Winfluence with Jason Falls

There's no question the pandemic had and is still having a tremendous impact on the restaurant industry. In fact, as today’s guest points out, when you look at the history of how and why people use restaurants, the experience has changed. 

Rev Ciancio is a food and hospitality industry influencer. Yep … in the B2B space. He speaks at food and beverage industry conferences. He is a marketing and tech evangelist for the food business. He’s often engaged to consult with restaurants on developing their tech stack and customer acquisition approach. 

But Rev is also quite the b2c influencer as well. He runs the channel @funwithfries on Instagram. It has 334,000 followers. For what is essentially french fry porn. Literally .. pictures of orders of french fries, mostly user-generated content he repurposes. 

Seems frivolous and silly, right? Well he has a long-standing relationship with a french fry wholesaler because of that account. 

His industry credentials give him true influence in a specific niche. His flare for creating engaging content gives him the consumer following. So, Rev has the best of both worlds as an influencer and content creator.

I caught up with him recently to talk about the food industry and its post-pandemic challenges. How he manages influencer marketing for his own local restaurant. What technology and marketing channels and approaches are smart for restaurants to acquire customers and beyond. 

He gives some great insight for both brands an influencers in the first part of the conversation about how to divide your content smartly around various networks. Really good advice here, so pay attention.

Don’t forget to drop Winfluence a rating or review on your favorite podcast app. Also, if you’d like a deep dive on an influencer marketing topic every so often, subscribe to my email newsletter at jason.online/subscribe. I send it every 4-6 weeks and go deep on a topic to make your influence marketing smarter.

Want to make a future episode of Winfluence awesome? Ask your question about influence or influence marketing that you want my answer to or take on. Send me an email to [email protected]. If you’re feeling adventurous, record a voice memo on your phone and email me that file. I’ll let you ask the question right here on the show using the recording. Regardless of how you ask it, I may use your comment on a future episode or your question to inspire a show topic. If I do, I’ll send you a signed copy of Winfluence the book as a thank you!

Today's episode is presented by Tagger, the complete influencer marketing platform. Get a demo to see if Tagger is right for you at jason.online/tagger.

Hosted by Jason Falls, Winfluence is a production of Falls+Partners. Explore the ideas and get help putting them into practice at fallspartners.com. Winfluence is a proud member of MPN – The Marketing Podcast Network.

Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

According to The State of Influencer Equity report from IZEA, black creators on average make more than white influencers. But find a black creator that thinks that’s accurate and you might be the first. In fact, other studies and surveys show the influencer pay gap through the filter of race is still very far from equitable. 

But the influencer pay gap isn’t as simple as creators should be paid the same fee for the same work. Our world is not that easy.

Yes, all things being equal, equal pay for equal work is right. But no influencer has the same amount of followers, the same level of content creativity, the same audience make up … no two creators or influencers are equal. So fair pay for the same work isn’t easy math.

Still, we have to continue to talk about the issue so we can get closer to fair and equitable pay for all creators, regardless of … but also with respect to … race. 

Latoya Shambo was a media buyer at an agency back in the mid-2010s. She had an idea to create a black blogger network, but at the time when blogs were losing their muster and platforms like Snapchat and Instagram were emerging. 

She founded Black Girl Digital in 2016 and started building a network of influencers of color. It started as black women focused, but expanded to inclusivity involving men, LGBTQ+ creators, Asian influencers and others of color. 

Shambo’s mission is to create opportunities for these creators … I’ll call them minority creators just as a broad label … but to create opportunities for them to monetize their content, build relationships with brands and yes, close that influencer pay gap.

She deals with brands and creators every day. She sees the gap. She fights against brands who don’t pay influencers fairly. And she has some ideas on how we can all work together to rid the industry of this practice. 

Shambo and I caught up recently after a whirlwind media blitz for her. She’s been featured recently on AdWeek, Bloomberg, Marketplace, Jezebel … But she stopped to chat with Winfluence and we’ll be all the better for it today on the show.

