Last year, Renée DiResta joined us on an episode of the podcast to talk about her book, Invisible Rulers: The People Who Turn Lies Into Reality, all about the people who have crafted a massive fictional narrative about the state of social media and government's involvement in content moderation. Now that Jim Jordan is celebrating Google's recent letter about the Biden administration and spreading all sorts of false claims about what it says, Renée joins us again to talk about maddening irony and overall craziness of this narrative that just won't go away.

Last year's episode: https://www.techdirt.com/2024/07/09/techdirt-podcast-episode-397-the-people-who-turn-lies-into-reality/

Renée's book: https://www.reneediresta.com/books/

Our coverage of Google's letter: https://www.techdirt.com/2025/09/25/jim-jordan-celebrates-google-caving-to-his-pressure-in-letter-that-says-caving-to-government-pressure-is-wrong/