YourForest

What makes a forest? Is it the trees? The animals? The plants? The soil? A forest is the connection between all these things. What makes it exciting is all the possibilities it holds. One such possibility is its capacity to feed and nourish us. And it may be one possibility that most people haven’t fully taken advantage of. Kevin Kossowan is passionate about wild food and helping people to see the potential natural places hold to nourish us, both physically and mentally. We talked wild food, artistic expression, perspectives, simplicity, taking advantage of what’s convenient, and much more.

Your Forest Podcast by Matthew Kristoff

From The Wild with Kevin Kossowan

Episode highlight

Kevin Kossowan of the TV show, From The Wild, speaks about using local ingredients to create elevated culinary experiences and develop a meaningful connection with the planet we inhabit.

Resources

Kevin’s website: http://www.kevinkossowan.com/

From The Wild: https://www.fromthewild.ca/

Les Stroud’s Wild Harvest: https://wildharvestfilms.com/

Sponsors

West Fraser: https://www.westfraser.com/

GreenLink Forestry Inc.: http://greenlinkforestry.com/

Damaged Timber: https://www.damagedtimber.com/

Giveaway

Enter YourForest10 at checkout at the Damaged Timber store for a 10% discount!

Enter “yourforest” when you buy Episode 3 Understorey in Season 6 of From The Wild on Vimeo to purchase it for FREE!

Quotes

12.04 - 12.16: “There’s lots of things in life - cookery is one of them - where sometimes the more you keep it simple, the more profound the experience for… folks. The more you intervene, the more it waters it down.”

38.06 - 38.11: “For most of our evolution, our life has been centered around food because we had to.”

41.56 - 42.04: “A danger in scaring people off from that connectivity is implying that every meal you always have has to be some profoundly connective... wild food.”

42.38 - 42.48: “Bringing food connection in your life, I think... shouldn’t be binary, 0 and 1, it should be some type of gradient that... fits well into your life.”

50.04 - 50.09: “Community building isn’t something that we've done a really great job of teaching people how to do.”

57.20 - 57.29: “Corporations are... like service robots. If we ask something different of them, they'll do something different.”

Takeaways

Outdoor kitchen/educational facility (6.56)

Kevin operates on a piece of land in the margins of the boreal forest near Edmonton, to teach people about the life that grows and lives there, and connect them to the food of that area through multi-course chef-made meals. With a wood library, the use of plastic is scarce. Kevin discourages using urban accouterments in this rustic space, and to enjoy the forest as is.

Fine dining in a forest (12.57)

The food served at Kevin’s kitchen is elevated and plated with talent, aimed to make people think holistically about local food and take them away from “bagged food”. This helps them experience a profound connection to the ecosystem, space, and others they are hunting or foraging with. It also reveals many hitherto unknown yet delicious ingredients to play with!

Flavours of the forest (20.48)

Kevin shares that his show, From The Wild, is “very undesigned” since nature’s plan supersedes any other. It documents him and his friends exploring the forest. He laments that food has become too much about convenience, but his show uncovers new ground in food. He has built an extensive knowledge base of local ingredients over 8+ years of filming.

Not wild, just non-agricultural (30.16)

Kevin was exposed to fine dining in Europe and returned home wanting to learn more and expand his skill set. He became involved in the local food movement - writing blogs, sourcing high-quality ingredients, reinventing his cooking, gardening, and hunting. He prefers the word ‘local’ to speak of ingredients found in the community of flora and human and non-human fauna.

Food is life (34.09)

Kevin enjoys the culinary exploration of different seasons and locations in the sourcing of local food. Those food experiences are stacked with “actual memories and visceral life experiences”, which shopping at a grocery store doesn’t provide. There is also a higher level of trust and transparency in the connections developed with local food growers.

You’re missing the meaning (37.59)

Kevin highlights that when we are disconnected from our food, “we give up some power about our confidence in making our way around this planet”. Becoming independent from corporations helps regain inner strength, confidence, and mental health. However, he warns against being a puritan about “wild” food, and that starting small with simple steps is enough, and easy!

What would make you treat nature more kindly? (48.59)

Kevin’s most valuable experience in the world of food has been the community he has formed sharing knowledge and feedback. His passion to connect people to the source of food drives his efforts to take people for foraging walks, outside of his media career, to develop cultural attachments that inform their engagements with the forest and its residents. 

Industry impacts nature and the ecosystem (56.54)

Kevin encourages listeners to make better choices as consumers and vote with their dollars to influence corporations to provide differently. By educating ourselves and getting involved with causes we care about, we can make a difference. While forestry has been a conflicted space, he believes, “it is easier for a forester to see the forest for the trees”.

What am I leaving when I’m done here? (1.17.56)

Kevin has a multi-generational ecological approach in understanding the cultural awareness and paradigms his grandparents and other ancestors grew up with and the politically environmental legacy he is leaving his children. His show explores some difficult realities of how humans treat the rest of the planet, and how we are answerable for what we do to public land.

Social responsibility is a moving target (1.33.09)

Kevin acknowledges that what is considered socially responsible changes from time to time, based on the current value system. It is also important to remember that the alleged “big bad corporations” have humans in those seats who are trying to do their jobs. Kevin has also encountered anti-foragers who believe foraging deprives other species of those plants.

Stay connected! (1.40.36)

Kevin believes that connectivity to nature is important to feel inspired to care for it, but how much interaction is good is up for debate. Join him in uncovering many more such issues in Season 7 of From the Wild. Also check out Season 6 Episode 3, Understory, which delves into the forestry world.

If you liked this podcast, please rate and review it, share it on Instagram and Facebook and tag a friend, and send your feedback and comments to [email protected].

Nature. What is it? Where does Nature end and Human-made begin? Where do we draw the line? Why would we draw the line? Questions like this keep Philosopher Dr. Martin Bunzl busy. Martin says the point of philosophy is to get us to question our assumptions. By questioning our assumptions, we are able to re-imagine our reality and dig deeper into the truth. By challenging our most fundamental pre-conceived notions of nature, and our relationship with it, we might discover a deeper meaning, and perhaps some answers to our most challenging questions.  

Your Forest Podcast by Matthew Kristoff

Philosophy of Nature with Martin Bunzl

 Episode highlight

Martin Bunzl, Professor Emeritus of Philosophy, Rutgers University and author of several books including the latest, Thinking While Walking - Reflections on the Pacific Crest Trail, explores philosophical arguments around the ‘naturalness’ of nature and the role of humans in it.

Resources

Martin’s website: https://sites.google.com/site/mbunzl/

Martin’s book ‘Thinking While Walking - Reflections on the Pacific Crest Trail’: https://www.amazon.com/Thinking-while-Walking-Reflections-Pacific/dp/0578882221/ref=tmm_pap_swatch_0?_encoding=UTF8&qid=1628459781&sr=1-3

Judith Jarvis Thomson: A Defense of Abortion: https://spot.colorado.edu/~heathwoo/Phil160,Fall02/thomson.htm

Sponsors

West Fraser: https://www.westfraser.com/

GreenLink Forestry Inc.: http://greenlinkforestry.com/

Damaged Timber: https://www.damagedtimber.com/

Giveaway

Enter YourForest10 at checkout at the Damaged Timber store for a 10% discount!

Quotes

8.37 - 8.44: “The goal of philosophy is the substitution of articulate hesitation for inarticulate certainty.” - Bertrand Russell

12.03 - 12.23: “I want discourse to be informed by a level of mutual uncertainty which I think can allow us to arrive at a more productive consensus about the policy questions we face and again, nowhere is that more true than when it comes to climate change.”

21.44 - 22.17: “We have a romantic view of forests and trees and we have a condemnatory view of technological developments like engineered crops or mechanical efforts to remove carbon dioxide from the atmosphere and I think this kind of binary between what we think of as the natural or the good versus the man-made and the bad distorts the way we think about the challenges we face today, not only with regard to climate but with regard to the natural world in general.”

43.34 - 43.52: “The calculus of what we can do when we think about climate change from the point of view of privilege in which we have excess wealth distorts the choice that faces 6.5 billion people in the world out of 7.8 billion who don’t have excess wealth.”

