The Pact

An exploration into Kelly Cochran's practice of avoidance, her list of trophies, and consistencies in her wildly varying stories, leads to some pretty solid conclusions about Kelly and Jason.

This is a Studio BOTH/AND production:
www.pactpodcast.com / www.bothand.fyi
For an ad-free experience or to support the show: www.patreon.com/studiobothand

Written, researched, edited, and produced by Josh Hallmark.
Research assistance by Becca Cline.
Music by William Hellfire, Sergey Cheremisinov, Lee Rosevere, and Radical Face.

Josh deep-dives the lists of Kelly's and Jason's alleged 32 victims, with some shocking revelations and a whole lot of WTF moments.
Next Episode: 28 June 2023

This is a Studio BOTH/AND production:
www.pactpodcast.com / www.bothand.fyi
For an ad-free experience or to support the show: www.patreon.com/studiobothand

Written, researched, and produced by Josh Hallmark
Research assistance by Becca Cline and Michelle Kaszuba

Resources include: NAMUS, The Charley Project, boatman.com.

Music by William Hellfire, Chris Zabriskie, Sergey Cheremisinov, Lee Rosevere.

Kelly's lists of 32 alleged victims lead investigators to find some interesting evidence in Illinois and Minnesota. And Josh begins making sense of Kelly's lists (and lies).
Next Episode: 21 June 2023

This is a Studio BOTH/AND production:
www.pactpodcast.com / www.bothand.fyi
For an ad-free experience or to support the show: www.patreon.com/studiobothand

Research assistance by Becca Cline and Michelle Kaszuba.

Music by William Hellfire, Chris Zabriskie, Sergey Cheremisinov, Lee Rosevere, and Radical Face.

Kelly's brother, Colton, shares some revealing and shocking information with investigators. Kelly discusses her first three murders. And patterns begin to emerge.
Next Episode: 14 June 2023

This is a Studio BOTH/AND production:
www.pactpodcast.com / www.bothand.fyi
For an ad-free experience or to support the show: www.patreon.com/studiobothand

Research assistance by Becca Cline.

Music by William Hellfire, Whithe, Sergey Cheremisinov, Lee Rosevere, Kyle Preston, and Radical Face.

The Kelly Cochran case files arrive, opening a Pandora's Box of depravity. And during an encounter following Jason's death, Kelly shows Hobart police just how calculating and unhinged she truly is.
Next episode: 31 May 2023

This is a Studio BOTH/AND production:
www.pactpodcast.com / www.bothand.fyi
For an ad-free experience or to support the show: www.patreon.com/studiobothand

Research assistance by Becca Cline.

Music by William Hellfire, Whithe, Sergey Cheremisinov, Lee Rosevere, Radical Face, Ian Alex Mac, Stacxk, and Kevin MacLeod.

Josh goes inside the investigation into Kelly Cochran, revealing new information, new links, and a possible timeline. And the investigation itself raises some important questions about what authorities do and don't know.
Next episode: 24 May 2023

This is a Studio BOTH/AND production:
www.pactpodcast.com / www.bothand.fyi
For an ad-free experience or to support the show: www.patreon.com/studiobothand

Written, researched, edited, and produced by Josh Hallmark

Music by William Hellfire, Whithe, Sergey Cheremisinov, Lee Rosevere, Radical Face, The Inner Shore

If Laura Frizzo knows Kelly best, then Walt Ammerman probably knew Jason best. We get to know Jason through an interview with friend and eventual informant, Walt. Then we explore Kelly's Facebook and its odd parallels to her crimes, and an unsolved Indiana homicide and its odd parallels to Chris Regan's murder.

This is a Studio BOTH/AND production:
www.pactpodcast.com / www.bothand.fyi
For an ad-free experience or to support the show: www.patreon.com/studiobothand

Written, researched, edited, and produced by Josh Hallmark.

Music by William Hellfire, Whithe, Sergey Cheremisinov, Lee Rosevere, Radical Face, Kyle Preston, and LEVY.

She may be the only living person to truly know Kelly Cochran.
Laura Frizzo talks the Cochrans, David Thayer, the glass ceiling, and how this case has impacted her life.

This is a Studio BOTH/AND production:
www.pactpodcast.com / www.bothand.fyi
For an ad-free experience or to support the show: www.patreon.com/studiobothand

Written, researched, edited, and produced by Josh Hallmark.
Music by William Hellfire, Whithe, Sergey Cheremisinov, Stacxk, Lee Rosevere, Radical Face, Chris Zabriskie, LaBon

The investigation into Jason and Kelly Cochran's other crimes begins with a look into their time in Indiana; revealing some strange and shocking connections.

This is a Studio BOTH/AND production:
www.pactpodcast.com / www.bothand.fyi
For an ad-free experience or to support the show: www.patreon.com/studiobothand

Written, researched, edited, and produced by Josh Hallmark.
Music by William Hellfire, Whithe, Sergey Cheremisinov, Stacxk, Lee Rosevere, Radical Face, Kevin MacLeod, and Jenny Wilson.

Sources: NAMUS, The Charley Project, Where Monsters Hide: Sex, Murder, and Madness in the Midwest by M. William Phelps, The Iron Mountain Daily News, and The Iron County Reporter.

The trial of Kelly Cochran reveals shocking information about Kelly and Jason, discerns Kelly's truth from lies, and begins painting a clear picture of the Cochrans' killing spree. Plus, we take a closer look at Jason's manuscript.

This is a Studio BOTH/AND production:
www.pactpodcast.com / www.bothand.fyi
For an ad-free experience or to support the show: www.patreon.com/studiobothand

Written, researched, edited, and produced by Josh Hallmark.
Music by William Hellfire, Whithe, Sergey Cheremisinov, Chris Zabriskie, Stacxk, Lee Rosevere, Radical Face.
Sources: Where Monsters Hide: Sex, Murder, and Madness in the Midwest by M. William Phelps, The Iron Mountain Daily News, The Iron County Reporter, and Dead North.