I chat with my buddy Kevin Indig about what he’s learning in his AI research, along with generative engine optimization, and user behavior in tools like ChatGPT, Gemini, Perplexity, and Google AI Mode.

Kevin explains why clicks are disappearing, why citations may matter less than brand mentions, and why trust is becoming one of the most important assets a brand can build in the AI era. He also explains “ghost citations,” how AI systems seem to read content, and why customer research is becoming newly essential.

Links to some of Kevin’s recent research:
The Fan-Out Effect: What Happens Between a Query and a Citation

Timestamps:
00:00 Kevin on why trust matters more in an AI world
00:32 Why GEO/AEO may be forcing executives to care about better marketing
01:39 Kevin’s research: fewer clicks, more variance, and trust as the key ingredient
05:11 What “ghost citations” are and why they matter
14:09 The risk of AI slop and how synthetic content erodes trust
19:24 Tools and approaches for tracking AI visibility
22:03 What user behavior research reveals about AI search habits
24:50 What brands should measure in their first 90 days of AI search tracking
27:03 Why old-school PR metrics like share of voice and sentiment are back
29:05 Best way to stay in the know on all things GEO

Connect with Kevin Indig: https://www.linkedin.com/in/kevinindig/
Sign up for Kevin’s Newsletter, Growth Memo: https://www.growth-memo.com/ 

Learn more: zeroclickmarketing.co

Connect with Amanda Natividad (@amandanat): LinkedIn | Substack | Instagram | Threads

This episode was produced in partnership with Share Your Genius
www.shareyourgenius.com 

In this Field Notes episode, Amanda looks at new research from Similarweb on the downstream impact of AI visibility, plus Seer Interactive’s argument that AI visibility isn’t just an SEO issue — it also affects paid media, brand, and attribution.

Timestamps

00:00 Why AI visibility is creating a new attribution problem
01:30 What Similarweb found: AI-recommended brands saw more downstream visits
03:00 Why the traffic often shows up as branded search, not AI referral traffic
04:45 Branded search as a “receipt” for upstream marketing
06:00 Why AI may not create demand, but move or nurture it
07:30 The four roles of AI visibility: create, capture, nurture, protect
10:30 Why AI visibility can’t live only with SEO
12:00 What marketers should track beyond referral traffic
14:00 The Zero Click Marketing takeaway: the most important touchpoint may be the one analytics never sees

Links Mentioned:

Similarweb: The Downstream Impact of AI Visibility
Rand Fishkin / SparkToro: New Research from Similarweb: How AI Brand Mentions Influence Direct Visits & Traditional Search Queries
Seer Interactive: Your SEO Team Is Building AI Visibility. Paid Media Should Be Too

Learn more: zeroclickmarketing.co

Connect with Amanda Natividad (@amandanat): LinkedIn | Substack | Instagram | Threads

When AI puts your brand in the wrong category or compares you to the wrong competitors, it's tempting to dismiss it as a hallucination. But what if AI's mistakes reveal something about how the market understands you? I suggest why AI visibility isn't merely a score. It's a mirror.

This episode pairs nicely with my May episode, "GEO Is What Happens When Search Becomes Zero Click." :)

Timestamps:

00:00 — Why AI visibility is becoming an executive question
01:34 — AI visibility as a mirror
03:15 — Testing HubSpot’s AEO Grader with SparkToro as an example
05:04 — What a messy competitive set can reveal
06:21 — AI visibility meets positioning
10:27 — Warning: vanity metrics
12:05 — Three buckets for evaluating your results
14:38 — Turning visibility gaps into marketing priorities
17:11 — A practical AI visibility playbook
19:22 — What the mirror can teach you

This episode is sponsored by HubSpot. You can try their free AEO Grader for yourself!

Learn more: zeroclickmarketing.co

Connect with Amanda Natividad (@amandanat): LinkedIn | Substack | Instagram | Threads

What if the best marketing doesn’t drive a click at all — but makes people seek you out?
I chat with Jay Acunzo about why public speaking might be the ultimate form of zero click marketing, how to build ideas that actually matter to your audience, and why resonance beats reach when you’re trying to create work people remember.

Jay breaks down how to build stronger arguments for your ideas, why commodity content has such a short shelf life, and what it really means to matter more instead of simply marketing more.

