Between the Briefs

The impact of AI on law has been studied through the narrow lens of productivity and profitability. But the reality is much broader than that. In this episode of Between the Briefs by Steno, Adrian Cea and Joe Stephens welcome back Daniel Schwarcz, Professor at the University of Minnesota Law School to discuss groundbreaking empirical research on how AI impacts lawyer performance, legal reasoning and long-term professional development.
What You’ll Learn:

• How to move beyond benchmarking studies to measure what actually matters
• Why reasoning models and retrieval-augmented generation (RAG) platforms deliver measurable improvements
• The counterintuitive finding that using AI for research strengthens independent legal reasoning when AI is unavailable
• How litigation work benefits more measurably from current AI tools than transactional work
• The critical distinction between confidentiality risks and genuine professional concerns
• Why high-valuation legal tech firms like Harvey and Legora face competitive pressure from accessible alternatives

This episode challenges everything we think we know about AI’s cognitive impact on lawyers and their practice. 
Highlights:
00:00 Introduction & Meeting Professor Daniel Schwarcz 2.0 02:09 How AI Progress Has Defied Earlier Predictions03:34 Getting into the Research: New Findings & More 05:56 Why Randomized Controlled Trials Matter for Lawyers10:47 Reasoning Models vs. RAG: Choosing the Right AI Architecture for Your Practice16:40 How and Why AI Research Skills Persist Even When Technology is Removed23:00 Legal Tech Vendors, Study Citations & Navigating Selective Evidence26:43 Why It’s Critical to Use Foundation Models Responsibly30:02 AI's Role in Access to Justice & Pro Se Litigants and Future Research34:00 The Long-Term Effects of AI in Law and Emerging Research Questions36:19 Human vs. AI: Context-Dependent Futures in Legal Practice39:05 Why Empirical Evidence Shouldn't Slow Adoption42:31 Daniel’s Hot Take: High-Valuation Legal Tech Firms Face Significant Market Pressure44:12 Key Takeaways & Closing Thoughts 

Quotes:

1. "I'm excited about this new paper I have that tries to look at not only what the effect on quality and speed is of using AI on legal tasks, but also what the effect is on the ability of people who are using AI to reason when the AI is taken away from them. I think that's an important step in trying to understand the broader scenario that all lawyers and members of the legal academy more generally are facing right now."
2. "The mere fact that an AI can do well on an exam or on a task doesn't really answer the question most lawyers want answered, which is: how will I perform when I use AI compared to how I perform when I don't use AI? You can't extrapolate from the fact that an AI performs well on its own to the fact that if I use an AI, I'll start performing well on my own."
3. The basic interpretation is that AI helped our participants understand the legal source material better - they understood the case law better, they understood the law better. That produces benefits that persist even when they no longer have AI."
4. "The study made me more confident than I would otherwise be that using these tools can be beneficial in many ways, even in ways that aren't fully intuitive.”
5. "In some contexts, the practice of law will absolutely look like AI judgment being primary with humans handling exceptions - like in will drafting where an AI handles the initial draft and a human checks it. But in other settings with massive human elements like counseling clients or talking to judges, AI won't be a substitute because the human element is essential."

Between The Briefs is handcrafted by our friends over at: fame.so

Lawyers can (technically) be the superheroes society needs them to be but the legal system simply doesn’t allow it. With a broken system, flawed legal aid and crumbling structures, justice gets the short end of the stick - but can AI be part of the solution? In this episode of Between the Briefs, hosts Adrian Cea and Joe Stephens welcome Sateesh Nori, Chief Legal Futurist at LawDroid and Senior Research Fellow at NYU School of Law, to explore how justice can truly be democratized. 
What You’ll Learn:

• How to quantify the access to justice crisis
• Why AI is uniquely suited to legal work
• The triage bottleneck and how chatbots solve it
• Why housing court illustrates systemic failure
• How to reframe legal services as a utility, not a luxury
• The critical gap in law school curriculum

