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The Antioch Podcast
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- Episode 41: Eric Nykamp – “Vacation, Community and the Church.”I’m getting ready to leave to go on vacation. Probably some of you will also be planning some kind of trip over the summer where you won’t be at your home church. If you are fortunate enough, you might want to visit another church to see how they worship as a part of your trip. For my family, we try to visit other multiethnic churches when we are on the road . . . or in our case this year, overseas to visit my wife’s family in Hong Kong.So . . . whenever you visit another church, it is inevitable that we humans compare what we think is normal about our home church to whatever church we are visiting.So here are questions I ask about my own congregation at home, as well as the congregations I visit while traveling anywhere.1.) What ethnic groups make up the community around the church building?2.) What ethnic groups make up the congregation?3.) What ethnic groups make up the leadership in this church?4.) Whose ethnic songs are used in worship? (You could also examine cultural rules for timeliness, emotional expression etc.)5.) What can you learn from noticing the similarities and differences between these three groups of people?So let me start with my own home church. We are one church in three campuses, with each Madison Church campus in a different neighborhood.The original campus of Madison is in the Madison Square Neighborhood of Grand Rapids, a neighborhood with a predominantly African-American population and a sizeable Latinx population which is gradually becoming more and more of a presence here. There are very few white folks in the neighborhood, and nearly no Asian or Native Americans. The housing stock is from the early 20th century, built over what had previously been a shanty-town on the outskirts of Grand Rapids. Many of the homes show signs of neglect, though there are some noteworthy examples of restoration taking place as the area is seeing some recent re-investment.A couple of miles north on Madison Avenue is Madison’s Ford Campus, which meets in a Public Middle-School gym in a neighborhood that is nearly entirely African-American falling solidly within the former red-lined area of Grand Rapids. The housing stock is smaller homes from around the turn of the twentieth century, some in good repair, and some in a state of disrepair. However, it borders a neighborhood of historic homes which have been recognized for their historical value and saved from dereliction by a historic preservation committee. This neighborhood is home to many middle and upper-middle class white people who want to live near the revitalized downtown area. The difference in housing stock is striking in this neighborhood, and the two populations of the two neighborhoods rarely mingle.Miles away on the northern side of Grand Rapids is Madison’s 4-year-old North campus. Like the Ford campus, Madison North meets in a school gym. Unlike its two sibling congregations, Madison North lies far outside the former red-lined areas of Grand Rapids. It is not far from where a group of history-making African American families bought their own land and built their own houses during the Civil Rights era, as a way to escape the housing discrimination rampant in Grand Rapids at the time. The neighborhood Madison North calls home is a mix of post World War Two housing through the early 1970’s, with a number of low-income and apartment housing complexes throughout the neighborhoods. The area is predominantly white, but there are pockets within the neighborhood with higher-concentrations of African American people.This is what our neighborhoods are like, but it isn’t what the makeup of our congregations are like. None of our congregations represent the ethnic mixes of the neighborhoods where our church buildings are located. The closest may be Madison North, but that is mainly due to the larger white population in that area.However, at each campus, there is an intentional mix of ethnic leadership, with the Ford and Sq0 min
- Episode 40: We Talk Different – “Transformative Friendships.”My wife and I consider ourselves to be fortunate in life because we have been well-loved by numerous people who deeply impacted our lives. Most of us long for this kind of transformative connection with people. We are fortunate when we find people whom we can relate to, people we can be unapologetically ourselves with … Continue reading Episode 40: We Talk Different – “Transformative Friendships.”52 min
- Episode 40: We Talk Different – “Transformative Friendships.”My wife and I consider ourselves to be fortunate in life because we have been well-loved by numerous people who deeply impacted our lives. Most of us long for this kind of transformative connection with people. We are fortunate when we find people whom we can relate to, people we can be unapologetically ourselves with when we are together. This past Sunday I met with two college students who were tearful at having to say goodbye to the friends and relationships they had formed at our church now that they had graduated. The value of authentic friendships cannot be overstated.One of the joys of listening to podcasts is getting to hear the same people over and over again. The hosts and casts can become like friends we listen to every episode. As a podcaster myself, I spend a fair amount of time searching and listening to podcasts on race and religion. There are a handful out there, but some of my favorites are those where a cluster of friends switch on the microphone every so often and let us listeners listen in on the