, and technology innovation, he partners with customers to design and scale enterprise AI solutions that deliver measurable business outcomes. Prior to Microsoft Frontier Company, he led Strategy and Operations for Microsoft’s Customer Experience & Success organization. Kevin is the author of two technology books, holds more than 50 patents, and earned degrees from the University of Florida, MIT, and Indiana University.
Podcast Credits:
Executive Producer and Host: Danielle Rios, TelcoDR
Senior Producer: Lindsay Grubb, TillCo Media
Senior Editor/Brand Manager: Alisa Jenkins, Springboard Marketing
Audio Editor: Andrew Condell
Supervising Producer: Amanda Avery
Associate Producer: Kriselda Dionisio
Music: Dyami Wilson
20 min
September 01Ep 148 - To G, or not to G (Stefan Pongratz)
To G, or not to G. That is the question every telco faces, and the 6G noise is getting louder. So how does that decision actually get made?
Stefan Pongratz, vice president of RAN and telecom CapEx research at Dell’Oro Group, has watched operators wrestle with it through 16 years and three G cycles. He knows what it really costs, what’s on the boardroom chart, and why waiting has a price of its own. He also knows what makes this cycle different, and why the operators dimensioning their networks for humans might be planning for the wrong customer.
Listen now to hear:
Why launching a new G is expensive—and not launching is, too [04:40];

What’s on the boardroom chart when operators greenlight a new G [07:31];

Why being second is safe—until it suddenly isn’t [10:47]; and

What happens when the network’s biggest users don’t sleep [13:11].
Links and Resources:
Learn more about the report that’s behind the numbers Stefan shares—Global Telecom Capex to Normalize, Not Disappear, According to Dell’Oro Group. CapEx is past its peak but not falling off a cliff, with capital intensity easing toward 15% by 2029.

Explore TM Forum’s Autonomous Networks framework, the “road toward Level 4.” Stefan name-checks it when he describes operators’ long quest to do more with less.

Curious which of your sites actually earn their next-G upgrade? See how the Totogi Ontology builds a live P&L for every cell site and ranks them by the profit each one brings, so you can decide where to invest by revenue instead of raw traffic.

Book your spot at TelecomTV’s AI-Native Telco Forum, September 8 and 9 in Düsseldorf, where I’m giving a talk and throwing another legendary Totogi party. Want an invite? Stop by our demo pod, or DM me on LinkedIn or X at @TelcoDR for more information.

Catch me with VIVA Bolivia CEO Ryan Alvarez at TM Forum’s Innovate Americas in Dallas on October 6, where we’ll have a fireside chat about the exact question Stefan keeps circling: which sites should you NOT upgrade? Alvarez brings the real next-G decision that VIVA is weighing right now.

Watch two pickleball obsessives in their natural habitat. Stefan took gold in the men’s open at the NVZ NorCal Summer Cup and I scored with the Austin Ballers, taking top prize at the MiLP DUPR16 50+ Nationals. I hope to bump into Stefan on the pickleball court someday soon!

Check out this episode on our YouTube channel.

You can find the episode transcript here.
Wanna talk AI and public cloud? Telco execs, set up a meeting with our team to learn how to tap the immense business value they can bring.
Follow DR:
Have an idea for a Telco in 20 podcast guest or topic? Send it in!

Want to sponsor a podcast? Let us know.

Follow DR on X @TelcoDR
The Telco in 20 podcast is ranked in the top 5% of all podcasts globally by Listen Notes! 🎉 We’ve won 2026, 2025, and 2024 Hermes Creative Awards, and 2025 and 2024 MarCom Awards. We are also recognized as a TeckNexus Top 12 Telco and Tech Podcast, Forrester Top 100 Channel Podcast and Feedspot Top 10 Telecom Podcast.
If you enjoy the podcast, would you leave us a review? It takes seconds to do in your app and really makes a difference in helping to convince hard-to-get guests. And I love reading your feedback and reviews!
This week’s guest:
Stefan Pongratz joined Dell’Oro Group in 2010 and leads the firm’s Mobile RAN market research programs. At the firm, Mr. Pongratz has expanded RAN research and authored multiple Advanced Research Reports to ensure the program evolves to address new RAN technologies and opportunities, including 5G, 6G, AI RAN, Open RAN, private wireless, Massive MIMO, mmWave, small cells, and CBRS. Before joining Dell’Oro Group, Mr. Pongratz spent 10 years at Anritsu Company.
Podcast Credits:
Executive Producer and Host: Danielle Rios, TelcoDR

