Jay and Andrew begin with a deceptively simple question: what actually makes a company “lean”? Starting with a quote from Shigeo Shingo, they challenge the common misconception that lean is just Kanban, and explore the deeper reality that lean is less about specific tools and more about principles, tradeoffs, and context.

From there, Andrew shares a deep dive into labor tracking and ERP data, uncovering how much work was happening that never made it into cost calculations, and why “door-to-door” time matters more than overly segmented tracking. Jay pushes back with the tension every shop feels: data is only valuable if it leads to action, and too much friction in systems can break team buy-in entirely.

The episode then shifts into Andrew’s current challenge: producing tight-tolerance parts that his team can’t fully verify in-house. They take a candid look at outsourcing vs. vertical integration, the true cost of CMM capability, and the uncomfortable position of shipping parts you can’t independently validate. Jay talks about why he bought a CMM earlier than expected, what he regrets, and how fast feedback loops can change everything.