On this episode of Behind The Numbers With Dave Bookbinder, Dave speaks with entrepreneur and author Betsy Pepine about her book Breaking Boxes: Dismantling the Metaphorical Boxes That Bind Us — and what those “boxes” really mean for business owners.

They move beyond the metaphor and into the boardroom. Dave and Betsy examine how invisible constraints — family expectations, industry norms, identity labels, fear of judgment — quietly shape leadership decisions, company culture, and growth trajectories. More importantly, they explore what it takes to recognize and dismantle those constraints before they limit enterprise value.

Betsy shares candid stories from building and scaling her real estate businesses, including a pivotal employee departure that forced a hard look at culture and alignment, and her unconventional decision to create salaried agent roles in an industry built on commission. The conversation tackles how fear masquerades as strategy, how misalignment shows up physically and relationally for leaders, and how outdated assumptions can cap performance long before the numbers reflect it.

You’ll hear practical insights for business owners and advisors alike:

How to identify the “boxes” shaping your decisions

Why growth often stalls at identity, not capability

The role of outside counsel, peer groups, and masterminds in exposing blind spots

How authentic alignment strengthens culture - and ultimately business results

If you’re a business owner, executive, or advisor who senses that something is holding your organization back  but can’t quite name it, this conversation will help you connect the dots between mindset, leadership behavior, and measurable outcomes.

About Our Guest:

Betsy Pepine is a best-selling author, speaker and serial entrepreneur in real estate. Her brokerage, Pepine Realty, has been named as an Inc. 5000 Fastest Growing Private Company in the USA multiple times and has earned spots on the Top 50 Florida Companies to Watch and Florida Trend Best Companies to Work For lists. Additionally, the Wall Street Journal has consistently recognized Betsy’s real estate team as one of the top-producing real estate companies in the United States. Betsy also owns a title company, real estate school and property management brokerage. Betsy is endorsed by her mentor, real estate mogul, and Shark Tank shark Barbara Corcoran, as well as leading media personality, Dave Ramsey. Passionate about helping at-risk families with children, Betsy founded Pepine Gives, a 501(c)3 non-profit foundation that helps families facing housing insecurity. Betsy earned an economics degree from Duke University and an MBA from The Wharton School of Business at the University of Pennsylvania.

About the Host:

Dave Bookbinder is known as an expert in business valuation and he is the person that business owners and entrepreneurs reach out to when they need to know what their most important assets are worth. Known as a collaborative adviser, Dave has served thousands of client companies of all sizes and industries. 

Dave is the author of two #1 best-selling books about the impact of human capital (PEOPLE!) on the valuation of a business enterprise called The NEW ROI: Return On Individuals & The NEW ROI: Going Behind The Numbers. 

He’s on a mission to change the conversation about how the accounting world recognizes the value of people’s contributions to a business enterprise, and to quantify what every CEO on the planet claims: “Our people are this company’s most valuable asset.”

Dave’s book, A Valuation Toolbox for Business Owners and Their Advisors: Things Every Business Owner Should Know, was recognized as a top new release in Business and Valuation and is designed to provide practical insights and tools to help understand what really drives business value, how to prepare for an exit, and just make better decisions.

He’s also the host of the highly rated Behind The Numbers With Dave Bookbinder business podcast which is enjoyed in more than 100 countries.

🔸 Grab Dave’s Books: The New ROI: Return on Individuals  | The NEW ROI: Going Behind The Numbers  |  A Valuation Toolbox for Business Owners and Their Advisors: Things Every Business Owner Should Know

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🔸 Check out www.NEWROI.com for more.

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