Right now, millions are disenfranchised, without access to the legal care they deserve. Tune in to find out how legal technology is tipping the scales. 
Highlights:
02:29 Sateesh’s Journey from Housing Court to Legal Technology04:26 Let’s Quantify the Access to Justice Crisis07:20 Why Large Language Models Are Architecturally Perfect for Legal Work09:10 The Harsh Truth About Housing Courts Today13:04 Fixing the System Before Court, Rent Assistance & Bureaucratic Friction14:12 Building Intelligent Triage Systems that Eliminate Burnout16:50 Courts Need Both Systemic Reform and Technology19:30 Why Comparative Risk Analysis is Our Best Friend Right Now22:41 What Needs to Change So Access to Justice Can Be Real 25:40 Innovation Hubs: Stanford, Suffolk and Utah's Regulatory Sandbox Model27:08 Thinking About the Future of Legal Services28:40 How We Need to Prepare Law Students for Disruption31:10 The Death of the Billable Hour in an AI-Driven Legal Market33:31 AI-Native Law Firms Without Humanity Mean Nothing 35:15 Redesigning Client Experience: The McDonald's Model for Legal Services36:56 Sateesh’s Rapid Fire: Big Law Pro Bono, Tec-Led Education & More39:37 Making Legal Aid and Clinics Irrelevant40:56 Thought Leaders Shaping the Future of Access to Justice42:17 Sateesh’s Hot Take: An AmLaw 40 Firm Will Fail Within 12 Months43:13 Key Takeaways & Closing Thoughts 
Quotes:

1. "I'm someone who always wanted to go to law school. Since I was a kid, I thought it was such a great way to spend time, to help people, to dress up and go to court, to stand up for the little guy. But after a long time practicing as a lawyer, I realized we're like superheroes, but we're being held down by a giant force. And that force is the legal system."
2. "The time that we do have, we're spending not on helping people, but on paperwork, on procedural things, on internal things within the structures of nonprofits, on fundraising, on answering emails. We're probably spending less than 40% of it on actually helping people and more than half of it on the drudgery of working in a big system that's so oppressive."
3. "We're comparing what we're offering to the perfect lawyer, which no one's gonna get. In fact, you're not gonna get anybody. The average person is going to Reddit and Google for help, and they're also going to OpenAI and Gemini. This is already happening. So regulating it from that end is not gonna do anything."
4. "I think law schools are still following law firms. The higher rank the law school, the more insulated they think their students are because they're still gonna get jobs. But you fast forward couple years, and if the law firms stop hiring people from elite law schools, what happens to the law schools? They're not thinking ahead far enough."
5. "We need to be the McDonald's. Instead, we're operating even the most modest legal services office like a fancy Michelin star French restaurant. People want burgers and fries and pizza, the basic answers to their legal problems, and we're like, let me see what the chef has in mind for you today. It's totally broken."

Between The Briefs is handcrafted by our friends over at: fame.so

The only thing more important than embracing AI transformation for legal teams today is being able to communicate the change and manage it. In this episode of Between the Briefs by Steno, hosts Adrian Cea and Joe Stephens sit down with Mike Russell, Head of Global Legal Operations at Expedia Group, to explore just how legal operations is spearheading this movement. 
What You’ll Learn:

• How to position change management as the most critical skill in legal operations
• The framework for evaluating AI tools in legal departments
• Why measuring "lawyer hours saved" alone is an incomplete metric
• How to structure listening tours across global legal operations
• The strategic vision for self-serving legal agents that reduce human touchpoints
• How to navigate the law firm relationship evolution in an AI-enabled market
• The governance framework that separates productivity gains from legal liability
• Why legal operations should hire for curiosity and adaptability over experience
• How peer-driven adoption accelerates AI implementation across legal teams
• The opportunity to position legal operations as the first hire after general counsel in growing companies

Tune in for the play-by-play on building and managing AI-enabled departments. 
Highlights:

