The Master Integrator Podcast

David Ledermann is one of 3 certified Control4 dealers in all of Indonesia. He runs SGS Design and Integration from Seminyak in Bali, with a team of 15. He arrived from Switzerland 13 years ago for a hospitality job, ended up four hours into the middle of a national park managing a luxury resort, and started fixing the place using Raspberry Pis. One of those Raspberry Pis went on to run the resort’s phone system for the next eight years.

In this conversation we look at the reality of running a high-end integration business in Indonesia. $3000-4000 to certify every product, in every colour, every three to four years. Brands quietly leaving the market because the paperwork no longer justifies the volume. Service centres that don’t exist. Grey importers shifting containers around the official channels. Why most so-called integrators in Indonesia are actually just project managers stitching together a network of subcontractors. And the wider question for any Australian supplier looking north: is there a real opportunity here, and if so, what does it actually take to win.

David doesn’t pull punches on any of it. If you’ve ever wondered what the integration business looks like in a market most of us never think about, this is the episode.

What this episode covers

•  How a Swiss hospitality manager ended up as one of three certified Control4 dealers in Indonesia

•  Why importing premium product into Indonesia adds 20-30% to project cost before you even start

•  The certification regime that’s pushing niche brands out of the market

•  The education gap that runs from installer to architect to end user

•  Why so few proper integrators exist in Indonesia, and what counts as “proper” in the first place

•  The new in-country certification system that’s changed what’s possible for David’s team

•  What an Australian supplier needs to understand before going into Indonesia

•  Where the Indonesian market is heading over the next five years

About the guest

David Ledermann is the co-founder of SGS Design and Integration, based in Seminyak, Bali. The business is one of only three certified Control4 dealerships in Indonesia and serves the high-end residential and hospitality sectors. David is also THX, ISF and PVA certified. He runs a team of 15 and is one of the most outspoken voices on the realities of building an integration business in Southeast Asia.

Links

•  SGS Design and Integration: swissglobalsolutions.com

•  David on Instagram: @control4bali  ·  @swissglobalsolutions

•  Master Integrator: masterintegrator.com.au

Sponsors of this episode

ADI Global

ADI Global is one of Australia’s largest distributors of professional smart home, AV and security solutions. Through its partnership with Snap One, it gives integrators access to Control4, Wirepath and a deep bench of category-leading brands. Its new in-rack certification system is a genuine step forward for integrators working outside the major training hubs. ⁠adiglobal.com⁠

Sonance by Amber Technology

Sonance is the global benchmarkf or architectural audio, designed to disappear into the space and let the room do the talking. Distributed in Australia by Amber Technology, the range covers in-ceiling, in-wall, invisible and landscape series.⁠https://ambertech.com.au/brands/blaze-by-sonance⁠

Kolosseum

Kolosseum is a design and documentation partner for integrators who want their proposals and project documentation to match the quality of the work itself. From concept through to as-built drawings, the team handles the production layer so integrators can focus on the install. kolosseum.io

Connected Magazine

Connected Magazine is Australia’s longest-running publication for the smart home and AV integration industry. It covers product news, project case studies, business and design content for installers and specifiers across the country. connectedmag.com.au

Subscribe and follow

Apple Podcasts, Spotify, YouTube, and wherever you get your podcasts.

For this episode, Connected Magazine editor Sean Carroll takes the mic and puts Paul Skelton in the hot seat on his own show.

Paul covers a lot of ground: how the podcast went from a couple of hundred listeners to tens of thousands, and why the taboo topics are the ones drawing the crowd. Where the apprenticeship sits and the push to have it open to students by early next year. The 11 August census and why your occupation has to read ‘smart home technology integrator’, word for word. The state of insurance, and why being insured as an electrician means you are not insured at all. The Integrator Advantage Program and the discounts alreadylanding for members. Plus the road: weeks of back-to-back travel, an unexpected soft spot for Albury, and a genuine call for help.

If you have the time, the expertise, or just the willingness to put your hand up, particularly on the apprenticeship, this is the episode that tells you how. Visit masterintegrator.com.au.

