Donald Trump poses a grave, long-term threat to our democratic institutions, Atlantic senior editor and former White House speechwriter David Frum has been warning. But, in this wide-ranging conversation with NYU Law School president Trevor Morrison, Frum argues we need to focus not just on Trump’s own behavior, but on “the system of power that enables him.” And Frum explores the ways in which America’s potential retreat from democracy under Trump mirrors developments around the world.

Brennan Center Live is a weekly series of podcasts created from Brennan Center events, featuring fascinating conversations with well-known thinkers on issues like democracy, justice, race, and the Constitution.