conversation they are having. Finding a multiethnic group of friends who talk about the things that make them different (and similar) is more of a challenge.So imagine my joy when I found the podcast “We Talk Different” a podcast that talks about race, religion, politics, gender and . . . basically everything! Three friends, all Christians, sit down weekly to talk about whatever is happening in the world at the moment they turn on the mic. They like to say that they don’t talk like everyone else. They talk different. And truthfully, ever since I came across this podcast, I’ve been wanting to talk with them! So, it was this podcaster’s dream to find a way to do this crossover episode with Ashley, Elijah and Ryan who make it a point of sharing their lives with all of us in podcast land from deep in the heart of Texas.I’m not going to drag out this prologue . . .Let’s wrap this up and listen to the cast of We Talk Different talk about their friendship, and how they learned how to talk together. And if you think this kind of crossover episode is fun, I’d love to hear your thoughts whether or not you would be interested in attending a live event some time where Christian podcasters who talk about race and religion get together maybe in 2019 or 2020. I’d like to gauge the level of interest in this, so leave comments on our Facebook and Twitter pages or send us an email at [email protected].Let’s go now and listen to this conversation.https://wetalkdifferent.comhttp://cdn.antiochpodcast.org/040.mp30 min
- Episode 39: Pastor John Eigege – “The Gospel of Gentrification.”According to recent statistics by CBS News, two zip codes in Houston’s third ward are among the top areas being affected by gentrification in 2018. https://www.cbsnews.com/news/does-gentrification-help-or-hurt-our-major-cities/ This is where we find today’s guest, a missionary from Nigeria to America, Pastor John Eigege. The gentrifying of Houston’s third ward is rapidly changing the neighborhood he has … Continue reading Episode 39: Pastor John Eigege – “The Gospel of Gentrification.”0 min
- Episode 38: Pastor Joy Bonnema & Matt Krieg – “Resurrection Matters for Healthy Sexuality.”This present moment in America will likely be remembered historically for the many social justice movements springing up in response to the societal ills presently plaguing this nation. Black Lives Matter arose in response to the numerous documented incidents of police violence against people of color. The recent March for Our Lives came about as … Continue reading Episode 38: Pastor Joy Bonnema & Matt Krieg – “Resurrection Matters for Healthy Sexuality.”1 hr 12 min
- Episode 38: Pastor Joy Bonnema & Matt Krieg – “Resurrection Matters for Healthy Sexuality.”This present moment in America will likely be remembered historically for the many social justice movements springing up in response to the societal ills presently plaguing this nation. Black Lives Matter arose in response to the numerous documented incidents of police violence against people of color. The recent March for Our Lives came about as teens respond to the ongoing plague of school shootings across the United States. The Women’s March, #TimesUp and the #MeToo movement have brought the culture of sexual harassment and abuse into the light, as brave women (and a few men) publicly disclose their stories of being raped and sexually abused by powerful men in the public eye.The #ChurchToo movement has also made it clear that these instances of abuse go far beyond the news headlines of the prior decades where there were scandalous accusation of priests abusing children under the cover of the Catholic church. No corner of the Christian world, it seems, is free from the stain of this sin. Likely, there are numerous stories yet to be told. As a therapist, I’ve heard many. Many churches have cultures where the stories of women are discredited, or where women are encouraged to stay in abusive situations. Other churches acknowledge the sin of sexual abuse, but emphasize forgiving the abuser more than seeking justice for the abused. Christians need to examine their hearts, church cultures, and church systems and make the needed changes in response to this cultural moment. And… there likely will be some people who will be swept up and falsely accused of sexual misconduct, but will be unable to document their innocence. These stories keep coming, and clearly the church in America is no different than the rest of society in having denied, ignored, or under-responded to allegations of sexual misconduct.This is nothing new. Both the Old and New Testaments are strewn with stories of sexual brokenness, though typically these stories are also “under-reported” in the pages of children’s story Bibles – the same place where the typical Christian adult’s Biblical literacy often ends. All Christians, those leading churches, and those in the pews, are affected. Fortunately, our God is neither surprised nor unequipped to help us address this most historical and still contemporary problem.Today’s episode comes to you from two prior guests of the Antioch Podcast: Pastor Joy Bonnema and Matt Krieg. This is a recording of a sermon they presented together at Madison Church’s North Campus entitled “Resurrection Matters for Healthy Sexuality.” This is an excellent example of how to talk about this most delicate of topics scripturally and directly, without running the risk of being graphic or overly descriptive. At a time when so many leaders are falling due to allegations of sexual abuse, this message is all the more timely.http://cdn.antiochpodcast.org/038.mp30 min
- Pastor Episode 38: Joy Bonnema & Matt Krieg – “Resurrection Matters for Healthy Sexuality.”