Senior Producer: Lindsay Grubb, TillCo Media

Senior Editor/Brand Manager: Alisa Jenkins, Springboard Marketing

Audio Editor: Andrew Condell

Supervising Producer: Amanda Avery

Associate Producer: Kriselda Dionisio

Music: Dyami Wilson
20 min
August 18Ep 147 - ANTA: TelecomTV’s AI-Native Telco Accelerator (Guy Daniels)
Everyone has an opinion about how telcos are doing with AI. Almost nobody has evidence—until now. Guy Daniels, chief strategy officer and content director at TelecomTV, spent the year compiling the AI-Native Telco Index—the first 100% evidence-based report on telco AI adoption. It’s one piece of TelecomTV’s new AI-Native Telco Accelerator (ANTA), a community built to bring operators, vendors, and standards bodies together to share what’s actually working in our industry.
I sat down with Guy to talk about what his research reveals, how ANTA works, and what’s coming at the AI-Native Telco Forum in Düsseldorf this September.
Listen now to hear:
What ANTA is, and the three pieces that make it run [04:21];

Which operators are doing impressive AI work [08:01];

Why so many telcos keep their best AI work hidden [09:08]; and

The “AI in telco” myth that Guy’s research debunks [13:44].
Links and Resources:
Read TelecomTV’s AI-Native Telco Accelerator (ANTA) announcement, the community launched to help operators move from AI pilots to deployments that actually scale.

Learn more about ANTA and the AI-Native Telco Index—the first evidence-based read on how 56 operators are scaling AI. The members-only report drops this September at the Forum in Düsseldorf.

Join the conversation! Book your spot at the AI-Native Telco Forum, September 8 and 9 in Düsseldorf.

Learn how the Totogi Ontology keeps every AI decision in one governed model, so you can show which rule fired and why. It’s exactly the kind of real-world deployment ANTA is tracking. Watch it run at our demo pod in Düsseldorf or set up a meeting with Team Totogi.

Catch up on the AI breakthroughs I rattle off at the top of the show:
Anthropic’s “When AI builds itself” report lays out how AI now writes most of its own code and runs unsupervised for hours, even days.

Fortune’s write-up covers how Claude Fable 5 helped disprove the 87-year-old Jacobian conjecture.

Explore the two operators that Guy singles out as pace-setters:
Read about Deutsche Telekom’s march toward AI-native and the customer-facing bot that’s posting published results.

Check out Orange, which is putting AI at the center of its strategy and briefing investors on it, something almost no other telco does.

Watch my keynote and panel from last year’s AI-Native Telco Forum, where a room of operators told me you can’t vibe code a carrier-grade BSS—so we built one live that day.

See what Totogi shipped in Düsseldorf last year: 617,000 lines of production code, generated live, all captured in this LinkedIn recap.

Go deeper in my blog, “Düsseldorf changed everything for BSS,” on why the use case is never the moat.

Want an invite to the Totogi party while you’re at the AI-Native Telco Forum? Stop by our demo pod, or DM me on LinkedIn or X at @TelcoDR for more information.

Speaking of parties, cue up some of the greatest ever put on film to help you prepare for a good time: the house party in Eddie Murphy’s Trading Places, the night that spirals in Bachelor Party, the rager that leaves the house a mess in Sixteen Candles, and the granddaddy party movie of them all, The Hangover. (Warning: explicit scenes, but they’re epic so I’m putting them in the show notes anyway!)

Check out this episode on our YouTube channel.

You can find the episode transcript here.
Wanna talk AI and public cloud? Telco execs, set up a meeting with our team to learn how to tap the immense business value they can bring.
Follow DR:
Have an idea for a Telco in 20 podcast guest or topic? Send it in!

Want to sponsor a podcast? Let us know.