00:00 Introduction 02:09 From Law Firm IT to Global Legal Operations: A Three-Decade Journey04:33 Breaking Down the Legal Ops Evolution  07:54 Why Change Management Defines Legal Ops Success08:30 Mike’s Legal Ops Success Playbook13:48 Building AI-Enabled Legal Operations Teams15:30 Is Saving Lawyer Hours a Valid Metric? 19:21 The New Skills: Hiring for Legal Ops Today 21:53 Building Agents That Compress Decision Timelines25:03 Architecting Self-Serving Legal Agents 10127:20 How to Sell Innovation in a Conservative Industry29:13 The Truth About Managing Multiple AI Agents30:17 Making AI Compliance Intrinsic, Not Retroactive31:36 The Importance of Internal AI Champions and Peer Advocacy33:23 How Real-Time Visibility and Peer Success Drive Deeper AI Adoption34:38 Unconventional Skills That Transform Leadership37:00 Balancing Innovation Velocity With Organizational Readiness38:10 The Art of Listening: Using the Five Whys to Diagnose Workflow Friction40:45 Essential Resources: Richard Susskind, David Cowan, and the Business of Law41:48 Why Jurisdiction Differences Demand Flexibility43:18 AI Won't Eliminate Jobs, It Will Transform Them44:31 Mike’s Hot Take: Legal Ops is the Secret to Scaling 45:34 Key Takeaways & Final Thoughts
Between The Briefs is handcrafted by our friends over at: fame.so

Applying AI to an already bad process is just automating a bad process,” says Myah Bowermaster, Head of Legal Operations at Cvent, in this episode of Between the Briefs by Steno. Tune in as hosts Adrian Cea and Joe Stephens sit down with Myah to explore the truth behind AI adoption in the legal landscape. 
What You’ll Learn:

• How to position legal operations as strategic partnership
• Why waiting for AI maturity beats first-mover adoption
• The framework for assessing legal tech readiness 
• How to build credibility as a non-lawyer legal operations leader 
• The “help me help you” approach to process implementation 
• Why contract data integration unlocks revenue-generating insights 
• How to hire for legal operations success without a legal background 
• The human-AI balance that protects cognitive capability

AI is shiny, but not all that glitters is gold. And, it turns out waiting, rather than rushing, might be the smarter choice when it comes to the AI game. 
Highlights:
00:00 Introduction & Meeting Myah Bowermaster 01:43 From Paralegal to Legal Operations Leader: An Unconventional Path05:48 What Legal Operations Actually Does and Why It Matters10:16 Strategic Patience: Why AI Adoption Should Follow Market Maturity13:29 Myah’s Advice to Legal Teams 15:40 Input Quality Determines Output Reliability18:27 Descriptive Context Over Prompt Engineering20:41 Building Credibility Without a Law Degree23:05 Ownership, Maturity Models, and Growing Legal Operations Teams25:50 The Real Resistance: Centralization and User Interface Design27:20 Three-Year CLM Implementation and Cross-Functional Excellence29:32 Hiring for Legal Operations: Soft Skills Over Legal Background32:33 Crisis Management and the Chaos Coordinator Role34:23 The Evolution of Legal Operations: From Admin to Chief of Staff35:57 When to Hire Your First Head of Legal Operations37:33 AI Tool Evaluation: Consistency, Integration, and User Experience40:02 Turning Contract Data Into Revenue-Generating Intelligence44:20 Myah’s Hot Take: Just Because AI Can Doesn't Mean It Should45:16 Key Takeaways and Final Thoughts
Quotes:

1. "Legal operations is doing everything it takes to run a legal department that doesn't involve practicing law. We're the connective tissue bringing the process to compliance. Lawyers are really good at being lawyers, but lawyers are not typically process oriented or tech oriented, and so a big part of what legal ops does is we empower lawyers to do what only lawyers can, and then we automate and operationalize the rest."
2. “Everyone kept saying we need to catch up with AI, but all the pain points that we have were not something that AI could do yet in the legal space. I could purchase this right now and address 25% of the pain point, but we haven't done the internal work to get to that 40%. Why don't I just wait and let the market catch up to us so they can address 70 to 80% of our pain points?"
3. "You don't need to be a prompt engineer. You need to be descriptive and then let the AI do the prompt engineering for you. Start every prompt with: I want you to refine this prompt so it works best with my tool. Do not run the prompt. This shows you how descriptive you actually were and what the AI understood from what you said."
4. "It is all about relationship building. I went out to everyone and said, help me help you. What are your pain points? Instead of telling you the best way to do something, I understand what your pain points are and tell you everything I do is to help you and enable you and make your life better. It all comes back to trust."