Take action

• Census, 11 August. When you fill it out, your occupation must read ‘smart home technology integrator’. Those exact words. It is the single biggest thing you can do for the industry’s recognition this year.

• Put your hand up. Instructors, content reviewers, people who can run a single session or sit on a panel — the apprenticeship needs you. One hour counts. Get in touch at masterintegrator.com.au.
• Share it. If this episode gave you something, send it to one person in the industry who needs to hear it.

This episode’s sponsors

ADI Global

This episode of Master Integrator is brought to you by ADI Global, one of the industry’s leading distributors of security, audiovisual, and smart living products for professional integrators. With an extensive product range, expert technical support, and training programs built to develop real-world skills, ADI helps integrators specify with confidence and deliver with precision. It’s a trusted partner for integrators seeking depth of choice, reliable supply, and the backing to grow their business on every project.

https://www.adiglobal.com

Sonance Blaze by Amber Technology

This episode of Master Integrator is brought to you by Blaze by Sonance, delivering powerful, high-efficiency amplification engineered for modern commercial and residential systems. Designed for performance, reliability, and seamless integration, Blaze combines advanced DSP, flexible connectivity, and robust output to drive exceptional audio experiences. It’s a smart solution for integrators seeking precision control, scalability, and uncompromising sound in every installation.

https://ambertech.com.au/brands/blaze-by-sonance

Kolosseum

This episode of Master Integrator is brought to you by Kolosseum, an independent consultancy that produces construction-ready design documentation for technology integrators. Working entirely white-label and free of supplier relationships, Kolosseum resolves system architecture, control topology, and rack and cabling detail before a single cable is pulled. It’s a smart solution for integrators seeking rigorous, unambiguous documentation that protects project outcomes and lets installation teams execute with confidence.

https://kolosseum.io

Connected Magazine

This episode of Master Integrator is brought to you by Connected, the leading independent trade publication for the residential and commercial integration industry across Australia and New Zealand. Through its magazine, website, and ongoing industry coverage, Connected keeps integrators across the trends, products, and emerging opportunities shaping the profession. It’s an essential resource for integrators seeking unbiased, in-depth reporting and a trusted read on where the industry is heading.

https://connectedmag.com.au

Follow the show

Subscribe on YouTube, Spotify, or wherever you listen, and follow Master Integrator on LinkedIn.

www.masterintegrator.com.au

Most integration projects are built component by component. A screen here. A speaker there. A controller somewhere in the middle. And then, somewhere down the track, it stops working the way the client expected — and nobody can quite work out why.

Peter Milojkovic has spent his career thinking about why that happens. As Director of Zennio Australia and Tecport, he sits at the intersection of electrical, AV, and building automation — and he has a very clear view on what separates the projects that hold up from the ones that don't.

In this episode, we dig into systems thinking and human-centric design — two ideas that sound abstract until Peter makes them very concrete. We talk about what it actually looks like to design a system around the person who lives or works in it, why interoperability matters more than most integrators realise, and what the integrators who are thriving in 2026 have in common with the ones who are struggling.

This is a conversation for anyone who has ever finished a job and wondered if there was a better way to have approached it from the start.

WHAT WE COVER

• Why component-by-component thinking creates problems that only show up later — and what systems thinking actually fixes
• What human-centric design means in practice on a real project
• How to talk to a client about system design without losing them in two minutes
• Why interoperability is a commercial argument, not just a technical one
• What skills integrators already have that translate directly into more sophisticated system delivery
• Where Peter sees the integration industry heading — and what that means for the businesses operating in it today

ABOUT THE GUEST

Peter Milojkovic is the Director of Zennio Australia and Tecport. With deep experience spanning electrical, AV, and building automation, Peter works with integrators across Australia on system design, standards-based integration, and next-generation project delivery.

EPISODE SPONSORS

This episode of Master Integrator is brought to you by ADI Global, Sonance (distributed by Amber Technology), and Kolosseum.

