The Sleep Edit

Today, we’re cutting through the noise to bring clarity to some common pediatric sleep myths that frequently confuse tired parents. Dr. Canapari and Arielle are tackling:

• Wake windows
• Sleep regressions
• Nap strikes
• Whether you should or should not wake a sleeping baby
• Teenage sleep myths

Notable Quotes:

• “Children are as unique in their sleep needs as they are in their personalities. It’s our job to guide, not dictate, their path to better sleep.” – Dr. Craig Canapari
• “The concept of wake windows has become a maze for parents. Let’s simplify and tailor sleep strategies to fit the child, not the other way around.” – Ariel Greenleaf
• “Initiating a bedtime routine early is key, but adjusting strategies as your child grows is equally important.” – Dr. Craig Canapari on establishing and evolving sleep routines.
• “Addressing sleep is not just about tonight’s rest; it’s about setting a foundation for healthy sleep habits that last a lifetime.” – Arielle Greenleaf

Time Stamps:

• 00:00 Introduction and Discussion on Naps
• 00:15 Debunking Sleep Myths and Discussing Wake Windows
• 08:44 Understanding Sleep Regressions
• 17:17 The Controversy of Nap Strikes
• 23:05 The Impact of Napping on Nighttime Sleep
• 23:39 The Role of Daycare in Children’s Sleep Patterns
• 25:35 Debunking Sleep Myths: Late Bedtimes and Desired Wake Times
• 38:22 The Controversy of Sleep Training
• 42:38 The Struggle of Teenagers with Early School Start Times
• 45:33 Closing Thoughts and Future Advocacy

Show notes

• Do wake windows really help babies and kids nap better?
• How to deal with a sleep regression
• Are sleep regressions real?
• Dealing with a nap strike
• FAQ and Tips for Sleep Regressions
• Sleep regressions in the NYT:
• Iglowstein article– on sleep needs and nap timing
• Study on driving in sleep deprived mothers: 
• Understanding sleep drive and the circadian clock in children
• Facebook groups raise cortisol in moms
• More help on napping

Questions or feedback? Email us here. We are collecting questions for future Q&A shows!

Video of show

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Transcript
4 sleep myths audio only
[00:00:00] Craig Canapari MD: Welcome to the Sleep Edit, a podcast devoted to helping tired kids and parents sleep better. We focus on actionable evidence-based sleep advice, so everyone in your home can sleep through the night. Now, a quick disclaimer, this podcast is for general informational purposes only and does not constitute the practice of medicine, nursing, or other professional healthcare services, including the giving of medical advice.
[00:00:27] No doctor patient relationship is formed. The use of this information and the materials linked to this podcast and any associated video content are at the user’s own risk. The content on the show is not intended to be a substitute for professional medical advice, diagnosis, or treatment. Users should not disregard or delay obtaining medical help for any medical condition they have.
[00:00:52] Or that their children may have, they should seek the assistance of their healthcare professionals for any such conditions. Nothing stated here [00:01:00] reflects the views of our employers or the employees of our guests. Enjoy the show.
[00:01:09] Arielle Greenleaf: Welcome back to the Sleep Edit our podcast where we talk about all things sleep in children. I am Dr. Craig Canapari. I’m a pediatric sleep doctor,
[00:01:19]
[00:01:19] and I’m Ariel Greenleaf, certified pediatric sleep consultant.
[00:01:23] Craig Canapari MD: Okay, So we thought it would be fun today to talk about, sleep myths, sleep pet peeves things that I think are in common circulation in the world of pediatric sleep and the information that parents get that we don’t think are either particularly useful or accurate.
[00:01:41] Ariel, I think on our list here, you put one of the things we’ve talked about at length wake windows
[00:01:47] Arielle Greenleaf: Yes
[00:01:47] Craig Canapari MD: wake windows are not a thing that are discussed in pediatric sleep doctor school, and we’ll get into the reasons for that. I had not even heard about these before a few years ago.
[00:01:56] And then I started researching and I saw that this was all over [00:02:00] the internet. And I don’t know if you want to take a pass at explaining what weak windows are Exactly.
[00:02:05] Arielle Greenleaf: Yeah.
[00:02:06] Wake windows are essentially age-based windows of time during which your child should be awake before they go back to sleep. So time between sleep periods during the day. Basically, it’s a system to determine when your baby or child is ready to go to sleep for a nap.
[00:02:27] Craig Canapari MD: Yeah, and it was interesting I think the idea behind wake windows is not a bad one, right? For lots of different reasons, parents struggle, especially in infants about the timing of naps. So any system that purports to tell you the ideal formula for when your child should nap seems like a great idea, but I would say the problem is. there’s really not a lot of evidence that these things are particularly predictable.
[00:02:57] Arielle Greenleaf: Sure, and I’m glad to [00:03:00] hear that on your end. It’s basically the same as what I experience, at least with the people that come to me even though there may not be a science, there’s no scientific background to it or there’s no medical background to it for easier babies or go with the flow babies, these formulas can work.
[00:03:18] But those aren’t the people that I’m seeing. Those aren’t the people that come to me and say, I’ve looked these up, I’ve tried them, it’s not working. Is my baby broken? Am I doing something wrong? And that’s where I have a problem with the idea of wake windows. the majority of the people who come to me and are struggling have found these wake windows by Googling or looking on social media and it’s just not working for them.
[00:03:41] And they feel like something’s wrong. And that’s where I start to get frustrated because it is wake windows are literally everywhere. You look as a parent, and you say, how do I get my baby to nap? Just use these wake windows And it can be very confusing and frustrating when it doesn’t work.
[00:03:58] Craig Canapari MD: Yeah. And I think [00:04:00] this is my main problem with it, right? There are parents will say, oh, wake windows really help me with my baby’s naps. I think the problem is i...