Timestamps
00:00 — Jay’s core idea: don’t market more, matter more
02:26 — Why every talk needs to create a real shift, not just a to-do list
04:24 — Jay’s “unsolicited response rate” metric
06:00 — Reach vs. resonance, and why making people care is the actual job
07:46 — Amanda’s coaching session with Jay and the missing “problem” in her talk
08:47 — Why marketers need to slow down and develop ideas that matter
14:21 — Creativity as trial and error, not instant genius
17:22 — Asking questions Google can’t answer
20:52 — Amanda’s favorite newsletter and useful zero-click content
22:38 — Michelle Warner as an example of a zero-click business
28:55 — How platforms reward lowest-common-denominator content
30:16 — Why speaking gives you control that social platforms don’t
34:48 — Jay’s podcast, *Why They Resonate*, and Amanda’s upcoming appearance

Connect with Jay Acunzo: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jayacunzo/
Learn more about Jay Acunzo: https://jayacunzo.com/
Sign up for Jay’s Newsletter: https://jayacunzo.com/newsletter
Listen to Why They Resonate: https://open.spotify.com/show/2xMty2O4GBcG8F7ySudeXl

Learn more: zeroclickmarketing.co

Connect with Amanda Natividad (@amandanat): LinkedIn | Substack | Instagram | Threads

This episode was produced in partnership with Share Your Genius
www.shareyourgenius.com 

Breaking news! Rand Fishkin/SparkToro published a new zero-click search study. In the first four months of 2026, a whopping 68% of Google searches ended without a click. I sound off on this finding, the trajectory of the zero-click phenomenon, and a durable strategy to help you win.

Sources:

• My blog post, which expounds on this episode: The Click Is Now Optional. Here’s What Isn’t.
• Rand Fishkin/SparkToro: In 2026, Less than One Third of Google Searches Still Send a Click
• Cyrus Shepard/Zyppy Signal: 5 Data-Backed Features of Websites Winning Google in 2026
• Search Engine Land: Roughly 3 in 4 consumers use AI to shop, and nearly 1 in 3 won't let it spend
• Adobe Analytics (via TechCrunch): AI-sourced traffic to US retailers grew ~393% YoY in Q1 2026 and converts ~42% better

ZCM Field Notes are short reactions to news or observations of what's happening in the field.

Learn more: zeroclickmarketing.co

Connect with Amanda Natividad (@amandanat): LinkedIn | Substack | Instagram | Threads

I chat with writer and strategist Kaleigh Moore about how content teams can adapt to AI search without sacrificing quality. 

Kaleigh shares her “source signal stack” framework, explains why third-party validation matters, and makes the case for treating LinkedIn, Reddit, YouTube, newsletters, and employee-led content as part of one larger visibility ecosystem.

Timestamps

00:00 — Why employee experts are such a powerful source of original content

03:06 — How Kaleigh started learning AI tools and GEO/AEO hands-on

05:46 — The “source signal stack” and how LLMs evaluate content

09:40 — The messy reality of measuring AI visibility and attribution

12:57 — Durable marketing bets in a fast-changing AI landscape

17:09 — What effective employee advocacy can look like in practice

20:43 — How internal talks can become LinkedIn, YouTube, and recruiting content

26:07 — Kaleigh’s underrated tactic: syndicating newsletters on LinkedIn

28:08 — Where to follow Kaleigh and read her newsletter, Context Window

Connect with Kaleigh Moore: https://www.linkedin.com/in/kaleighmoore/

Learn more about Kaleigh Moore: https://www.kaleighmoore.com/

Subscribe to Context Window: https://kaleigh-moore.kit.com/ 

Learn more: zeroclickmarketing.co

Connect with Amanda Natividad (@amandanat): LinkedIn | Substack | Instagram | Threads

This episode was produced in partnership with Share Your Genius
www.shareyourgenius.com

B2B buyers like to pretend decisions are purely rational. But when your job, reputation, budget, and team trust are on the line? That’s emotional as hell.

I sat down with Talia Wolf, founder of GetUplift and author of Emotional Targeting, to dig into customer research, pricing transparency, AI search, and how emotional targeting helps marketers create messaging that actually resonates.

Talia also shares a case study on how her team helped one company increase free trials by 54% through emotionally resonant comparison pages.

Timestamps

00:00 — Why B2B purchases are deeply emotional

01:36 — How emotional targeting and zero-click marketing fit together

04:47 — Talia’s three-step framework: research, audit, test

05:11 — Why buying B2B software carries more emotional risk than B2C

09:27 — The qualitative research that reveals what buyers actually care about

11:00 — How Teamwork.com used comparison pages to increase free trials by 54%

16:50 — Why honest comparison content can attract better-fit customers

19:37 — Why pricing transparency matters more in the AI search era

25:41 — The KPIs Talia’s team tracked beyond free trials

28:10 — The problem with A/B testing and what to do about it

Resources:

• Unlock better marketing with Emotional Targeting by Talia Wolf. Get your copy now

Connect with Talia Wolf: https://www.linkedin.com/in/taliagw/
Learn more about GetUplift: https://getuplift.co/ 

Learn more: zeroclickmarketing.co

Connect with Amanda Natividad (@amandanat): LinkedIn | Substack | Instagram | Threads

This episode was produced in partnership with Share Your Genius
www.shareyourgenius.com 

Learn more: zeroclickmarketing.co

Connect with Amanda Natividad (@amandanat): LinkedIn | Substack | Instagram | Threads

The best-of-breed marketing stack made sense when traffic was cheap. But in a zero-click world, every lead is harder to earn — and every tool handoff is another place for that lead to die.