Follow DR on X @TelcoDR
The Telco in 20 podcast is ranked in the top 5% of all podcasts globally by Listen Notes! 🎉 We’ve won 2026, 2025, and 2024 Hermes Creative Awards, and 2025 and 2024 MarCom Awards. We are also recognized as a TeckNexus Top 12 Telco and Tech Podcast, Forrester Top 100 Channel Podcast and Feedspot Top 10 Telecom Podcast.
If you enjoy the podcast, would you leave us a review? It takes seconds to do in your app and really makes a difference in helping to convince hard-to-get guests. And I love reading your feedback and reviews!
This week’s guest:
Guy Daniels is chief strategy officer and content director at TelecomTV, where he leads editorial strategy across the company’s events, including the DSP Leaders World Forum, the Great Telco Debate, and the AI-Native Telco Forum. He recently launched ANTA, the AI-Native Telco Accelerator—TelecomTV’s industry-backed initiative uniting operators, vendors, and industry bodies to help telcos move from AI experimentation to real-world deployment. A pioneer of online video in telecoms, Guy co-founded Decisive Media and TelecomTV in 2001 after a decade in telecoms publishing.
Podcast Credits:
Executive Producer and Host: Danielle Rios, TelcoDR

Senior Producer: Lindsay Grubb, TillCo Media

Senior Editor/Brand Manager: Alisa Jenkins, Springboard Marketing

Audio Editor: Andrew Condell

Supervising Producer: Amanda Avery

Associate Producer: Kriselda Dionisio

Music: Dyami Wilson
19 min
August 04Ep 146 - Eutelsat’s AI in the sky (Dr. Mariam Kaynia)
It’s hard to manage a network in space. That constraint shapes everything Dr. Mariam Kaynia thinks about as chief data and information officer at Eutelsat, Europe’s only LEO alternative to Starlink in orbit today. The company runs more than 600 satellites at 1,200 kilometers alongside a geostationary fleet parked even higher. When Eutelsat launches a satellite, the intelligence running it has to be right before it leaves the ground: self-calibrating, self-healing, and autonomous by design, not by choice.
I sat down with Mariam to unpack why satellite is becoming core connectivity instead of the backup layer, how Eutelsat federated its data platforms instead of ripping them out, and where AI decisions should—and should NOT—live inside an operator.
Listen now to hear:
Where satellite fits in telco connectivity strategy [04:03];

Why Eutelsat connected its data platforms [06:47];

The customization trap—and knowing when to say no [08:49]; and

Four guardrails for AI—including one everyone overlooks [13:25].
Links and Resources:
See how Eutelsat delivers a “mobile network from the sky” with higher speeds and lower latency.

Read about the next-generation sovereign constellation Eutelsat has filed for, its sovereignty and critical-infrastructure play.

Explore the TM Forum Catalyst Team Awards, where Eutelsat’s multi-orbit AI prototype won the “Tech for Good” award. Then learn about the SATCOM with an Edge – Phase III project behind that win, championed by Airbus, Bell Canada, Eutelsat, and MTN Nigeria.

Track Eutelsat’s OneWeb LEO constellation in real time, the fleet that has to keep itself alive once it’s in orbit.

Learn how Eutelsat is connecting remote communities across Greenland, where population density can’t cover the cost of terrestrial networks.

Read my blog “Where do decisions live?,” which argues that decisions belong in an ontology, not at inference time, where they hallucinate at scale.

Want AI that can explain itself? Check out the Totogi Ontology, which keeps decisions in one governed model so you can show which rule fired and why.

Mariam and I got into the challenge of being working parents with big jobs. Read two of my recommendations on the topic, Anne-Marie Slaughter’s 2012 Atlantic essay “Why Women Still Can’t Have It All” on fixing broken workplaces and Sheryl Sandberg’s “Lean In” on the importance of personal ambition.

Check out this episode on our YouTube channel.

You can find the episode transcript here.
Wanna talk AI and public cloud? Telco execs, set up a meeting with our team to learn how to tap the immense business value they can bring.
Follow DR:
Have an idea for a Telco in 20 podcast guest or topic? Send it in!

Want to sponsor a podcast? Let us know.