47.29 - 47.40: “The more we are individuals and alienated from our communities, the harder it is to... engage in behaviour that is not selfish.”

Takeaways

Hesitate to be certain (4.57)

After completing his Ph.D. in the philosophy of science at the University of Minnesota, Martin taught philosophy for 40 years at Rutgers University. He has been attempting to analyze the catastrophic risk of climate change since 2008. His book intends to make readers question their assumptions and the things they take for granted with respect to climate change and ecology. 

To stroll or to hike, that is the question (14.07)

Martin makes a distinction in the book between strolling, which is conducive to creative thinking, and hiking, which “to some extent, dulls the mind”. Each chapter is a meditation on a certain section of the Pacific Crest Trail (PCT). Hiking the PCT would not have lent him the same focus and opportunity to engage with nature as strolling did.

Natural, good; human-made; bad? (19.09)

Martin laments that the philosophy of nature is a neglected subject since nature is too wide and complex for modern analytic philosophers to articulate on and our relationship with nature is overlaid with assumptions of what is natural. He traces the historical roots of the binary discourse on natural vs. human-made and how that informs our understanding of the subject.

“This idea of freezing nature is profoundly unnatural” (23.09)

Martin explains that environmental science considers humans a part of nature, including the plastic pollution we create. A pure image of nature excludes human lives from it, as evidenced by John Muir’s displacement of indigenous people to create Yosemite National Park, an artificially curated experience of nature.

Romanticizing the ‘natural’ (25.41)

Martin acknowledges that our concept of nature is shaped by the experiences we grew up in. He speaks about the extinction of large mammals due to overhunting and the burning of forests in North America even before the arrival of Columbus. Most plants in Hawaii are what would be considered ‘invasive’ today and have floated across the ocean to it. 

Are there ‘shoulds’ in nature? (31.20)

Martin challenges the concept of a ‘duty to nature’ as an anthropocentric moral discourse, and claims that nature does not have an interest in existing and warns against ascribing ethical standing to all components of nature if they cannot be given the same rights as humans. He believes that overpopulation is inversely related to economic and environmental wellbeing.  

The curse of magical thinking (40.01)

Martin blames Al Gore for deceiving the public about having a risk-free, no-cost alternative by stating in 2008 that if we tried, we could be a fossil-free economy in 8 years. This “first world discourse that frames debates about climate” ignores the limitations of those in poverty. Only when people collectively demand that politicians address climate change will progress occur.

Generational gratification (46.47)

Martin highlights the intergenerational connection in forest management, where trees planted by one person will only be available after two generations to the population that continues to live there. “Self-interest with high-blown discussions” ignores the processes of nature. He encourages respect and humility to lead to treading carefully in nature.

The zen notion of nature (53.39)

Martin encourages thinking about life as one organism of which we are spatially separated but interconnected parts, which began when life began in the universe and will end when all life goes extinct. This may help in reducing generalizations and self-interest by extending the definition of self to all of nature.

If you were a chair… (56.52)

Martin discusses the source of value of an organism and the right value to assign it, a philosophically difficult problem to solve. A human-centered analysis outlines some values that promote the maximum collective wellbeing of all organisms that have moral standing, determined by their sentience.

The jiu-jitsu move (1.01.41)

Martin explains that philosophy plays a process role in questioning the assumptions two parties take for granted before indulging in discourse, which can also help in arriving at the exact opposite conclusion as one’s opponent. However, philosophy can settle an argument too, by invalidating two inconsistent statements.

Climate change is like nuclear destruction (1.05.07)

For events without a history, it is difficult to calculate the risk or probability of a catastrophic outcome, Martin notes. Taking a stand from an individual as well as a public policy perspective calls for conceptual and mathematical thinking. The concentration of greenhouse gases in the atmosphere today could spell doom if it increased every year.

Step back just enough (1.10.17)

Martin calls for examining the notion of ‘protecting nature’ and the way in which it is done. Humans cannot know the consequences of customizing nature and therefore, “the best course of action for us is to leave the world no worse off than we find it”. However, we needn’t live by the ‘precautionary principle’ of inaction either.

Did you rationalize an emotion and call it a fact? (1.14.18)

Martin points out that we are under the illusion that our conscious brain is in control of ourselves. He cites Jonathan Haidt’s research mapping the areas of the brain that are involved in responding to visuals, showing that the crude parts of the brain kick in before cognitive functioning does.

Nature is better understood as a cultural project (1.17.23)

Humans also deny the social development of our cognitive content. Individualistic cultures are at risk of acting destructively in nature. However, Martin is of the opinion that “human beings are an inventive species” and investing in the technical approaches to solve nature’s problems can bring hope for a solution.

If you liked this podcast, please rate and review it, share it on Instagram and Facebook and tag a friend, and send your feedback and comments to [email protected].

As stewards of the land, it is the duty of all environmental professionals to look after all forest values forever. We have gotten good at managing for plants and animals, water, and recreation. Unfortunately, Indigenous values have been left behind. Indigenous people have been left behind. The only way we can properly account for Indigenous values and needs is to understand where they come from and what they have been through. We must look into the dark depths of Canada’s past and accept it for what it is. Perhaps when we all understand we can seek to forge a new path forward together. If we want forest management to succeed, we need Indigenous people to succeed. Let’s start by hearing their story.

Your Forest Podcast by Matthew Kristoff

Honouring Truth with Michael Gubbels

Episode highlight

Michael Gubbels shares the history of Indigenous peoples in Canada and the ways in which non-indigenous people can be allies in the journey towards truth and reconciliation.

Resources

The Story of A National Crime by P. H. Bryce: https://www.amazon.ca/Story-National-Crime-Classic-Reprint/dp/1397731877/ref=sr_1_1?dchild=1&gclid=Cj0KCQjw0emHBhC1ARIsAL1QGNcwr5dAtqYafPdHkAaxTuLIEA8xEwwoQfpFIkO3MO5hzYwZgfdAvSUaAiaIEALw_wcB&hvadid=231246495818&hvdev=c&hvlocphy=9061281&hvnetw=g&hvqmt=e&hvrand=13170726457531781699&hvtargid=kwd-407004869754&hydadcr=10144_9613689&keywords=the+story+of+a+national+crime&qid=1627082477&sr=8-1

Dr. Gabor Maté’s theories: https://drgabormate.com/

Truth and Reconciliation Commission of Canada - Calls to Action: http://trc.ca/assets/pdf/Calls_to_Action_English2.pdf

United Nations Declaration on the Rights of Indigenous Peoples: https://www.un.org/development/desa/indigenouspeoples/declaration-on-the-rights-of-indigenous-peoples.html

Sponsors

West Fraser: https://www.westfraser.com/

GreenLink Forestry Inc.: http://greenlinkforestry.com/

Damaged Timber: https://www.damagedtimber.com/

Giveaway

Enter YourForest10 at checkout at the Damaged Timber store for a 10% discount!

Quotes

29.37 - 30.15: “A lot of... international organizations... United Nations, academic organizations, corporations, companies... they are realizing this more and more that there is such a benefit to partnering with indigenous peoples, to working with them in their cultures, in areas of biodiversity conservation, balancing development.”

31.30 - 31.38: “The simplicity in hearing the wind is medicine; smelling the trees and the plants, it’s medicine.”

1.02.16 - 1.02.33: “Love, compassion, determination - those 3 things will change the world.”

1.48.00 - 1.48.16: “Sometimes, when people criticize, it says more about them than it does about me... It says more about where they are coming from and how they see the world, and I don't need to… take all that on because I believe in myself and I know I’m doing the best I can.”

2.00.00 - 2.00.06: “Mother Earth gives to us freely, so we are to give to each other freely and to the earth freely.”

Takeaways

“From your heart to your head” (13.25)

Michael acknowledges indigenous people for sharing this land which is the source of our livelihood and the lives of all organisms. At age 12, when he first found out that he was Métis on his mother’s side, he was ashamed because he had grown up in the prairies with myths and misconceptions about indigenous people. At 22, he joined the Aboriginal Student Union in hopes of a scholarship but ended up learning about and loving his culture.

