The Next Reel Film Podcast

"Remember how devastated you were at first? So why get others to do the same?”

In 2008, 18 students at Gloucester High School in Gloucester, MA, all got pregnant. At the time, the principal said that there had been a pact between a number of the girls to all get pregnant together. The mayor later came out to say that there wasn’t a pact, and later some of the girls said there was a pact but it had been made after the pregnancies and more about helping each other raise their babies together.

The initial story about the pregnancy pact had gotten out into the world, however, and created quite a fervor because the concept of so many young teens making a life-altering decision like this in such an off-the-cuff way is so frightening. Some people wrote books, others made Lifetime movies. French writer/director sisters Delphine and Muriel Coulin adapted the concept into their feature film debut 17 Filles, or 17 Girls in English. Join us – Pete Wright and Andy Nelson – as we kick off our Tenth Anniversary series, celebrating films celebrating their 10th anniversaries as we celebrate our own – with Coulins’ 17 Filles, or 17 Girls. 

It’s a challenging film for each of us for different reasons, which makes for a lot to talk about with 17 Girls.

Pete didn’t like this movie. He didn’t like the characters. He found the story fairly boring. Andy liked the movie, but didn’t love it. He found more compelling elements in a few of the characters but certainly not all of them. He didn’t find it boring but understands how people could find it that way.

We mainly focus on Camille, the first of the girls to get pregnant, but she’s a challenging character to have as a protagonist. Is she more our antagonist? There is a moment early on when we get a sense of her life at home. Does that give us what we need to latch on to her and start feeling what she’s going through? Or do we need more?

How About the 17 Girls in 17 Girls?

What about #2? This speaks partly to our frustrations about the film – we’re assuming all 17 of the girls have names, but we aren’t given many of them in the film. But #2 gets pregnant just because she wants to be part of the in-crowd. Of all the stories, perhaps hers is the most tragic. But we’re not given much of her.

How about Clémentine? If any girls ends up getting more of our sympathy, surely it’s her. She’s desperate to stay a part of the club so does everything she can to get pregnant, even though her body is too small to handle a pregnancy. She runs away from home after fighting with her parents and her friends put her up in an abandoned trailer by the beach. It’s miserable. But do we end up garnering much sympathy for her?

This is the challenge of the film. It’s constructed more like a parable or fable, and we don’t find much to connect with the characters themselves. Is that a problem in context of this film? Or would it be fine if the story had more energy?

17 Girls is a slow-paced film.

We spend a lot of time with our group of pregnant girls together as well as alone. When they’re alone, they’re often sitting quietly at home looking scared, helpless, lost. When they’re together, they’re talking about all the great times they’ll have helping each other care for their children. If you can’t connect with these girls, it’s easy to feel bored. And that’s a big part of our conversation.

We also talk about the nature of the town of Lorient, France, where the story takes place. It feels like a dying town, and perhaps we’re meant to feel that the people here are dying as much as the town is and in a weird way, these girls may be trying to find a way to latch onto life. That also ties into the ladybugs we see in the film.

It’s an interesting film to kick off our new series with. Is it a fun film? No, but it provides a lot of points for discussion. Perhaps that’s all we needed right now, even if it’s not a film we’ll be returning to. Check it out (or not) then tune in to this week’s episode! The Next Reel – when the movie ends, our conversation begins!

Join the conversation with movie lovers from around the world on The Next Reel’s Discord channel!

Film Sundries

Learn more about supporting The Next Reel Film Podcast through your own membership — visit TruStory FM.

• Watch this on Apple or Amazon, or find other places at JustWatch
• Theatrical trailer
• Poster artwork
• Flickchart
• Letterboxd

Learn how to support our show and The Next Reel’s family of film podcasts by becoming a member. It's just $5 monthly or $55 annually. Learn more here.

Join the conversation with movie lovers from around the world in our Discord community!

Here’s where you can find us around the internet:

• The Web
• Letterboxd
• Facebook
• Instagram
• Threads
• X
• YouTube
• Flickchart
• Pinterest
• Pete 
• Andy

What are some other ways you can support us and show your love? Glad you asked!

• You can buy our movie-related apparel, stickers, mugs and more from our MERCH PAGE.
• Or buy or rent movies we’ve discussed on the show from our WATCH PAGE.
• Or buy books, plays, etc. that was the source for movies we’ve discussed on the show from our ORIGINALS PAGE.
• Or renew or sign up for a Letterboxd Pro or Patron account with our LETTERBOXD MEMBERSHIP DISCOUNT.
• Or sign up for AUDIBLE.

We’re done talking about the movies. Now let’s talk about the series.