Follow DR on X @TelcoDR
The Telco in 20 podcast is ranked in the top 5% of all podcasts globally by Listen Notes! 🎉 We’ve won 2026, 2025, and 2024 Hermes Creative Awards, and 2025 and 2024 MarCom Awards. We are also recognized as a TeckNexus Top 12 Telco and Tech Podcast, Forrester Top 100 Channel Podcast and Feedspot Top 10 Telecom Podcast.
If you enjoy the podcast, would you leave us a review? It takes seconds to do in your app and really makes a difference in helping to convince hard-to-get guests. And I love reading your feedback and reviews!
This week’s guest:
Mariam Kaynia is Eutelsat’s chief data and information officer and a member of the group’s Executive Committee. She oversees IT, data, and AI for the group. She brings extensive telecommunications expertise from VP roles at Telefónica Germany, where she led digital transformation, strategy, and data analytics, and from her time as an associate partner at McKinsey & Company. Named among the Top 50 Women in Technology in Germany, she holds a Ph.D. in Wireless Communications and Electrical Engineering from the Norwegian University of Science and Technology.
Podcast Credits:
Executive Producer and Host: Danielle Rios, TelcoDR

Senior Producer: Lindsay Grubb, TillCo Media

Senior Editor/Brand Manager: Alisa Jenkins, Springboard Marketing

Audio Editor: Andrew Condell

Supervising Producer: Amanda Avery

Associate Producer: Kriselda Dionisio

Music: Dyami Wilson
21 min
July 21Ep 145 - Swisscom is building the AI-first telco (Mark Düsener)
What does it actually take to become an AI-first telco? Swisscom is finding out. It has launched the biggest transformation program in its history: a ground-up rebuild of the software core behind its consumer and enterprise business units.
In this episode, I sit down with Mark Düsener, chief technology and information officer at Swisscom, to unpack how the operator is doing it. We get into why standardization is the new differentiation, why you can’t be agentic without a brain, and how Swisscom is converting the know-how of its hero engineers—critical talent at telcos—into skills everyone can use.
Listen now to hear:
Why data is the “brain” AI needs [05:17];

How Swisscom is collapsing its systems into one platform [07:51];

Mark’s rule for killing technical debt [12:14]; and

How to bring your experts along when AI codifies what they know [12:49].
Links and Resources:
Read Swisscom CEO Christoph Aeschlimann’s LinkedIn post about why telcos have to reinvent themselves at the core, not just the edge.

Listen to Mark’s interview on the TM Forum podcast. He talks about how Swisscom is using AI to move to an open, composable architecture, even across applications still tied to legacy systems.

Tired of knowledge staying locked inside your experts’ heads? Read Anthropic’s explainer on Agent Skills, the codified, reusable expertise Mark wants his "heroes" to package so any agent or colleague can call it.

Learn how the Totogi Ontology sits over your mainframe, BSS, and network systems so they all speak one language, letting you retire one legacy system at a time instead of betting on a multi-year rip and replace.

Interested in the underlying architecture for becoming AI-first? I’ve written three blogs on this topic:
“You built a data lake. You needed a river” about why AI needs an ontology close to your live systems so it can act, not just report.

“Nail your AI architecture” about why business logic doesn’t belong inside your agents.

“Where do decisions live?” about the board-level question of where decisions should be made in an AI-native telco.

Mark’s go-to dish is filet with asparagus and béarnaise. Béarnaise is the sauce home cooks fear most, a temperamental combination of egg yolks and butter that breaks the second you stop whisking. I attempted it and produced something I’d rather not describe. If you want to try it, watch culinary icons Julia Child, Jacques Pépin, and Martha Stewart make béarnaise together in this TV clip from 1999.

Check out this episode on our YouTube channel.

You can find the episode transcript here.
Wanna talk AI and public cloud? Telco execs, set up a meeting with our team to learn how to tap the immense business value they can bring.
Follow DR:
Have an idea for a Telco in 20 podcast guest or topic? Send it in!

Want to sponsor a podcast? Let us know.

Follow DR on X @TelcoDR
The Telco in 20 podcast is ranked in the top 5% of all podcasts globally by Listen Notes! 🎉 We’ve won 2026, 2025, and 2024 Hermes Creative Awards, and 2025 and 2024 MarCom Awards. We are also recognized as a TeckNexus Top 12 Telco and Tech Podcast, Forrester Top 100 Channel Podcast and Feedspot Top 10 Telecom Podcast.
If you enjoy the podcast, would you leave us a review? It takes seconds to do in your app and really makes a difference in helping to convince hard-to-get guests. And I love reading your feedback and reviews!
This week’s guest:
Mark Düsener is chief technology & information officer (CTIO) at Swisscom and a member of the Executive Committee, Swisscom Switzerland. He leads the IT, Network & Infrastructure division and drives the modernization of Switzerland’s network landscape as part of Swisscom’s TelCo to TechCo journey. His focus includes advancing Switzerland’s best and smartest network across fixed and mobile, expanding 5G and preparing for 6G, while driving the transformation towards automated, software-driven networks and an AI-driven Swisscom. He joined Swisscom in November 2020 and most recently led the Mobile Network, Mobile Services & B2B Telco unit. Prior to Swisscom, he was managing director of Deutsche Telekom Healthcare Solutions GmbH and held various leadership roles at Vodafone Germany.
Podcast Credits:
Executive Producer and Host: Danielle Rios, TelcoDR

