Tito Ambyo, who is wrapping up a PhD on Indonesian horror, a lecturer on journalism at Melbourne's RMIT and co-host of the podcast Talking Indonesia joins Jeff and Kevin to discuss whether Jokowi is setting the table to break with Ibu Mega.

We also get into the very real horror story of childhood stunting, and finally wheeling and dealing on the power grid that might make room for consumers who want to source electricity from renewable sources - scary stuff for coal fired power plants.

Later Tito talks to the guys about the enduring love of horror in Indonesian popular culture and how discussing the supernatural and the ghosts of women and ethnic minorities who are wronged in this life is a way of backing into the taboo and fraught topics like the rights of women, and the communist purges of the 1960s.

You can listen to Talking Indonesia here: https://open.spotify.com/show/6gwgrqZuYIw5gVaSjisQ1R?si=5juHLsamQmSgOD3iPvklbw

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