“Don’t just pray with your mind, pray with your heart” (19.22)

Michael shares his experience at a sweat lodge, where he learned the power of praying alongside others, and the resilience and strength prayer can bestow on you. He worked with elders to learn more about praying and even manifested the woman of his dreams through sincere, humble prayer. He is grateful for the beauty and wisdom he has discovered in his culture through the teachings shared by elders.

From shame to connectedness (31.30)

Michael encourages others like him to look beyond the negative messaging they have grown up with, and learn about indigenous cultures with an open mind and heart. He is mindful that residential schools, RCMP officials and priests taught children to be ashamed of their culture, history and ancestry and tore them away from the elders and sources of knowledge. Other government measures and like banning ceremonies and impoverishment reinforced the shame.

Residential schools more dangerous than World War I (43.18)

Michael recommends the book The Story of A National Crime by P. H. Bryce, which exposes the countless deaths in residential schools due to dangerously unhealthy conditions. When the children were living in their own homes, they led healthier lives than even settlers’ children. The schools were rife with medical experiments, assaults and sexual abuse. There are many more hidden graves of children yet to be uncovered for the truth to be revealed.

Intergenerational trauma (56.44) 

Michael quotes Dr. Gabor Maté’s theory on trauma, addiction, stress and childhood development to explain why residential school survivors took to addictions to escape their realities and numb their pain, loneliness and depression and passed on the trauma through their familial generations due to lack of healing opportunities. Elders teach that it will take fewer generations to heal if we create a safe, understanding and compassionate society.

All Canadians are my brothers and sisters (1.03.51)

Michael believes that people “try to do the best they can with what they have” and that those who are ignorant of indigenous issues have just not received the correct teachings. Reconciliation is about “no shame, no blame, no guilt” so a space to share the truth and grow in a community is needed. By modelling compassion, love and determination, people can be taught to undo their biases, which can lead to the resolution of many other issues in society.

When a language dies, a university worth of knowledge is lost (1.17.32)

Michael highlights some First Nations are in danger of losing their cultures because of the dwindling numbers of language speakers. Some Nations have mandated that all their members learn one new word a day, which, in a few years, will ensure that most people can speak the language fluently. He hopes that the government and all Canadian citizens support such initiatives which will benefit the children, economy, environment and international reputation.

“It’s hard but it’s simple” (1.20.04)

Michael claims that “evolution isn’t survival of the fittest, it’s the species that can adapt most to change”, and urges listeners to live with love, compassion and determination to adapt. There are many ways to contribute to the cause and be an ally, but the underlying goal should be making indigenous voices heard instead of being a voice for them. He encourages us to be curious, patient and unafraid of making mistakes in this journey as long as we are respectful.

 Love is humility, giving, listening, forgiving (1.39.43)

 Michael says that success at any initiative is the tip of the iceberg, and it hides the many failures on which it rests. The path of truth and growth is easier to walk on with love, compassion and determination and it will change your life and the world in a good way. Love is a conscious journey, not a destination, and it can help attract and cultivate the love, hope and willingness to change and improve that we wish to see in the community.

 “Truth has so much trauma” (1.47.30)

 Michael suggests being kind to yourself when someone criticizes you and showing empathy for their hurt. He asks us to question if our messaging is imbued with love or fear and to face the fears to let love shine through and energize courage to uncover the truth. When people are afraid to live in truth, it can have dangerous consequences for them and the world. “Indigenous cultures see Canada as a family”, and want everyone to rise up in truth together.

 If you liked this podcast, please rate and review it, share it on Instagram and Facebook and tag a friend, and send your feedback and comments to [email protected].

We ask a lot of our forests. We demand food, water, and wood for shelter, but we also ask it to be natural, biodiverse, healthy, and ever-lasting. To many, these things seem at odds. How could we extract resources while maintaining healthy and sustainable ecosystems? With extensive research, forethought, and the right tools we can balance all these values at once. Albeit that balance often treads the knifes edge. This is why we need every proven tool at our disposal to assist us with that balance. Herbicides may be one of these tools. To find out how it measures up we speak to ecologists and researchers about its ecological impact in the long term. We must follow the science if we want all values to persist. No values have to suffer if all values are considered equal.

Your Forest Podcast by Matthew Kristoff

Glyphosate and Biodiversity with John Nash and Matthew Olson

Episode highlight

John Nash and Matthew Olson discuss the use, effects and ecological impact of herbicides in forest management citing research studies and sharing popular opinions on the same.

Resources

Episode 60 - Pesticides with Ryan Prosser: https://yourforestpodcast.com/episode-1/2019/4/6/0nmjhtlqmqqcjm7289suub61vaxodq

New Herbicide Study findings and Field Tour Guide https://fgrow.friresearch.ca/herbicidefacts

The Austin Pond Study: https://www.academia.edu/29076147/Midrotation_response_of_ground_vegetation_to_herbicide_and_precommercial_thinning_in_the_Acadian_Forest_of_Maine_USA

Effects of herbicide treatments on biotic components in regenerating northern forests: Lautenschlager, R.A. and Sullivan, Thomas P. https://maineforest.org/wp-content/uploads/2019/05/Effects-of-herbicide-treatments-on-biotic-components.pdf

Shannon-Wiener Index of Diversity: https://www.encyclopedia.com/earth-and-environment/ecology-and-environmentalism/environmental-studies/shannon-wiener-index-diversity

Ecosystem Management Emulating Natural Disturbance. EMEND Study: https://emend.ualberta.ca

Sponsors

West Fraser: https://www.westfraser.com/

GreenLink Forestry Inc.: http://greenlinkforestry.com/

Damaged Timber: https://www.damagedtimber.com/

Giveaway

Enter YourForest10 at checkout at the Damaged Timber store for a 10% discount!

Quotes

17.51 - 18.02: “We have to practise sound ecologically based management in our forests and woodlands to ensure that there is a resource not only for present generations but also for future generations.” (Matthew Olson)

1.08.25 - 1.08.34: “I think everybody in the forest industry... that would be their end goal, is to try and emulate as much as possible what's going on naturally in the environment.” (John Nash)

1.21.55 - 1.22.15: “As foresters, we’re always trying to have a positive impact... on the environment. We want to consider... biodiversity, we want to consider habitat, because foresters, I think, are just as big users of the forest as anybody else... and have as much respect for the forest as anybody else”. (John Nash)

Takeaways

Forestry: “As much a creative outlet as it is a career path” (10.10)

Olson is Assistant Professor of Environmental Science teaching the forestry classes at Stockton University in New Jersey, USA. He grew up pursuing many activities in the woods and has always thought of them as welcoming recreational spaces. He wants to ensure that forests are cared for, healthy and can provide recreational opportunities to others too. He enjoys teaching about forests to his students and making them engaged in forestry.

Jack of all trades (12.53)

Nash is a Forest Ecologist with GreenLink Forestry. He had always enjoyed the forests in Northern Ontario and Manitoba, and his father was a hard rock geologist, in whose footsteps he followed for 15 years. After having a family, he changed his major to environmental studies and biology and was mentored by Jeff Wang. Nash enjoys the multidisciplinary aspect of ecology and increasing his knowledge about many different disciplines under ecology.

Respecting the various demands on forests (17.12)

Olson points out that along with being recreational, the woods also provide wood products. His focus is on extracting timber from forests and woodlands in a way that “doesn’t undercut our ability to meet present and future needs” and keeps ecosystems healthy for all. Nash comments that industrial and recreational pressures on forests need to be balanced, and that forest management is an important aspect of fire management.

First thoughts on herbicides (22.54)

Growing up in New Jersey, Olson thought herbicides were only applied in yards and farmlands, not the woods, and only learnt about herbicide application in vegetation management at university. He was concerned about their use, but his mind was opened by Dr. Robert Wagner, who used a rigorous experimental framework to explain the pros and cons of herbicide technology. Nash had not heard much about herbicides being contentious till recently.

