What’s really happening in craft beer right now?

In this episode of The Craft Equation Podcast, we sit down with Bart Watson (President & CEO of the Brewers Association) to break down the realities facing the beer industry—from slowing demand and changing consumer habits to rising costs, distribution challenges, and the future of craft.

If you’re a brewer, industry professional, or just someone who loves great beer, this conversation pulls back the curtain on what’s actually driving the headlines—and what comes next.

🍻 What We Cover

Is craft beer actually declining… or just maturing?

Why there are more craft drinkers than ever—but they’re drinking less

The real impact of inflation, competition, and shifting consumer behavior

Why “local + authentic” still matters more than ever

Diversification: seltzers, NA, and beyond—how far is too far?

Taprooms vs. distribution: where breweries should focus

The biggest challenges brewers face right now

What a “healthy” craft beer industry looks like in 5 years

Advice for anyone starting a brewery today

⏱️ Timestamps

00:00 Intro

00:15 Welcome + Guest Intro (Bart Watson)

01:24 State of the Craft Beer Industry

03:16 Supply vs. Demand Explained

04:03 Decline vs. “Maturation”

04:57 Is There Future Growth Ahead?

06:17 Craft Beer Identity Crisis

09:51 Diversification & Innovation

12:28 How Far Is Too Far?

12:58 What Counts as “Craft”? (BA Perspective)

16:49 Are People Drinking Less?

18:22 Economic vs. Cultural Shifts

21:03 Pricing Pressure & Margin Challenges

22:09 Competition from Other Beverages

24:07 Is the Pie Shrinking?

25:22 What Consumers Actually Want

27:46 Biggest Challenges for Breweries

30:02 Margin vs. Volume Problems

31:23 Taprooms vs. Distribution Strategy

34:27 Policy & Regulatory Changes

36:27 What a Healthy Industry Looks Like

37:59 Starting a Brewery Today (Advice)

41:12 Staying Focused in a Tough Market

42:35 Outro

🔎 About Bart Watson

Bart Watson is the President & CEO of the Brewers Association, the leading trade organization representing small and independent American craft brewers. Previously the organization’s Chief Economist, Bart is one of the most trusted voices on craft beer trends, data, and industry insights.

🎙️ About The Craft Equation

The Craft Equation Podcast explores the intersection of craft brewing, business, and culture—featuring conversations with brewers, industry leaders, and innovators shaping the future of beer.

🔗 Links & Resources

🌐 Mother Earth Brew Co

https://www.motherearthbrewco.com/

📸 Instagram

https://www.instagram.com/motherearthbrewco/

📘 Facebook

https://www.facebook.com/motherearthbrewco/

🐦 X (Twitter)

https://twitter.com/motherearthbrco

🎥 YouTube

https://www.youtube.com/@MotherEarthBrewCo

🎙️ Apple Podcasts

https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-craft-equation/id1833372541

🎧 Spotify

https://open.spotify.com/show/4etLT56CD8uMjlPaRfaVGh?si=891ae07791814923

🍺 Brewers Association

https://www.brewersassociation.org/

📊 Bart Watson (BA Economist Insights)

https://www.brewersassociation.org/author/bwatson/

In Part 2 of The Craft Equation, we dive deep into the real science behind hazy IPAs — not just what they look like, but what physically and chemically makes haze form, stay suspended, and remain stable from tank to package.

Joined by Chris Baker, Director of Brewing Operations at Mother Earth Brew Co., we break down the technical side of haze formation: protein–polyphenol interactions, wheat and oat percentages, dextrin malts, yeast strain selection, and why heavy dry hopping plays a bigger role than most brewers think.

We also talk through the lessons we learned the hard way — early beers that cleared up, the “snow globe” effect, and the process changes that helped us dial in consistent, shelf-stable haze across our Project X Series.

You’ll learn about:

• Chill haze vs. permanent haze

• Protein + polyphenol chemistry

• Wheat, oats, and dextrins for mouthfeel and stability

• Hot side hopping vs. dry hopping strategy

• Fermentation dry hopping + biotransformation

• Yeast impact on haze (including Imperial A38 “Juice”)

• Finding agents, centrifuging, and packaging consistency

• Why some brewers still prefer West Coast IPAs

We crack open our latest Project X hazy and walk through the real-world process decisions that shape what ends up in your glass.