Senior Producer: Lindsay Grubb, TillCo Media

Senior Editor/Brand Manager: Alisa Jenkins, Springboard Marketing

Audio Editor: Andrew Condell

Supervising Producer: Amanda Avery

Associate Producer: Kriselda Dionisio

Music: Dyami Wilson
23 min
July 07Ep 144 - TDC’s dragon in the basement (Carlos Moreno Alonso)
Every telco has a system it can’t get rid of—a mainframe, a billing platform, a vendor with hooks in everything. The transformation math is brutal: years of work, massive investment, and a failure rate that makes every next attempt harder to sell internally.
Carlos Moreno Alonso is CTIO at TDC Brands, Denmark’s largest telecom provider. Nine months into the job, he’s leading the next phase of one of Europe’s biggest IT transformations—including wrestling with a decades-old mainframe that the former CEO called "a dragon in the basement." He talks about inheriting a transformation mid-flight and what strategies actually work when your legacy system is too entangled to rip out.
Listen now to hear:
How TDC got its consumer business onto a modern stack [03:58];

Carlos’s two-part plan for the harder B2B side [06:45];

Where AI actually speeds migration [07:56]; and

The phase of transformation that is the heaviest lift [09:32].
Links and Resources:
Read the announcement that Nuuday is now TDC Brands, which unites six brands—YouSee, TDC Erhverv, Telmore, Hiper, eesy, and Relatel—under one 145-year-old name.

Learn how TDC Brands brought Carlos on board as CTIO to lead the next phase of its digital transformation project.

Read the story behind “the dragon in the basement,” a phrase coined by former Nuuday CEO Jon James at DTW 2022. It describes the decades-old Columbus mainframe as a beast that needs to be “fed and watered and constantly checked to make sure it’s still breathing.”

Ready to slay your own dragon? Learn how the Totogi Ontology sits over your mainframe, BSS, and network systems so they speak one language, letting you retire one legacy system at a time.

Check out the live World Cup standings as the tournament plays out across North America. When we recorded, I was pulling for Mexico, and Carlos was backing Spain. As of this episode's release, England knocked Mexico out, but Spain squeaked past Portugal to move into the quarterfinals. Looks like Carlos gets the bragging rights—for now.

Think World Cup stakes are high? Try kids’ soccer. In the 2005 movie Kicking and Screaming, Will Ferrell’s Coach Phil gets so threatened when his assistant (NFL legend Mike Ditka) offers coaching advice that he orders him to fetch a juice box instead. Even the fiercest competitors need to hydrate.

Check out this episode on our YouTube channel.

You can find the episode transcript here.
Wanna talk AI and public cloud? Telco execs, set up a meeting with our team to learn how to tap the immense business value they can bring.
Follow DR:
Have an idea for a Telco in 20 podcast guest or topic? Send it in!

Want to sponsor a podcast? Let us know.

Follow DR on X @TelcoDR
The Telco in 20 podcast is ranked in the top 5% of all podcasts globally by Listen Notes! 🎉 We’ve won 2026, 2025, and 2024 Hermes Creative Awards, and 2025 and 2024 MarCom Awards. We are also recognized as a TeckNexus Top 12 Telco and Tech Podcast, Forrester Top 100 Channel Podcast and Feedspot Top 10 Telecom Podcast.
If you enjoy the podcast, would you leave us a review? It takes seconds to do in your app and really makes a difference in helping to convince hard-to-get guests. And I love reading your feedback and reviews!
This week’s guest:
Carlos Moreno Alonso is CTIO of TDC Brands in Denmark, where he oversees a 700-person IT organization (employees and subcontractors) and leads the company’s cloud BSS migration and AI-driven automation programs. Over a 25-year career spanning ONO, Vodafone Spain, Vodafone Italy, and Vodafone Group, Carlos has run complex BSS transformation programs, including a four-year platform overhaul at Vodafone Italy and the post-acquisition integration of ONO into Vodafone Spain. He most recently served as CTIO at Adamo.
Podcast Credits:
Executive Producer and Host: Danielle Rios, TelcoDR