This present moment in America will likely be remembered historically for the many social justice movements springing up in response to the societal ills presently plaguing this nation. Black Lives Matter arose in response to the numerous documented incidents of police violence against people of color. The recent March for Our Lives came about as teens respond to the ongoing plague of school shootings across the United States. The Women’s March, #TimesUp and the #MeToo movement have brought the culture of sexual harassment and abuse into the light, as brave women (and a few men) publicly disclose their stories of being raped and sexually abused by powerful men in the public eye.
The #ChurchToo movement has also made it clear that these instances of abuse go far beyond the news headlines of the prior decades where there were scandalous accusation of priests abusing children under the cover of the Catholic church. No corner of the Christian world, it seems, is free from the stain of this sin. Likely, there are numerous stories yet to be told. As a therapist, I’ve heard many. Many churches have cultures where the stories of women are discredited, or where women are encouraged to stay in abusive situations. Other churches acknowledge the sin of sexual abuse, but emphasize forgiving the abuser more than seeking justice for the abused. Christians need to examine their hearts, church cultures, and church systems and make the needed changes in response to this cultural moment. And… there likely will be some people who will be swept up and falsely accused of sexual misconduct, but will be unable to document their innocence. These stories keep coming, and clearly the church in America is no different than the rest of society in having denied, ignored, or under-responded to allegations of sexual misconduct.
This is nothing new. Both the Old and New Testaments are strewn with stories of sexual brokenness, though typically these stories are also “under-reported” in the pages of children’s story Bibles – the same place where the typical Christian adult’s Biblical literacy often ends. All Christians, those leading churches, and those in the pews, are affected. Fortunately, our God is neither surprised nor unequipped to help us address this most historical and still contemporary problem.
Today’s episode comes to you from two prior guests of the Antioch Podcast: Pastor Joy Bonnema and Matt Krieg. This is a recording of a sermon they presented together at Madison Church’s North Campus entitled “Resurrection Matters for Healthy Sexuality.” This is an excellent example of how to talk about this most delicate of topics scripturally and directly, without running the risk of being graphic or overly descriptive. At a time when so many leaders are falling due to allegations of sexual abuse, this message is all the more timely.
http://cdn.antiochpodcast.org/038.mp30 min - Episode 37: Retonia Brashier – “A Journey of Awakening.”I joined my multiethnic church in 1990 at the invitation of my high-school art teacher. As an angst- filled teen, she told me that her church was a “good place for hurting people.” As a result, I found a lot of healing, in particular from being mentored by a number of African-American worship leaders whose … Continue reading Episode 37: Retonia Brashier – “A Journey of Awakening.”47 min
- Episode 37: Retonia Brashier – “A Journey of Awakening.”I joined my multiethnic church in 1990 at the invitation of my high-school art teacher. As an angst- filled teen, she told me that her church was a “good place for hurting people.” As a result, I found a lot of healing, in particular from being mentored by a number of African-American worship leaders whose transparency and music helped me discover a music that spoke truth with a level of emotion that underscored the power of the lyrics which words on a page could not achieve alone. For me as a white person, being invited to discover the gospel music tradition which married profound scriptural truth with palpable delivery gave me a place in which to pour out my heart to a God who gave me hope while walking with me when I didn’t know if I could take one more step. Being part of a multiethnic congregation helped me find healing.But this isn’t the case for everyone. In the 1990’s through the turn of the millennium, the phrases “celebrating diversity” an “racial-reconciliation” became familiar terms in larger, white churches, popularized by mass movements such as Promise Keepers which touted cross-racial friendships as a goal for the faithful. I recall reading the 2005 Christianity Today article entitled “All Churches Should Be Multiracial” and thinking to myself (with a twist of pride) that my church were a little ahead of the curve on this issue as we had been a multiethnic congregation since the 1970’s. But the images of racial harmony in multiethnic churches began to be tested in the second decade of the 21st century. In 2012, Trayvon Martin was shot while walking through a neighborhood while eating candy and wearing a hooded sweatshirt by someone who thought he looked suspicious. While not an isolated case, the drumbeat of racial injustice arose again in 2014 with protests erupting in the Ferguson neighborhood of St. Louis, Missouri following the police shooting of Michael Brown. The shootings of black and brown people by the police were frequently on the news and social media, leading the rise of the Black Lives Matter movement. Questions of racism and injustice were in the news and a topic of regular discussion for all Americans, including those in multiethnic churches.In 2016, 81% of white Evangelicals voted for Donald Trump, a candidate who regularly espoused policies and used language which at best could be considered racially insensitive, and at worst publicly affirmed the similar expressions of overtly racist organizations. Following the 2016 election and