This episode of Winfluence is presented by Tagger, a complete influencer marketing software solution. With it, you can find, prioritize, connect and collaborate with, measure and even pay the content creators you use for your influencer programs. Go to jason.online/tagger to get a free demo and see if Tagger is right for you.

Also, LinkedIn has partnered with me to offer you a $100 advertising credit to get your message in front of the right kind of decision makers. Go to LinkedIn.com/winfluence today. 

Hosted by Jason Falls, Winfluence is a production of Falls+Partners. Explore the ideas and get help putting them into practice at fallspartners.com. Winfluence is a proud member of MPN – The Marketing Podcast Network.

Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

This is a special episode of Winfluence. I’m going to step aside and let you hear someone else guide a discussion about influence marketing.

There’s another great show on the Marketing Podcast Network called The Endless Coffee Cup. Matt Bailey of Site Logic is the host of that show. He welcomes expert guests from all around the world on a variety of marketing and business topics.

Matt and I have known each other since an event called Blogger Social back in 2008. He comes from the SEO segment of the marketing space, but he is an agency owner, an entrepreneur and all-around brilliant guy. 

You should definitely subscribe to the Endless Coffee Cup podcast. Matt does a great job of dissecting the expertise of his guests. Which is why I wanted to share a specific episode of Matt’s show.

Back in early February, Endless Coffee Cup featured Rashid Al Awadhi. He is leading the New Media Academy in Dubai. Its mission is to transform the Arabic region through digital skills and developing influencers. But, as Matt points out, it’s not the way most people think of influencers. It’s the way we tend to think of them here on Winfluence … as people with influence.

Al Awadi and his team are working to develop people to change the region in areas of women’s rights, economics, sport, environment and more. 

I was fascinated by the discussion. As you can probably tell, this is my kind of influence discussion. So I wanted to share it with you.

A segment of Matt Bailey’s recent episode of the Endless Coffee Cup with Rashid Al Awadhi is coming up for you today on Winfluence. Of course, if you want to listen to the full episode or subscribe to Matt’s show, I’ll leave links to both in the show notes. Or, you can just search for Endless Coffee Cup on your favorite podcast app.

I also want to touch on two fantastic supporters of Winfluence today. You’ve heard me talk about Tagger quite a bit on this show. That’s because they are our presenting sponsor. Tagger is complete influencer marketing software solution. I spent a couple of days with the Tagger team last week at the Influencer Marketing Show. And not only is it great software, but the team is just amazing to be around. 

Pete Kennedy and his crew really do have the growth and best interests of you in mind when you’re a customer of Tagger. I’m not going to spend more time talking about the features. You know I use it. You should check it out too. It might be right for your brand or agency. Go to jason.online/tagger to get a free demo and see if Tagger is right for you.

And, you may have hear me talking about LinkedIn Marketing Solutions before the show, or maybe during the breaks lately. That’s because LinkedIn has partnered with me to offer you a $100 advertising credit to get your message in front of the right kind of decision makers. I use LinkedIn advertising to target leads based on job description, company, seniority, industry and more. That means I’m not wasting advertising spend getting my message in front of people who aren’t my idea customer. You can do. Get started with a $100 ad credit just for listening to Winfluence. Go to LinkedIn.com/winfluence today.

Don’t forget to drop Winfluece a rating or review on your favorite podcast app. You should pause and do it now so you don’t forget! Unless you’re driving. Then do it later, please. 

Also, if you’d like a deep dive on an influencer marketing topic every so often, subscribe to my email newsletter at jason.online/subscribe. I send it every 4-6 weeks and go deep on a topic to make your influence marketing smarter. 

Want to help make a future episode of Winfluence awesome? Ask your question about influence or influence marketing that you want my answer to or take on. Record a voice memo and send it via email … or just send a regular email … to [email protected]. I may use your comment on a future episode or your question to inspire a show topic. If I do, I’ll send you a signed copy of Winfluence the book as a thank you!

Hosted by Jason Falls, Winfluence is a production of Falls+Partners. Explore the ideas and get help putting them into practice at fallspartners.com. Winfluence is a proud member of MPN – The Marketing Podcast Network.

Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

We learned on a recent episode of Winfluence that we’re all gamers. If you play Wordle, or 2048 or Solitaire on your phone, you’re considered a gamer. When you think of the label that way, and filter that label through the lens of influence and influencers, a stereotype is shattered a bit, right?

Gaming is a $250 billion industry. The demographic of a gamer isn’t what you think. The demographic of the gaming audience isn’t what you think, either. 

One of the things about gaming I personally have had a hard time with about gaming is understanding why anyone would want to sit around and watch other people play games. But millions do. Whether they’re watching to learn game tips and secrets to get better, or just watching to be entertained, millions and millions of people do just that. 

Because there’s an audience there, there are influencers. Some play their games for others to watch. Twitch has been built largely on the backs of these types of folks. But others create how-to videos and instruction and entertainment around games. Still others are creating content about the products and services around gaming, like controllers and peripherals.

Gamers are also now teaching people about the Metaverse since virtual reality is second nature to them. Video games have offered VR options for years now. 

There are all kinds of reasons to look to gamers as part of your influence marketing, even if you’re not a tech or gaming product company. 

Jordan Mauriello is the managing partner at More Yellow, a branded content and gaming influencer management firm. He not only has a roster of gamers who create great content, but a team that helps brands navigate partnerships and creative content ideas to leverage relationships with gamers. 

I took another step in my own efforts to educate myself on the gaming segment of our industry with a great chat with Jordan, who opened my eyes to even more nuances of gaming, partnering with gamers, brand success there and beyond. 

I’m sure you’ll learn more as well.  

Speaking of Learning More, if you haven’t downloaded The State of Content Mangement from Storyblok, get that while the getting is good. That free report is available to help you see how businesses just like yours are managing the content mess … creating it, distributing it and the like. Storyblok is a headless content management system and a new sponsor and supporter of this program via the Marketing Podcast Network. The report is a very useful survey of 515 businesses in the U.S. and Europe – companies just like yours – and how they are approaching content distribution through their digital channels in 2022. 

I promise you’ll get some interesting insights and inspiration for your content management plans. That’s The State of Content Management Report from Storyblok. Just go to storyblok.com/winfluence for your free report. 

Hosted by Jason Falls, Winfluence is a production of Falls+Partners. Explore the ideas and get help putting them into practice at fallspartners.com. Winfluence is a proud member of MPN – The Marketing Podcast Network.

Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

It could be the economy. Or opportunity. Or greed. But I’ve become fed up with the ever-increasing price tags influencers and content creators are putting on brand engagements. For you brands and agencies out there, I’m guessing you might be as well. 

In the most recent edition of my monthly email newsletter, I shared some tinkering I’ve been doing with ideas that might help us know when we’re being fleeced by an influencer’s inflated prices. It has involved posing and testing hypotheses around various analytics and whether or not we could use common language from other marketing channels to understand influencer costs and value more clearly.

I’ve gravitated to what I think is a fair assessment of the CPM, or cost-per-thousand impressions, an influencer may produce. But it’s not as simple as comparing it to CPM rates from other channels because those channels aren’t communicating messages of validation via a trusted third party. The channels are also not the same because the costs are very different. You simply can’t engage most influencers for the same cost as running a pay-per-click ad. Or sending an email.

Today on Winfluence, I’m going to share a lot of my thinking on how to adequately produce a CPM rate for influencers. Then I’m going to share several CPM rates of creators and influencers I’ve calculated based on rate cards and other information I’ve gathered from several creators across content verticals and social channels. 

I’ll point out the trouble spots and cautionary tales for how to use and not use this approach, too. 

My hope is that we can start to analyze and understand the cost and the value of influencer marketing engagements in a more sophisticated and analytical way … We can know when someone is charging far too much … and perhaps even start to convince those who hold the purse strings, be they bosses or clients … that there is a way to know an influencer or content creator is worth the investment.

