Unfiltered: Real Church Planting Conversations

Converge church planting leaders Lee Stephenson and Danny Parmelee discuss Converge’s five-year church planting goal and how your church can participate in Church Planting Weekend.

0:18 Lee talks about Converge’s goal of planting 312 churches in five years.

1:20 Lee discusses how Converge came up with the number 312.

2:21 Danny asks Lee if they considered changing the goal because of the pandemic.

3:12 Lee says there are more people in the church planting pipeline than any other time in his history with Converge.

3:55 Lee talks about the concept behind Church Planting Weekend.

4:35 "If we could get a third of our churches playing the game and getting involved at some level, praying, raising up people from within to go out and plant a church, we easily reach our number [of 312 new churches]."

5:20 We want every Converge church across our movement to set aside time on the first Sunday of June, or sometime between Mother’s Day and Father’s Day, to have this conversation.

6:07 Lee says, "I believe that a lot of our churches, they have at least one person in their church that maybe God has called and even anointed to plant a church."

6:50 Lee talks about the resources Converge is providing churches for Church Planting Weekend.

7:59 Lee says, "The goal is to make it as easy as possible for anybody to have this conversation."

8:04 Lee gives some ideas of what churches can do for Church Planting Weekend.

9:22 Lee says, "If the majority of our churches engage in this conversation, I think it could be overwhelming of what we would see God do."

Small towns in rural America are big but often overlooked mission fields. Special guest Ty DesEnfants shares his experience planting a church in Wyoming.

0:28 Lee Stephenson, executive director of Church Planting for Converge, introduces Ty DesEnfants, who planted Prairie Hills Community Church in Lusk, Wyoming.

1:00 Ty talks about how God called him to start a church in a small town like Lusk.

3:00 Ty describes Wyoming "as a small town with really long streets." The population of the entire state is less than 600,000. The county Ty lives in has 2000 people. "We’re about 90 miles from the nearest Walmart."

6:05 Lee asks Ty what advice he would give people thinking about planting a rural church.

9:25 Ty talks about where he grew up and why he’s uniquely positioned to pastor a church in Lusk. 

12:25 Ty discusses how the pandemic has affected his church and the adjustments they have made.

13:25 Ty shares about his church’s experience having a drive-in church service for Easter in a snowstorm last year.

16:49 Ty talks about resources for people interested in rural church planting.

Things are different, but not everything has to change. Some past metrics are still working for the church. See if you are using these metrics and, if not, how they can benefit your church.

0:20 Lee Stephenson talks about how some standard metrics for pastors and church planters have changed because of the pandemic.

1:09 Lee and Danny Parmelee discuss the difficulty of determining attendance numbers during COVID-19.

2:51 Danny says it’s hard during this season to measure engagement and impact.

4:06 Online views don’t equal engagement.

5:10 You could waste a lot of time chasing after a somewhat meaningless number.

6:45 Often, numbers have more to do with our egos and insecurities.

7:35 "More than ever, it’s not about the content that a church is delivering. It is more about the conversation that the church is creating. So conversation equals engagement."

7:53 Are your giving units decreasing or increasing? If they increase, it’s a sign that more people are buying into the church’s mission and vision.

8:42 People you haven’t seen but are still giving indicate that they are still "with you."

9:39 Danny says stories are important indicators of the impact your church is making.

10:28 Stories should be celebrated and shared. The more you share them, the more it encourages other people to act and to be the church throughout the week in no matter what the context is.

10:59 Lee thinks it’s important to count who’s in some discipleship process. "How are people connecting with other people and growing in their own discipleship process?"

11:54 Danny talks about the value of surveying your people.

13:10 Lee and Danny discuss counting commitments to Christ and baptisms.

14:56 Lee encourages pastors and planters to set some personal metrics. Are you focused more on creating and pushing content? Or are you looking at creating a conversation that’s meaningful and caring for people?

16:04 Danny talks about setting goals you can control.

As a church planter, your most valuable resources are the people who help you accomplish your church’s mission. How can you manage your staff well when times are tough?

0:18 This episode is a continuation of the conversation Lee and Danny had in the previous episode.

1:19 Danny points out a silver lining during this difficult time.

2:19 Danny recommends not to respond too quickly or emotionally if suddenly your giving is down.

3:35 Danny discusses looking at your current staff and assessing if you need to reorganize.

5:04 Lee shares an example of God's grace during a financially challenging time at his church plant.

5:49 Questions to ask when a staff member leaves: Do you need to replace them? Do you need that position? Or do you need something else? 

6:25 Lee asks Danny if his church ever had to cut salaries across the board.

