What does it mean to be Pākehā today? Prof. Alison Jones from the University of Auckland talks to the University of Canterbury's Jeanette King in this highlight of WORD Christchurch 2021.

Listen to Alison Jones in conversation with Jeanette King at Word Christchurch 2021

Highlights of the discussion

Jeanette King:

When colleagues say, "I want to involve Māori more or co-design research with them, how do I start?" I find it's a really hard question to answer.

Alison Jones:

It is. It's impossible to answer because when people just want to say "I'm doing some really interesting research on Māori, so I need a Māori person to work with," what's unspoken is the underlying belief that "they should be really pleased because I'm doing this exciting work."

Well it just doesn't work like that, because it is all about relationships. I've spent years in relationships with Māori people I work with. Being their friend, teaching, whatever what I'm doing, engaging, turning up, doing dishes - whatever! - it doesn't matter. It's just being present that matters.

Māori will always notice if you turn up to things, to hui, to tangi, or other Māori events. They'll notice you, they'll know who you are. And so if you're going to be then saying to your friend "Hey, I'm thinking of doing some research what do you reckon?" they might say OK, because they know you're there. You're not just diving in for the goodies and then are going to dive out again. They know you're permanently there in a committed engagement. Your heart's in the right place, you've got the right politics, all that kind of thing.

You can't just leap into a relationship.

It's quite interesting though, Jeanette, that I quite often get emails from people overseas, whether it's Germany or Chile or United States, saying "I've read about Maori education, or I've read about kohanga reo, kaupapa Māori philosophy, or something indigenous in New Zealand, and I really want to come and find out about it. Can you help me work in a school/learn from Maori people/learn the culture/et cetera?"

I've got to write back as though I'm writing to anthropologists of old.

You can't just pop up and say, "Hey Māori people I want to know about you. Sit down with me and tell me all about yourself." That ain't gonna happen.

I mean just imagine if it was you? If someone popped into your house and said "Hey Alison, I'm really interested in you, you know will you just let me ask you a whole lot of questions about your culture and what you had for dinner and whatever."…

Go to this episode on rnz.co.nz for more details