Are music lawyers the biggest secret in the music industry? How do major labels ACTUALLY recoup your money — the math is worse than you think! What is "Fair Use" and how is it impacting YouTube? How songwriters are adapting to the new rules of the music industry. Also, Cameron drops his Chappell Roan hot take.

Links

• Fair Use: https://copyright.wp.musiclibraryassoc.org/statement-on-the-copyright-law-and-fair-use-in-music/
• More Fair Use: https://digitalpromise.org/initiative/360-story-lab/360-production-guide/investigate/360-media/post-production/copyright-fair-use/
• How Music Attorneys Help Artists Navigate Confusing Record Contracts in a Post-Streaming Revolution, Chappell Roan-Enlightened World by Todd Longwell for Variety https://variety.com/2025/biz/entertainment-industry/music-attorneys-help-artists-navigate-confusing-contracts-1236474097/
• Recoupment: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Recoupment
• Recording contracts: https://entertainment.howstuffworks.com/recording-contract2.htm
• The music business is splitting in two. Here’s why songwriters are reinventing their role by Tatiana Cirisano via MIDiA Research https://www.hypebot.com/hypebot/2025/07/how-the-songwriters-are-reinventing-their-role-in-a-divided-industry.html
• MIDiA Research Bifurcation Report: https://www.midiaresearch.com/bifurcation
• Tranter's Label Will Be First to Give Master Points to Songwriters by Music Connection https://www.musicconnection.com/tranters-label-will-be-first-to-give-songwriters-master-points/
  
  

Recorded live at Secret Spot DTLA http://secretspotdtla.com

Cameron Ljungkull https://www.cameronljungkull.com

Augustus Watkins https://augustuswatkins.com

Cocaine Opera - Music PR https://cocaineopera.com/

A number of established artists are leaving Spotify. Should you? Should we? How artists support each other as they stand up against the genocide in Gaza. Yung Thug and the RAP act. The collective building the next Bandcamp. We have an update on Super Fans. We spotlight ONErpm. What's YouTube doing to combat AI slop on their platform? And how can artists use AI to help their careers — without generating songs?

Links

• Massive Attack, Kneecap, Brian Eno, Fontaines D.C. announce formation of musicians’ alliance to repel Zionist attacks by David Walsh https://www.wsws.org/en/articles/2025/07/21/ckjv-j21.html
• Music Industry Backs Reintroduced ‘RAP ACT’ That Would Bar Lyrics From Being Used As Evidence In US Court Trials by Daniel Tencer via Music Business Worldwide https://www.musicbusinessworldwide.com/music-industry-backs-reintroduced-rap-act-that-would-bar-lyrics-from-being-used-as-evidence-in-us-court-trials/
• Subvert https://subvert.fm/
• Super Listeners https://artists.spotify.com/blog/super-listeners-your-guide-for-developing-fans-who-go-deeper
• ONErpm’s Emmanuel Zunz: ‘There Are No more Distribution Companies, There Are No More Record Labels. There Are Just Companies Providing Solutions to Creators.’ by Dave Roberts via Music Business Worldwide https://www.musicbusinessworldwide.com/onerpm-emmanuel-zunz-no-more-record-labels/
• Humanable - certified non-generative AI https://www.humanable.com
• It Looks Like YouTube Is Getting Serious About Eliminating AI Slop by Bobby Owsinksi for Music 3.0 Blog https://music3point0.com/2025/07/11/it-looks-like-youtube-is-getting-serious-about-eliminating-ai-slop/
• I created a music manager with AI. Here's how... by Musicben on their Substack https://ziggyziggymusic.substack.com/p/i-created-a-music-manager-with-ai

Recorded live at Secret Spot DTLA http://secretspotdtla.com

Cameron Ljungkull https://www.cameronljungkull.com

Augustus Watkins https://augustuswatkins.com

Cocaine Opera - Music PR https://cocaineopera.com/

We got so excited to talk about DIY music videos that we came back around for another round. When should you shoot vertical or horizontal? How can you find great locations? What video editing software is best?

After that, we look at the proliferation of music business education. How does a degree stack up against real-world experience? We talk about superfans, their importance, and caveats when promoting to them. What kinds of communities will develop as a backlash against AI music? And a look at how Soundcloud updated their AI policy.