A lot of the analytical data you’ll hear me talk about in today’s episode is information I’m pulling from Tagger. It is a complete influencer marketing software platform that allows you to find, engage, book, collaborate, pay and measure influencers. Tagger is also the presenting sponsor of this podcast and the platform I use in my day-to-day work at Cornett to manage influence marketing efforts of our clients.

In fact, I wouldn’t be able to get as deep into these ideas without Tagger because it offers a couple of critical pieces of information for my calculations. I’ll explain more of that in the episode.

But I highly recommend you give Tagger a look-see. When I have a new project for influencers, I have my campaign up and running, build my lists of potential collaborators, spit out one-page profiles of each for my clients to review and load in contracts, creative briefs and more, all in just a few minutes, provided I have the briefs written, of course. Tagger is good but it can’t write them for me. 

When my creators post on their social networks, the data is pulled into Tagger automatically, so I can kick out analytics reports for our campaigns to give to our clients every day if need be. 

All I ask of you is to do a demo of Tagger. See it for yourself. Go to jason.online/tagger and sign up for a free demo today. It might just be the influence marketing management solution you’re looking for. It certainly does wonders for me, my team at Cornett, and our clients.

That’s jason.online/tagger.

Hosted by Jason Falls, Winfluence is a production of Falls+Partners. Explore the ideas and get help putting them into practice at fallspartners.com. Winfluence is a proud member of MPN – The Marketing Podcast Network.

Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

As you know here on Winfluence, we spend a good deal of time talking to influencers and content creators. We also have had the chance to dive into the talent management side of the industry and see the space from the angle of someone who is mindful of the creator’s business and the brand’s needs in interacting with them.

On this episode, we have an interesting and rare treat. Molly Tracy is a talent manager who came from the brand and agency side of things only to go out on her own and start VRAI Digital, her own talent management firm. 

Jess Keys is a popular lifestyle blogger and influencer … @JessKeys_ on Instagram. She is also one of Molly Tracy’s clients. I rolled the dice and asked them both to come on the show … together. I wanted to talk to the talent and the talent manager about that relationship, how they collaborate to serve brands and Jess’s audience in authentic ways, what the challenges of being talent in today’s volatile market place are and more.

We had such a fun discussion, I kept pushing a little deeper and even got both of them to answer a hot-button question … what do they think of the influencer marketing software companies and managed services? Those are set up to serve the brands. But are they set up to serve the creators? You might be surprised at their answers. 

Let’s just say the software company folks might want to get out some note pads and pens to take some notes. You might also want some ice packs and band aids. This one might hurt a little.

An honest and revealing discussion about being the talent … and being the talent manager ... is on this episode of Winfluence.

This episode is sponsored by Storyblok and its 2022 State of Content Management Report. It is a very useful survey of 515 businesses in the U.S. and Europe – companies just like yours – and how they are approaching content distribution through their digital channels in 2022. 

You’ll get some interesting insights and inspiration for your content management plans. That’s The State of Content Management Report from Storyblok. Download it for free at storyblok.com/winfluence.

Hosted by Jason Falls, Winfluence is a production of Falls+Partners. Explore the ideas and get help putting them into practice at fallspartners.com. Winfluence is a proud member of MPN – The Marketing Podcast Network.

Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Without question, the number one issue that brands and agencies have in the influencer marketing space is simply finding the right influencers to use for a campaign. While that might seem like a simple solution to solve for (there’s a whole industry of software companies with search algorithms meant to do so), typing a few characteristics into a search engine isn’t really a good solution, regardless of how complex the search engine’s algorithm is. 

 But the issue with identifying the right influencers isn’t solely left with software. The issue of discovery is layered and complex. The software is just one method and mechanism. This may come as a shock to you but there are influential people you should be engaging that aren’t on social media. Or at least that’s not where they have the strongest connection to their audience.

 And of course, no matter how complete your list of potential influence partners and creators, you also have to factor in the various opinions of the stakeholders in the selection process. 

Influencer discovery is a mess. I’ll explain more about why and offer some thoughts on how to fix it in today’s commentary.

