Trust & Influence in B2B

In this episode of the 'Trust & Influence in B2B' podcast, host Joel Harrison speaks with Annie Dunleavy, EVP of Content Strategy at Edelman, about the critical role of internal influencers in B2B purchasing decisions. They explore Edelman's latest research revealing that over 40% of B2B deals stall due to internal misalignment, and how thought leadership can serve as a "Trojan horse" to reach hidden stakeholders who hold 50% of decision-making power but rarely interact with sales teams. Annie shares insights on why internal influencers prefer provocative content over validation, how quality thought leadership outperforms traditional marketing materials, and practical strategies for B2B marketers to engage these otherwise inaccessible audiences. Join them as they discuss the evolving complexity of B2B buyer groups and the future of thought leadership strategy.

🎯 Hidden buyers hold 50% of decision-making power but are often overlooked by marketing efforts

📊 Internal influencers consume just as much thought leadership as formal decision makers (64% vs 63%)

🧠 86% of internal influencers want provocative ideas that challenge assumptions rather than validate existing thinking

🔓 95% say strong thought leadership makes them more receptive to future sales outreach

💪 71% view thought leadership as more effective than traditional marketing materials for demonstrating vendor capabilities

🤝 79% of internal influencers are more likely to champion RFP proposals from companies with strong thought leadership

🎨 60% of internal influencers prefer unique formats compared to 51% for target buyers

⚖️ 53% of both audiences agree that high-quality thought leadership matters more than brand recognition

📈 41% of decision makers have been encouraged by C-suite executives to consider vendors based on their thought leadership

🔄 Thought leadership creates internal virality, helping stakeholders advocate for vendors in closed-door conversations

00:00 - Introduction to Trust in B2B Marketing

01:32 - The Challenge of Internal Misalignment in B2B Deals

02:39 - Understanding Hidden Buyers vs Target Buyers

04:23 - Content Strategy for Internal Influencers

06:10 - Why Internal Influencers Want Provocative Content

08:58 - Thought Leadership as a Trojan Horse Strategy

12:09 - Building Credibility vs Traditional Marketing Materials

13:23 - Transforming Skeptics into Internal Advocates

15:10 - Creating Human-Accessible Content Formats

18:01 - Leveling the Playing Field for Challenger Brands

19:08 - C-Suite Influence and Top-Down Momentum

20:17 - Measuring Impact on Internal Influencers

25:28 - Three Key Recommendations for B2B Marketers

27:59 - The Future of Internal Influences and Buyer Complexity

🔎 The Jolt Effect by Matt Dixon - amazon.com/Jolt-Effect-Hard-Customers-Decide/dp/059308076X

🔎 LinkedIn and Bain Research on Buying Committees - business.linkedin.com  

🔎 Edelman's 2025 B2B Thought Leadership Report - edelman.com 

https://linkedin.com/in/anniedunleavy/

Edelman - https://edelman.com

https://linkedin.com/in/joelharrison/

B2B Marketing - https://linkedin.com/company/b2b-marketing/

In this episode of the 'Trust & Influence in B2B' podcast, host Joel Harrison speaks with Roland Glass, CCO of Hello Kindred, and Shane Redding, a prominent B2B marketing expert, about building future-fit marketing teams in an AI-driven world. They explore the challenges of managing distributed teams, the evolution from traditional hierarchical structures to agile pod-based models, and the critical importance of building trust while navigating resource constraints. The conversation delves into the "Rubik's cube" approach to talent allocation, the rise of star-shaped marketers, and how AI is reshaping skill requirements across different experience levels. Roland and Shane share insights on maintaining culture in decentralized teams, the ethics of AI implementation, and practical strategies for CMOs looking to transform their operations while proving commercial value to stakeholders.

Takeaways:

🎯 CMOs must shift from functional design to outputs and value-driven team structures

🧩 The "Rubik's cube" talent model combines full-time, freelance, agency, and specialist resources dynamically

⭐ Star-shaped marketers need both deep specialization and commercial breadth across marketing functions

🏗️ Pod-based structures enable agile, multidisciplinary teams for specific projects and outcomes

🤖 AI augments experienced marketers more effectively than replacing junior talent entirely

🌍 Distributed teams require intentional culture-building and inclusive environments regardless of contract type

⚖️ Ethical AI usage and thinking skills are paramount for responsible marketing automation

📊 Sharp instruments (specialized teams) deliver better results than blunt tools (generalized approaches)

🔄 Change management has become the #1 skill for modern CMOs navigating constant transformation

🚀 Start small with pilot projects to prove value before scaling new operating models

