You Are A Lawyer: Take Risks and Change Careers in Law

Change management in the legal industry is increasingly important as the industry recognizes the need for innovation and embraces technology. This podcast transcript provides insights into the role of change management in the legal industry and how it can drive positive transformation.

Maya Markovich was part of an advanced team that conducted change readiness assessments and developed implementation plans for big tech platforms. This work went beyond simply installing technology and providing user guides. It involved creating the muscle memory and buy-in necessary for long-term change adoption. At the time, Maya had no idea this expertise would be relevant to the legal industry.

"So the legal industry, you know, hasn't changed much for hundreds of years," explains Maya Markovich on the You Are A Lawyer podcast.

However, Maya Markovich eventually realized they wanted a broader social impact and went to law school. While working in law, they were always drawn to working with technology and the benefits it could bring to both clients and attorneys. They saw the potential to reduce the drudgery of early years of practice and improve efficiency. Eventually, they transitioned to the legal tech side and stopped practicing law.

In this episode, we discuss:

• Innovation in the legal industry.
• Legal tech gaining attention.
• Legal industry's changing landscape.
• Closing the access to justice gap.
• Pro se litigants.
• Legal tech and innovation space.

Law and tech intersect for social impact in various ways. The podcast transcript highlights the importance of leveraging technology to address access to justice issues and make legal services more affordable and accessible to all.

The legal industry has traditionally been slow to embrace technology innovation. The industry has relied on traditional methods and practices for centuries with little change or advancement. However, there has been a significant shift towards embracing technology and innovation within the legal sector in recent years.

"Lawyers are just, you know, they're reluctant to change and the legal industry itself is reluctant to change for a lot of different reasons, but change is coming," shares Maya Markovich on the You Are A Lawyer podcast.

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One example of this shift is the emergence of NextLaw Labs, a tech-focused industry innovation catalyst founded by Dentons, the world's largest law firm. NextLaw Labs aims to drive transformation within the legal industry by investing in and evaluating legal tech startups and working with Dentons' clients on their internal innovation initiatives. This initiative recognizes the need for change and aims to position Dentons at the forefront of the evolving legal landscape.

"[A]lso bringing in diverse stakeholders to the table and understanding what perspectives they can bring is always going to outperform the kind of services that a homogenous status quo focused group is going to be able to deliver to clients," shared Maya Markovich while speaking to Kyla Denanyoh on the You Are A Lawyer podcast.

The legal industry has been historically resistant to change for several reasons. Firstly, there is a lack of client-centricity, with the industry often failing to prioritize the needs and expectations of clients. Additionally, the legal sector has been slow to adopt technology, lagging behind other industries in utilizing technology to improve efficiency and deliver better client services.

"No one goes to law school to sit in a windowless room and do doc review," explained Maya Markovich on the You Are A Lawyer podcast.

However, the landscape is changing rapidly. In just a few years, the number of legal tech companies has grown exponentially, from 75 in 2015 to close to 2000 today. These companies offer various solutions, from court filing and e-discovery tools to regulatory monitoring and client request intake platforms. This explosion of legal tech products demonstrates the increasing interest and demand for innovative solutions within the legal industry.

Moreover, institutional investors are starting to take notice of the potential in the legal tech market. Previously, legal tech was often overlooked or misunderstood by investors. However, as the industry continues to evolve and the demand for technology solutions grows, investors recognize the opportunity for growth and profitability in this sector.

The legal industry is known for resisting change, and many lawyers and law firms remain reluctant to adopt new technologies. This reluctance can be attributed to various factors, including a fear of job displacement, concerns about data security and privacy, and a lack of understanding or awareness of available technology solutions.

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Stephanie Clark, a Southern University Law Center graduate, shares her experience transitioning from law school to practicing law in Florida. She talks about her decision to move to Florida for better job opportunities and the importance of free childcare provided by her parents. Stephanie reflects on her journey of taking the bar exam multiple times and working as a paralegal at a criminal defense firm. Tune in to hear Stephanie's story and insights about the legal profession.