We have come to the end of our Horror Debuts series, exploring six films and one extra as our September 2021 Member Bonus Episode. All told, we looked at Messiah of Evil, Goodnight Mommy, A Girl Walks Home Alone at Night, The Babadook, The Lure, Saint Maud, and Relic. Each director (or pair of directors as the case may be) brings a unique vision to their story, and perhaps the fact that they chose the horror genre as the place to start their feature film career is telling as it allows for a lot of play. So what did we – Pete Wright and Andy Nelson – think about not just the films but the series as a whole? How do these films stand up to other horror films of the past and of this last decade? Why these shifts in the types of horror films getting made? We dig in to horror films in general and these films specifically in our Horror Debuts Retake.

Here’s a hint at what we talk about.

How accurate were our original star ratings from when we had our initial conversations as compared to now? Pete found that Goodnight Mommy hasn’t held up over time and demoted it whereas Andy largely still connects with The Babadook the least. Relic tops both of our lists though.

Horror films have evolved over the years and decades. It’s great seeing so many strong female voices rising in the ranks as directors over the last few decades. We would’ve liked to have had more woman-directed horror debuts on this list but found few before the turn of the century. Messiah of Evil is a fun one to include, but even that was co-directed (and still had Gloria Katz uncredited for her role in directing, likely because of DGA policies).

But is there anything to the fact that these films have horror elements but aren’t straight-up horror films? Or that they’re incorporating metaphorical elements much more strongly than we’ve seen recently? Horror films have shifted each decade, so this tone definitely seems to fit the overall vibe of horror in the 2010s, but is any of that coming from the larger group of female directors?

We finally rank all of the films on Flickchart. It’s becoming more and more clear to us that our middle block is throwing too many films we really like into the bottom half. Regardless, it’s an interesting order that mostly reflects our positions on the films, even if not 100% accurate.

All in all, it was a thrilling series and a great addition to our 11th season. Next up – as a way to celebrate our tenth anniversary coming up on November 11th, we’re looking at 10 films that are also celebrating their Tenth Anniversaries! The Next Reel – when the movie ends, our conversation begins!

Join the conversation with movie lovers from around the world on The Next Reel’s Discord channel!

Film Sundries

• Original poster artwork
• Rank the Movies on Flickchart:
  Messiah of Evil
  Goodnight Mommy
  A Girl Walks Home Alone at Night
  The Babadook
  The Lure
  Saint Maud
  Relic
• The Series on Letterboxd

Listen to Each of the Episodes:
Messiah of Evil
Goodnight Mommy
A Girl Walks Home Alone at Night
The Babadook
The Lure
Saint Maud
Relic

This is a member bonus episode.

We'd love it if you became a member to support our show, but you’d love it because of everything you get. We have monthly member bonus episodes that only members can access. You also get monthly Flickchart re-ranking episodes, access to members-only Discord channels, and early releases for every episode. We have a special episode we release at the end of each series called Retake during which we break down our overall thoughts of the entire season. Plus, you get to vote on the movies we discuss in our members only episodes as well as the movie lists we discuss on the Saturday Matinée podcast! What can we say? It pays to be a member. Learn more about supporting The Next Reel Film Podcast through your own membership — visit TruStory FM.

“Meryl Streep is not in enough movies where she feeds on people with the mouth in her armpit.”

Who rules the roost in this month’s Flickchart Re-Ranking? Pete or Andy?

Pete and Andy are back for yet another cockfight, this time for our October Flickchart Re-Ranking for our wonderful members. Also, Andy challenges Pete to remember which series each movie was featured. Here’s a breakdown of the battles. Based on this list, what would you pick to win? And which one will win as we duke it out?

Here's the list of our rankings in this month's Flickchart Re-Ranking episode.

• Inception vs. The Fly
• Snatch. vs. Moon
• City Zero (Zerograd) vs. The Illusionist (2006)
• Sophie’s Choice vs. TimeCrimes
• Dr. Strangelove vs. Miller’s Crossing
• The Book of Eli vs. The Emigrants
• Il Postino (The Postman) vs. Force Majeure
• Compulsion vs. Network
• Star Trek V: The Final Frontier vs. The Town
• Defending Your Life vs. Rabid
• Fast Times at Ridgemont High vs. Day of the Locust
• Cloverfield vs. The Philadelphia Story
• Duck, You Sucker vs. Intacto
• Born on the Fourth of July vs. 2001: A Space Odyssey
• Lady Vengeance vs. Underworld: Evolution
• Interstellar vs. The Man With Two Brains
• Roma vs. Son of the Bride
• National Lampoon’s Vacation vs. Detour
• Dead Ringers vs. The Lonely Guy
• The Illusionist (2006) vs. Letters From Iwo Jima
• Silver Streak vs. Sophie’s Choice
• The Hurt Locker vs. Pennies From Heaven
• Drive vs. Alice Doesn’t Live Here Anymore

We also look at our top 5 and bottom 5.