Chapters:

00:00 - Introduction to Future-fit Marketing Teams

01:59 - The Catalyst for Change in Marketing Talent Strategies

04:34 - From Crisis to Smart Adaptation

06:22 - The Rubik's Cube Approach to Team Building

09:09 - Star-shaped Marketers vs Deep Specialists

12:34 - Skills Polarization and the Missing Middle Layer

17:04 - Pod-based Structures and Agile Operating Models

21:38 - AI's Role Across Different Experience Levels

27:57 - Maintaining Culture in Distributed Teams

30:19 - Future-proofing Marketing Organizations

38:12 - Practical First Steps for Transformation

Resources:

📚 The Culture Map by Erin Meyer - Essential reading for global teams

🏢 Hello Kindred - Digital talent management specialists

🎓 Cambridge University Faculty - IT ethics, law and business program

Follow Roland Glass:

https://linkedin.com/in/rolandglass

Hello Kindred - hellokindred.com

Follow Shane Redding:

https://linkedin.com/in/shaneredding

Follow Joel Harrison:

https://linkedin.com/in/joelharrison/

B2B Marketing:

https://linkedin.com/company/b2b-marketing/

Listen to Trust & Influence in B2B:

🎧https://open.spotify.com/show/trust-influence-b2b

🍎 https://podcasts.apple.com/podcast/trust-influence-b2b

📺 https://youtube.com/c/trustinfluenceb2b 

In this episode of the 'Trust & Influence in B2B' podcast, host Joel Harrison speaks with Paul Collier, CMO of Funnel Fuel, and Preeti Saini, Global Marketing Leader at IFS, about the critical need for transparency and accountability in B2B digital advertising. The conversation, recorded live at Marketing Ignite, explores the widespread lack of visibility into where digital advertising budgets actually go and how much reaches target audiences. Paul shares his personal journey from ignorance to awareness after experiencing a costly digital advertising failure, while Preeti discusses IFS's approach to taking control of their digital destiny. Together, they examine why the traditional B2C-focused digital advertising model doesn't work for B2B, the importance of challenging agency relationships, and practical steps marketers can take to regain control of their digital spend. Join them as they advocate for a fundamental shift from blind trust to informed scrutiny in digital marketing.

Takeaways:

🔍 Challenge what you've been doing and why - question your current digital advertising approach

💰 Understand where your advertising dollars actually go in the supply chain

📊 Demand transparency from agencies beyond impression data and eyeball metrics

🎯 Start with inclusion lists rather than exclusion lists when targeting audiences

🧪 Test small, learn fast, and scale successful campaigns gradually

🤝 Take back control of your digital destiny rather than outsourcing blindly

📈 Focus on conversion into your funnel, not just media conversion metrics

🔄 Use multiple data sources to piece together the complete customer journey

💡 Fail faster to identify where to place confident bets with your budget

⚖️ Balance agency expertise with internal control and oversight

Chapters:

00:00 - Introduction and Setting the Stage

01:50 - Guest Introductions: Preeti Saini and Paul Collier

03:20 - The Problem: Inefficiencies in Digital Advertising Spend

04:56 - Paul's Journey: From Ignorance to Awareness

08:12 - Preeti's Perspective: Moving Beyond Tick-Box Marketing

11:09 - The Industry Structure Problem: B2C Models Applied to

B2B 15:19 - Taking Back Control: Agency vs In-House Approaches

18:40 - Q&A: Making Data Meaningful in Digital Advertising

23:40 - Preeti's Practical Approach: Breaking Down the Elephant

26:23 - Q&A: Showing Value in Programmatic Advertising

28:22 - Final Thoughts: Challenge Yourself and Fail Faster

Resources Mentioned:

🔍 Gartner CMO Survey - Latest research on digital marketing spend priorities 📊 Funnel Fuel - funnelfuel.com 🏢 IFS - ifs.com

Follow the Guests:

Follow Paul Collier https://linkedin.com/in/paul-collier-cmo/ Funnel Fuel - funnelfuel.com

Follow Preeti Saini https://linkedin.com/in/preeti-saini/ IFS - ifs.com

Follow Joel Harrison https://linkedin.com/in/joelharrison/

B2B Marketing - https://linkedin.com/company/b2b-marketing/

In this episode of the 'Trust & Influence in B2B' podcast, host Joel Harrison speaks with Chris Wickson, serial entrepreneur and founder of ReelFlow, about the future of B2B websites and how AI can make them more human and trusted. Chris, who has experience building two pioneering MarTech firms and selling one to a US parent company, shares his insights on how websites must evolve to serve as both AI training data sources and enhanced visitor experiences. They discuss the declining effectiveness of traditional SEO-driven content, the rise of video consumption in B2B, the importance of humanization in digital experiences, and how interactive video overlays can transform website engagement. The conversation also explores the role of AI avatars, the integration challenges companies face, and practical steps for implementing video-first website experiences. Join them for this forward-looking discussion on the intersection of AI, trust, and human connection in B2B marketing.