Between The Briefs is handcrafted by our friends over at: fame.so

You can know every detail of a case - the when, what and who - but if you miss out the why, you’re playing a losing game. In this episode of Between the Briefs by Steno, hosts Joe Stephens and Adrian Cea welcome Kaelyn Gustafson, Litigation Associate at Friedman, Kaplan, Seiler, Adleman and Robbins, to explore how genuine human connection, strategic preparation, and technological literacy are reshaping modern legal practice.
What You’ll Learn:

• How service industry experience builds the foundational empathy lawyers need to understand client motivation and case strategy
• Why authenticity is the primary credibility meter in litigation
• The critical difference between understanding the "what" and the "why" in case strategy
• How to leverage closed-loop AI systems strategically while protecting client privilege and sensitive information
• The necessity of transparent client communication about AI use in legal services
• How judges evaluate counsel credibility through written work product and courtroom behavior

This episode serves as a reminder that authenticity, even in the age of AI, is every lawyer’s biggest winning bet.
Highlights:
00:00 Introduction & Meeting Kaelyn Gustafson 02:22 From Waiter to Complex Litigation: An Unconventional Path07:26 Building Empathy and Credibility Through Hospitality Experience09:10 Kaelyn’s Aha Moment & Overcoming Impostor Syndrome  16:20 Where Authenticity and Strategy Converge in Legal Practice18:43 Understanding Client Motivation: The Irreplaceable "Why" in Litigation23:25 Using AI as a Tool for Access to Justice27:23 Being Human Beats AI: Storytelling in the Courtroom 28:17 Kaelyn’s Lessons from Clerkship 30:35 Life Without AI: Written Advocacy and Courtroom Credibility 35:03 Navigating the Modern Litigator Life 41:12 Kaelyn’s Hot Take: Empathy is Every Lawyer’s Biggest Advantage 41:57 Key Takeaways & Final Thoughts
Quotes:
1. "I think everyone should work in the service industry at one point in their lives because that is what shaped me as an empathetic person, but also as someone who can manage a myriad of personalities."
2. "If you don't know the why for what people are pursuing a case for or what you know, on the opposite side, like, the why of an individual's actions that may have led to a lawsuit, then you're not gonna get it right."3. “Authenticity, I think, is the number one credibility meter, and credibility, by the way, is most of a trial court's determination."
4. "The lawyers still standing at the end of this AI revolution are the ones with empathy and who understand the client's problem, and that can only be done with a human connection."Between The Briefs is handcrafted by our friends over at: fame.so

What if legal professionals have been missing the key to responsible AI implementation this whole time? In this episode of Between the Briefs, hosts Adrian Cea and Joe Stephens welcome Matthew Krengel, eDiscovery Counsel and Director of Information Retention Counseling at Cooley LLP, to explore the real solution.
What You’ll Learn:

• How to transition from viewing AI as a liability to recognizing it as a strategic asset
• Why the "move fast and break things" ethos conflicts with legal practice, and how to implement a phased approach to AI governance 
• The critical importance of client consent frameworks for AI usage
• How to protect confidentiality and trade secrets in an AI-enabled workplace 
• The psychological barriers to effective AI implementation, including automation bias and confirmation bias
• Why information governance and records management professionals have become more critical than ever

We're at an unprecedented inflection point in law and technology and this conversation reveals how to position yourself at its forefront.
Highlights:

00:00 Introduction & Meeting Matthew Krengel  01:57 From eDiscovery Pioneer to AI Governance Leader07:10 What’s Changing in the Tech-Law Space Today 10:50 Machine Learning's Two-Decade Role in Legal Discovery13:56 From Malpractice Fear to Mandatory AI Implementation18:06 Discovery Sanctions and the Technology Adoption Cycle21:57 Combating Automation Bias in Legal Practice26:19 Hafner Case: Confidentiality Breaches and Privilege Waiver30:45 Client Consent Frameworks and Engagement Letter Protocols35:28 Implementing Governance Without Perfection38:25 Fear and Existential Doubt in an AI-Driven Practice39:55 AI as Force Multiplier for Trial Team Excellence42:44 Business Acumen: The JD-MBA Advantage in Legal Practice45:42 Matthew’s Hot Take: We’re at an Inflection Point48:00 Key Takeaways & Closing Thoughts
Quotes:

1. "I like to gravitate towards the new and unformed. I like to be on sort of the frontier of, you know, the development of law."