This episode of Master Integrator is brought to you by Blaze by Sonance, delivering powerful, high-efficiency amplification engineered for modern commercial and residential systems. Designed for performance, reliability, and seamless integration, Blaze combines advanced DSP, flexible connectivity, and robust output to drive exceptional audio experiences. It’s a smart solution for integrators seeking precision control, scalability, and uncompromising sound in every installation.

⁠https://ambertech.com.au/brands/blaze-by-sonance⁠

LINKS & RESOURCES

• Zennio Australia — zennio.com.au
• Tecport — tecport.com.au
• Master Integrator — masterintegrator.com.au

Subscribe on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you listen

This episode is a special preview of the ADI A/NZ Expo and Training Tour 2026 — the region's largest multi-day training and technology event for professional integrators. In place of our usual single-guest format, Paul sits down with exhibitors from across the Tour to find out what they're bringing, who should stop by, and what conversations they're hoping to have on the floor.

Guests featured in this episode:

• ADI
• Control4
• Yeelight Pro & SmartLicht
• Chowmain Software
• CoolAutomation
• Sonos
• LEA Professional and SurgeX
• Thor Technologies
• Dendo Systems

Paul also appears in his capacity with CEDIA with updates on the apprenticeship program and the new Integrator Advantage Program, plus a special offer for new members who sign up on-site at the Expo. And if you've been thinking about coming on the podcast — the Tour is your chance to come and talk to Paul in person.

ADI Expo & Training Tour 2026 dates:

• Adelaide — 5–6 May | Crowne Plaza Adelaide
• Perth — 19–20 May | Residence on Langley Park
• Brisbane — 2–3 June | Brisbane Marriott Hotel
• Sydney — 16–17 June | Four Points by Sheraton Sydney, Central Park
• Melbourne — 30 June–1 July | Melbourne Marriott Hotel Docklands
• Auckland — 21–22 July | Four Points by Sheraton Auckland

Expo entry is free. Training places are limited.

Register: https://bit.ly/ADIGlobalExpo-EventbriteCollection-Link

Training schedule: https://bit.ly/adiglobal-trainingschedule-email

This episode of Master Integrator is brought to you by Blaze by Sonance, delivering powerful, high-efficiency amplification engineered for modern commercial and residential systems. Designed for performance, reliability, and seamless integration, Blaze combines advanced DSP, flexible connectivity, and robust output to drive exceptional audio experiences. It’s a smart solution for integrators seeking precision control, scalability, and uncompromising sound in every installation.

https://ambertech.com.au/brands/blaze-by-sonance

More about ADI Global: https://bit.ly/adiglobal_apacThanks to our sponsors - ADI Global, Sonance by Amber Technology, Kolosseum, and Connected magazine.

What happens when an AV industry veteran watches a terminally ill child light up in front of a donated cinema system — and decides to do it again?

In this episode of Master Integrator, host Paul Skelton sits down with Ian Morrish — founder of Together for Cinema and the driving force behind the new GivingBack.Tech platform — for a conversation about purpose, industry generosity, and what happens when you point the skills of our trade at something that really matters.

Ian has spent 35 years in the AV industry — including long stints with CEDIA and the ISE show — and in 2009, he started something he didn't quite have a name for yet. Today, Together for Cinema has installed 58 fully donated cinema rooms across children's hospices, adult hospices, hospitalwards, and respite care centres in the UK, with a combined value of over £1.55 million. Every install. Every piece of gear. Donated. Every integrator. Volunteered.

Now Ian is turning his attention to GivingBack.Tech — a new platform designed to redirect second-hand, discontinued, and B-stock AV equipment from industry warehouses to registered charities and community interest companies across the UK. Launching to beneficiaries in May 2025, it's a simple idea with enormous potential, and it's already attracting support from some of the biggest names in the business.

This episode covers:

• How Together for Cinema started with one phone call and a donated 35,000-pound system
• The moment Ian knew he had to keep going — watching a little girl called Bethany watching SpongeBob SquarePants
• How CEDIA integrators across the UK became the backbone of every install
• What it's like emotionally to run an organisation operating inside children's hospices
• The launch of GivingBack.Tech and why our industry has a landfill problem worth solving
• Ian's succession plans for Together for Cinema — and why the mission will outlast him

 

Connect with Ian Morrish

• Together for Cinema: www.togetherforcinema.com
• GivingBack.Tech: www.givingback.tech

Ian is open to conversations with anyone in the industry who wants to get involved — in the UK or beyond. Reach out via the websites above or contact Master Integrator.