Senior Producer: Lindsay Grubb, TillCo Media

Senior Editor/Brand Manager: Alisa Jenkins, Springboard Marketing

Audio Editor: Andrew Condell

Supervising Producer: Amanda Avery

Associate Producer: Kriselda Dionisio

Music: Dyami Wilson
16 min
June 23Ep 143 - Norlys bets big on Telia (Daniel Askeroth)
Telcos love mergers. In 2025 alone, the industry spent nearly $70 billion on M&A, and every single deal brought its own baggage. New systems, new cultures, new tech debt—all bolted onto everything that came before. Everyone celebrates the deal. No one celebrates the hard work of bringing two organizations together.
For this episode, I sit down with Daniel Askeroth, senior vice president of telco at Norlys, the Danish energy and broadband co-op that acquired Telia Denmark in 2024. Daniel spent 17 years at Telia Denmark. Now, he's the one tasked with stitching his old company into Norlys, which is itself the product of 40+ prior mergers. We dig into how he runs the integration without breaking the customer experience, how to unite workforces without losing the people you need most, and what Daniel would do differently if he had to do it all over again.
Listen now to hear:
Why the people side of mergers takes longer than anyone expects [03:20];

How Norlys keeps integration invisible to customers [05:08];

How AI is changing the way Daniel’s teams build [06:48]; and

What Daniel learned from temporarily stepping into an HR role [11:58].
Links and Resources:
Read Bain's Telecom M&A: Here Are the Latest Deal Trends Worldwide for the latest on where the industry is placing its bets.

Learn more about Norlys's $926M acquisition of Telia Denmark and why adding mobile was the missing piece in its full-service play for Danish consumers.

Check out Daniel’s LinkedIn post about the Norlys leadership role-swap. He traded his telco seat for one in People & Culture for a few days and came back with a different perspective on the business.

Every merger means bringing together new billing stacks, CRMs, and decades of past decisions. Learn how the Totogi Ontology sits over all those acquired systems so they speak the same language.

Want to see the Totogi Ontology in action? Catch Team Totogi at DTW Ignite, running June 23-25 in Copenhagen.

Daniel's kids discovered historical architecture through Pokémon GO, a location-based mobile game that uses your phone's GPS and camera to catch virtual Pokémon at real-world landmarks. Launched in 2016, it peaked at 232 million players and still draws 55 million monthly players and $545M in annual revenue—accidentally tricking a generation into exploring historic landmarks. Who knew Pokémon GO was still going so strong?

Check out this episode on our YouTube channel.

You can find the episode transcript here.
Wanna talk AI and public cloud? Telco execs, set up a meeting with our team to learn how to tap the immense business value they can bring.
Follow DR:
Have an idea for a Telco in 20 podcast guest or topic? Send it in!

Want to sponsor a podcast? Let us know.

Follow DR on X @TelcoDR
The Telco in 20 podcast is ranked in the top 5% of all podcasts globally by Listen Notes! 🎉 We’ve won 2026, 2025, and 2024 Hermes Creative Awards, and 2025 and 2024 MarCom Awards. We are also recognized as a TeckNexus Top 12 Telco and Tech Podcast, Forrester Top 100 Channel Podcast and Feedspot Top 10 Telecom Podcast.
If you enjoy the podcast, would you leave us a review? It takes seconds to do in your app and really makes a difference in helping to convince hard-to-get guests. And I love reading your feedback and reviews!
This week’s guest:
Daniel Askeroth is senior vice president of telco at Norlys, a Danish energy and telecoms cooperative. He leads Norlys’ telecom business following the acquisition of Telia Denmark, including the integration and transformation focusing on simplifying systems, aligning cultures, and driving large-scale technology and organizational change.
With over 17 years of experience at Telia Denmark prior to joining Norlys, Daniel brings deep expertise in telecom operations, transformation, and leadership. He is passionate about building strong teams and delivering customer-focused, future-ready connectivity solutions.
Podcast Credits:
Executive Producer and Host: Danielle Rios, TelcoDR