KEY TOPICS:

• Moving to Louisiana for better opportunities.
• National law practice for veterans.
• Balancing law school and motherhood.
• Alternative career paths for lawyers.
• Autonomy and freedom in law firms.
• The challenges of working from home.

The podcast episode also explores the diverse career opportunities that a law degree offers. The host mentions that law students and new lawyers can pursue various paths, including working in HR, becoming a law librarian, and engaging in research. They emphasize that a law degree can change one's viewpoint and perspective, which proves advantageous in different career paths.

"If you went to law school to become a lawyer and say, I'm going to make all this money, I am sorry about your luck," explains Stephanie Clark on You Are A Lawyer.

After leaving the firm, Stephanie joined another criminal defense firm focused solely on criminal defense cases. This change allowed her to specialize in this area of law, unlike her previous firm, where she handled various types of cases. Stephanie also mentions that during her time at the second firm, she sat for the Alabama bar exam and successfully passed it. She praises the UBE (Uniform Bar Examination) for its real-world scenarios and practical application.

"I'm not going to let this thing beat me," shares Stephanie Clark in Episode 106 of You Are A Lawyer.

As a veterans' affairs attorney, Stephanie explains that she advocates for veterans and ensures they receive their entitled benefits. She emphasizes that her firm's approach is to go to hearings and present their cases directly to the judges. This personal touch allows the judges to see the attorneys and their passion for their clients' cases. Stephanie believes this approach leads to better outcomes for veterans instead of simply submitting paperwork, which is often denied.

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Aman Costigan runs a wellness business, is a partner at Shores Jardine, is a wife, #toddlermom, real estate investor, and master prioritizer. Aman acknowledges that finding time for work and personal life can be challenging, especially for an actively practicing lawyer. Listen as Aman explains why she advocates for lawyers and their mental health and why she is creating an Empire of Freedom.

Aman Costigan emphasizes the importance of integrating yoga and wellness practices into daily life beyond just the confines of a yoga mat. Aman acknowledges that lawyers constantly move, do, and multitask and seldom have the time or space for a traditional yoga practice. Therefore, Aman started offering easy yoga breathing techniques and other activities that can be done anytime and anywhere. The goal is to make yoga accessible and adaptable to fit into busy lifestyles through her business, Beyond Yoga for Lawyers.

Additionally, Aman Costigan mentions that she's given multiple speeches about work-life balance but questions whether the term "balance" is appropriate. Life is about prioritizing! Specifically, finding ways to practice law while pursuing personal desires and goals. Instead of trying to escape from the demands of a legal career, Aman encourages individuals to take control of their lives and improve their lives by prioritizing.

Since creating Beyond Yoga for Lawyers, Aman has added pillars to their wellness practices, building their "empire of freedom." She has been invited to speak at women's lawyers groups, where Aman shares her journey and provides guidance on achieving personal and professional fulfillment. During these talks, Aman Costigan also incorporates easy yoga breathing and other activities to provide practical tools for well-being. It is evident that Aman has incorporated yoga into every aspect of her life because even her husband, Tom, practiced yoga with her. Although the two no longer teach classes together, Aman relishes their time teaching and training other lawyers. Aman and Tom met in law school.

Overall, the episode explores the concept of work-life balance and suggests the idea of work-life integration as a more suitable term. It highlights the challenges of balancing work and personal life but also emphasizes the importance of prioritizing personal interests and finding ways to integrate them into one's professional life.

LISTEN TO LEARN

• How to build an empire of freedom
• The value of balancing work, family, and wellness
• How yoga helps lawyers break down mental health barriers

WE ALSO DISCUSS

• How prioritizing allows you to pursue your passions beyond the law
• What it means to take control of your life
• Why you need a Quarterly Marriage Alignment Retreat

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Anne Hamer is not afraid to share her opinion, especially about how marriage impacted her career, her biological clock, and why menopause is an advantage. In Episode 104 of You Are A Lawyer, host Kyla Denanyoh interviews Anne Hamer, a family lawyer from Nashville, Tennessee, about attending law school in New York, how divorce impacted her children, and why she stands in the Super Woman pose before every trial.