Takeaways

🎯B2B websites must evolve to serve dual purposes: AI training data sources and enhanced visitor experiences

📱Visitors arriving at websites today have higher intent but shorter attention spans, requiring more effective engagement

🎬Video content dramatically outperforms traditional text-based content for engagement and trust-building

👥Humanization becomes more critical as digital advancement increases, with authentic video helping build trust

🔄 Traditional website navigation is becoming obsolete in favor of guided, personalized experiences

📊 Interactive video overlays can achieve 20-40% engagement rates compared to 1-2% for chatbots

⚡ Modern video creation barriers are lower than ever, requiring minimal technical setup and budget

🤖 AI avatars and voice synthesis can enable video content creation while maintaining transparency about usage

🚀 Future websites will combine immersive video experiences with AI-powered live chat for better buyer enablement

📈 Video-enhanced websites show improved metrics: lower bounce rates, higher time on site, and deeper page engagement

Chapters:

00:00 - Introduction to B2B Website Evolution

01:21 - The Changing Role of Websites in AI Era

02:24 - Website Complexity and Political Challenges

03:44 - Simplifying Buyer Journeys and User Experience

05:56 - Higher Intent Visitors and Better Engagement

07:23 - The Importance of Humanization in B2B

09:35 - Why Human Connection Matters More Than Ever

10:08 - Video vs Text-Based Content Consumption

12:03 - Video's Impact on Website Engagement Metrics

14:36 - Building Trust Through Authentic Video Content

16:16 - Overcoming Executive Resistance to Video

18:12 - The Rise of Media-Savvy Workforce

19:25 - Future of Website Experiences and Navigation

23:24 - Getting Started with Enhanced Video Experiences

25:59 - Integration Challenges and Technical Solutions

26:58 - Results and Performance Data from Video Overlays

29:08 - AI Avatars and Authenticity in Video Content

33:04 - The Future Intersection of AI and Human Marketing

Resources Mentioned

🎬 ReelFlow - Interactive video overlay platform

📊 Story Lane - Interactive product demo platform 

💬 Intercom - AI-powered customer support platform

📈 B2B Marketing Trends Report - Anti-corporate creativity insights

Connect with Our Guest and Host

Follow Chris Wickenson

https://linkedin.com/in/chriswickenson/

ReelFlow

https://reelflow.com

Follow Joel Harrison

https://linkedin.com/in/joelharrison/](https://linkedin.com/in/joelharrison/

B2B Marketing -

https://linkedin.com/company/b2b-marketing/

Summary

In this episode of the Trust and Influence in B2B podcast, host Joel Harrison speaks with Heather Barnett, a freelance copywriter known for her humorous approach to B2B marketing on LinkedIn. They discuss the importance of humour in engaging audiences, the challenges of using humor in a corporate environment, and how humour can help build a community among marketers. Heather shares her journey in B2B marketing, the evolution of her content creation, and the impact of her humorous videos on her professional reputation. The conversation emphasizes the need for authenticity and the potential for humour to break down barriers in communication.

Takeaways

• Humour is a powerful tool in B2B marketing.
• Building a community through humour can enhance engagement.
• Marketers often fear taking risks with humour due to corporate culture.
• Authenticity in communication is crucial for connection.
• Using simple language can make messages more relatable.
• Humour can help break down barriers in professional settings.
• Experimenting with humour can lead to innovative marketing strategies.
• The first attempt at humour may not always succeed, but it's a learning process.
• Supportive organizations encourage creative risk-taking.
• Humour can make the workplace more enjoyable and relatable.

Chapters

00:00 - Introduction to Humour in B2B Marketing

02:42 - Heather Barnett's Journey in B2B Marketing

05:33 - The Impact of Humour on Social Media Engagement

08:18 - Navigating Humour in Professional Settings

11:16 - The Role of Creativity in B2B Marketing

14:08 - Client Receptiveness to Humour in Copywriting

15:30 - The Role of Humour in B2B Marketing

18:28 - Breaking the Jargon Barrier

21:10 - From Digital to Live: The Evolution of Performance

25:23 - Encouraging Humour in Marketing

28:50 - The Power of Humour in B2B

In this episode of the Trust and Influence in B2B podcast, host Joel Harrison speaks with Saima Rashid, CMO of Sixth Sense, about the multifaceted challenges of building trust in B2B marketing. They discuss the role of the CMO in establishing credibility, the balance between brand and demand, and the importance of sales and marketing alignment. Saima shares insights on navigating intent data while respecting customer privacy, leveraging customer advocacy, and making informed martech decisions. The conversation also touches on the impact of AI on trust, the significance of post-sale trust, and the importance of transparent reporting and metrics in building trust within teams.