In this episode, I make the case for rethinking bloated marketing stacks, explain why small teams may need fewer tools instead of "the best" tool for every job, and share how Typeform’s Growth Flow turns forms into richer workflows for capture, enrichment, automation, and reporting.

Timestamps:
00:00 — The best-of-breed era is ending
01:00 — How we got from monoliths to unbundled SaaS stacks
04:30 — What changed in a zero-click world
07:00 — The hidden cost of handoffs
11:00 — Typeform Growth Flow and built-in enrichment
14:00 — The DTC skincare quiz funnel example
18:00 — Five places a lead can die
23:00 — The new question: “What’s the fewest tools I can run this through?”

For the full DTC workflow, read my newsletter, "Your Marketing Stack Is About to Get Smaller."

This episode is sponsored by Typeform. It features my honest take on Growth Flow.

Learn more: zeroclickmarketing.co

Connect with Amanda Natividad (@amandanat): LinkedIn | Substack | Instagram | Threads

Here's my new rule for demand generation: Ungate the argument. Gate the utility. Ungate the point of view — and ungate the template, tool, deeper cuts, or genuinely useful live experience.

Buyers now have more ways to get answers without entering your funnel: AI search, Reddit, YouTube, private communities, and competitors’ ungated posts. And if your best educational content is locked behind a form, it's not shaping your public record.

The better question isn’t “should we gate this?” It’s: what should be freely available so buyers can understand, trust, remember, cite, and share your ideas — and what is valuable enough that someone would reasonably trade their information for it?

Because in a zero-click world, changing someone’s mind without relying on clicks and form fills is the whole game.

Timestamps:

00:00 — The old B2B bargain: email address for the thing

02:04 — Buyers have more ways to get answers without you

03:03 — AI search makes the gated content problem more obvious

04:00 — Why the public record matters in a zero-click world

05:00 — Ungate the argument, gate the utility

06:00 — Buyers want to engage on their own terms

07:07 — A form fill is not the same thing as demand

07:26 — Three questions to ask before gating content

08:05 — Good gates vs. lazy gates

Sources & Tools:

What is Gated Content? And How to Make It Discoverable to AI Bots by Conductor

Gated Content and AI Search: Why It’s Invisible by Ziptie

Gartner Sales Survey Finds 67% of B2B Buyers Prefer a Rep-Free Experience

10 Minute Email - 10minuteemail.com

SparkToro - sparktoro.com

Alertmouse - alertmouse.com

Pre-order the book: Zero Click Marketing (zeroclickmarketing.co/book)

Learn more: zeroclickmarketing.co

Connect with Amanda Natividad (@amandanat): LinkedIn | Substack | Instagram | Threads

This episode was produced in partnership with Share Your Genius
www.shareyourgenius.com 

AI search is changing SEO, but not because SEO is dead. It’s changing because search is becoming more zero-click.

In this episode, I explain GEO — Generative Engine Optimization — and why it’s less about chasing AI hacks and more about making your content easier to retrieve, understand, cite, trust, and remember. I break down four practical mechanics of GEO: retrievability, extractability, credibility, and public evidence — and show why good AI visibility still starts with good marketing.

Timestamps

00:00 Why AI search is changing SEO

01:35 What GEO actually means

03:10 Why GEO is a zero-click marketing problem

04:30 The four mechanics of GEO, beginning with retrievability

08:30 Extractability: can your content be understood and reused?

11:00 Credibility: why generic SEO content falls short

13:30 Public evidence: why your brand’s off-site record matters

18:45 Why GEO is not magic — it’s good marketing

Resources:

• Ahrefs study: AI Overviews Reduce Clicks by 58%
• Pre-order the Zero Click Marketing book (yes, there’s a chapter on AI marketing!)

Learn more: zeroclickmarketing.co

Connect with Amanda Natividad (@amandanat): LinkedIn | Substack | Instagram | Threads

This episode was produced in partnership with Share Your Genius
www.shareyourgenius.com