• 🎵 Superfans are deeply engaged fans who actively support artists beyond casual listening
• 🎥 How to make affordable DIY music videos
• 🎓 Music education is shifting from hands-on internships to degree programs, but practical experience remains essential
• 🤝 The roles of managers and agents are increasingly overlapping, especially in the indie music scene
• 🤖 SoundCloud clarified it does not train generative AI on artists’ music, focusing AI on discovery and support instead
• 💼 The EU is investigating Universal’s $775 million acquisition of Downtown Music Group due to antitrust concerns
• 🌐 How music culture is fragmenting across decentralized platforms, with superfans driving engagement and community

Links

• Everyone’s A Manager Now by Maria Picard for The B-Side https://nouxme.substack.com/p/everyones-a-manager-now
• Superfans Must Be Made, Not Just Mined by Sammy Andrews, on Music Business Worldwide https://www.musicbusinessworldwide.com/superfans-must-be-made-not-just-mined/
• SoundCloud Updates AI Policy in Terms of Use After Backlash By Nina Corcoran at Pitchfork https://pitchfork.com/news/soundcloud-updates-ai-policy-in-terms-of-use-after-backlash/

Recorded live at Secret Spot DTLA http://secretspotdtla.com

Cameron Ljungkull https://www.cameronljungkull.com

Augustus Watkins https://augustuswatkins.com

Cocaine Opera - Music PR https://cocaineopera.com/

What's it take to make a DIY music video? Also, some rare good news from the government in 2025: the HITS act is a new tax break for indie musicians! We discuss layoffs at Warner Music Group. And what's the latest news for TikTok, and what does it mean for musicians?

Links

• SoundCloud Still Matters for Emerging Artists - Here’s Why by Ben Jolley on Chartmetric.com https://hmc.chartmetric.com/soundcloud-trends-2025-josh-baker-electronic/
• HITS Act becomes law in a Big Win For Independent Artists by Randi Zimmerman via Symphonic Blog https://www.hypebot.com/hypebot/2025/07/hits-act-becomes-law-in-a-big-win-for-indie-artists.html
• Warner Music Group announces $170 million in layoffs as part of larger restructuring plan by Kaitlyn Huamani for LA Times https://www.latimes.com/entertainment-arts/business/story/2025-07-01/warner-music-announces-mass-layoffs-larger-restructuring-plan

Recorded live at Secret Spot DTLA http://secretspotdtla.com

Cameron Ljungkull https://www.cameronljungkull.com

Augustus Watkins https://augustuswatkins.com

Cocaine Opera - Music PR https://cocaineopera.com/

What is “adding value” on social media? How can musicians use their platform to help others? Zines and other forms of physical media are making a comeback. The co-founder of Kickstarter introduces artist corporations. The death of the middle class musician. We also wade into the fake AI bands controversy, including Velvet Sundown. 

Links

• Social Media Replaced Zines. Now Zines Are Taking the Power Back by C. Brandon Ogbunu for Wired https://www.wired.com/story/zines-social-media-power/
• The Death of the Middle-Class Musician by Lucy Rinaldi for The Walrus https://thewalrus.ca/the-death-of-the-middle-class-musician/
• Why Artist Corporations? by Yancey Strickler https://ideaspace.ystrickler.com/p/why-artist-corporations
• Yancey Strickler Ted Talk https://youtu.be/iLhFAWKCE0M?feature=shared
• “The Grammys” for AI Music? Entries Open for Groundbreaking Song Contest from the Fanvue World AI Creator Awards - as Millions of Creators Make Music with AI https://www.morningstar.com/news/globe-newswire/9490722/the-grammys-for-ai-music-entries-open-for-groundbreaking-song-contest-from-the-fanvue-world-ai-creator-awards-as-millions-of-creators-make-music-with-ai

Recorded live at Secret Spot DTLA http://secretspotdtla.com

Cameron Ljungkull https://www.cameronljungkull.com

Augustus Watkins https://augustuswatkins.com

Cocaine Opera - Music PR https://cocaineopera.com/

Everyone in the music industry has a day job. The people who make a living in the music industry serve others. Most of us are actually consumers and hobbyists — and that’s okay. Meanwhile, Project 2025 and the administration is coming for your vinyl. Finally, is ChatGPT cooking your brain?

LINKS

• Why Tariffs Are Quitely Undermining The American Vinyl Comeback by Chris Castle for Music Technology Policy https://musictechpolicy.com/2025/06/19/why-tariffs-are-quietly-undermining-the-american-vinyl-comeback/
• If I Press Vinyl, Will I Make My Money Back? by Tony van Veen, Diskmakers Blog https://blog.discmakers.com/2025/01/is-vinyl-worth-the-cost/
• Suno And Udio Hit With Class Action Lawsuits From Independent Artist by Mandy Dalugdug https://www.musicbusinessworldwide.com/suno-and-udio-hit-with-class-action-lawsuits-from-independent-artists/
• Your Brain on ChatGPT: Accumulation of Cognitive Debt when Using an AI Assistant for Essay Writing Task by Nataliya Kos'myna, Research Scientist https://www.media.mit.edu/publications/your-brain-on-chatgpt/

Recorded live at Secret Spot DTLA http://secretspotdtla.com

Cameron Ljungkull https://www.cameronljungkull.com

Augustus Watkins https://augustuswatkins.com

Cocaine Opera - Music PR https://cocaineopera.com/

Let's talk about analytics and dashboards! What music promo tactics are cooked in 2025? And what works, according to indie music executives? Suno and Udio's potential licensing deal with major labels could be a major shift in creators rights. New Grammy category. We also explore previously unheard of rhyme schemes.