accelerating after the 2017 white nationalist rally in Charlottesville, Virginia, many of evangelical megachurches which touted multiracial harmony a decade earlier now began to see the ranks of the people of color in their congregation thin. This was expertly expressed in the 2018 article in the New York Times titled “ A Quiet Exodus: Why Black Worshipers Are Leaving White Evangelical Churches”.Retonia Brasier is one such person. I got to know Retonia in a private facebook group for Christians passionate about antiracism and Christianity. After eventually deciding to connect by phone, and hearing her story, I asked Retonia if she would be willing to share her story on the podcast.We are intentionally keeping the identity of her now former church private, because this is not a story being told to “get back” at any people or institution in particular. Because this story has resonance around the country, Retonia is sharing her story as an example of how multiethnic churches who are unwilling or do not know how to talk about racism actually harm people in the church by allowing the sin of racism rooted in white supremacy to remain intact. This exodus of people of color from predominantly white churches is happening all over the United States as there is a reawakening among many people that the church, that God cares not just about saving us from our individual sin, but also to rid the world of the systemic sins of society at large.Let’s go now and he0 min
- Episode 37: Retonia Brashier – “A Journey of Awakening.”I joined my multiethnic church in 1990 at the invitation of my high-school art teacher. As an angst- filled teen, she told me that her church was a “good place for hurting people.” As a result, I found a lot of healing, in particular from being mentored by a number of African-American worship leaders whose transparency and music helped me discover a music that spoke truth with a level of emotion that underscored the power of the lyrics which words on a page could not achieve alone. For me as a white person, being invited to discover the gospel music tradition which married profound scriptural truth with palpable delivery gave me a place in which to pour out my heart to a God who gave me hope while walking with me when I didn’t know if I could take one more step. Being part of a multiethnic congregation helped me find healing.But this isn’t the case for everyone. In the 1990’s through the turn of the millennium, the phrases “celebrating diversity” an “racial-reconciliation” became familiar terms in larger, white churches, popularized by mass movements such as Promise Keepers which touted cross-racial friendships as a goal for the faithful. I recall reading the 2005 Christianity Today article entitled “All Churches Should Be Multiracial” and thinking to myself (with a twist of pride) that my church were a little ahead of the curve on this issue as we had been a multiethnic congregation since the 1970’s. But the images of racial harmony in multiethnic churches began to be tested in the second decade of the 21st century. In 2012, Trayvon Martin was shot while walking through a neighborhood while eating candy and wearing a hooded sweatshirt by someone who thought he looked suspicious. While not an isolated case, the drumbeat of racial injustice arose again in 2014 with protests erupting in the Ferguson neighborhood of St. Louis, Missouri following the police shooting of Michael Brown. The shootings of black and brown people by the police were frequently on the news and social media, leading the rise of the Black Lives Matter movement. Questions of racism and injustice were in the news and a topic of regular discussion for all Americans, including those in multiethnic churches.In 2016, 81% of white Evangelicals voted for Donald Trump, a candidate who regularly espoused policies and used language which at best could be considered racially insensitive, and at worst publicly affirmed the similar expressions of overtly racist organizations. Following the 2016 election and accelerating after the 2017 white nationalist rally in Charlottesville, Virginia, many of evangelical megachurches which touted multiracial harmony a decade earlier now began to see the ranks of the people of color in their congregation thin. This was expertly expressed in the 2018 article in the New York Times titled “ A Quiet Exodus: Why Black Worshipers Are Leaving White Evangelical Churches”.Retonia Brasier is one such person. I got to know Retonia in a private facebook group for Christians passionate about antiracism and Christianity. After eventually deciding to connect by phone, and hearing her story, I asked Retonia if she would be willing to share her story on the podcast.We are intentionally keeping the identity of her now former church private, because this is not a story being told to “get back” at any people or institution in particular. Because this story has resonance around the country, Retonia is sharing her story as an example of how multiethnic churches who are unwilling or do not know how to talk about racism actually harm people in the church by allowing the sin of racism rooted in white supremacy to remain intact. This exodus of people of color from predominantly white churches is happening all over the United States as there is a reawakening among many people that the church, that God cares not just about saving us from our individual sin, but also to rid the world of the systemic sins of society at large.Let’s go now and he0 min
About The Antioch Podcast
From the publisher's feed
The Antioch Podcast is a weekly recorded conversation among a multiracial team of Christian antiracism educators and friends. Biblical Antiracism is the starting point for all these conversations,…
which inevitably includes a healthy dose of laughter, thoughtfulness, vulnerability and theology.
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