7:44 Danny talks about his church’s decision not to provide health insurance for its staff. 

9:48 Danny and Lee discuss if the lead pastor should offer to take the biggest and first pay cut.

12:27 Lee and Danny talk about solo pastors who don’t have any other paid staff.

15:21 What are three options for a planter who is struggling financially after two or three years?

18:24 Lee encourages you to embrace the challenge because it’s in the challenge that opportunity is presented. Look for new opportunities and ways to do things differently.

18:42 Lee says pastors shouldn’t be afraid to have the financial conversation with their church and leaders and talks about what to say.

19:12 Danny discusses several ideas for sharing staff and resources.

The financial hits have been one blow after another, especially for those starting something new. As a church planter, how can you budget for your church during this uncertain season?

0:24 Lee introduces this two-part series on the challenges that church planters face specific to the economic downturn.

2:07 Danny says most of the church planters he talked to weren’t affected as much as they were expecting at the beginning of the pandemic.

3:22 Danny says the most challenging thing about COVID is there is so much unknown.

3:43 You have to figure out what are the absolutes that can’t change, like rent.

4:53 Lee talks about the 2020 end-of-year giving at his church plant.

6:39 In the U.S., when things turn down economically, nonprofit giving goes up.

8:33 Lee says it was tough to try to create a budget for 2021.

10:46 Lee says his church plant’s designated giving to benevolence grew significantly in 2020.

11:42 Lee explains his church plant’s budgeting decisions for 2021.

12:58 Lee’s church had to cut things they were dreaming of doing.

14:15 Lee discusses the most critical drivers in the life of his church that couldn’t be cut.

16:04 Lee talks about an after-school sports program that his church invested in that they had to shut down when COVID hit.

18:08 Lee says you have to watch your financial numbers weekly when things are challenging economically.

19:19 Danny encourages you to keep an eye on things even if you say you’re not a money guy or you don’t like it. Burying your head in the sand doesn’t do any good.

When you’re first starting out as a leader, you may feel like Superman and that you can accomplish anything. But you’ll quickly discover your limits. Learn how this realization can be a gift that allows you to lead in your strengths.

0:33 When Lee started his first church plant, he didn’t feel like he had any limits.

1:09 Lee thinks it’s a great gift when we become more in touch with our limits as a leader.

1:41 Danny talks about a dramatic change that happened to him about five years after planting and the importance of having a coach.

2:16 Danny shares how a 360 evaluation helped him identify his strengths and weaknesses.

4:06 Danny and Lee explain what the 360 experience is.

6:54 It’s hard sometimes to hear things that you don’t perceive about yourself as being the reality, but at the same time, you’ve got to see it as a gift to help you know how to best lead through your strengths.

7:43 Lee says his most impactful "aha" moments have come through life circumstances, like being bedridden for 12 weeks.

7:55 "You realize quickly: I’m not nearly as important as I thought I was. And honestly, that was a great gift."

8:45 "That allowed me to reallocate energy and think through difficult situations completely different. I think it gave me permission to say no more often."

9:04 Danny says leadership limits usually come down to competency issues or relational capacity.

11:21 Lee shares two indicators that you’re pressing up into your area of limits.

13:12 Lee also says to pay attention to your habits, like negative thinking and not sleeping well.

13:55 Danny and Lee talk about the importance of finding friends and colleagues who you can trust to speak into your life.

When events like the storming of the Capitol happen, people look to their pastor to say something. How can you know what to say to them, or if you should say anything at all?

1:09 Lee asks Danny if his perspective on this issue changed over time.

1:53 Starting out, Danny didn’t want to say anything about politics and other issues.

2:47 Danny says the reasoning behind being cautious isn’t being politically correct, but not missing the opportunity in a very divided country to speak to someone about Jesus.

3:12 Always wanting people to think that you have more in common with them than you don’t have in common with them.

4:10 After the Capitol riots, Danny saw some pastors go off the rails. "It was just adding fuel to the fire of division."

4:40 If you’re going to say anything, it somehow should point it back toward Jesus.

4:52 But you also may be communicating just as much by being absent. "So it’s a toss-up. There’s no easy answer."

6:13 Lee asks Danny how he helps young church planters know if they should or shouldn’t say something.

6:21 Danny says having many people speak into it is important, including coaches, your leadership board and nonbelievers.

7:32 Tethering and tying it back to Scripture is going to be the best way to help your people.

8:17 Think of your preaching as discipleship. How are you going to make better followers of Christ?

9:18 Lee says what we see happening culturally across our country is somewhat a direct result of Christian leaders not speaking up enough in the right way to lead people in how to manage their thoughts.