Senior Producer: Lindsay Grubb, TillCo Media

Senior Editor/Brand Manager: Alisa Jenkins, Springboard Marketing

Audio Editor: Andrew Condell

Supervising Producer: Amanda Avery

Associate Producer: Kriselda Dionisio

Music: Dyami Wilson
18 min
June 09Ep 142 - AT&T bets on the last mile (Shawn Hakl)
Every major telco is racing to claim a piece of the AI infrastructure stack. Operators like Telefónica, Orange, Deutsche Telekom, SoftBank, and TELUS are betting on sovereign clouds, AI factories, and GPU-as-a-service to deliver local data, national compute, and a seat at the AI table.
Then there's AT&T. In March, it announced AWS Interconnect - last mile: fiber and fixed wireless plugged directly into AWS and engineered for AI workloads. AT&T’s view is that enterprises using AI don't just need more compute—they need flatter networks and faster connections. So it’s betting on the layer it owns outright—the last mile.
In this episode, I'm joined by Shawn Hakl, SVP of product at AT&T Business. We dig into why the operator is partnering with hyperscalers instead of competing with them, the use case where AT&T deployed AI at the edge to cut latency from 110ms to 40ms, and what an "agent-consumable" network actually looks like.
Listen now to hear:
Why AT&T sees hyperscalers as partners, not rivals [05:18];

What it takes to put AI into production at telco scale—and lessons learned from AT&T's internal deployment [07:14];

The edge AI deployment that cut latency from 110ms to 40ms for a live customer [08:45]; and

What it really means to make a network "agent-consumable" [10:55].
Links and Resources:
Read the AT&T and AWS announcement on AWS Interconnect - last mile, which brings AT&T's fiber and fixed wireless connectivity directly into AWS environments.

Learn more about AT&T's edge AI collaboration with Cisco and NVIDIA, which pushes real-time AI inference directly to the network edge.

AT&T doesn't just sell AI solutions; it runs on them. Learn how Ask AT&T has evolved into a full agentic platform, with more than 100,000 users consuming 27 billion tokens a day and teams building custom AI agents with a drag-and-drop tool.

Want to scale AI agents without the semantic chaos? Learn how the Totogi Ontology gives AI the business context it needs to discover, act, and execute—so agents stop flying blind.

Shawn was on the Canadian national luge team, which means he knows a thing or two about commitment once you're flying down the track. Elana Meyers Taylor knows that feeling too! At age 41, in her 5th Olympic appearance, she finally won the Olympic gold medal in women's monobob at Milano Cortina. So, Shawn might be right—stick to the plan!

Check out this episode on our YouTube channel.

You can find the episode transcript here.
Wanna talk AI and public cloud? Telco execs, set up a meeting with our team to learn how to tap the immense business value they can bring.
Follow DR:
Have an idea for a Telco in 20 podcast guest or topic? Send it in!

Want to sponsor a podcast? Let us know.

Follow DR on X @TelcoDR
The Telco in 20 podcast is ranked in the top 5% of all podcasts globally by Listen Notes! 🎉 We’ve won 2026, 2025, and 2024 Hermes Creative Awards, and 2025 and 2024 MarCom Awards. We are also recognized as a TeckNexus Top 12 Telco and Tech Podcast, Forrester Top 100 Channel Podcast and Feedspot Top 10 Telecom Podcast.
If you enjoy the podcast, would you leave us a review? It takes seconds to do in your app and really makes a difference in helping to convince hard-to-get guests. And I love reading your feedback and reviews!
This week’s guest:
As the senior vice president of product at AT&T Business, Shawn Hakl is responsible for the portfolio servicing enterprise, public sector, partner, and small business segments, which generates over $30 billion in annual revenue. A seasoned leader in cloud, AI, and communications, Shawn’s unique knowledge of software, security, and infrastructure is helping enterprises, government, and small businesses harness the power of technology to successfully execute on their digital transformation. In his current role, Shawn is responsible for wireline, 5G/wireless, voice/UC, security/SASE, data center, AIOps, and Network-as-a-Service product lines.
Podcast Credits:
Executive Producer and Host: Danielle Rios, TelcoDR

