In amongst the border closures, groundings and rows, it can be easy to forget the impact of COVID-19 on airline pilots themselves, who have found their industry has effectively shut down. In this episode of the Australian Aviation podcast, hosts Phil Tarrant and Christian "Boo" Boucousis speak to Mark Sedgwick, the executive director of Australian and International Pilots Association, about how pilots are adapting to the new normal. He discusses why states should sign up to a national framework on border closures, how many of his members have found work elsewhere and why he has worked hard to build a good relationship with the Qantas Group. He also tells long-time friend Boo what advice he would give to governments trying to protect the profession for the next generation.