If you’re brewing hazy IPAs — or just want to understand what’s actually happening inside them — this one’s for you.

Timestamps:

00:00 Intro + cracking beers

01:00 Motor Skills hazy IPA + hop combo

02:00 What “haze” actually is

03:30 Protein–polyphenol chemistry explained

05:00 Wheat, yeast, and permanent haze

07:00 Early haze problems + “snow globe” effect

09:00 Hot side vs dry hop strategy

10:30 Yeast strain impact (A38 / Juice)

12:00 Recipe design: wheat, oats, dextrin malts

14:00 Dry hopping and biotransformation

16:00 Finding agents + centrifuging

18:00 Packaging + carbonation considerations

22:00 Why brewers debate hazy vs West Coast

27:00 Final thoughts 

Subscribe for more deep dives into craft brewing science, process, and business.

🎧 Don't forget to check out Part 1 in The Science of Haze where we discuss stylistic nuances of various hazy beers and the history of the style.

Watch / Listen to The Craft Equation on  ▶️ YouTube, 🎧 Spotify, 🍏 Apple, or wherever you get your podcasts 

Follow Mother Earth Brew Co. 👇

🌐 Website: https://www.motherearthbrewco.com

📸 Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/motherearthbrewco

📘 Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/MotherEarthBrewCo

🐦 X (Twitter): https://twitter.com/MotherEarthBrCo

About The Craft Equation

The Craft Equation explores the intersection of brewing science, business, and culture through conversations with industry professionals, brewers, creators, and thought leaders shaping the world of craft beer.

Health, Nutrition, and…Beer?! | The Craft Equation Podcast

Beer and health aren’t words you usually hear in the same sentence — especially during Dry January, when conversations around alcohol, moderation, and nutrition are everywhere. In this episode of The Craft Equation, we take a science-first look at how beer fits into modern discussions about health, mindful drinking, and balance. We’re joined by Dr. Charles Bamforth, one of the world’s most respected brewing scientists, to explore what’s actually in beer beyond alcohol and calories, how the body processes beer depending on dose and frequency, and why moderation matters from a biochemical standpoint.

We also dig into common myths around beer and weight gain, and discuss how Dry January, low-alcohol beer, and non-alcoholic beer are reshaping how people think about their relationship with alcohol. Rather than asking whether beer is “good” or “bad,” this episode focuses on context, chemistry, and nuance — grounded in evidence, not extremes.

In This Episode, We Cover:

What beer contains beyond alcohol and calories The role of fermentation, polyphenols, minerals, and yeast byproducts Why moderation matters chemically, not just culturally Dry January and changing attitudes toward alcohol Beer, weight management, and the origins of the “beer belly” myth How low-alcohol and non-alcoholic beers change the conversation Where beer fits in a balanced, modern lifestyle

About Our Guest: Professor Charles Bamforth is Professor Emeritus at the University of California, Davis, and one of the most influential voices in brewing science. He has authored numerous books and hundreds of scientific papers on beer quality, foam, flavor stability, and brewing chemistry, and has served as President of the Institute of Brewing and Distilling. His work has shaped how brewers and scientists around the world understand beer.

Watch / Listen to The Craft Equation

▶️ YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@motherearthbrewco

🎧 Podbean: https://motherearthbrewco.podbean.com

🍏 Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-craft-equation/id1833372541

Follow Mother Earth Brew Co.

🌐 Website: https://www.motherearthbrewco.com

📸 Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/motherearthbrewco

📘 Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/MotherEarthBrewCo

🐦 X (Twitter): https://twitter.com/MotherEarthBrCo

About The Craft Equation: The Craft Equation explores the science, business, and culture of craft beer through thoughtful conversations with brewers, scientists, and industry leaders shaping the future of beer.

Health, Nutrition, and…Beer?! | The Craft Equation Podcast

Beer and health aren’t words you usually hear in the same sentence — especially during Dry January, when conversations around alcohol, moderation, and nutrition are everywhere. In this episode of The Craft Equation, we take a science-first look at how beer fits into modern discussions about health, mindful drinking, and balance.