Make sure you have downloaded that great resource Storyblok has published to make you smarter. It’s a new report called The State of Content Management and is a very useful survey of 515 businesses in the U.S. and Europe – companies just like yours – and how they are approaching content distribution through their digital channels in 2022. 

Go to storyblok.com/winfluence for your free report. 

Hosted by Jason Falls, Winfluence is a production of Falls+Partners. Explore the ideas and get help putting them into practice at fallspartners.com. Winfluence is a proud member of MPN – The Marketing Podcast Network.

Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

My definition of an influencer is anyone who can motivate an audience to take action. Now, that’s a very broad definition. In fact, anyone can be an influencer (or more accurately, influential) under those criteria. 

But when it comes to differentiating between influencers, we have to split hairs. And one category where my hair-splitting axe comes out is the category of celebrities. I think there are two categories of celebrity influencers: Those who are celebrities and also have social media followings. And celebrities who are such because of their social media followings.

Regardless of the differences or similarities, Brittani Kagan works with both kinds. She is the head of talent partnerships and a partner at Portal A. It bills itself as a branded and original content company. What they do specifically is create branded content … so influencer and celebrity campaigns, commercials and even long-form content, for brands. But they also create original content for streaming and media platforms like Netflix, HBO Max and beyond.

They work with celebrities, but also with those I might classify as influencers. If the creator is a good fit for what they’re building, they work with them.

I put my definitions to the test with Brittani when we caught up recently. She shared a lot of insight into how bigger, celebrity-focused branded and original content talent scouts cast their projects, come up with ideas and more.

Our conversation revealed a bit more about what it’s like to create and partner with creators at the highest levels … with the biggest budgets. It was an enlightening conversation and one that should spark a few interesting ideas for us all. 

This episode of Winfluence is presented by Tagger, the complete influencer marketing software solution. You can meet me and Tagger president and founder Pete Kennedy at the Influencer Marketing Show April 27 in New York City. We will be joined on stage by Jenny Heinrich who leads influencer marketing at Ketchum as we discuss the metrics that matter for moving the needle in influencer marketing. Tagger is a great partner for isolating those success metrics and helping me report back to our clients at Cornett how their campaigns are doing at returning the KPIs and ROI they’re seeking. 

Come see us both and hear more at the Influencer Marketing Show. See the full speaker and topic lineup and get your ticket at jason.online/imsfalls. On checkout, use the code FALLS to get a 15 percent discount, just for listening to Winfluence.  

And thanks to Pete Kennedy and the team at Tagger for helping bring Winfluence to you each week.

Hosted by Jason Falls, Winfluence is a production of Falls+Partners. Explore the ideas and get help putting them into practice at fallspartners.com. Winfluence is a proud member of MPN – The Marketing Podcast Network.

Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Can you think of a brand that has done something in marketing in the last few years, not just with influencers, but marketing overall, and they’ve immediately had to put out the fires of a PR crisis because their campaign was culturally insensitive? 

I mean, how can you not think of a few. From L’Oreal to Amazon to Disney … some of the biggest brands, and certainly even small businesses, have either been disingenuous supporting efforts like Black Lives Matter or Pride, or gone to far worse extremes like some brands being accused of stealing ideas or designs from minority creators or businesses. 

The problem in these circumstances is the lack of diversity and inclusivity at the decision-making level means white people are making decisions about non-white cultural themes. Not smart. 

While the solution is certainly to drive more diversity and inclusivity at all levels of brands and the agencies that serve them, that won’t happen overnight. There has to be an interim solution to help brands and agencies better understand the communities they’re trying to serve. 

Now there is. 

And it underlines a major theme in our thesis and discussion of influence marketing. 

Joshua DuBois is the CEO of Gauge, a research and insights platform of sorts, that allows agencies and brands to tap into cultural and community leaders to better understand the communities and cultures they represent. Need a focus group of thoughtful African-American thought leaders to gut check your latest ad campaign? You can find that on Gauge.