Olson and The Austin Pond Study (26.55)

In his post-doctoral research, Olson was introduced to The Austin Pond Study (long-term effects of herbicide and precommercial thinning treatments on species composition, stand structure, and net present value in spruce-fir stands in Maine) and worked on long-term data sets of silviculture studies to evaluate long-term consequences in the woods. He has been involved with the new experimental design overlays and new treatments of The Austin Pond Study.

Herbicides and biodiversity (30.33)

Nash was involved in a similar study in the early 2000s but it had more of a focus on the impacts of herbicides on trees. The study he is involved in now has a focus on biodiversity, collecting information about lower vegetation. He investigated if herbicides affect sites in any way in the long term using many biodiversity indicators to understand the impact of herbicides on soil properties. Olson, too, used biodiversity as a way to evaluate the impact on soil.

Differences in herbicide-treated and untreated areas (38.40)

In his study, Nash found no significant differences between the areas that had herbicide application and those that didn’t, other than there was much more feather moss in the undertreated areas. Olson discusses that glyphosate was tested in the Austin Pond study, and 20-30 years later, the treated areas were conifer-dominated, while the untreated areas were deciduous-dominated, but there weren’t any other effects seen in the soil.

Pre-research and post-research differences of opinion (43.46)

Nash wasn’t biased towards any outcome of herbicides before beginning his study. Olson had noticed during The Austin Pond Study that sprayed areas had lower diversity and unsprayed areas had rich floors. However, in his later study, he found that areas that had precommercial thinning had the highest richness in diversity and cover, irrespective of herbicide application. Both explain that glyphosate does not last long in the soil and breaks down into non-toxic forms.

What glyphosate really does (53.18)

Olson highlights that glyphosates are more selective against aspen than against maple and that areas were sampled extensively to have definitive data. Nash found that there was a 5% difference in cover on average with 3 indicator species, and there were some differences in earlier flora. Olson is interested in doing a follow-up study to investigate the life cycle aspects of the plants.

Additional perspectives (1.06.28)

Nash believes that long-term data following forest fires would be valuable to integrate into the current studies. Olson shares that not just the intensity of burns but different factors of the burns will predict future outcomes of the forest. He wants to broaden the spectrum of different management intensities, including areas where ecological forest management and silviculture are being applied. Nash refers to some such studies being done in the southeastern states.

The fluctuations in biodiversity (1.10.55)

Nash explains that biodiversity can be investigated by seeing if herbicides inhibited vegetation or stopped the competing vegetation enough to support the desired vegetation. Chemical analyses and accounting for micro variants in the soil must be done for this. Olson claims that affecting the forest composition and structure may have habitat impacts that are detrimental to some species and beneficial to others. The Austin Pond study is being revamped to do this.

Nash and Olson on herbicides (1.21.33)

Nash is of the opinion that most people understand they are having an impact on the environment, and those who enjoy the forest have a lot of respect for it. He supports the use of herbicides in forest management. Olson laments that people think forests are not impacted by humans, and they have negative perceptions about applying herbicides to manage forests. He has seen more positive effects of herbicides than negative.

The advantages of forest management (1.29.41)

One of the advantages of forest management and silviculture is that we can increase crop rotation and supply the economy with more wood, Nash says. Olson mentions the control of the government on crown land and offers that producing the same amount of timber on a smaller acreage can free up some other areas for different uses while maintaining the same ecological function on those areas. Forest management is a mitigation strategy to manage climate change and protect biodiversity.

If you liked this podcast, please rate and review it, share it on Instagram and Facebook and tag a friend, and send your feedback and comments to [email protected].

How does music impact your life? Does it make you happy or sad, giddy, or intense? Does it make you relax or reflect on life? Does it change the way you think about and relate to reality? It does all those things for me. So, I wanted to explore the intersection between art and science and how one can make us think differently about the other. Ben Cosgrove’s art is inspired by nature and our relationship with it, so who better to speak to.

Your Forest Podcast by Matthew Kristoff

The Trouble With Wilderness with Ben Cosgrove

Episode highlight

Ben Cosgrove is a travelling composer-performer whose music explores themes of landscape, place, and environment. He has held artist residencies and fellowships with institutions including the National Park Service, the National Forest Service, Harvard University, Middlebury College, the Schmidt Ocean Institute, and the Sitka Center for Art & Ecology.

His nonfiction has appeared in Orion, Taproot, Northern Woodlands, Appalachia, and other publications. Ben’s fourth studio album, The Trouble With Wilderness, was released on April 23rd, 2021. In this episode, he talks about his relationship with nature and the role art plays in helping us relate to nature and the way it affects our decision-making in environmental management.

Resources

Ben’s website: https://www.bencosgrove.com/

Northern Woodlands Magazine: https://northernwoodlands.org/

Sponsors

West Fraser: https://www.westfraser.com/

GreenLink Forestry Inc.: http://greenlinkforestry.com/

Damaged Timber: https://www.damagedtimber.com/

Giveaway

Enter YourForest10 at checkout at the Damaged Timber store for a 10% discount!

Quotes

23.21 - 23.43: “If by hearing me sit on stage every night and... tell stories about... how these different landscapes and environments and places have influenced and affected me, then I might... inspire somebody else to wonder about how the places that they inhabit and move through and care for affect them.”

28.34 - 28.47: “The trees outside your office... they all kind of rhyme with each other and just because it’s in a city and … surrounded by concrete doesn’t mean it's not also nature.”

30.03 - 30.16: “Just because there is wilderness out there doesn’t mean that you don’t also have a responsibility to... treat the nature in your own life with... respect and awe and interest and reverence.”

44.57 - 45.17: “When I write... I have to imagine that if my work or if that of any other environmental artist is influencing the thinking or eventually the work of a scientist, it’s by appealing to them as a person first and a scientist second”.

1.05.17 - 1.05.29: “I am of the opinion that... a lot of our broader environmental problems and issues are... not the result of... malevolence but of neglect.”

Takeaways

Playing about the world (6.50)

As a pianist, Ben identifies as a folk songwriter more than a classical composer, whose music is inspired by the environment, landscape and place. As a child, his piano teacher encouraged him to use music to understand his place in the world and he now expresses his feelings through music about geography. 

Greater than the sum of its sounds (11.24)

Ben has moved from an objective data-driven musical portrait of an environment to a more emotionally resonant use of data to inspire his music. He talks about a piece he created based on a study on two species of megafauna, where their interactions, both pleasant and conflicting, were depicted using a cello and a viola.

Soundscapes and conversation (16.41)

Ben’s music is an interpretation of his interest in “topography and what it feels like to be a person-sized person in differently shaped landscapes”. His travels feed his nuanced understanding of being in a place and compel him to pay attention to how qualitatively different each place is.

What does your soul feel like? (19.55)

Ben’s natural interests and abilities in discovering the nature of the self combine with his interest in scientific understandings of different landscapes and places. Though he does not make music with the intention of advocacy, he hopes that his joyful self-expression helps others rediscover their connection with even mundane and lesser-noticed landscapes like sidewalk weeds.

Inspiration begins at home (27.45)

Ben’s new album, The Trouble With Wildnerness, is named after “an argument against conflating wilderness and nature or even wilderness and wildness”. He admits that it took being stuck at home during the pandemic for him to discover the beauty of nature at his doorstep. His new music evokes the smaller features of ecosystems instead of the sweep of landscapes.

Connecting through interpretations (35.36)

Ben considers landscape painters and nature essayists as more his role models than musicians. He finds value in others unexpectedly emotionally resonating with his musical interpretation of nature. “The best thing art can do… [is] providing a point of connection that might otherwise be hard to articulate”, he claims. 

“Half of the work of the song is letting it be interpreted by somebody else” (38.50)

Ben is mindful that “there is a lot… that art can do to frame public understanding of what a place is and what it means”, whether positive or negative and could present a narrow or reductive definition of a place too without the artist intending to. However, he appreciates how being interpreted lends his music new meaning and allows him to be a part of his audience’s lives.

