The MMT Podcast with Patricia Pino & Christian Reilly

#197 The Problem With Wealth Taxes with Steven Hail (part 2)


Listen Later

Part 2: Patricia and Christian continue their conversation with economist, author, and founder of Modern Money Lab Professor Professor Steven Hail about the well-intentioned (taxing the rich is good!) but counter-productive call for a wealth tax to “fund” life-saving support for vulnerable people (needlessly waiting for the rich to cough up while people suffer and die is bad!) and, of course - those beautiful tariffs.

 

Full conversation here: https://www.patreon.com/posts/126627127

 

 

Please help sustain this podcast! 

Patrons get early access to all episodes and patron-only episodes: https://www.patreon.com/MMTpodcast

 

 

All our episodes in chronological order: https://www.patreon.com/posts/43111643

 

All our patron-only episodes: https://www.patreon.com/posts/57542767

 

LIVE EVENTS!

Modern Money Lab UK weekend seminars in London featuring Dr Steven Hail: 

  • June 21st & 22nd (White City) - Rethinking Capitalism
  • June 28th & 29th (Finsbury Park) - Money, Government and the Public Interest - Beyond The Deficit Myth

Details and tickets: https://modernmoneylab.org.uk/events/

 

JOIN PATRICIA’S MMT ACTIVIST NETWORK (MMT UK): https://actionnetwork.org/forms/activist-registration-form

 

MMT: THE MOVIE!

  • “Finding The Money”, a documentary by Maren Poitras featuring Stephanie Kelton is now available worldwide to rent or buy: https://findingthemoney.vhx.tv/products/finding-the-money
  • Updates on worldwide screenings of “Finding The Money” can be found here: https://findingmoneyfilm.com/where-to-watch/
  • To arrange a screening of “Finding The Money”, apply here: https://findingmoneyfilm.com/host-a-screening/

 

STUDY THE ECONOMICS OF SUSTAINABILITY!

  • Details of Modern Money Lab’s online graduate, postgraduate and standalone courses in economics are here: https://modernmoneylab.org.au/

 

 

Relevant to this episode:

  • Episode 30 - Steven Hail: Understanding Government Bonds (Part 1) :https://www.patreon.com/posts/29621245
  • Episode 31 - Steven Hail: Understanding Government Bonds (Part 2):  https://www.patreon.com/posts/29829500
  • “Federal Debt and Modern Money” by Steven Hail & David Joy: https://www.global-isp.org/wp-content/uploads/PN-121.pdf
  • "There is no need to issue public debt” by Bill Mitchell: https://billmitchell.org/blog/?p=31715
  • “How to Fight Back Against the False Idea that the Government is at the Mercy of Financial Markets” by Sheridan Kates: https://thealternative.org.uk/dailyalternative/2025/3/10/scotonomics-monetary-autonomy
  • Lecture: “The CFA Franc and Monetary Sovereignty in Africa”, by Dr Ndongo Samba Sylla: https://youtu.be/W3P14tpE70U?si=0Dv7dukz_bnQbIbN 
  • “Who Is Ron Vara? The Truth Behind Peter Navarro's Fake Expert” by Brendon Beebe: https://brendonbeebe.substack.com/p/who-is-ron-vara-the-truth-behind
  • For more on the endogenous money view (the non-fringe, very mainstream view that bank loans create deposits, not the other way around), listen to episode 126 - Dirk Ehnts: How Banks Create Money: https://www.patreon.com/posts/62603318 and episode 43 - Sam Levey: Understanding Endogenous Money: https://www.patreon.com/posts/35073683
  • For more on the (Liz) Trussageddon, listen to Episode 147 - Dirk Ehnts: Do Markets Control Our Politics?: https://www.patreon.com/posts/episode-147-dirk-72906421 

 

For an intro to MMT:

  • Our first three episodes: https://www.patreon.com/posts/41742417
  • Episode 126 - Dirk Ehnts: How Banks Create Money: https://www.patreon.com/posts/62603318