We’re joined by Dr. Charles Bamforth, one of the world’s most respected brewing scientists, to explore what’s actually in beer beyond alcohol and calories, how the body processes beer depending on dose and frequency, and why moderation matters from a biochemical standpoint. We also dig into common myths around beer and weight gain, and discuss how Dry January, low-alcohol beer, and non-alcoholic beer are reshaping how people think about their relationship with alcohol.

Rather than asking whether beer is “good” or “bad,” this episode focuses on context, chemistry, and nuance — grounded in evidence, not extremes.

In This Episode, We Cover:

What beer contains beyond alcohol and calories

The role of fermentation, polyphenols, minerals, and yeast byproducts

Why moderation matters chemically, not just culturally

Dry January and changing attitudes toward alcohol

Beer, weight management, and the origins of the “beer belly” myth

How low-alcohol and non-alcoholic beers change the conversation

Where beer fits in a balanced, modern lifestyle

About Our Guest

Professor Charles Bamforth is Professor Emeritus at the University of California, Davis, and one of the most influential voices in brewing science. He has authored numerous books and hundreds of scientific papers on beer quality, foam, flavor stability, and brewing chemistry, and has served as President of the Institute of Brewing and Distilling. His work has shaped how brewers and scientists around the world understand beer.

Watch / Listen to The Craft Equation

▶️ YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@motherearthbrewco

🎧 Podbean: https://motherearthbrewco.podbean.com

🍏 Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-craft-equation/id1833372541

Follow Mother Earth Brew Co.

🌐 Website: https://www.motherearthbrewco.com

📸 Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/motherearthbrewco

📘 Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/MotherEarthBrewCo

🐦 X (Twitter): https://twitter.com/MotherEarthBrCo

About The Craft Equation

The Craft Equation explores the science, business, and culture of craft beer through thoughtful conversations with brewers, scientists, and industry leaders shaping the future of beer.

Hazy beers have exploded in popularity over the last decade, but what actually makes a beer “hazy”? And why do drinkers associate haze with juiciness, softness, and modern IPA flavor?

In Part 1 of The Science of Haze, Mother Earth Brew Co.’s Director of Brewing Operations, Chris Baker, joins us to explore how haze-forward beers evolved, what defines them, and how consumers interpret what they see in the glass. We break down the stylistic differences between hazy IPAs, NEIPAs, juicy pale ales, and “unfiltered” beers, and discuss the sensory and psychological cues that drive the modern haze craze.

Whether you’re a brewer, beer enthusiast, or someone who loves learning how trends shape the craft beer industry, this episode is your guide to understanding haze from a style and flavor perspective.

In This Episode You’ll Learn:

-What separates hazy IPAs, NEIPAs, and juicy pale ales

-Why haze became a symbol of “juicy” hop flavor

-How appearance affects aroma and mouthfeel expectations

-Why some haze is intentional — and some isn’t

-How breweries balance haze, drinkability, and stability

🎧 Stay tuned for Part 2, where we dive into the brewing chemistry behind haze: proteins, polyphenols, yeast behavior, biotransformation, and how modern brewers engineer haze on purpose.

Watch / Listen to The Craft Equation on ▶️ YouTube, 🎧 Spotify, 🍏 Apple, or wherever you get your podcasts

Follow Mother Earth Brew Co.

🌐 Website: https://www.motherearthbrewco.com

📸 Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/motherearthbrewco

📘 Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/MotherEarthBrewCo

🐦 X (Twitter): https://twitter.com/MotherEarthBrCo

Learn more about our Hazy IPA at motherearthbrewco.com/project-x.

Search for our beer on our beer finder at motherearthbrewco.com/locator.

About The Craft Equation

The Craft Equation explores the intersection of brewing science, business, and culture through conversations with industry professionals, brewers, creators, and thought leaders shaping the world of craft beer.

Hazy beers changed the craft beer landscape almost overnight — but what is haze, stylistically speaking? And why do drinkers associate it so strongly with juiciness, softness, and modern hop character?

In Part 1 of The Science of Haze, Mother Earth Brew Co.’s Director of Brewing Operations, Chris Baker, joins the show to explore how hazy beers evolved, what defines them, and why consumers respond to them the way they do. We break down the differences between hazy IPAs, New England IPAs, juicy pale ales, and unfiltered beers, and unpack the visual and sensory cues that shape expectations long before the first sip.