1. "How do I enable the responsible use of information? How do I make sure that companies are using it responsibly so that they can then use it in a manner that both benefits themselves and also the people that they serve."

1. “Move fast and break things works because when they break things, you don't end up with sanctions, you end up with, “okay. We just need to rebuild this and fix it.” That doesn't really always work for the law."

1. “Attorneys are known for their analytical rigor. If we're not doing that because we're now seeding it to AI, then how are we supposed to verify and vet the outputs with any degree of scrutiny if we're not exercising that."

Between The Briefs is handcrafted by our friends over at: fame.so

What does it take to lead one of the world's most prestigious law firms through a global financial crisis, a pandemic, and now, a generative AI revolution? 
In this episode, Eric Friedman draws on his three decades of experience at Skadden to dissect the current "headwinds" impacting the legal landscape. Now an advisor to legal tech leaders like Litera and Ironclad, Eric explores why adoption remains the number one hurdle for innovation and how the "client voice" is finally forcing the hands of reluctant law firms. From the "crystal ball" question of the billable hour's future to the potential for AI to move the needle on access to justice, this conversation provides a strategic roadmap for the future of legal services.,,


What You’ll Learn:

• How tech, competitive dynamics, and geopolitics are creating a high-pressure environment.
• Why meeting lawyers "where they work" is the only way to overcome the static of new tools.
• Why value-based billing might finally gain traction as clients demand to share in tech-driven efficiency gains.
• Understanding the complex "Middle Earth" between the business and practice of law to successfully sell to law firms.,
• Why we are still in the "early innings" of tech innovation and why declaration of winners is premature.
  
  

Highlights:
00:01 – Introduction: Welcoming Eric Friedman, former CEO of Skadden.
01:04 – The Pivot: Transitioning from M&A lawyer to the "Business of Law."02:27 – Under Pressure: Assessing the "ferocious" competitive and geopolitical landscape.,,08:18 – The Adoption Challenge: Why "meeting them where they work" is the key to success.,13:42 – The Billable Hour Crystal Ball: Will tech finally kill the predominant benchmark?,,23:54 – The Founder’s Bane: Navigating the complex buyer persona in Big Law.,38:29 – Access to Justice: Using tech to bridge the gap for the Legal Services Corporation (LSC).,41:35 – Hottest Take: Why it’s still "early innings" for the legal tech battle.,

Quotes:

1. “Law firms are under pressure from every direction... Tech, I'll start there... the emergence of this next wave of legal tech is definitely creating pressures on law firms. You also have a massive competitive dynamic... Law firms are ferociously competitive. That may always have been the case. It feels like it's notched up a bit.”,
2. “Adoption is the number one challenge. You have to get through the static of which tools should we even pilot... Meet them where they're working and be accretive to what they're otherwise doing and you have to prove the value proposition in the real world for lawyers.”,
3. “I do want to point out that at least since the mid 1980s, the legal media has been talking about the death of the billable hour. And so 40 years later, I would say it remains the predominant benchmark for legal service delivery.”
4. “I don't think it's a bubble. I think we're still in the early innings of tech innovation and adoption... it’s way too early to be declaring winners in this space.”,
   
   

Between The Briefs is handcrafted by our friends over at: fame.so

What does it take to represent families facing the unthinkable? For Brian Shapiro, it starts with deep mentorship and a commitment to strategic precision. In this episode, Brian discusses his journey from a "family of law" to becoming a passionate advocate for individuals impacted by spinal and brain injuries. He pulls back the curtain on his firm’s meticulous intake process, explaining how he identifies red flags early and prepares clients for the psychological rigors of depositions from the very first meeting.
Beyond the courtroom, Brian explores the intersection of technology and law, highlighting how tools like Steno’s Transcript Genius are revolutionizing medical record review and deposition prep. He also dives into his legislative work with the Consumer Attorneys of California (CAOC), discussing the vital importance of protecting access to justice against corporate-backed fee-cap initiatives.