While that is astonishing and much needed, what’s more interesting to me, however, is the treatment of influence in Gauge’s approach. It’s not an app where you can filter and search for influencers … those with big online social media followings. It’s an app where you can find people who actually influence communities. 

Civic leaders, journalists, academicians, activists … these are the “influencers” DuBois has collected in Gauge.

He joined me to talk more about the platform and the concept of influence versus influencers last week. He should know the difference, for sure. DuBois served as the executive director of the White House’s Office of Faith Based and Neighborhood Partnerships in the Obama Administration. He also authored the best-selling book of President Obama’s devotionals.

More impressively to me, however, DuBois has been recognized by The Root and Ebony magazine as one of the most influential African-American leaders in the country. Needless to say, it is an honor to have him here.

We also tended to my own personal journey of understanding the African-American experience which I think you should hear. My journey has unlocked a lot of growth for me. I hope it can for you, too. 

And be sure to download the great resource Storyblok has published to make you smarter. It’s a new report called The State of Content Management and is a very useful survey of 515 businesses in the U.S. and Europe and how they are approaching content distribution through their digital channels in 2022. 

Managing content is more complex today than ever. Get insights and ideas on how companies like yours are tackling the content challenge with The State of Content Management Report from Storyblok. Just go to storyblok.com/winfluence for your free report. 

Hosted by Jason Falls, Winfluence is a production of Falls+Partners. Explore the ideas and get help putting them into practice at fallspartners.com. Winfluence is a proud member of MPN – The Marketing Podcast Network.

Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Too many content creators and influencers are building their homes on borrowed ground. And someday, the landlord may well swoop in and hand them an eviction notice. 

That analogy is actually a toned down version of reality, though. When an influencer or content creator puts all their content on Instagram, TikTok, YouTube or Facebook, they’re building their house on borrowed ground. When they build an audience there, they are decorating and investing in that house. 

And someday, the landlord may well swoop in and not only hand them an eviction notice, but will keep all their stuff, too. 

We’ve cautioned content creators and I’ve prognosticated a bit and predicted we’re soon to see a pendulum swing back to old school content creation … I think influencers will be wise to build their own connection with their communities on their own property … on blogs. Maybe subscription based social platforms like FanBase where the creator owns and controls more of the territory. 

And making sure that community and follower connection is strong by moving followers to subscribers … as in email subscribers. 

Build your list. 

It’s not just advice for businesses. Well, it is, but content creators don’t often think of what they do as a business. But they are. Or their content engine is.

Email marketing is not just a thing, it is imperative for any business to leverage to succeed. Email marketing is still the most effective channel in the digital marketing spectrum in terms of average return on investment. 

Who better to help us understand that and how influencers can leverage email marketing to protect their house … and their stuff … than the Email Marketing Heroes? 

Rob and Kennedy are the hosts of the Email Marketing Show. You’ve probably heard me talking about them on a promo before the show. They are also supporters of the Marketing Podcast Network. 

But their content is so useful and fun, I wanted to dive in deeper with them here on Winfluence. We’re going to do just that today on the show. 

Today's episode is presented by our friends at Storyblok who have to make you smarter. It’s a new report called The State of Content Management and is a very useful survey of 515 businesses in the U.S. and Europe – companies just like yours – and how they are approaching content distribution through their digital channels in 2022. 

Think about it … you have to provide content for your website. Maybe a mobile app. Then there’s e-commerce platforms. Voice-activated speakers … Managing content is more complex today than ever. Get insights and ideas on how companies like yours are tackling the content challenge with The State of Content Management Report from Storyblok. Just go to storyblok.com/winfluence for your free report. 

The resource Kennedy mentioned in the show is at emailmarketingheroes.com/winfluence.

Also, don't miss the Influencer Marketing Show in New York City April 27. Get tickets at jason.online/imsfalls and use the code FALLS at checkout for a 15% discount just for listening to Winfluence.

Hosted by Jason Falls, Winfluence is a production of Falls+Partners. Explore the ideas and get help putting them into practice at fallspartners.com. Winfluence is a proud member of MPN – The Marketing Podcast Network.

Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.