Nora Freeman Engstrom is a professor of law who says that in three-quarters of cases one or more of the parties lacks legal representation. Worse yet, often the litigants are involved in high-consequence civil cases where there is no right to a lawyer and costs are prohibitive. Some states are looking at alternatives including non-lawyer representation, curated legal help for low-income citizens, and even AI, as Engstrom tells host Russ Altman on this episode of Stanford Engineering's The Future of Everything podcast.

Have a question for Russ? Send it our way in writing or via voice memo, and it might be featured on an upcoming episode. Please introduce yourself, let us know where you're listening from, and share your question. You can send questions to [email protected].

Episode Reference Links:

• Stanford Profile: Nora Freeman Engstrom

Connect With Us:

• Episode Transcripts >>> The Future of Everything Website
• Connect with Russ >>> Threads / Bluesky / Mastodon
• Connect with School of Engineering >>> Twitter/X / Instagram / LinkedIn / Facebook

Chapters:

(00:00:00) Introduction

Russ Altman introduces guest Nora Freeman Engstrom, a professor of law at Stanford University.

(00:03:11) Path to Justice Work

Nora’s journey into legal ethics and justice reform.

(00:04:46) Misconceptions About Civil Court

How civil cases often involve one represented and one unrepresented party.

(00:08:40) Limits of Judicial Help

Why the U.S. adversarial system limits judicial involvement.

(00:10:40) Problems with Self-Help

The lack of reliable resources for people trying to represent themselves.

(00:13:41) The Cost of Legal Help

The high cost of representation and how legal aid is overwhelmed.

(00:15:20) A Missing Middle

How law lacks mid-level professionals to offer affordable legal help.

(00:17:41) Expanding Legal Access

Why law lacks mid-level roles and bans non-lawyer advice.

(00:22:22) New Models for Legal Support

The ways some states are testing trained non-lawyers to expand access.

(00:27:22) Legal Help in the Past

The history of legal access, including lawyers in banks and auto clubs.

(00:30:29) Legal Protectionism

How depression-era protectionism led to today’s lawyer-only model

(00:32:48) The Role of AI in Legal Access

The potential of AI for creating smarter legal tools for courts.

(00:35:52) Conclusion

Connect With Us:

Episode Transcripts >>> The Future of Everything Website

Connect with Russ >>> Threads / Bluesky / Mastodon

Connect with School of Engineering >>>Twitter/X / Instagram / LinkedIn / Facebook