This Episode is Proudly Supported By

ADI Global Distribution

One of the world's leading distributors of security, AV, and low-voltage products. Trusted by integrators across Australia, New Zealand, and globally. Visit: www.adiglobal.com 

Sonance — Distributed by Amber Technology

This episode of Master Integrator is brought to you by Sonance, delivering high-performance architectural audio that blends seamlessly into the built environment. From discreet small-aperture speakers, ideal for timber ceilings, to completely invisible solutions, Sonance empowers integrators and designers to achieve exceptional sound while preserving the visual integrity of every space.

https://www.ambertech.com.au/sonance-small-aperture-seriesKolosseum

Specialists in high-performance home cinema, lighting and automation system design and documentation. Kolosseum partners with integrators to deliver world-class experiences for their clients. Visit: http://kolosseum.io

Connected Magazine

The essential publication for the connected home and building technology industry in Australia. Stay current with the people, products, and projects shaping our industry. Visit: www.connectedmag.com.au

Subscribe to Master Integrator wherever you get your podcasts. Follow Paul Skelton on LinkedIn for industry news, industry updates, and new episode announcements.

#MasterIntegrator #AVIndustry #TogetherForCinema#GivingBackTech #HomeAutomation #CustomInstall #AV

In this episode of Master Integrator, Paul Skelton is joined by Sarah Bradsell, Aftercare Manager at SMC, to explore how structured service and maintenance programs can transform integration businesses.

Sarah shares her journey from reception desk to leading a 12-person aftercare team, and explains why aftercare must be designed, resourced, and sold with the same intent as projects.

The conversation unpacks the realities of reactive vs proactive service, how to build service agreements that actually work, and why aftercare is fast becoming a competitive advantage for professional integrators.

Topics covered include:

• Why service is often undervalued in integration businesses
• Reactive vs proactive aftercare
• Building and pricing service contracts
• Remote support and monitoring as force multipliers
• Setting boundaries with clients
• Documentation and reporting discipline
• How aftercare drives upgrades and long-term revenue
• Why service needs dedicated people and systems
• Small steps integrators can take to get started

Guest: Sarah Bradsell – Aftercare Manager, SMC

Sponsors:

• ADI Global
• Sonance, distributed by Amber Technology
• Kolosseum
• Connected Magazine
• CEDIA

This episode of Master Integrator is brought to you by Sonance, delivering high-performance architectural audio that blends seamlessly into the built environment. From discreet small-aperture speakers, ideal for timber ceilings, to completely invisible solutions, Sonance empowers integrators and designers to achieve exceptional sound while preserving the visual integrity. ⁠https://www.ambertech.com.au/sonance-small-aperture-series⁠

Contact: [email protected]

In this episode of Master Integrator, Paul Skelton is joined by Leslie Shiner, a long-time financial management consultant to the CEDIA channel, to unpack the real financial pressures facing integration businesses.

Drawing on decades of experience, Leslie explains why many integrators struggle despite strong demand, how misunderstandings around margins, cash flow, and deposits quietly destroy businesses, and what owners can do to regain control.

This is a practical, unfiltered conversation about profit, pricing, estimating, labour, cash flow, and the mindset shifts required to build a business with longevity.

