It’s a low time in American Christianity, but are we doing better than we were in the 1970s?   Many are seeking revival but what does that mean?  Rearranging the furniture, trying a whole new set of programs, introducing a new worship band, or reverting to house churching. . .none of that will work, without the power of God opening the hearts of the people and bringing about real conversions.   We interview two of the leading pastors in America — one Presbyterian and the other Baptist.  We ask a simple question, “How does the church reform in the 21st century?”