In this episode, we talk about the controversial method of 'Cry It Out' (CIO) or Extinction Sleep Training. This approach, often misunderstood and feared, can be a quick and efficient method to improve a child's sleep. We go deep on the criteria for its successful implementation, discussing age-appropriateness, parental consistency, and prioritizing safety and health. We also cover that the method is not suitable for all children or families, and alternative methods like bedtime fading and pick up/put down are also considered. Finally, we cover importance of sleep training for both children and parents to improve the overall family dynamic. (Full transcript and a video are available here). 

Here are the three key take-aways from the episode:

Be open to trying different sleep training methods - What works well for one child's temperament may not work for another. Give a new method 3-5 nights before deciding if it's effective.

"Gentle" is not always better - Sitting in the room while ignoring crying (camping out) can actually prolong upset in some young babies. More separation may help them learn to self-soothe faster.

Cry it out is generally safe when done responsively - Research shows no long term emotional harm. But if excessive crying persists beyond expectations, reevaluate and adjust. Be responsive to your baby's needs.

• 00:00 Introduction to the Sleep Edit
• 00:03 Discussing Cry It Out (CIO) Method
• 00:09 Introducing Arielle Greenleaf
• 01:08 The Controversy Around Sleep Training
• 02:56 Understanding Different Sleep Training Techniques
• 03:43 The Importance of Sleep for Children and Parents
• 04:02 Defining Sleep Training Terms
• 09:21 The Impact of Parenting Styles on Sleep Training
• 09:27 The Role of Attachment Theory in Sleep Training
• 17:03 The Effectiveness of Extinction Sleep Training
• 24:46 Sleep Training in the Era of Room Sharing
• 28:14 The Power of Parental Presence
• 29:12 Understanding the Importance of Age-Appropriate Schedules
• 29:56 The Role of Routine in Sleep Training
• 30:58 The Challenges of Nap Time
• 31:40 Who is Extinction Sleep Training For?
• 33:35 The Importance of Consistency in Sleep Training
• 36:54 The First Year of Life: Sleep Expectations and Realities
• 39:22 The Pitfalls of Sleep Training Methods
• 42:59 The Role of Feeding in Sleep Training
• 45:56 Alternatives to Extinction Sleep Training

Links:

• How long will your baby cry during sleep training?
• How to CIO Sleep Train Your Baby
• Article in Time on why Dr. Sears’ contention about the dangers of crying are false
• Two articles on why sleep training doesn’t hurt your child
• Why you should room share but not bed share in infancy
• Modern family sleep training scene
• Youtube video link to episode 3

Questions or feedback? Email us here. We are collecting questions for future Q&A shows!

Assistant producer: Theodore Canapari

In part two of our discussion on helping kids sleep through the night, pediatric sleep expert Dr. Craig Canapari and sleep consultant Arielle Greenleaf tackle night wakings and feedings.  (You can find part 1 here, including a video of both episodes). They provide guidance on when night feeds may or may not be necessary, how to handle night nursing for comfort vs nutrition, and tips for transitioning toddlers away from nighttime calories.

- Only a small percentage of sleep issues are caused by medical problems. Most kids need some type of sleep training or behavioral intervention.

- Check with your pediatrician before dropping night feeds - make sure your child is getting enough calories during the day first. 

- Night nursing is about more than nutrition - it also provides comfort. Wean slowly if desired.

- Toddlers generally don't need extra calories at night. But there is little guidance given on transitioning from milk feeds to solids at this age.

