Whether the issue is climate, energy, or the response to Covid-19, the use of the word “science” has become -- in the words of Avik Roy, president of the Foundation for Research on Equal Opportunity -- a “cloak of virtue.” In this episode, Robert Bryce talks to Avik about the need to view scientific evidence dispassionately, the limits of models, the American health care system, why his mother is a Democrat, and why, even in the midst of the pandemic, he is hopeful about our future.