“I write for people and scientists are people” (44.29)

Ben has done a few residencies where he has created music in response to scientific research, using art to communicate his feelings to others, who may find value in his illustration of science. Though he is unaware of any research inspired by his music, he is confident that his music can “do a bit to show the public what science can do”.

“Getting those conversations started makes the world run better” (1.02.47)

Ben believes that the ways in which people act as stewards of one environment or landscape over another have a lot to do with the art they consume about it that has helped frame those places in their minds. He hopes his music compels people to discover and think critically about how they feel about a place, even if it is in disagreement with how he expresses his feelings.

Stay in touch! (1.16.48)

To learn more about Ben and his work, visit his website and listen to his new album, read his essays and dive deep into his philosophy surrounding nature!

Humans love the outdoors. We love to observe it, recreate in it, listen to it, and we depend on its resources to drive our economy and build cool stuff. Unfortunately, the way we go about extracting some of these resources can sometimes leave nature worse for wear. In comes land reclamation to save the day! Reclamation of environmental resources is a tricky, complex, and fascinating science. From building soils like Anthroposols (human-made soil) to fixing waterways, land reclamation is one very cool way to rebuild what was lost.

Your Forest Podcast by Matthew Kristoff

Defining Land Reclamation with Anne Naeth

Episode highlight

Dr. Anne Naeth is Professor of Land Reclamation and Restoration Ecology, Director of the Land Reclamation International Graduate School (LRIGS), Director of the Energy Systems Signature Area, Director of the Future Energy Systems Research Program, all at the University of Alberta. In this episode, she defines the types of land reclamation and who should be held responsible for it and how to create a sustainable future for us all.

Resources

University of Alberta’s Bachelor of Science in Environmental and Conservation Sciences | Major

in Land Reclamation:

https://www.ualberta.ca/agriculture-life-environment-sciences/programs/undergraduate-

programs/degree-programs/environmental-conservation-sciences/land-reclamation/index.html

Sponsors

West Fraser: https://www.westfraser.com/

GreenLink Forestry Inc.: http://greenlinkforestry.com/

Damaged Timber: https://www.damagedtimber.com/

Giveaway

Enter YourForest10 at checkout at the Damaged Timber store for a 10% discount!

Quotes

16.08 - 16.23: “Land reclamation, put very simply, is taking land that has been disturbed and

reclaiming it, getting it back to what it was either before the disturbance or to some other

productive use.”

17.35 - 17.45: “Ecological restoration is really building that broader ecosystem rather than

focussing on a particular end land use.”

25.12- 25.19: “What is it that we need as stewards of the land in that particular area at that

particular time?”

27.38 - 27.58: “I teach in land reclamation, that it’s not just about our romantic views or our

ideals but it’s about what is appropriate - and appropriate of course is a loaded word as well -

but what is appropriate for the time, for the place, for the people in that particular area.”

40.39 - 40.59: “We have learned so much just by working with nature and understanding

ecological processes that now there is augmented natural recovery and in some cases, what

would be considered doing nothing is the best approach to be taking for that particular

restoration.”

44.36 - 44.42: “We have to always remember that land reclamation, in itself, is a disturbance.”

47.39 - 47.48: “We are part of the environment… we can’t talk about ourselves as being

separate from nature, we are part of nature.”

1.02.05 - 1.02.13: “There are many good companies and they take their responsibility seriously

and they will do the best that they can.”

1.055.55 - 1.06.22: “If we as consumers make smart choices and we decide we’re going to

make our choices for whatever we need... then you know we have a lot of control too because if

we’re saying we’re not buying your product because you don’t clean up your environmental

messes then that product becomes less valuable for that particular company.”

1.06.42 - 1.07.01: “It’s hard when you are raising a family, you don’t have a great paycheque

and... you’re just trying to... make ends meet, you’re not necessarily going to make sustainable

environmental choices. You’re going to take the cheapest fuel or whatever you have to spend

less money for.”

1.21.51 - 1.22.00: “This whole COVID scenario just really reminded me of what we can do when

we put our hearts and minds into it when we work together.”

1.22.49 - 1.22.56: “You mess around with the environment, nobody’s going to buy your stuff. So,

get on board and do what you need to be doing.”

Takeaways

Nature trailblazer (6.08)

Living on a farm as a child, Anne loved nature. When she took botany in her pre-medical study at university, she decided to switch to environmental studies. She worked with the University of Alberta to create an individual master’s program in land reclamation so she could explore the subject. She completed many courses in plant and soil science to earn the first land reclamation degree there. Nature conservation is her passion and duty, she says.

Where can you learn about land reclamation? (10.23)

Anne has been actively involved in developing land reclamation studies at the University of Alberta. Land reclamation is offered as a major in the bachelor’s program in environmental and conservation sciences. The master’s and doctoral programs are a broad offering with many areas of focus. The Land Reclamation International Graduate School (LRIGS) began in 2012 and delves into international aspects of land reclamation, in keeping with the times.

Terms of reclamation (15.30)

Anne explains land reclamation as bringing disturbed land back to its original state (ecological) or to productive use (agricultural). Restoration, remediation of contaminants and revegetation are components of land reclamation. The terms are used differently across the planet and sometimes interchangeably. However, she is mindful of the legal implications of the terms from her experience with the Environmental Appeals Board and considers land reclamation to be the scientifically appropriate term.

Land ownership and responsibility (28.26)

Anne believes that “land reclamation practitioners should be involved in the planning before the disturbance, not just coming in and cleaning up the mess after”. The planning decisions are made differently in each province in Canada based on ownership (private or crown). Landowners are expected to complete documentation before undertaking any disturbing activity and are held accountable to their reclamation plan in order to get a reclamation certificate.

To whom the land belongs (32.21)

Anne believes land reclamation plans should be developed in consultation with indigenous spiritual perspectives and traditional ecological values because “the soil can be rebuilt, the plant community can be reestablished but we don’t necessarily have that sense of place; the spirit of the land isn’t brought back”. Land reclamation has now evolved from only a science-based practice to one where the spirit is considered.

Conscientious reclamation (42.49)

Land reclamation projects have evolved conscious stages to manage any ecological issues that may come up since the reclamation process is itself disturbing to the land. Different approaches are taken based on how populated the area is. Less invasive techniques like drones are being employed for monitoring purposes in sensitive environments. Anthroposols (soils made by humans) are being created to reclaim the land where natural materials are not available.

The future of reclamation (56.34)

Today, before land reclamation plans can be approved, companies have to separate the soil horizons and use natural materials to ensure the viability of the land reclaimed. Anne imagines a time when companies trade soil layers to ensure maximum viability through timely use, though ownership and cost may be hindrances. She also hopes that companies will be given a time frame in which to reclaim disturbed lands and only be allowed a certain amount of disturbance in a certain period.

Miles to go (1.02.51)

Anne laments that there are some philosophical and practical hurdles to overcome, and tradeoffs between the environment and economy that will have to be made to continue our modern way of life. The industry, other peers, and consumers along with regulators could exert pressure on companies to operate sustainably. However, end consumers should not be expected to carry the weight of responsibility through their choices.

Making regulation work (1.09.06)

Anne observes that Alberta has a stringent certification process that has evolved to regulate the operations of companies and hold them accountable to sustainability. She recommends conducting more studies on the ecosystems of the lands being reclaimed to truly assess the ecological impact of the operations and reclamations. Monitoring metrics need to be refined based on the type of land.

Orphaned oil wells (1.15.59)

When companies go bankrupt or cease operations, they abandon their oil wells, reneging their responsibility of reclamation. The Orphan Well Association reclaims these using the deposits the companies had paid before beginning operations. Anne suggests that each company should be given the responsibility to reclaim one oil well pro bono every year with the help of land reclamation students. Abandoned oil wells could also be used for geothermal projects.

The future is in whose hands? (1.21.36)

Anne worries that we may be taking too long to implement positive changes to protect the environment, but is excited by the new technologies and ideas pouring into this space from people concerned about sustainability. She is also hopeful about youth entering environmental careers or choosing sustainability as a way of life and her observation that “the environment is important to them even if they are living in the city”.