"I always like to say I am not, if a sleep consultant starts working with someone and says, without any digging, we're going to eliminate all feedings overnight really fast, we're just gonna take 'em all away, run for your life." - Arielle Greenleaf

"Honestly, a normally growing child over a year of age doesn't really need those calories at night. And if you find that you are meaning to give milk or anything else during the night you, I give you permission to cut it out and you may want to wean it slowly." - Dr. Craig Canapari

Subscribe & Follow:

Don't forget to subscribe to "The Sleep Edit" podcast and follow Dr. Canapari and Arielle Greenleaf on social media for more great sleep advice!

In part two of our discussion on helping kids sleep through the night, pediatric sleep expert Dr. Craig Canapari and sleep consultant Arielle Greenleaf tackle night wakings and feedings.  (You can find part 1 here, including a video of both episodes). They provide guidance on when night feeds may or may not be necessary, how to handle night nursing for comfort vs nutrition, and tips for transitioning toddlers away from nighttime calories.

Key Takeaways:

– Only a small percentage of sleep issues are caused by medical problems. Most kids need some type of sleep training or behavioral intervention.

– Check with your pediatrician before dropping night feeds – make sure your child is getting enough calories during the day first. 

– Night nursing is about more than nutrition – it also provides comfort. Wean slowly if desired.

– Toddlers generally don’t need extra calories at night. But there is little guidance given on transitioning from milk feeds to solids at this age.

Notable Quotes:

“I always like to say I am not, if a sleep consultant starts working with someone and says, without any digging, we’re going to eliminate all feedings overnight really fast, we’re just gonna take ’em all away, run for your life.” – Arielle Greenleaf

“Honestly, a normally growing child over a year of age doesn’t really need those calories at night. And if you find that you are meaning to give milk or anything else during the night you, I give you permission to cut it out and you may want to wean it slowly.” – Dr. Craig Canapari

Subscribe & Follow:

Don’t forget to subscribe to “The Sleep Edit” podcast and follow Dr. Canapari and Arielle Greenleaf on social media for more great sleep advice!

• 00:02 Introduction and Disclaimer
• 01:18 Understanding Sleep Disorders in Children
• 02:03 Medical Problems and Behavioral Interventions
• 05:14 The Role of Bedtime and Nighttime Awakening
• 05:18 Feeding and Sleep Patterns
• 13:44 Adjustment Issues and Sleep Disruptions
• 18:02 Addressing Nighttime Fears
• 20:24 Imagining Bedtime Stories
• 20:41 Addressing Children’s Fears
• 21:13 The Huggy Puppy Intervention
• 21:55 Dealing with Trauma and Sleep Difficulties
• 23:18 Environmental Causes of Nighttime Awakening
• 24:44 The Impact of Light and Shadows
• 25:14 The Creepy Doll Story
• 25:53 Technology and Sleep
• 26:40 Sensory Disorders and Sleep
• 27:54 Too Much Time in Bed Syndrome
• 36:14 The Importance of Independent Sleep
• 38:28 Closing Thoughts and Contact Information

Questions or feedback? Email us here. We are collecting questions for future Q&A shows!

Links:

• Huggy puppy intervention for night time fears
• Brett Kuhn Ph.D
• Why is your toddler waking up at night
• How much sleep does your child need at night?
• How to address night feedings