 

Quick MMT reads:

  • Warren’s Mosler’s MMT white paper: http://moslereconomics.com/mmt-white-paper/
  • Steven Hail’s quick MMT explainer: https://theconversation.com/explainer-what-is-modern-monetary-theory-72095
  • Quick explanation of government debt and deficit: “Some Numbers Are Big. Let Me Help You Get Over It”: https://christreilly.com/2020/02/17/some-numbers-are-big-let-me-help-you-get-over-it/

 

 

For a short, non-technical, free ebook explaining MMT, download Warren Mosler’s “7 Deadly Innocent Frauds Of Economic Policy” here: http://moslereconomics.com/wp-content/powerpoints/7DIF.pdf

 

 

Episodes on monetary operations: 

  • Episode 20 - Warren Mosler: The MMT Money Story (part 1): https://www.patreon.com/posts/28004824
  • Episode 126 - Dirk Ehnts: How Banks Create Money: https://www.patreon.com/posts/62603318
  • Episode 13 - Steven Hail: Everything You Always Wanted To Know About Banking, But Were Afraid To Ask: https://www.patreon.com/posts/41790887
  • Episode 43 - Sam Levey: Understanding Endogenous Money: https://www.patreon.com/posts/35073683 
  • Episode 84 - Andrew Berkeley, Richard Tye & Neil Wilson: An Accounting Model Of The UK Exchequer (Part 1): https://www.patreon.com/posts/46352183
  • Episode 86 - Andrew Berkeley, Richard Tye & Neil Wilson: An Accounting Model Of The UK Exchequer (Part 2): https://www.patreon.com/posts/46865929 

 

For more on Quantitative Easing:

  • Episode 59 - Warren Mosler: What Do Central Banks Do?: https://www.patreon.com/posts/39070023
  • Episode 143 - Paul Sheard: What Is Quantitative Easing?: https://www.patreon.com/posts/71589989?pr=true 

 

Episodes on inflation:

  • Episode 7: Steven Hail: Inflation, Price Shocks and Other Misunderstandings: https://www.patreon.com/posts/41780508
  • Episode 65 - Phil Armstrong: Understanding Inflation: https://www.patreon.com/posts/40672678
  • Episode 104 - John T Harvey: Inflation, Stagflation & Healing The Nation: https://www.patreon.com/posts/52207835
  • Episode 123 - Warren Mosler: Understanding The Price Level And Inflation: https://www.patreon.com/posts/59856379
  • Episode 128 - L. Randall Wray & Yeva Nersisyan: What’s Causing Accelerating Inflation? Pandemic Or Policy Response?: https://www.patreon.com/posts/63776558

 

Our Job Guarantee episodes: 

  • Episode 4 - Fadhel Kaboub: What is the Job Guarantee?: https://www.patreon.com/posts/41742701
  • Episode 47 - Pavlina Tcherneva: Building Resilience - The Case For A Job Guarantee: https://www.patreon.com/posts/36034543
  • Episode 148 - Pavlina Tcherneva: Why The Job Guarantee Is Core To Modern Monetary Theory: https://www.patreon.com/posts/episode-148-why-73211346
  • Quick read: Pavlina Tcherneva’s Job Guarantee FAQ page: https://pavlina-tcherneva.net/job-guarantee-faq/

 

More on government bonds (and “vigilantes”):

  • Episode 30 - Steven Hail: Understanding Government Bonds (Part 1):https://www.patreon.com/posts/29621245
  • Episode 31 - Steven Hail: Understanding Government Bonds (Part 2): https://www.patreon.com/posts/29829500
  • Episode 143 - Paul Sheard: What Is Quantitative Easing?: https://www.patreon.com/posts/71589989?pr=true
  • Episode 147 - Dirk Ehnts: Do Markets Control Our Politics?: https://www.patreon.com/posts/episode-147-dirk-72906421
  • Episode 144 - Warren Mosler: The Natural Rate Of Interest Is Zero: https://www.patreon.com/posts/71966513
  • Episode 145 - John T Harvey: What Determines Currency Prices?: https://www.patreon.com/posts/72283811?pr=true

