Ben Rhodes was 29 when he went to work for Barack Obama in the White House. In his role as Deputy National Security Advisor, Rhodes helped to negotiate the Iran nuclear deal and the opening to Cuba, only to see Donald Trump tear down those policies. Then Rhodes traveled to Hungary, Russia and China to look at governments that promote nationalism. I talk to Ben Rhodes about reinvention, global despair and what the road ahead might look like. “Now What?” is produced with the help of Steve Zimmer, Fei Lu and Alexander Wolfe. Audio production is by Nick CIavatta.