Transcript
Copy of Audio sleep throught the night part 2
[00:00:00] Craig Canapari MD: Welcome to the Sleep Edit, a podcast devoted to helping tired kids and parents sleep better. We focus on actionable evidence-based sleep advice, so everyone in your home can sleep through the night. Now, a quick disclaimer, this podcast is for general informational purposes only and does not constitute the practice of medicine, nursing, or other professional healthcare services, including the giving of medical advice.
[00:00:27] No doctor patient relationship is formed. The use of this information and the materials linked to this podcast and any associated video content are at the user’s own risk. The content on the show is not intended to be a substitute for professional medical advice, diagnosis, or treatment. Users should not disregard or delay obtaining medical help for any medical condition they have.
[00:00:52] Or that their children may have, they should seek the assistance of their healthcare professionals for any such conditions. Nothing stated here [00:01:00] reflects the views of our employers or the employees of our guests. Enjoy the show.
[00:01:09]
[00:01:09] Craig Canapari MD: Welcome back to the sleep edit. I’m Dr. Canapari. I’m a pediatric sleep expert and author. This is the second part of. The episode with never really Greenleaf, my friend, and the very wise sleep consultant. About the important topic of how to get your child to sleep through the night. The first episode, we discussed the definition of sleeping through the night and what you expect at different ages, sleep onset association disorder, which is the problem that we are generally trying to treat with any sort of behavioral sleep intervention. How having the wrong bedtime can wake your baby up during the night. And medical problems that wake your child up. During the night. So, if you haven’t heard that episode yet, I suggest you go back and listen to that, one first, before continuing with this episode.[00:02:00]
[00:02:03] Arielle Greenleaf: Well, Craig, I have a question for you. What percentage of children have actual medical problems, and then what percentage of normally developing healthy children have need some sort of a behavioral intervention
[00:02:25] Craig Canapari MD: The first one was what percentage of children presenting have actual medical problems? And it’s a really good question, right? Because I could tell you like 1- 3% of children will have sleep apnea, right?
[00:02:38] If they’re obese and they snore, it’s closer to 50%. All comers like presenting to the sleep lab, I’m not sure if anyone has those numbers. But what we see in the, in sleep world is a lot of these problems are multifactorial. And that’s just a fancy way of saying there’s actually more than one cause.
[00:02:54] In medicine we love Occam’s Razor. We’re like, it’s the most which is just stating that simplest single [00:03:00] explanation is the cause of what’s going on. Butnever reallyally as one of my mentors used to say, the patient can have as many problems as they damn well please. So don’t get hung up on that.
[00:03:10] There has to be just one explanation though often, usually there is most children are pretty healthy and, sorry, what was the second part of your
[00:03:17] Arielle Greenleaf: I guess the second part of my question is. There’s there, having been in this industry for almost a decade and seeing such a rise in the industry and a need for sleep support, behavioral, non-medical, I’m wondering what percentage of the average developing child in the United States needs some sort of what, or maybe it’s the parents, maybe the question is, do you think it would be beneficial for parents to have more of an understanding of how to handle sleep to avoid things spiraling out of control?
[00:03:59] [00:04:00] Because I feel like there’s a surge in the need for behavioral sleep specialists like myself.
[00:04:08] I would agree, and there’s a lot of different studies that have looked at this but I’ve seen anywhere between 20 and 50% of parents being concerned enough to tal...

Night time awakenings are THE most common reason that parents bring their child to a sleep physician or consultant. Dr. Craig Canapari and expert sleep consultant Arielle Greenleaf join forces to give advice on the most common reasons that kids wake up at night. The first step to getting your child to sleep through the night is understanding why they are waking up. They address the concept of sleep regressions, the impact of medical conditions such as asthma, acid reflux, and ear infections on sleep, and the importance of consulting a professional when these issues arise. Greenleaf discusses her own journey from a sleep-deprived mother to a pediatric sleep consultant, highlighting the valuable role of sleep consultants in helping families achieve better sleep. Canapari reminds listeners that the goal isn’t about achieving “perfect” sleep but about achieving sleep that enables everyone in the family to feel good and function well in the morning. (Note that this is such a big topic we split it in two-- here is part 2). 

• 00:00 Introduction and Disclaimer
• 01:06 Meet the Host and Guest
• 01:41 Arielle's Journey into Sleep Consultancy
• 03:15 The Impact of Nighttime Awakenings
• 05:37 Defining 'Sleeping Through the Night'
• 09:34 Understanding Nighttime Awakenings
• 09:49 Addressing Early Evening Awakenings
• 16:06 Understanding Sleep Cycles and Stages
• 18:35 The Importance of Independent Sleep
• 24:07 Understanding Your Child's Sleep Patterns
• 24:27 The Role of Sleep Consultants and Pediatricians
• 25:04 The Importance of Independent Sleep
• 26:21 The Misconceptions Around Sleep Training
• 28:06 The Impact of Developmental Milestones on Sleep
• 30:19 The Effects of Travel and Illness on Sleep
• 31:35 Addressing Nighttime Awakenings
• 37:11 The Role of Medical Issues in Sleep Disruptions
• 40:34 The Importance of Addressing Health Before Behavior
• 42:35 Preview of the Next Episode
• 43:18 Closing Remarks and Contact Information

Links:

• Sleep training won't hurt your child
• How much sleep do kids need?
• What to do about sleep regressions
• How to stop night feedings
• Things that go bump in the night: Night terrors, sleep walking, etc. 
• Craig's Book: It's Never Too Late To Sleep Train: The Low Stress Way to High Quality Sleep for Babies Kids and Parents
• Why you should ignore annoying things your kids do
• Toddler night wakenings: what causes them, what you can do about them
• Youtube video link to episodes 1 and 2.

Questions or feedback? Email us here. We are collecting questions for future Q&A shows!

Parenting is hard– especially when your child isn’t sleeping well. Because that means you aren’t sleeping well. I’m excited to launch a new podcast tackling the most common sleep issues that parents are facing these days. Why does my child wake up every night? How do I get him out of my bed? Is melatonin safe. Join us twice a month as Dr Craig Canapari (author, sleep expert, and director of the Yale Pediatric Sleep Center) and Arielle Greenleaf (noted sleep consultant) give you the best, evidence based information you need so EVERYONE in your home can sleep better.