Lawyers and NetworkingAnne doesn't regret attending law school, but she could've lived without the student loans. Working alongside colleagues is an invaluable opportunity to learn from those who have already succeeded. The speakers highlight the

Anne explains how mentorship becomes more valuable AFTER law school because being surrounded by colleagues who are further along inspires what you can do in your career.

Networking with other lawyers and connecting with individuals who share the same professional path will allow young lawyers to gain insights from their experiences and learn how to attract clients and build a prosperous practice.

Parenting After Divorce

Anne Hamer had some tough conversations before her divorce. When one of Anne's daughters wanted to be a stay-at-home mom like Anne, she knew it was time to go back to work and show her daughters that they could do anything!

Anne also had conversations with other lawyers and friends with strong opinions about how and when Anne would allow her spouse to see their children. Traditionally, the advice given to divorcing parents is to aim for a 50-50 parenting plan, as studies suggest that equal parenting time benefits children. However, Anne challenges this notion, highlighting that every family is unique and what works for one may not work for another.

Anne's divorce allowed her to see the need for mentorship and guidance with divorced parents. There is so much advice out there, but every family is different and must find out what will work for their family. After her divorce, Anne saw how her children changed, and she dedicated herself to being the best advocate for other families, including millionaire families.

"You got to pay attention to that because kids need both parents," shared Anne Hamer on the You Are A Lawyer podcast.

The Perks of Opening a Law Firm

There are a lot of expectations for lawyers to work in big law firms, but this isn't typically where a new lawyer's passion would lie. Anne shared her personal experience of feeling pressured to follow a traditional path of working in a big law firm and climbing the corporate ladder. However, Anne realized that this lifestyle did not align with her values and instead focused on family law and helping parents through the challenges of divorce and child custody.

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Laura Terrell discusses the importance of challenging our assumptions and the need to advocate for ourselves. Laura earned her master's degree in law school and worked in the public sector before being a Special Advisor to the President of the United States. Listen to Episode 103 as Laura explains her journey and her insights as a lawyer.

LISTEN TO LEARN

• How to get out of your comfort zone
• Ways to transition from public to private sector
• Tips for finding a challenging career role

WE ALSO DISCUSS

• The value of Joint JD/MA programs
• How executive coaches encourage professional growth
• How lawyers can foster a supportive career network

Lawyers and Comfort Zones

Laura Terrell discusses stepping outside your comfort zone for personal and professional growth. Embracing new experiences and challenges, even if they initially feel uncomfortable, allows lawyers to pivot from government lawyers to the private sector or away from the law.

Executive Coaching and Lawyers

Laura Terrell became an executive coach because she wants people to explore the value of coaching and mentoring in career development. They discuss their experience working with coaches, finding it helpful to navigate their career path and determine their next steps. Additionally, Laura expressed a passion for connecting with and guiding others, which they needed more opportunities to do in their previous role.

Coaching and mentoring allow individuals to receive guidance, advice, and support in their career journeys. Coaching will enable executives to learn from the experiences and insights of others, gaining a fresh perspective on their own goals and aspirations because there are many similarities in high achievers.

After becoming an executive coach, Laura realized mentoring provides accountability and motivation, helping individuals stay focused and committed to their career development. Overall, this episode highlights the benefits of coaching and mentoring in assisting individuals to navigate their career paths and make informed decisions about their professional lives.

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Contact Laura Terrell

Laura Terrell is licensed to practice law in Washington, D.C., and as in-house counsel in Virginia.

Learn more about Laura Terrell:

Connect Our Kids: https://www.connectourkids.com

Executive coaching: https://www.lauraterrell.com

Interact with You Are A Lawyer

Kyla Denanyoh hosts the You Are A Lawyer podcast.

Follow the podcast:

YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@youarealawyer

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/youarealawyer/

Twitter: https://twitter.com/YouAreA_Lawyer

Website: https://www.youarealawyer.com

How Digital Media Impacts Lawyers Technology in political campaigns has become essential in today's digital age. With the rise of social media and digital marketing, campaigns can reach a wider audience and engage with voters innovatively. This has become even more crucial in light of the current global pandemic, where traditional campaign methods such as door-to-door canvassing and in-person events are no longer feasible.