Should we feel guilty about any of these or are we okay with where they are? What do you think?

So much blood in our re-rankings this month. Wanna look at our entire chart? Just click here to visit our Flickchart page!

"We don’t need anyone else.”

The release of Rose Glass’s 2019 film Saint Maud was cut short due to the pandemic. That being said, the film still garnered enough attention from festival play and the awards circuit to become a talking point in movie circles as the newest horror film worth seeing. Glass received a lot of the praise as a new director who clearly has a sense of vision and story with this, her debut feature. And the performances of both Morfydd Clark and Jennifer Ehle were discussed as true highlights. Join us – Pete Wright and Andy Nelson – as we wrap up our Horror Debuts series with Glass’s 2019 film Saint Maud.

We are a bit split on Saint Maud.

Despite the fact that the trailer for this was selected for a Saturday Matinée episode in December 2019, Pete didn’t remember watching it so had no idea what to expect when he started this movie. When the story shifted at its midway point, that disappointed him. The story in that first half engaged him so strongly that he was never able to really connect with the film after that point. Andy, on the other hand, remembered the trailer. While he didn’t feel the trailer changed his opinion of the film, he was able to move along with the shift in the story.

So does that matter? Or does it end up becoming a point in the story where you just have to go along with the shift? Some people seem to be able to go along with that better than others but there certainly is a contingent of people online who seemed to connect more to the first half of the story.

Despite our split, there's a lot to love about Saint Maud.

Outside of that, though, Glass has a sense of story clearly. We both firmly connected with Maud’s journey, particularly as it relates to her time with Amanda. Both Clark and Ehle are perfect in their parts. The exploration of obsession, possession, and mental breakdowns are handled well.

Glass crafted a difficult but affecting journey with Maud. We discuss the way she works through Maud’s descent into madness and religious fervor. Maud's self harm comes up. Maud also uses sex as a tool when she is trying to get out of her personal nadir before reconnecting with God.

Then there’s the conversation with Joy. If Joy had agreed to hang out, would all of this have gone away? Or would it have gotten there eventually? It’s hard to say but interesting to think about.

It’s a powerful film that didn’t affect us equally but is still a strong one worth looking at. So check it out then tune in. The Next Reel – when the movie ends, our conversation begins!

Join the conversation with movie lovers from around the world on The Next Reel’s Discord channel! Learn more about supporting The Next Reel Film Podcast through your own membership — visit TruStory FM.

Film Sundries

• Find out where you can watch this at JustWatch
• Theatrical trailer
• Poster artwork
• Flickchart
• Letterboxd

Learn how to support our show and The Next Reel’s family of film podcasts by becoming a member. It's just $5 monthly or $55 annually. Learn more here.

Join the conversation with movie lovers from around the world in our Discord community!

Here’s where you can find us around the internet:

• The Web
• Letterboxd
• Facebook
• Instagram
• Threads
• X
• YouTube
• Flickchart
• Pinterest
• Pete 
• Andy

What are some other ways you can support us and show your love? Glad you asked!

• You can buy our movie-related apparel, stickers, mugs and more from our MERCH PAGE.
• Or buy or rent movies we’ve discussed on the show from our WATCH PAGE.
• Or buy books, plays, etc. that was the source for movies we’ve discussed on the show from our ORIGINALS PAGE.
• Or renew or sign up for a Letterboxd Pro or Patron account with our LETTERBOXD MEMBERSHIP DISCOUNT.
• Or sign up for AUDIBLE.

“To me, you’ll always be a fish, an animal.”

There is clearly a coming of age story in Agnieszka Smoczynksa’s 2015 film The Lure, which is also a horror and a musical. And it’s likely that genre mashup that made it difficult for people to connect to the movie and why it did poorly at the box office. Smoczynska created a strong vision for her first film, though. Because of that, the film’s cult following is already growing not to mention people taking it seriously because of its placement in Criterion’s lineup of releases.

Join us – Pete Wright and Andy Nelson – for the fifth film in our Horror Debuts series as we join the dance party in Smoczynska’s 2015 film The Lure.

The Lure is pretty bonkers, but at a level that works well for both of us.

While the genre mashup may be difficult for some people to click with, it worked for us. Well, to that end, Andy feels more comfortable calling it a dark fairytale musical rather than a horror film. No matter how you slice it, though, it’s a fascinating film that metaphorically explores female coming-of-age and sexuality through a fairytale lens. There is a strong current of Hans Christian Anderson’s “The Little Mermaid” running through this film. The filmmakers have also imbued the mermaids with the darker elements from Homer’s “The Odyssey.”