What does true equity look like? Why is it important? How do we accomplish it? Jessica has spent her career looking for answers to these questions. Turns out, it’s on us. We have to do the hard work to make true equity and diversity a reality. We have to look our own bias in the face and allow it to change us. We need to ask the hard questions and get comfortable with the uncomfortable. Only then can we all recognize the benefits of true equity.

Resources

Women in Wood Website: https://www.womeninwood.ca/

Women in Wood Facebook Group: https://www.facebook.com/groups/womeninwood

Sponsors

West Fraser: https://www.westfraser.com/

GreenLink Forestry Inc.: http://greenlinkforestry.com/

Damaged Timber: https://www.damagedtimber.com/

Giveaway

Enter YourForest10 at checkout at the Damaged Timber store for a 10% discount!

Quotes

8.53 - 9.02: “That’s one thing actually I've always found interesting about the tree planting camps - you don't really learn why; you are just… told, okay… here’s your trees, here’s your plot of land, get it done.”

13.06 - 13.12: “That’s kind of what’s kept me here, is just being able to interact with those people that really love their job and do their job because they really believe in what they do.”

14.07 - 14.15: “I never saw my gender as something that was an issue in forestry because of the classes I was a part of, the people I was with.”

14.57-15.06: ”We’d hang out with the guys… at the conferences and they would joke about being part of the boys’ club and we would say, ‘No, we should start our own girls’ club, right?’”

21.46 - 21.51: “You can only advocate for yourself. You can only be your own cheerleader. So if you’re not asking, you’re not going to get it.”

25.25 - 25.35: “The sector still totally impacts confidence… If you’re not creating an inclusive environment for a woman to enter, it’s going to drive people out.”

26.44 - 26.56: “It’s a very simple thing to think about but... it has huge implications on the trajectory of women’s career paths - if you are not providing those same growth opportunities, then they are never going to grow into those leadership positions.”

29.21 - 29.27: “Just because you are a male, doesn’t mean that by having women in the workplace, you understand what it’s like to be a woman.”

37.48 - 38.01: “I’ve run into situations before where I have to stop myself and think… am I giving equitable advice and opportunities to my employees regardless of their gender or regardless of their background or regardless of their ethnicity?”

40.52 - 40.55: “The only way you ever learn is if you get outside your comfort zone.”

41.58 - 42.03: “You are never not learning, and don’t ever think that you’ve got all the knowledge.”

45.41 - 45.50: “It was tough to be one of the only women in the room and have a voice…. Some people in the room just helped me find that voice and gave me that confidence to speak up more and more.”

50.35 - 50.42: “I think that there’s a lot of promise for more women staying in the sector and feeling empowered to grow into leadership positions.”

1.03.21 - 1.03.26: “If you want to be more inclusive, you have to do the work.”

1.13.42 - 1.13.47: “You’re only going to come up with unique solutions if you bring in unique perspectives into the organization.”

1.16.50 - 1.16.54: “For me, I don’t feel that my gender has held me back but I know it does for a lot of people.”

Takeaways

The roots take hold (6.32)

Jessica grew up in a wooded conservation suburb outside Toronto but didn’t consider herself outdoorsy. At the University of Toronto to be a vet, she began taking forestry courses to expand her repertoire and enjoyed the subject. She signed up for tree planting camps as a summer job in northern Ontario, her first camping experience which piqued her interest in the industry. She was also accepted into a European program to learn about sustainable forest management.

The sapling of sustainability (10.45)

On her return to Canada, Jessica travelled to different provinces at the behest of the government to learn about forestry practices across the country. Soon, opportunities began to show up which guided her into the forestry industry - a free conference here, a job there, an internship here, a volunteering post there. She pursued her master’s degree in forest conservation and joined the network of people passionate about sustainable forestry.

Somewhere I belong (13.56)

In Jessica’s undergrad program, all four students enrolled in forestry were women. Only at her first job did she realize that “something doesn't belong here and it’s definitely me”, she recalls. At one industry event, she noticed another woman, Lacey Rose, and together, they decided to create a Facebook group, Women in Wood, as a safe space for women in the forestry industry. With a quirky logo and t-shirts, the grassroots network has grown to over 2300 members today.

If the shoe doesn’t fit (18.07)

The Facebook Group is only open to women, and organizations or men trying to join are rejected to “provide that safe space for women… [to] ask those questions that they might not be able to ask if there were men part of the group”, Jessica explains. One of the discussions on the group is around finding gear that fits correctly since gear is not designed keeping women’s bodies in mind. Women feel unsafe and underconfident working in gear that doesn’t fit right.  

Asking for something is a gendered issue (20.10)

Jessica shares that women and men perceive job postings differently - while a woman will only apply if she meets all the requirements, men apply even if they meet just half. They also differ in negotiating salaries, with women settling for lower salaries and men asking for more. She encourages women to have conversations around salary with their bosses, citing examples where just a conversation has led to a 17% raise.

 The sisterhood of the forestry women (22.02)

 Jessica has observed that Women in Wood has become a safe space to discuss many issues like sexual harassment and difficult supervisors or workplaces. Women offer advice, opportunities, examples and personal stories, creating a wealth of information and resources to guide every member. The diversity of approaches and perspectives in this empowering community helps the women equip their toolbox with a holistically informed perspective.

 What women are taught (25.24)

 Jessica laments that while many women enter the forestry industry, “the challenge has been women staying in forestry”. Not just forestry, but all industries need to support women in their life goals, providing equitable opportunities to nurture them into leaders. Men and women are often trained differently, making women miss out on the important skills required of leaders. Jessica learned how to read financials and talk numbers to increase her credibility as a leader.

 You can’t do a forest without us (29.03)

 Jessica suggests that men approach this conversation with humility and recognition that unconscious biases exist, asking employees questions to make workplaces more inclusive for them. When Jessica came back from maternity leave, she became mindful of how conversations with each employee can make the workplace more inclusive, making them feel “they matter and what works for them matters to the organization”.

 The authenticity of inclusivity (32.27)

 Jessica urges workplaces not to view inclusivity as a check in the box, but to make an honest effort. Most organizations recognize that without a focus on diversity and inclusion, they will lose customers, suppliers and employees, since “social media could ruin you as an organization”, Jessica observes. She believes people should work for companies that are reflective of their values and foster an inclusive and welcoming environment.

 You’re not listening to me (36.01)

 Jessica talks about an online event where her workplace had organized closed captioning for a deaf attendee, who later discussed how job postings with ‘excellent verbal communication skills’ intimidated her. This got Jessica thinking about how mindful we need to be to incorporate inclusivity into our workplaces and unravel our unconscious bias. She recommends employers become more aware of these details when looking to hire or advance people.

 Get comfortable with the uncomfortable (37.39)

 The responsibility of inclusivity lies with everyone, not just men, Jessica believes. Society needs to become more reflective of its unconscious biases. Uncovering them can be uncomfortable for each person based on their backgrounds and upbringing, but Jessica views it as a humbling opportunity to learn about other people’s challenges and deconstructing our assumptions around them, adapting to different people to create a culture of self-development and growth.

 Leading the way (42.50)

 Jessica thinks that a good leader draws out others’ successes and knowledge using their own as inspiration. She claims she is a relaxed leader and aspires to elevate the people on her team to share ideas. She warns other leaders against falling back on the women for extraneous tasks like taking meeting minutes or planning the Christmas party but giving them a safe space to voice their ideas in board meetings, mindful of their communication preferences.

 A word speaks a thousand opinions (48.49)

 A man may be described as a leader while a woman gets described as aggressive. Jessica still catches herself when she uses different words to describe men and women doing the same actions, but she says that part of the learning is to recognize that we make mistakes and then correct them. She advises the forestry sector to do the same, asking women for the support that is needed and encouraging them to have conversations around creating a welcoming space.

 Internal diversity and inclusion training (51.43)

 Jessica guides the listeners towards quizzes to reveal their unconscious bias. When her organization conducted diversity training, it was uncomfortable because “you don’t realize how you might be associating certain people with certain characteristics”. She suggests reaching out to local training organizations and professionals to learn about your biases. If you receive a bad report, don’t deny it, but use it to identify the gaps and encourage your team to do the same.