10:09 The challenge is you’re always going to tick someone off. It’s not about keeping everybody happy. It’s about doing what’s right and what God’s called you to do and say.

10:40 Lee talks about what he posted on social media after the storming of the Capitol.

12:09 Lee’s church radically changed the entire service that week.

12:54 Lee talks about how he called his church to repentance and how it led to great conversations all week.

15:02 As a leader, you need to set the example for what it means to be slow to speak and quick to listen.

16:43 There are moments when you’ve got to be willing to admonish your people.

Keeping your staff and volunteers focused on the mission is critical to developing your church plant’s momentum and growth and maximizing your impact in the community. 

1:28 Danny discusses the dangers of playing the comparison game.

2:05 It’s important to find ways to reinforce the values over and over.

3:21 You have to constantly trickle the culture, vision and value system in the life of your people. You have to figure out different ways to communicate it, but never let off the gas pedal.

4:31 When people get more task-focused than relational and ministry-focused, they probably have lost sight of the mission. 

5:42 You have to show it in your own life. You have to reflect it, that this is something you believe in, and you’re living it, and they need to be able to see it, that it’s evident in the way you live life and you approach people and you approach ministry as a whole.

6:01 Find ways to celebrate it. Celebrate life change, celebrate all of those key moments resulting from the mission being carried out. And the celebration itself empowers people in a totally different way than you could ever do on your own. 

7:49 Lee and his team continuously set 90-day goals. "We fight against silos happening by doing that."

9:02 Lee discusses four goals he and his team set.

11:50 When your church plant is young, the timing of your goals has to be shorter.

12:39 Lee talks about the six by six system. What are the six things that you need to accomplish over the next six weeks? 

13:25 Conferences are great places to get ideas. But any idea that you get, you should sit on it for a while.

14:03 As a visionary leader, you’ve got to be careful because a visionary leader can reinvent the vision every 90 days. You will wear your leaders and team out doing that.

Converge church planting leaders Lee Stephenson and Danny Parmelee discuss how their preaching preparation and process have changed over time.

1:00 Danny talks about his sermon preparation and delivery in the beginning.

2:16 Danny says a major shift came when his church went multisite and started prerecording services. He began having people give input before he delivered the sermon.

2:55 Danny says the preaching evaluation was part of his church’s leadership pipeline development. There were usually about five to eight people in the room, including pastoral staff and young leaders who were residents or interns.

4:16 He tried to have diversity culturally and gender-wise in the room.

4:47 Danny says preaching got more difficult the bigger the church got.

6:38 Danny discusses how many hours he spent on sermon prep.

8:20 Danny talks about why he loved having a preaching team.

10:13 Lee says you need to realize that your relational capacity is more important than your preaching in the first couple of years as a church plant.

10:20 Lee talks about how he devoted more prep time to his sermons as his church grew.

12:12 Lee says that as the church grew, he took more time to figure out how to communicate so that everyone took something away that would be meaningful to them.

14:00 Danny says if you’re building relational equity with people, then what you say, and because it lines up with your life, will have an impact, even if you’re not the most eloquent speaker with the best illustrations. 

14:27 The ministry that you do Monday through Friday and Saturday will enhance your preaching on Sunday. 

15:00 Lee encourages pastors who are working another job either part time or even full time. You can still do it, even if you aren’t able to put in as much time as you hope to.

Despite the COVID-19 pandemic, 2020 has been an exceptional year for Converge Church Planting. Converge church planting leaders Lee Stephenson and Danny Parmelee discuss positive trends they’ve seen this year.

0:56 Lee talks about how Converge Church Planting started the year with great expectations. "We were building toward an internal goal of wanting to plant 312 churches nationally, among our network, among our movement, and then COVID hit." 

1:18 A lot of people thought the church planting pipeline would dry up, and it would take years to recover. That hasn’t been the case. Lee says Converge has assessed more couples this year than in the previous eight years. 

3:20 Danny says there are openness and receptiveness to church planting.

4:17 Lee says God is using this time to raise up the next generation of pastors, leaders and planters.

4:25 This season has forced the church to focus on individual development. How do we grow our people in this season to be deeper disciples and to embrace what it may be to be a leader on mission? 

5:35 Danny says there’s an excitement that church doesn’t have to look exactly the same as it did before.

6:10 Lee says churches are more willing to release staff to pursue missional causes. It’s fired up our existing churches at a different level to rethink their mission.

8:06 Lee has seen an increase in candidates wanting to pursue a covocational or bivocational method of planting.

8:45 Lee encourages listeners to share the church planting trends they’re seeing by emailing him at [email protected].