Takeaways

• Marketing must show the value of its contributions.
• Strong brands lead to lower customer acquisition costs.
• Sales and marketing alignment is crucial for success.
• Intent data should be used responsibly to build trust.
• Customer advocacy is a powerful tool in B2B marketing.
• Transparency in reporting builds trust within teams.
• AI can create trust issues if not used properly.
• Choosing the right martech partner is essential.
• Post-sale trust is vital for customer retention.
• Building a culture of trust starts with hiring the right people.

Chapters

00:00 Introduction to Trust in B2B Marketing

02:09 The Role of the CMO in Building Credibility

05:52 Balancing Brand and Demand in Marketing

09:50 Sales and Marketing Alignment for Trust

12:14 Navigating Intent Data and Customer Privacy

14:55 Harnessing Customer Advocacy in Marketing

17:06 Building Trust in Martech Decisions

19:46 AI's Impact on Trust in Marketing

25:06 Post-Sale Trust and Customer Retention

28:00 Building Trust Through Reporting and Metrics

30:57 Personal Trust and Team Dynamics

Summary:

In this podcast episode, Joel Harrison and Sarah Aird-Mash discuss the evolving landscape of B2B marketing, focusing on the impact of generative AI on search behavior, the importance of trust, and the metrics that matter. They explore how smaller brands can leverage their authenticity, the necessity of human engagement in sales, and the role of content in building relationships. The conversation also touches on the significance of third-party validation and the need for marketers to adapt their strategies in light of AI advancements.

Takeaways

• Generative AI is reshaping search behavior and content consumption.
• Businesses prioritize quality leads over traditional metrics.
• Smaller brands can leverage authenticity to stand out.
• Human engagement remains vital in B2B sales processes.
• Content is essential for building brand authority.
• Third-party validation is important for trust-building.
• Marketers need to optimize for generative AI in their strategies.
• Gated content may be losing its effectiveness.
• Building community is becoming a key focus in B2B marketing.

Chapters

00:00 - The Rise of Generative Engine Optimization

04:26 - Understanding the Shift in Search Behavior

09:29 - The Paradox of Trust in AI

12:32 - The Importance of Thought Leadership

16:13 - Building Trust with Indirect Channels

19:23 - Conducting a GEO Audit

22:14 - Evolving Content Strategy for GEO

24:28 - Rethinking Gated Content Strategies

25:22 - The Evolution of B2B Marketing Metrics

30:06 - The Authority Arms Race in B2B

31:00 - The Role of Humans in B2B Sales

33:12 - The Future of AI in Marketing

In this episode of the 'Trust & Influence' in B2B podcast, host Joel Harrison speaks with Dan Shaw of Funnel Fuel about the evolving challenges of trust in B2B marketing, particularly in the realm of digital advertising. They discuss the current crisis in digital advertising, the complexities faced by B2B marketers, and the importance of data integrity and transparency. Dan shares his journey in B2B media and the mission of Funnel Fuel to address these issues. The conversation highlights the need for B2B marketers to ask critical questions about their advertising spend and the importance of data sovereignty.

Takeaways

• Trust in B2B marketing is multi-dimensional and evolving.
• B2B advertising is currently facing a crisis of integrity.
• The B2B community is lagging behind in advertising innovation.
• Complexity in advertising leads to inefficiencies and poor results.
• B2B marketers must focus on data quality over quantity.
• Funnel Fuel aims to improve transparency in B2B advertising.
• Marketers should ask suppliers about their advertising spend.
• Data sovereignty is crucial for maintaining control over first-party data.
• The future of B2B advertising lies in omni-channel strategies.
• Asking questions is essential for understanding advertising effectiveness.

Is B2B influencer marketing finally ready for prime time? In this episode, host Joel Harrison tackles this question with two industry experts: Katie Howell (20 years B2B social media expertise) and Katie Martell (former B2B marketer turned successful influencer). Discover why 51% of B2B campaigns now include influencers, how LinkedIn's new tools are changing the game, and why customer advocacy remains the most underutilized opportunity.

