200,000 downloads. A tagline that finally made people “get it.” And a few hard lessons along the way.

In this episode of The Burnouts, co-founders Phoebe Gates and Sophia Kianni unpack the marketing experiments that helped Phia find traction—from trial reels and creator guides to AI-generated scripts and TikTok reach campaigns. They share what worked, what didn’t, and what they’re still learning about building a brand from scratch.

They also talk about the power of a clear metaphor (“Google Flights for fashion”), the pressure of launching on the same day as a major podcast appearance, and why community has been their most valuable asset.

Also: how Kris Jenner got involved...

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🔍 CHAPTERS

2:00 – Launching Phia the same day as Call Her Daddy

6:20 – Trial Reels: our low-cost growth engine

8:45 – Our best-performing hook

11:15 – TikTok flops, LinkedIn wins, and why Substack matters

13:10 – The hack to community-building

15:00 – How we use AI to write scripts that work

17:30 – The SEO agency mistake we won’t make again

19:10 – The "special sauce" in a marketing hire

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Sophia Kianni

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Subscribe to The Burnouts for exclusive conversations with today’s top founders and culture-shaping entrepreneurs. Hosted by former Stanford roommates turned startup co-founders, Phoebe Gates and Sophia Kianni, this isn’t just another founder podcast—it’s untold conversations and the unfiltered reality of what it takes to build your dream career in your 20s.

Guests include Paris Hilton, Chelsea Handler, Kris Jenner, Karlie Kloss, and more visionaries defining the brands—and blueprints—of our time. Whether you’re dreaming big or building now, these are the conversations that will show you how it’s done (and what no one else tells you).

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