 Say when it’s not okay (58.12)

 Jessica tries to challenge herself and the people around her on orthodox ideas. In the past, she notes, people would brush off inappropriate remarks made by someone that made them uncomfortable. “It’s no longer okay to accept that that's just how someone is and that's the character they are and brush it off”, she remarks. She gives the example of now pointing out how bikini model calendars are offensive instead of ignoring them like in the past.

 Adaptable diversity and inclusion (1.01.49)

 Jessica acknowledges that the process of diversity and inclusion is continuous, and there isn’t just one way to get there. In the forestry industry, adapting has been the strategy with sustainability and with diversity. Organizations who truly want to create a culture of diversity and inclusion instead of just mentioning it in the mission statement on their website need to invest the effort needed to make it happen.

 Working Moms (1.04.49)

 Before Jessica went on maternity leave, she completed a lot of work because she wanted to focus on her child during her leave. Becoming a mother has taught her how to be much more conscious and efficient with time. She is part of a Facebook group, Moms at Work, filled with resources to help working moms across sectors. Her partner is an equal parent, even though society expects her to do most of the parenting as a woman.

 Returning to work as a new mom (1.08.07)

 Jessica puts expectations on herself to be everything and works to balance her work and family life. She sets time aside to be with the family even if that means she spends time before bed working. Her workplace has been supportive in her return, and she recommends organizations conduct onboarding sessions for employees returning from parental leave. This helps them catch up on the work they missed without feeling overwhelmed. 

 Hold your leaders accountable (1.11.29)

 “If your leadership is indicating that you’re further ahead than you feel they might be, it’s important for people to bring that up”, Jessica advises. Pushing your leadership to correct the shortcomings in diversity and inclusion in the organization will help them provide appropriate solutions. Looking for a champion in senior management to further the cause in the organization is a good way to get leadership to take notice of important issues.

 Diversity helps businesses (1.13.29)

 Jessica guides employees to online searches to find statistics on how profitable it is for businesses to have diversity. Hard facts will convince senior management to make a change. “If you want to create change, come with a business case of why this may matter and you’re more likely to create change”, she says. She also mentions the importance of women developing the business skills to make such presentations and drive changes in the sector.

 Privilege and the way ahead (1.15.14)

 Jessica is aware that even though she didn’t have many challenges in the forestry sector because of her gender, not every woman has the same experience. There is much work to be done to eliminate discrimination and other challenges in the workplace. She is now “focussed on building a space in the sector where women feel like they can stay and feel like they are empowered... contributing to something that is long term”, she says.

 Do your part! (1.17.03)

 Jessica encourages women in forestry to join the Facebook group Women in Wood, to discover a treasure trove of empowerment, resources and opportunities. You can also follow them on Twitter and Instagram. Men are encouraged to guide the women in their life to the group and to be a supportive ally by donning the t-shirts! Most of all, she urges men to elevate the women in their organization and highlight their achievements.

Sustainability can be confusing. We all want it, but how do we achieve it? Jake Kheel makes it understandable. In his new book “Waking The Sleeping Giant: Unlocking the Hidden Power of Business to Save the Planet” Jake details one companies sustainability journey. Jake explains how chasing sustainability has changed not only their business but the local environment, economy, and communities for the better. In the end, it is just about solving problems.

Your Forest Podcast by Matthew Kristoff

 Waking The Sleeping Giant with Jake Kheel

 Episode highlight

Jake Kheel, Vice President and Director of the Center of Sustainability at Groupo Puntacana, demystifies sustainability and explains how businesses can achieve it, make a difference and unlock more success in their own operations.

Resources

Jake’s book: Waking The Sleeping Giant: Unlocking The Hidden Power of Business To Save The Planet: https://www.amazon.ca/Waking-Sleeping-Giant-Unlocking-Business/dp/1544520123

Jake’s website: https://jakekheel.com/

Sponsors

West Fraser: https://www.westfraser.com/

GreenLink Forestry Inc.: http://greenlinkforestry.com/

Damaged Timber: https://www.damagedtimber.com/

Giveaway

Enter YourForest10 at checkout at the Damaged Timber store for a 10% discount!

Quotes

8.56 - 9.15: “What has fascinated me about the area of sustainability is trying to find solutions to these very complex challenges that balance the environment with other interests... It’s not just the environment, you really need to have... local people and local communities benefitting.”

13.00 - 13.17: “Sustainability is all about creativity, it’s all about… being flexible and find new ways to do things and it’s… playing in the grey area and… really celebrating nuance and… recognizing that each local situation is its own universe.”

27.51 - 27.58: “Sustainability really... sharpens your skills at responding to big new challenges and being able to adapt to that.”

40.12 - 40.18: “Creating that environment where innovation is... thought of as positive is every important.”

 46.21 - 46.28: “It’s in our interest to invest in those two assets, in our human resources and our natural resources.”

Takeaways

 Ecology and economy (5.17)

Jake grew up in the lap of nature in Southern Florida and in school, learnt about how the environment was threatened. Wanting to make a difference started him on his sustainability journey, learning along the way the importance of balancing ecology with the economy.  

 The trifecta of sustainability (10.14)

Jake defines sustainability as “trying to find solutions to big global challenges that balance these interests of economic growth, environmental protection and local communities”. He recognizes that sustainability requires flexibility and creativity in its application in different ecosystems.

 Sustainability think tanks (15.47)

Jake believes that when businesses apply their human resources along with capital to sustainability, innovating solutions for environmental and social challenges can become possible in a way that ensures profitability and meaningful change.

 Sustainability, a competitive advantage (20.41)

Jake finds that by looking through the lens of sustainability, businesses can find value and solutions to their own challenges, like employee retention. Groupo Puntacana’s staff has been galvanized into a dedicated community through the shared mission of sustainability.

 Protecting the ecosystem one flourishes in (29.22)

Groupo Puntacana has faced and found solutions to the various ecological, economic and social challenges that the Dominican Republic has thrown their way. They now have a diverse portfolio of sustainability projects they have taken on in the region.

 Shark Tank for sustainability (34.11)

Groupo Puntacana ran a Shark Tank-style cross-department contest to innovate for sustainability, and the winning group found a way to repurpose plastics that couldn’t be recycled. The company backed the project as their commitment to sustainability.

Human resources and natural resources (43.14)

Jake explains that businesses must view their local community as their extension. In his industry, tourists want to experience the culture by interacting with the locals, and the locals must feel positive about the impact tourists have on their land to allow that interaction.

Immersing in local issues (48.38)

Jake shares the story of Daniel Janzen, an ecologist who focussed his research in Costa Rica, to streamline his energy and efforts into making more of an impact. Anchoring in one issue is a better way to make a difference to it, Jake believes.

Greening (53.09)

Jake explains that ‘greening’ is a way for companies to improve their image, by taking small steps to become more sustainable. Foraying into sustainability will then improve efficiency and capacity, create an innovation culture and mindset, and attract customers who care.

Failing is good (56.40)

Even though the tourism industry has been hard hit, Jake credits Groupo Puntacana’s commitment to sustainability for its resilience. Embracing and sharing failures in sustainability with perseverance paves the way for improvement, innovation and success.

No pongas tímida (1.04.26)

Jake encourages businesses, no matter how big or small, to begin on the sustainability journey which will add value to both the business as well as the community it operates in. Know-how about the business can translate into more creativity in tackling sustainability challenges.

Stronger together (1.09.01)

“Engaging your employees and your collaborators in the process of problem-solving is incredibly powerful”, says Jake. Employees may see what senior management can’t, and find creative solutions that benefit sustainability and profitability.

Wake the sleeping giants (1.12.16)

Jake’s book is a simple, enjoyable read for people looking to make an impact. Discussing how companies can contribute to transformational change by viewing sustainability as a value proposition, he shares stories from his own life to inspire readers to be the difference.