Topics covered include:

• Why “busy” often means underpriced

• The three ways to improve profitability — and the one to avoid

• Why customer deposits are liabilities, not income

• How one bad job can erase multiple good ones

• Margins vs markup (and why they’re often misunderstood)

• Estimating mistakes that cost real money

• Why jobs lose profit in the final 10–15 percent

• Delegation, boundaries, and lifestyle vs growth businesses

• Raising rates without losing clients

Sponsors:

ADI Global

Sonance, distributed by Amber Technology

Kolosseum

Connected

CEDIA

This episode of Master Integrator is brought to you by Sonance, delivering high-performance architectural audio that blends seamlessly into the built environment. From discreet small-aperture speakers, ideal for timber ceilings, to completely invisible solutions, Sonance empowers integrators and designers to achieve exceptional sound while preserving the visual integrity. https://www.ambertech.com.au/sonance-small-aperture-series

Contact:

[email protected]

In this episode of Master Integrator, Paul Skelton is joined by Amanda Wildman, integrator, business owner, and newly appointed Chair of CEDIA’s Global Board.

Amanda shares her personal journey into the integration industry, the challenges she faced building confidence and credibility, and the mentors who helped shape her path. She reflects on imposter syndrome, representation, and the realities of running a small integration business while volunteering at a global level.

The conversation also explores Amanda’s priorities as Chair, including education, certification, volunteer engagement, and ensuring CEDIA remains relevant and accessible across global markets — including Asia-Pacific.

This is an honest, human discussion about leadership rooted in service, not status.

Topics covered include:

• Entering the industry later in life

• Confidence, imposter syndrome, and asking questions

• Being a woman on job sites and in leadership roles

• The realities of small business ownership

• Volunteering and professional growth

• What the CEDIA Chair role actually involves

• Global representation and emerging markets

• Education, certification, and workforce development

• Why volunteers are CEDIA’s greatest asset

Guest:
Amanda Wildman – Chair, CEDIA Global Board | Owner, TruMedia

Sponsors:

• ADI Global - call 1800 990 548
• Kolosseum - http://kolosseum.io
• Connected Magazine - www.connectedmag.com.au
• CEDIA - http://cedia.org/join

Uni SC:To participate in the University of the Sunshine Coast's survey, visit https://tinyurl.com/ycy8cmxdContact:Email Master Integrator at [email protected], or visit www.masterintegrator.com.au

In this episode of Master Integrator, Paul Skelton is joined by Jeff Sonnleitner, cybersecurity educator and long-time CEDIA instructor, to unpack what cybersecurity really means for professional AV and smart home integrators.

Jeff explains why modern AV systems are increasingly targeted, how everyday smart devices create hidden entry points, and why integrators can no longer treat network security as someone else’s responsibility.

The conversation also explores the human side of cybersecurity, the rise of AI-driven threats, the importance of ongoing system maintenance, and how integrators can turn cybersecurity from a risk into a value-adding service.

Topics covered include:

• Why AV systems are attractive cyber targets

• Residential vs commercial cybersecurity risks

• The hidden danger of everyday smart devices

• Why hardwired systems still matter

• The human factor as the weakest link

• AI, automation, and emerging threats

• Cybersecurity as an ongoing service, not a one-off task

• Why education is now essential for integrators and clients

Guest:
Jeff Sonnleitner – Cybersecurity Educator, CEDIA Instructor

Sponsors:

• Kordz Australia
• Kolosseum
• Connected Magazine
• CEDIA

Contact:

[email protected]

In this episode of Master Integrator, Paul Skelton is joined by Adam Liddington from Smarta Automation & AV to discuss the current state of the New Zealand smart home and AV integration market.

As a newer entrant to the industry, Adam brings a fresh and grounded perspective on consumer confidence, market conditions, workforce challenges, and what integrators need to do to ensure long-term viability.

The conversation explores where the NZ market feels strong, where it’s under pressure, and how education, collaboration, and industry engagement can help move things forward.

Topics covered include:

• Entering the integration industry in New Zealand
• Consumer confidence and client behaviour
• Market drivers and soft spots
• Skills shortages and career pathways
• Education and apprenticeships
• What the NZ industry needs to do next
• Why newer voices matter

Guest: Adam Liddington – Smarta Automation & AV (New Zealand)

Sponsors:

Netvio, distributed by Kordz Australia - www.kordz.com.au

Integrated Systems Europe - http://iseurope.org

Kolosseum - http://kolosseum.io

Connected Magazine - www.connectedmad.com.au

CEDIA - www.cedia.org

Contact: [email protected]