Links

• What Music Promo Tactics Don't Work Anymore?  by Yona Marie https://www.indieonthemove.com/blog/2025/6/what-music-promo-tactics-dont-work-anymore
• What Suno And Udio’s AI Licensing Deals With Music Majors Could Mean For Creators Rights by Virginie Berger https://www.forbes.com/sites/virginieberger/2025/06/06/what-suno-and-udios-ai-licensing-deals-with-music-majors-could-mean-for-creators-rights/
• What Moves the Needle for Artists in 2025? 84 Indie Music Executives Weigh In by Dan Rys https://www.billboard.com/lists/what-moves-needle-for-artists-indie-music-executives-answer/annie-ortmeier-triple-tigers-records/
• 15 Essential Rhyme Schemes for Songwriters by Jordan Reynolds https://www.ascap.com/help/career-development/15-rhyme-schemes-jordan-reynolds

Recorded live at Secret Spot DTLA http://secretspotdtla.com

Cameron Ljungkull https://www.cameronljungkull.com

Augustus Watkins https://augustuswatkins.com

Cocaine Opera - Music PR https://cocaineopera.com/

What makes a good recording session or a good collaborator? What's really going on in LA in 2025? (Spoiler: it's not an urban hellscape warzone). We'll also share some artist mental health resources, discuss TikTok's new artist tools, and stare deeply at Timbaland's very weird take on AI. A Goldman Sachs report gets reviewed — shout out to global banking, we love you. Oh, and our transition game is impeccable.

Links

• Artists Often Pay For Their Own Health Care — This Is Their Biggest Expense By Elizabeth Dilts Marshall for Billboard  https://www.billboard.com/pro/therapy-artists-biggest-health-care-expenses/
• TIKTOK FOR ARTISTS LAUNCHES GLOBALLY AFTER BETA TESTING
  MANDY DALUGDUG at Music Business Worldwide https://www.musicbusinessworldwide.com/tiktok-for-artists-launches-globally-after-beta-testing/
• Goldman Sachs Lowers Global Music Industry Growth Forecast, Wiping Out $2.5 Billion by ELIZABETH DILTS MARSHALL for Billboard https://www.billboard.com/pro/goldman-sachs-lowers-global-music-industry-growth-forecast/

Recorded live at Secret Spot DTLA http://secretspotdtla.com

Cameron Ljungkull https://www.cameronljungkull.com

Augustus Watkins https://augustuswatkins.com

Cocaine Opera - Music PR https://cocaineopera.com/

Cameron Ljungkull and Augustus Watkins break down social media strategies for reluctant posters. Then we talk about the way the tech industry has changed the "soft power" of American culture, share some mental health resources for musicians, and discuss the new era of 360 deals. We also tempt fate by calling out UMG's famously rowdy legal team.

• Meta, TikTok, Spotify & New Rules of Soft Power  by Mark Mulligan via Music Industry Blog https://www.hypebot.com/hypebot/2025/05/meta-tiktok-spotify-the-new-rules-of-soft-power-mark-mulligan-of-midia.html
• Mental Health Resources for Musicians in 2025 By Randi Zimmerman https://blog.symphonic.com/2025/05/01/mental-health-resources-for-musicians/
• 20 years ago, labels targeted fandom. Will it work the second time around? by Tatiana Cirisano https://www.midiaresearch.com/blog/20-years-ago-labels-targeted-fandom-will-it-work-the-second-time-around
• UMAW https://weareumaw.org

Recorded live at Secret Spot DTLA http://secretspotdtla.com

Cameron Ljungkull https://www.cameronljungkull.com

Augustus Watkins https://augustuswatkins.com

Cocaine Opera - Music PR https://cocaineopera.com/

Welcome to Wholesome Music Podcast with Cameron Ljungkull and Augustus Watkins. It's our first episode and we're talking about the right time to get a manager, the creator economy, how social media broke capitalism, the economics of touring, AI brainrot music, and more!

Links: 

• Why Some Artists Are Rethinking Touring https://hmc.chartmetric.com/why-artists-arent-touring-2025/
• Americans Are Paying $300-Plus or Going Into Debt for Concert Tickets, Studies Show https://www.billboard.com/pro/concert-ticket-prices-studies-spending-debt-consumer-trends/
• Into the Horrid Depths of Instagram Reels Music By Kieran Press-Reynolds https://pitchfork.com/thepitch/into-the-horrid-depths-of-instagram-reels-music/

Recorded live at Secret Spot DTLA http://secretspotdtla.com

Cameron Ljungkull https://www.cameronljungkull.com

Augustus Watkins https://augustuswatkins.com

Cocaine Opera - Music PR https://cocaineopera.com/