Archeological finds in the boreal forest have exploded in the past 5 years. Hundreds of new sites have been located with evidence of vast populations of Indigenous people living deep into the boreal forest, not just on the fringes like what was previously hypothesized. This changes the way we think about the boreal. It was never an untouched landscape. People are deeply rooted in this land and the forest itself evolved with people as part of the ecology. These new findings paint a picture that should cause us to reflect on our relationship with nature, and how we interact with it. Kurtis is an Archeologist with a wealth of knowledge and experience in the boreal forest. He came on to discuss how Archeology is changing our future.

Your Forest Podcast by Matthew Kristoff

Digging Into The Past With Kurtis Blaikie-Birkigt

Episode highlight

Kurtis Blaikie-Birkigt, an archeologist with a wealth of knowledge and experience in the boreal forest shares how archeology has provided evidence of vast populations of indigenous people living deep in the boreal forest. These new findings paint a picture that should cause us to reflect on our relationship with nature, and our understanding of indigenous perspectives.

Resources

Kurtis’ blog: https://archaeologyblog.treetimeservices.ca/author/kblaikie/

Sponsors

West Fraser: https://www.westfraser.com/

GreenLink Forestry Inc.: http://greenlinkforestry.com/

Damaged Timber: https://www.damagedtimber.com/

Giveaway

Enter YourForest10 at checkout at the Damaged Timber store for a 10% discount!

Quotes

10.22 - 10.46: “Through better understanding the history of the land we’re on… I can help contribute to truth and reconciliation that way by helping to communicate to other people of settler backgrounds like me about the history of the land that we’re on. It’ll help us come to terms with... the land we live on and... the other people that live on this land with us.”

13.29 - 13.41: “Even though I knew that I was looking for artifacts left behind by people, people didn't really play a big role in my awareness of the forest and the way I was thinking about it.”

24.06 - 24.12: “Archeology is a western science so it’s reductionist and it’s about compartmentalizing.”

25.12 - 25.25: “From a regulatory perspective... it’s very difficult to manage a thing that you can't see... and that you can’t touch. It’s hard to manage the cultural landscape, the stories that are on the land.”

40.41 - 40.52: “The sense I have now is that there is nowhere out there that wasn’t used in the past and if we look hard enough in any area, we’re going to find evidence of that.”

51.11 - 51.22: “Wanting to make a difference and leave a mark and help things move in the right direction... I think that’s where a lot of us are coming to things right now.”

52.18 - 52.34: “If we look at the United Nations declaration on the rights of indigenous people, it’s pretty clear in there that we should not be making decisions on what happens to sites without talking to indigenous people who might have an interest in or a historical connection to those sites.”

1.02.05 - 1.02.18: “Understanding the past... helps us understand how we got to where we are now and that'll help us set up for the future... that’ll help us to figure out how we're going to move forward and in what direction.”

1.04.02 - 1.04.27: “I think it’s been easy for us to drop in and just focus on resource extraction... and just focus on… short-term gains and not see sustainability because we don’t have… 15000 years of family history connected to this land... We don’t see that big picture.”

Takeaways

Kurtis’ changing relationships with land (9.23)

Kurtis’ curiosity about the complexity of life over millennia and the different ways to live on this land were fundamental drivers in his foray into archeology. While visiting and working in Swan Hills, he approached the area from a colonial perspective that the forest had been untouched but now understands that it was a cultural landscape for indigenous people. He now acknowledges and shares with his kids the rich history of multiple generations in these lands.

The practice of consulting archeology (20.33)

Kurtis talks about how archeology, like other western sciences, is learning from traditional indigenous ecological knowledge and weaving stories from each excavated object to create a narrative of a life lived in the past. However, there are many intangible, culturally significant revelations that are elusive to excavation. Consultation is being sought on projects for “better integration of traditional land use, oral history and archeological work”, he observes.

This land is not what it seems (28.54)

Kurtis has learned from excavating different sites for pipeline projects, that most lands are more complex in their history than was previously understood. As archeology advances and more sites are identified, he is optimistic that more such results will be unearthed. He shares stories of discovering medicinal plants and herbs in remote lands and learning about the true nature of the Laurentide Glacier that covered Canada thousands of years ago.

No landscape untouched (37.27)

Kurtis explains that the more exploration and excavation that takes place across newer landscapes that we may not have assumed people lived or travelled in, the more history reveals itself. It informs our understanding of the lifestyles of people then and the depth of time. “Every time you’re out there and you're in a place no one’s been, you find something left by someone in the past”, he notes.

Achieving a balanced use of land (45.42)

Kurtis has noticed the integration of different demands from the land at higher levels in the overall planning, to balance modern needs with cultural values and ecosystem preservation, and scientific information potential with heritage and history. He believes that the use of land is up to the indigenous people, and with improved consultation and engagement, a more holistic interpretation of land use can be arrived at, without regulatory or industry hindrances.

Understanding the past to move into the future (55.05)

Kurtis is mindful that even though they are given permits by and report to the government of Alberta, “putting the archeology first isn’t the same thing as being really open and transparent to everybody involved”. He sees his greatest contribution in educating settlers like him who are disconnected from their own cultural heritage, about indigenous perspectives and history. Using physical artifacts is a good way to segue into truth and reconciliation conversations, he says.

Your Forest Podcast by Matthew Kristoff

Recycling Is Dead with Raz Razgaitis

Episode highlight

Raz Razgaitis, CEO of FloWater, talks about water security, the failure of the plastics recycling system, and how his company is making clean drinking water democratized and pure while eliminating plastic waste.

Resources

FloWater: https://www.drinkflowater.com/ 

Social Media: @drinkflowater

Plastic Pollution Coalition: https://www.plasticpollutioncoalition.org/

Sponsors

West Fraser: https://www.westfraser.com/

GreenLink Forestry Inc.: http://greenlinkforestry.com/

Damaged Timber: https://www.damagedtimber.com/

Giveaway

Enter YourForest10 at checkout at the Damaged Timber store for a 10% discount!

Quotes

 15.40 - 15.47: “I think, in many ways, big bottled water is very much… the big tobacco of 2020 and 2021”.

 16.39 - 16.44: “Let’s keep these plastics from even being created in the first place so then we don’t have to recycle them.”

 31.40 - 31.48: “We’re facing a situation today where there are going to be more plastics in the ocean by the year 2050 than there are fish.”

 34.35 - 34.38: “We do believe everyone deserves access to clean drinking water that they can trust.”

 43.03 - 43.11: “There’s a lot of data that even the stuff that makes it into your recycle bin, there’s a pretty low chance that it actually makes it all the way through the recycling system.”

Takeaways

What makes Raz get out of bed each morning (5.01)

Raz is motivated to end the use of single-use plastic water bottles by democratizing and decentralizing water. He also feels a sense of “responsibility and obligation” towards making these happen for the planet and its people.

A big opportunity to do good while doing well (10.57)

Raz took a natural wellness approach to break free from medications and to make water the healthy drink of choice for everyone. He also wanted to move from a greenwashed idea of recycling to ‘uncycling’ - removing plastics from the ecosystem.

Whether you’re drinking bottled water or not, you’re now drinking bottled water (20.40)

Raz cites a SUNY study stating 90% of bottled and tap water contains 300 microplastic particles per litre. While cigarettes contain 6000 known chemicals, plastic bottles contain 10,000 which permeate our organs. Though tap water is cheap and easily available, people can’t trust it.

A regression back to a positive natural state (29.24)

Raz explains that microplastics contribute to oxidative stress and inflammation in human and non-human animals, and cause the destruction of marine life. Aquatic animals ingest them and lead them into our food system. FloWater makes tap water plastic-free, safe and re-mineralized.

Recycling is broken (41.41)

Raz laments that instead of being recycled, 8 million tonnes of plastic bottles get dumped into waterways every year. Human behaviour is difficult to change, especially moving people away from the convenience of single-use plastic water bottles when they don’t like or trust tap water.

Make the switch from trash to treasure (49.19)

Focussed on ending single-use plastic water bottle use, FloWater is offering touchless refill stations to purify water fountains at schools and other public places, and water packed in aluminum bottles to transition people from single-use to reusables through infinite recyclables.