Using horror films like The Lure to explore metaphorical issues

We’ve talked about horror as metaphor in both The Babadook and Relic. Horror has often been a way for storytellers to deal with issues in metaphorical ways. There’s something strong in this recent run of films we’ve discussed, though, that seems to make the metaphors very visual. It’s a wonderful genre to explore ideas like these. We love how recent filmmakers are pushing their stories forward so deliberately. Plus, they all have strong visual design and story structure that makes these films stand out. The Lure does have its share of story issues, particularly as it builds toward the climax in the third act, but the world is so unique and engaging that it’s easy to give it more of a pass.

But why does The Lure need to be in the 80s? Is it just because that’s when the director, writer, and musicians upon which the story is very loosely based spent their childhood? Do the metaphors work when trying to explore what they’re saying about Communist Poland in the 80s? On top of that, we also have a metaphor for immigrants moving to foreign lands to make better lives for themselves only to get trapped in the sex industry. So when is it too much?

Regardless, we still really enjoy The Lure. The performances are great, particularly from the three actresses playing the two mermaids and their mother figure in the band. We have a lot to talk about with this one so check the film out and tune in. The Next Reel – when the movie ends, our conversation begins!

Join the conversation with movie lovers from around the world on The Next Reel’s Discord channel!

Film Sundries

Learn more about supporting The Next Reel Film Podcast through your own membership — visit TruStory FM.

• Watch this on Amazon, or find other places at JustWatch
• Script Transcript
• Original theatrical trailer
• Original poster artwork
• Flickchart
• Letterboxd

Learn how to support our show and The Next Reel’s family of film podcasts by becoming a member. It's just $5 monthly or $55 annually. Learn more here.

Join the conversation with movie lovers from around the world in our Discord community!

Here’s where you can find us around the internet:

• The Web
• Letterboxd
• Facebook
• Instagram
• Threads
• X
• YouTube
• Flickchart
• Pinterest
• Pete 
• Andy

What are some other ways you can support us and show your love? Glad you asked!

• You can buy our movie-related apparel, stickers, mugs and more from our MERCH PAGE.
• Or buy or rent movies we’ve discussed on the show from our WATCH PAGE.
• Or buy books, plays, etc. that was the source for movies we’ve discussed on the show from our ORIGINALS PAGE.
• Or renew or sign up for a Letterboxd Pro or Patron account with our LETTERBOXD MEMBERSHIP DISCOUNT.
• Or sign up for AUDIBLE.

"It’s here. Under the bed.”

Relic delivers on the haunted house tropes.

There’s a tone and mood that often permeates horror films that give you a constant sense of dread and terror. Sometimes, it’s broken up with laughs or jump scares, but that’s clearly not what director/co-writer Natalie Erika James is looking for. Her debut film Relic generates this sense of dread and terror but maintains it throughout in a quiet way that for some keeps them on the edges of their seats but for others leaves them feeling bored. Which are we? Join us – Pete Wright and Andy Nelson – as we add to our Horror Debuts series this member bonus episode, James’ 2020 film Relic.

Relic is a quiet but moody metaphorical horror film.

There are shadowy spirits lurking in the corners of Edna’s house, but are they really there? The way James constructs the film creates wonderful tension as we just catch glimpses of something in the shadows. It’s really a blink-and-you-miss-it type of treat because they’re not highlighted by musical stings that hit you over the head. We love the way she builds tension through these techniques, and how she uses her location to great effect.

The cast is wonderful as well. Emily Mortimer, Robyn Nevin and Bella Heathcote play the three generations of this family and as the story progresses, we are right there with mother and daughter as they try to sort out what’s wrong with Gram. Their performances become more affecting as the story reveals itself to be about the family struggle with Alzheimer’s. It’s a powerful metaphor handled well and works because of the power in the three lead performances.

Relic is a quiet horror film but one that works exceptionally well for us. It’s likely not for everyone, particularly people who are looking for those jump scares in their horror, but we had a great time watching it and talking about it. Check it out then tune in! The Next Reel – when the movie ends, our conversation begins!

Join the conversation with movie lovers from around the world on The Next Reel’s Discord channel!

Film Sundries

Learn more about supporting The Next Reel Film Podcast through your own membership — visit TruStory FM.

• Watch this on Apple or Amazon, or find other places at JustWatch
• Theatrical trailer
• Poster artwork
• Flickchart
• Letterboxd
• Get your Relic T-Shirt!