Yladrea worked as the Deputy National Training Director for the 2020 Tom Steyer Presidential Campaign, where she trained campaign staff to organize and activate communities. Currently working with DigiDems, Yladrea focuses on finding innovative ways to include technology in political campaigns, as the current pandemic means that we must look beyond phone banking and physically knocking on doors to reach voters.

One of the key roles of technology in political campaigns is in mobilizing and organizing supporters. Campaign tech specialists, like those at DigiDems, are vital in utilizing digital platforms to connect with voters and spread the campaign's message. Through social media, digital marketing, and the development of apps and websites, campaigns can reach a broader audience and engage voters more personally.

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What is Campaign Tech?During the episode, Yladrea emphasizes the importance of managing tech support in political campaigns, particularly in the current era of self-quarantine, where physical mobilization and traditional campaign strategies are limited. Technology becomes crucial for reaching and engaging voters.

Yladrea Drummond explains that campaigns typically utilize "campaign tech" or campaign technology, encompassing various digital tools and strategies. She highlights the significance of social media and digital marketing in reaching diverse nationwide voters. Additionally, she mentions the potential of developing apps and utilizing databases to enhance campaign efforts.

One of the main takeaways from the podcast is the importance of analytical thinking in the legal profession. Yladrea often mentions that her employers valued her analytical skills, as she was able to rationalize and strategize campaign decisions. This highlights the significance of critical thinking and problem-solving skills in the legal field. Law school teaches students how to analyze complex situations and make informed decisions, which can be invaluable in a career.

What Can I Do With My Law Degree?

Furthermore, Yladrea Drummond discusses the role of campaign tech specialists in teaching others how to utilize these digital tools effectively. It is not solely about having a team of specialists but also about empowering others to become proficient in digital organizing. This perspective underscores the importance of building a strong, knowledgeable team capable of adapting to the evolving campaign landscape.

Moreover, Yladrea emphasizes the need for innovative and progressive approaches in the current political climate. She stresses the importance of functioning digitally and finding new ways to reach voters, especially if self-quarantine measures persist. She explains that the reliance on digital platforms and tools will likely increase, and campaigns must be prepared to adapt and innovate.

Overall, the episode highlights the critical role of managing tech support in campaigns, particularly during times of self-quarantine. It underscores the significance of social media, digital marketing, and technical tools in reaching and engaging voters. The episode also emphasizes the importance of building a knowledgeable and adaptable team to navigate the changing campaign landscape.

As of August 2023, Yladrea Drummond is licensed to practice law in Maryland and Texas.

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The podcast features a conversation with Brent Nelson who shares his perspective on the difficulties of finding time for professional development in a demanding job. Brent emphasizes the importance of Twitter in staying up to date with relevant topics and news in his practice area and using LinkedIn for networking. Brent is also a podcast host of the show, Wealth & Law.

The Value of Informal Networking as a Lawyer

Brent Nelson believes in spending time with people and valuing relationships. Because his work in tax law and estate planning is heavily based on numbers, Brent appreciates how relationships and money are intertwined.

"Twitter is definitely one of those hidden gems, which sounds ironic, right? Because everyone's heard of it. But I think a lot of people, they don't use it the way that you and I are using it," shared Brent Nelson in Episode 101 of the You Are A Lawyer podcast.

Having connected on Twitter, Brent Nelson talks a lot about the impact of technology on the legal profession. Brent describes the importance of networking at in-person events, on social media, and with local and state bar associations.

There are many arguments that technology will replace lawyers, but technology and automation will improve legal practice. Technology cannot replace the personal touch and expertise that lawyers bring to their clients. Therefore, lawyers should focus on developing their interpersonal skills and building relationships with clients and potential clients.

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International Families and Tax Law

Brent Nelson acknowledges that all lawyers don't have to be full-service practitioners. Depending on the city's size and the community's specific needs, being a general practitioner may be required, but Brent found great success in international law and estate planning.

Brent decided to specialize in working with international families, which stemmed from his experiences studying abroad during college. When cases with international elements landed on his desk, Brent took it upon himself to learn more about the topic through self-education, reading articles, attending conferences, and speaking on the subject and quickly found himself an expert.