Senior Producer: Lindsay Grubb, TillCo Media

Senior Editor/Brand Manager: Alisa Jenkins, Springboard Marketing

Audio Editor: Andrew Condell

Supervising Producer: Amanda Avery

Associate Producer: Kriselda Dionisio

Music: Dyami Wilson
19 min
May 26Ep 141 - Tele2 goes back to the future (Ove Wik)
Every operator made the same bet—go digital, close stores, turn over distribution to the resellers. Somewhere along the way, they gave away the customer relationship. In the first half of 2025, data usage grew in 92% of markets while ARPU grew in only 50%. Operators are delivering more yet earning less.
Tele2 is fighting back. It’s opening physical stores while everyone else is closing them, consolidating six IT stacks down to two, and using AI to rebuild subscriber relationships at scale. For this episode, I talk with Ove Wik, EVP and CTIO at Tele2, about what it takes to reclaim customer relationships, why most BSS transformations never get finished, and what real change actually takes.
Listen now to hear:
The question that got Tele2 from six IT stacks to two [03:58];

The 80/20 trade-off most operators refuse to make [05:45];

Why Tele2 is opening physical stores while most operators are closing them [09:41]; and

What real BSS transformation actually requires [12:13].
Links and Resources:
Check out Tele2's latest annual report. CEO Jean-Marc Harion declares that the company is going "back to the future."

Learn more about Tele2 and Telenor's Net4Mobility joint venture, which just hit 99.9% 5G population coverage in Sweden.

Since we recorded this episode, Tele2 has named a new CEO. Nicholas Högberg will take over for Jean-Marc Harion as president and CEO on July 1, 2026.

Are you planning a transformation and don’t know what trade offs to make? Use the Totogi Ontology. It maps your business processes and customer interactions so you can see exactly what matters and make trade-offs with confidence.

Tele2 is using AI and hyperpersonalization to rebuild subscriber relationships. Watch my MWC23 talk, SUPERCHARGE your MVNO with personalization to see how operators of any size can use subscriber data to deliver tailored, individual offers that grow ARPU and stop churn—exactly the kind of direct customer engagement Tele2 is now chasing.

Ove renovates homes in his spare time and knows how to finish projects. If only all telco transformations made it over the finish line! This clip from the movie The Money Pit shows how quickly things can go wrong.

Check out this episode on our YouTube channel.

You can find the episode transcript here.
Wanna talk AI and public cloud? Telco execs, set up a meeting with our team to learn how to tap the immense business value they can bring.
Follow DR:
Have an idea for a Telco in 20 podcast guest or topic? Send it in!

Want to sponsor a podcast? Let us know

Follow DR on X @TelcoDR
The Telco in 20 podcast is ranked in the top 5% of all podcasts globally by Listen Notes! 🎉 We’ve also won 2026, 2025, and 2024 Hermes Creative Awards, and 2025 and 2024 MarCom Awards. We are also recognized as a TeckNexus Top 12 Telco and Tech Podcast, Forrester Top 100 Channel Podcast and Feedspot Top 10 Telecom Podcast.
If you enjoy the podcast, would you leave us a review? It takes seconds to do in your app and really makes a difference in helping to convince hard-to-get guests. And I love reading your feedback and reviews!
This week’s guest:
Ove is CTIO at Tele2. He has spent his entire life in telecom operators, starting in Sweden at a time when one incumbent provided fixed telephony. He has navigated more than 40 years of telco evolution that has included intense competition, extensive product portfolios, and international operations.
With a background in engineering, Ove has worked in technology, product management, sales, operations, and strategy. Some of his international assignments have included COO at Yoigo Spain, Head of Transformation at Salt Switzerland, and Head of Digital Enablement at Veon Group. For more than 25 years, he has worked to drive change through a combination of technology, organization, and culture.
Podcast Credits:
Executive Producer and Host: Danielle Rios, TelcoDR

Senior Producer: Lindsay Grubb, TillCo Media

Senior Editor/Brand Manager: Alisa Jenkins, Springboard Marketing

Audio Editor: Andrew Condell

Supervising Producer: Amanda Avery

Associate Producer: Kriselda Dionisio

Music: Dyami Wilson
19 min

About Telco in 20

From the publisher's feed

Over the next 20 years, the telco industry will radically change as we move the entire IT estate to the public cloud to use AI. Are you ready? Telco in 20 helps telecom execs drive transformative…