 

More on bank runs banking regulation: 

  • Episode 162 - Warren Mosler: Anatomy Of A Bank Run: https://www.patreon.com/posts/80157783?pr=true
  • Episode 163 - L. Randall Wray: Breaking Banks - The Fed’s Magical Monetarist Thinking Strikes Again: https://www.patreon.com/posts/80479169?pr=true
  • Episode 165 - Robert Hockett: Sparking An Industrial Renewal By Building Banks Better: https://www.patreon.com/posts/81084983?pr=true
  • MMT founder Warren Mosler’s Proposals for the Treasury, the Federal Reserve, the FDIC, and the Banking System: https://neweconomicperspectives.org/2010/02/warren-moslers-proposals-for-treasury.html

 

 

MMT Events And Courses:

  • More information about Professor Bill Mitchell’s MMTed project (free public online courses in MMT) here: http://www.mmted.org/
  • Details of Modern Money Lab’s online graduate and postgraduate courses in MMT are here: https://modernmoneylab.org.au/

 

 

Order the Gower Initiative’s “Modern Monetary Theory - Key Insights, Leading Thinkers”: https://www.e-elgar.com/shop/gbp/modern-monetary-theory-9781802208085.html

 

MMT Academic Resources compiled by The Gower Initiative for Modern Money Studies: https://www.zotero.org/groups/2251544/mmt_academic_resources_-_compiled_by_the_gower_initiative_for_modern_money_studies

 

MMT scholarship compiled by New Economic Perspectives: http://neweconomicperspectives.org/mmt-scholarship

 

 

A list of MMT-informed campaigns and organisations worldwide: https://www.patreon.com/posts/47900757

 

 

We are working towards full transcripts, but in the meantime, closed captions for all episodes are available on our YouTube channel: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCEp_nGVTuMfBun2wiG-c0Ew/videos

 

 

Show notes: https://www.patreon.com/posts/episode-197-with-127904530

...more
View all episodesView all episodes
Download on the App Store

The MMT Podcast with Patricia Pino & Christian ReillyBy Patricia Pino & Christian Reilly

  • 4.7
  • 4.7
  • 4.7
  • 4.7
  • 4.7

4.7

88 ratings


More shows like The MMT Podcast with Patricia Pino & Christian Reilly

View all
Jacobin Radio by Jacobin

Jacobin Radio

1,397 Listeners

Ralph Nader Radio Hour by Ralph Nader

Ralph Nader Radio Hour

1,198 Listeners

Scheer Intelligence by Scheerpost

Scheer Intelligence

391 Listeners

Current Affairs by Current Affairs

Current Affairs

623 Listeners

Macro N Cheese by Steven D Grumbine

Macro N Cheese

143 Listeners

Debunking Economics - the podcast by Steve Keen & Phil Dobbie

Debunking Economics - the podcast

43 Listeners

Activist #MMT - podcast by Jeff Epstein

Activist #MMT - podcast

14 Listeners

Tech Won't Save Us by Paris Marx

Tech Won't Save Us

523 Listeners

Bad Faith by Briahna Joy Gray

Bad Faith

2,686 Listeners

Planet: Critical by Rachel Donald

Planet: Critical

86 Listeners

Ones and Tooze by Foreign  Policy

Ones and Tooze

342 Listeners

Geopolitical Economy Report by Ben Norton

Geopolitical Economy Report

292 Listeners

Macrodose by Planet B Productions

Macrodose

27 Listeners

Multipolarity by Multipolarity

Multipolarity

33 Listeners

The Chris Hedges Report by Chris Hedges

The Chris Hedges Report

259 Listeners