What You’ll Learn:

• How a background in a "family of law" and judicial clerkships provides a competitive edge in trial practice.
• The psychology of client coaching: How to help plaintiffs remain calm, honest, and likable during depositions.
• Strategic case selection: Identifying "red flags" and navigating difficult conversations about insurance limits.
• The evolving role of AI in litigation, from summarizing medical jargon to interrogating multiple depositions with Transcript Genius.
• Why trial lawyers have a professional obligation to engage in legislative advocacy and pro bono work.
  
  

Highlights:

• 00:00 - Introduction: Meet Brian Shapiro, catastrophic injury specialist
  
  
• 01:10 - Learning the ropes from a father and mentor
• 03:58 - Clerking for Judge James DeCeaser in Orange County
• 08:14 - The case that cemented Brian's path
• 10:53 - Why selective cases require high-resource commitment
• 14:32 - Coaching clients to be "the star" of their own story
• 21:57 - Translating Medicine: Simplifying spinal and brain injuries for a jury
• 25:22 - The AI Advantage: How Steno's Transcript Genius transforms prep
• 34:10 - Giving Back: Pro bono work with the Legal Aid Society of San Bernardino
• 43:15 - Hot Take: Why the trial lawyer remains irreplaceable in the age of AI
  
  

Quotes:

1. "We spend hours with the folks in the very beginning... we are pre-training them on how we're almost taking their depo without them knowing... we do want them to know from the very beginning... they are kind of getting ready."
2. "In a deposition, we want you to be comfortable. The number one thing is we want you to feel like you could speak slowly... that it's your—you're the star. If you don't remember the question, don't feel like you need to answer it."
3. "@Steno, obviously with depots, I very much am a fan of Transcript Genius... being able to literally ask the deposition anything... and then it will pop up where in the depot and highlight the section it's coming from so you can verify it real time."
4. "We represent folks... we have that voice and a lot of times we have the resources... if you can't commit the time, I think that we all owe it... to at least give to the cause when you can, because people are coming after us."
   
   

Between The Briefs is handcrafted by our friends over at: fame.so

In these volatile and uncertain times, what does it really take to uphold peace? Someone like Judge Paul Raleeh, it would seem. In this episode of Between the Briefs, hosts Joe Stephens and Adrian Cea sit down with Judge Raleeh, Justice of the Peace for Precinct 1 in Collin County, Texas, to explore the critical yet often misunderstood role of justice courts in modernizing local litigation.

What You’ll Learn:

• How to navigate pro se representation effectively
  
  
• The critical distinction between bond-setting and punishment
  
  
• Why civil jurisdiction expansion matters for rural and urban practitioners
  
  
• How exclusive eviction jurisdiction consolidates both residential and commercial disputes
  
  
• The customer service imperative in judicial administration
  
  
• Why AI-assisted legal research and judicial drafting require human oversight
  
  

Tune in for the full deep dive on why the justice courts of America are an integral part of the country’s legal system. 

Highlights:


00:00 Introduction: Welcome to Between the Briefs

00:59 From Law Enforcement to the Bench: Judge Paul's Unconventional Path

02:38 Collin County's Explosive Growth and Its Impact on Local Courts

04:30 The Surprising Scope of Justice Court Jurisdiction

09:33 Navigating the Learning Curve: Civil Law and the Early Days

15:56 Serving Pro Se Litigants Without Crossing Into Legal Advice

19:53 AI, ChatGPT and the Dangerous Illusion of Legal Expertise

23:39 Beyond the Bench: A Judge's Role in Community Education

26:33 Magistrate Duties and the Evolution of Bond-Setting Standards

30:54 Senate Bill 6: How Legislative Change Reshapes Judicial Practice

32:45 Balancing Justice With Humanity in Criminal Proceedings

37:00 The Realities of Running for Reelection as an Elected Judge

42:08 The Hardest Part: Politics, People and Lasting Impact

46:35 Controversial Cases and Judicial Philosophy on Marriage Equality

51:18 Key Takeaways & Closing Thoughts 



Quotes:

1. “The justice of the peace or the justice court judge is the only judicial position in the entire state of Texas that doesn't require you to first be an attorney. My career started off in law enforcement, and I went to school for public administration. I had no idea I was gonna be a judge, but one day the sitting justice of the peace told me I had the qualifications and personality to do it, and I decided I'd run for the position."
2. "We have jurisdiction in criminal cases of all criminal offenses that are punishable only by a fine. We also have civil court jurisdiction for cases of $20,000 or less, and we have exclusive jurisdiction over all evictions, both residential and commercial. Last year, I took the bench 6,000 times with 6,000 trials or hearings of some sort."
3. "My role is to navigate people through the process. The rules that govern the court don't go away just because you're in a justice court, and almost everybody that represents themselves are unprepared for what their role is. I have seven staff that work in my office, and we have the same responsibility to help people understand the process in plain language so that they know their rights."
4. "When people Google search or use AI information sites, it's great information, but it doesn't make you an attorney. I don't know how to change a plug in the wall, but I can Google it and walk through it and get that plug changed, but it won't make me an electrician. AI is going to change not just the court system, but it's going to change the world, and it's going to happen very quick."
   
   
   

Between The Briefs is handcrafted by our friends over at: fame.so

What if the legal AI revolution is actually a good thing? In this episode of Between the Briefs by Steno, Adrian Cea and Joe Stephens welcome David Coale, partner and leader of the appellate practice at Lynn Pinker Hurst & Schwegman, to unpack how said revolution is transforming appellate law without replacing human judgment. 


What You’ll Learn:

• How to structure an appellate practice that balances deep legal writing with real-time courtroom advisory work

• Why generative AI excels at document digestion, trial transcript summarization and sophisticated legal research

• How to draft appellate briefs by writing the argument section first using legal principles, then backfilling facts 

• Why young attorneys need intensive reps in writing, research and oral advocacy to develop mastery

• How a single presidential term of judicial appointments can shape a circuit's jurisprudence for 30+ years

• Why the human element of judgement, preparation and understanding remain relevant in appellate advocacy

Tune in for the full deep dive on navigating appellate law in the age of AI. 

Highlights:


00:00 Introduction

00:00 The Dual Nature of Modern Appellate Practice

00:02 Building Mastery: Reps, Writing and Deliberate Practice

00:05 Generative AI as Research Partner, Not Brief Writer

00:07 Navigating AI Risks: Citation Hallucination and Quality Control

00:10 What Humans Bring to Appellate Advocacy

00:12 Common Mistakes That Undermine Appellate Work

00:14 Reading Like a Writer: Studying Judicial Craftsmanship

00:17 Strategic Brief Architecture: The Reverse-Engineering Method

00:19 The Intake Process and Case Assessment

00:20 Fifth Circuit Dynamics: How Politics Shapes Appellate Dockets

00:23 Presidential Appointments as Multi-Generational Court Shapers

00:27 Judicial Resources and the Reality of Appellate Workload

00:28 Trial Experience and Appellate Excellence: Finding Your Path

00:31 Writing as Creative Practice, Not Compliance Exercise

00:33 Intellectual Influences and Maintaining Sharp Analysis

00:33 The Future of Law: AI Integration and Professional Transformation

00:37 Key Takeaways: Excellence in the Age of Appellate Innovation


Quotes:

1. "Half of my practice is writing learned intellectual briefs to courts and appeals. The other half is providing advice to very smart, very aggressive trial lawyers, often on the fly while they're at the courthouse when something comes up. I call it the drop in traffic, and it's absolutely fascinating because it keeps me from getting to Ivory Tower."
2. "You gotta get reps in to develop the skills, and that means writing whatever needs to be written, offering to do whatever. It's fundamentally a written practice, and you have to like writing and the process of sitting there and getting it done. If you like writing, you need to practice it to get better at it, and you need extra reps writing articles to hone those skills."
3. "What AI forces you to confront is what am I really adding as a human being to this? Certain parts of the briefing process now take a lot less time and energy than they used to, which frees me up to do more meaningful stuff. The net is a better product in the end because I'm spending my time on way more beneficial work than me digging around in a bunch of boxes."
4. "Generative AI is here to stay, and ChatGPT was released three and a half years ago, but the ChatGPT today is unrecognizable from what it was. In another four years, it's going to significantly impact society and the profession, with fewer new lawyers hired and overwhelming changes to what humans do in the legal system."

Between The Briefs is handcrafted by our friends over at: fame.so