If you could sit down with a seasoned leader and ask, “What do you wish you had known earlier?”—this episode is exactly that conversation.

In Episode 197 of the Fly on the Wall Podcast, I’m joined by my good friend Pastor John Martin, Assistant Superintendent for the Southern California Assemblies of God and former lead pastor of a large multi-site church. This is a wisdom-filled, honest discussion shaped by decades of leadership experience.

We talk about the things leaders rarely say out loud—but deeply feel.

In this episode, we cover:

What Pastor John wishes he had known as a younger leader

How to recognize when staff members are losing passion or energy

The difference between spiritual exhaustion and role misalignment

Why passion leaks when calling and assignment drift apart

How to have non-corrective, non-urgent conversations that restore leaders

What to do when churches are growing faster than finances or staffing

Why leadership development—not money—is usually the real bottleneck

How to lower the bar to serve without lowering the bar to lead

We also dive into reframing common leadership problems, shifting from pastoring everyone to pastoring leaders, and building systems that can actually sustain growth.

This episode is thoughtful, practical, and deeply pastoral. If you’re leading people through changing seasons—or navigating one yourself—you’ll walk away encouraged and better equipped.

🎧 Listen to Episode 197 now and sit in on this coaching conversation.

And if you’re craving leadership community and ongoing growth, I want to personally invite you to explore the Church Boom Network at churchboom.org. We gather monthly, grow together, and remind each other that leadership was never meant to be done alone.

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👋 About Us
Fly on the Wall Podcast, presented by Church Boom, takes pastors into a live coaching session with Chris Sonksen, CEO & Founder of Church Boom. Each episode features a pastor, just like you, as they share the challenges they face and get practical advice on how to overcome them.