This episode looks at haze through the lens of style and experience — how it looks, how it tastes, why it became a cultural symbol, and what breweries consider when designing a haze-forward beer.

The stylistic differences between hazy IPAs, NEIPAs, juicy pale ales, and “unfiltered” beers

How appearance influences flavor expectations

Why consumers perceive hazy beers as “softer” and “juicier”

The role of aroma, mouthfeel, and hop selection in haze-driven styles

How breweries balance aesthetics with drinkability and stability

🎧 Up next: Part 2, where we dig into the chemistry of haze — what causes it, how brewers control it, and the techniques shaping modern hazy beer production.

Ever wonder why your favorite brewery isn’t on every shelf or tap list? Maybe your'e a brewery looking to expand and don't know where to start. Distribution might be the toughest part of craft beer—and we’re breaking it down.

In this episode of The Craft Equation, we sit down with Kevin Hopkins, VP here at Mother Earth Brew Co., and Rich Collins, an industry veteran with stints at Stone Brewing, Maui Brewing, and Modern Times Beer. Together, they unpack the real challenges breweries face when trying to grow beyond their backyard—and why consumers often can’t find the beers they love everywhere.

Learn what goes into getting beer from the brewhouse to the bar, the shifting relationship between breweries and distributors, and how market trends, shelf space, and consumer habits are reshaping the business of beer.

What You’ll Learn in This Episode

✅ Why beer distribution is so complicated

Follow Mother Earth Brew Co.

🎧 Listen to The Craft Equation on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

Ever wonder why your favorite brewery isn’t on every shelf or tap list? Maybe your'e a brewery looking to expand and don't know where to start. Distribution might be the toughest part of craft beer—and we’re breaking it down.

In this episode of The Craft Equation, we sit down with Kevin Hopkins, VP here at Mother Earth Brew Co., and Rich Collins, an industry veteran with stints at Stone Brewing, Maui Brewing, and Modern Times Beer. Together, they unpack the real challenges breweries face when trying to grow beyond their backyard—and why consumers often can’t find the beers they love everywhere.

Learn what goes into getting beer from the brewhouse to the bar, the shifting relationship between breweries and distributors, and how market trends, shelf space, and consumer habits are reshaping the business of beer.

What You’ll Learn in This Episode

✅ Why beer distribution is so complicated

✅ What limits breweries from expanding into new markets

✅ How distributors decide which brands get priority

✅ The impact of shelf space, pricing, and logistics

✅ How a brewery looking to grow should target markets

✅ What smaller breweries can do to stand out

✅ What consumers can do to get their favorite brands seen

Follow Mother Earth Brew Co.

🌐 Website: https://www.motherearthbrewco.com

📸 Instagram: @motherearthbrewco

📘 Facebook: @MotherEarthBrewCo

🐦 Twitter/X: @MotherEarthBrCo

🎧 Listen to The Craft Equation on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

Why do alcohol laws look so different from state to state? And what exactly is a control state?

In this episode of The Craft Equation, we sit down with Jeremy Pisca, attorney, government affairs expert, and partner at Risch Pisca Law & Policy, to demystify the world of alcohol control states. From their origins after Prohibition to their impact on breweries, consumers, and legislation today, Jeremy helps us unpack one of the most influential—and often misunderstood—systems in the alcohol industry.

Whether you’re a craft brewer, industry insider, or just a curious beer fan, this conversation will give you a clearer picture of why these systems exist, how they work, and what the future may hold.

What You’ll Learn in This Episode:

✅ What control states are and why they were created

✅ How control states affect breweries large and small

✅ The consumer experience—price, variety, and access

✅ Common myths and misconceptions about control states

✅ How legislation continues to evolve in today’s market

✅ What the future of alcohol regulation could look like

Follow Mother Earth Brew Co.

🌐 Website: https://www.motherearthbrewco.com

📸 Instagram: @motherearthbrewco

📘 Facebook: @MotherEarthBrewCo

🐦 Twitter/X: @MotherEarthBrCo

🎧 Listen to The Craft Equation on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.