Brent's example of constantly reading, researching, and studying shows that becoming an expert in a niche area requires ongoing dedication and curiosity for many years after graduation from law school.

Contact Brent Nelson

Brent Nelson is licensed to practice law in Arizona. Learn more about Brent Nelson:

Wealth & Law Podcast: https://wealthandlaw.com/category/podcast/

Rimôn Law: https://www.rimonlaw.com/team/brent-nelson/

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Interact with You Are A Lawyer

Kyla Denanyoh hosts the You Are A Lawyer podcast.

Follow the podcast:

YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@youarealawyer

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/youarealawyer/

Twitter: https://twitter.com/YouAreA_Lawyer

Website: https://www.youarealawyer.com

Yohanna Romero Baca, a bar exam coach and former immigration attorney, shares her personal experience of not passing the bar exam and how it inspired her to help others succeed. She discusses her unique approach to bar exam preparation, emphasizing the importance of mindset and effective writing skills. Tune in to learn more about Yohanna's expertise and how passing the bar exam can open doors to career opportunities.

IRAC Like A Pro

Yohanna Romero Baca teaches her clients how to effectively communicate in writing using the IRAC format, but she also goes beyond that. She teaches them how to think critically and analyze the law, allowing their original thoughts to shine through in their answers. IRAC stands for Issue, Rule, Analysis, and Conclusion, which is a format taught in law school and used for the bar exam.

The "IRAC like a pro mindset" is about more than just following a formula. It's about developing a mindset that prioritizes thinking, analysis, and effective communication. It's about recognizing that success on the bar exam requires more than just memorizing information and completing tasks. It requires a deep understanding of the law and the ability to apply that knowledge in a thoughtful and strategic way.

"What makes it magical is when the reader, the bar exam grader, hears your original thoughts. That's where the magic comes in," said Yohanna Romero Baca on You Are A Lawyer.

Yohanna's coaching approach is rooted in her own personal experience of failing the bar exam multiple times. It was through her own journey of self-discovery and growth that she developed the "IRAC like a pro mindset." She understands the challenges and frustrations that individuals face when preparing for the bar exam, and she is passionate about helping them overcome those obstacles and achieve success.

LISTEN TO LEARN

• How to overcome bar exam failure
• What the IRAC formula is
• How to leverage the written portion of the bar exam

WE ALSO DISCUSS

• The process of becoming a bar prep student
• Unhappiness in the legal field
• The importance of a growth mindset

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Interact with You Are A Lawyer

Kyla Denanyoh hosts the You Are A Lawyer podcast.

Follow the podcast:

YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@youarealawyer

Website: https://www.youarealawyer.com

In this throwback episode, I am sharing the first You Are A Lawyer podcast episode featuring Christina Lael. Christina owns and operates Lael Tax, LLC, based in Fort Myers, Florida. Her business helps law firms and attorneys throughout the United States save money in taxes with her thorough knowledge of the United States tax code. Christina is a Certified Public Accountant in Tennessee and Florida and a licensed attorney in the state of Tennessee.

Christina helps to dispel the notion that lawyers are bad at math or dislike math. She enjoys math and the tax code. This episode is an oldie, but goodie and I am happy to share it with the new podcast listeners.

Visit laeltax.com and sign up for the Lael Tax, LLC newsletter to receive a copy of a book chapter entitled Hidden Business Expenses. This chapter is written by Christina and will be included in a book co-authored by Christina about the tax code, called Thinking Outside the Tax Box. More details at laeltax.com. You can email her directly at [email protected]

Join the FREE mailing list and get behind-the-scenes content from Kyla.

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Bianca Jordan applied to 500 jobs before opening her law firm. Now, every law firm wants to hire Bianca, but she's already found GREAT success helping families and business owners with their immigration paperwork and is an entrepreneur coach. Based in Boston, Massachusetts, Bianca assists clients nationwide because immigration cases are handled in federal courts. Learn about the brazen power of Bianca Jordan on the You Are A Lawyer Podcast.

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