Key Highlights:

• Why 51% of B2B campaigns now include influencers and 90%+ of CMOs plan to increase spending
• How LinkedIn's new advertising tools are changing the influencer game completely
• The surprising effectiveness of Facebook for reaching C-suite decision makers
• Why customer advocacy remains the most underutilized influencer opportunity
• The critical difference between transactional campaigns and relationship building

Guest Info:

Katie Howell has been a leading voice in B2B social media for two decades, helping brands develop influence strategies. Connect with Katie on Twitter and LinkedIn.

Katie Martell is a former B2B marketing executive now working as a top-tier influencer with brands like Adobe, Vimeo, and MailChimp. Connect with Katie on Twitter and LinkedIn.

Key Takeaways:

• B2B influencer marketing requires subject matter expertise, not just reach
• Long-term relationships outperform one-off campaigns every time
• Customer advocacy can generate millions in attributed pipeline when done strategically
• Platform strategy matters: C-suite executives may not be active on LinkedIn daily
• The future includes AI agents as part of the buyer journey

Chapters

00:00 Introduction to Influencer Marketing in B2B

02:23 The Current State of Influencer Marketing

05:45 Maturity and Creativity in Influencer Marketing

08:04 Trust and Visibility in Influencer Relationships

10:30 The Role of Technology in Influencer Marketing

14:39 Exploring Different Platforms for B2B Influencer Marketing

17:48 Defining Thought Leaders vs Influencers

21:42 The Essence of Thought Leadership

23:55 Influencer Marketing in B2B

26:37 The Role of Customer Advocacy

29:45 The Future of Influencer Marketing

34:47 Practical Steps for Marketers

For sceptical CMOs

Both Katies recommend asking your buyers directly who they follow and trust for industry insights. Research shows 89% of buyers trust peer recommendations over brand messaging.

For marketing managers getting started:

Start with one influencer and focus on building a genuine relationship. Co-create content together and think long-term partnership, not transactional campaign.

Call to action:

If you enjoyed this episode, please leave a review on Apple Podcasts and share the episode with friends! Subscribe to the Trust & Influence in B2B podcast for weekly episodes on influencer marketing, thought leadership, and building trust in B2B.

Subscribe:

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Connect with Our Guests:

• Katie Howell: [Social Media Links]
• Katie Martell: [Social Media Links]
• Joel Harrison: [Social Media Links]

In this episode of the Trust and Influence in B2B Marketing podcast, host Joel Harrison speaks with Antonia Wade, Global Chief Marketing Officer at PwC. Fresh from unveiling a major brand revitalization, Antonia shares insights on how one of the world's leading professional services firms approached the complex challenge of evolving their brand while maintaining the trust and credibility that underpins their business model.

• The strategic rationale behind PwC's recent brand revitalization and the "catalyst for momentum" positioning.
• How to balance brand evolution with heritage preservation in professional services
• The three-year transformation program encompassing client experience, people experience, and market experience
• Internal change management strategies for gaining buy-in from thousands of partners globally
• The role of thought leadership in professional services, including PwC's "Value in Motion" research
• Building trust through transparency, data-driven decision making, and course correction
• Marketing as a commercial discipline and the importance of understanding business fundamentals
• Strategies for sustaining long-term brand transformation across global markets

1. Trust Requires Authenticity in Brand Evolution: Antonia emphasizes that successful rebranding isn't about becoming an entirely different organization, but about signaling broader capabilities while preserving core credibility. As she notes, "Creating that credibility gap is actually bad for brand and bad for business, because we are a business where credibility is actually part of our core value."
2. Marketing Must Be Commercially Grounded: Throughout the conversation, Antonia reinforces that effective B2B marketing requires deep understanding of business fundamentals. Marketing leaders must "speak the language of finance, be able to make business cases, understand how your business makes money, understand the cost of marketing and why."
3. Change Management Requires Hearts and Minds: The three-year transformation program succeeded because it combined rigorous data analysis with emotional engagement. By consulting widely across the organization and giving employees space to "own" the new brand before external launch, PwC created genuine internal buy-in rather than imposed change.
4. Thought Leadership Drives Strategic Conversations: In professional services, thought leadership isn't just about brand awareness—it's about earning permission to have more strategic, upstream conversations with clients. The launch of "Value in Motion" research alongside the rebrand demonstrates how proprietary insights can support both brand positioning and commercial objectives.

For marketing leaders navigating similar transformations, Antonia's approach offers a blueprint for balancing innovation with credibility, ensuring that brand evolution supports rather than undermines the trust that drives B2B relationships.